Shock And Awe

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  1. Comparison....
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  2. yeah man...moab is insane....

    I would think it would be mainly used on mine fields, or in the desert where large unsurrendering Iraqi troops are.


  3. i'm quite impressed by the peace protests that turn violent....quite a concept....
    another thing, how about them bag of **** democrat representatives that went to baghdad in the fall of last year? ofcourse they were taken to hospitals just to see how bad us americans are for not providing medicine and food for dying goes on and on...they talked **** about OUR PRESIDENT in baghdad...what the **** were they thinking? course you sure don't hear from them anymore...and the dems wonder why the republicans control congress now...

    smiler51, yep this war is soooo must be a spineless democrat yourself...just think of all the meals that are prepared each day for sadaam in all his palaces just to make intelligence think he may be there...all the while he's got his own people starving in parts of his country....yeah, it's all our fault...


  4. Well BigAl, I happen to be a registered democrat myself, and I wouldn't exactly consider myself "spineless". I have been on and off again about supporting action in Iraq, but NOT because my party says so. Not everyone follows the herd brother

  5. hell bro, that's not what i was getting at....i didn't mean that as a "collective comment" at all....i just really get frustrated at times...kinda wish we didn't have a "partied" government sometimes....and i get really pissed when i hear **** like smiler51 threw on here...i've got family over there right now and to have him want to blame us for ****, hell i just would love to choke the bastard....
    i'm a republican but i don't always vote that way....if bush were to get beat in the next election, i hope for our sake someone like lieberman or gephardt gets in there...they are good people who aren't afraid to take a not so popular stance at times....
    so, i'm sorry if i offended you at all...certainly wasn't intended, just spoutin'

  6. Well when we find the WMD's, all I will say is I told ya so! It is sad it came to this, but needed to be done long ago!

  7. unfortunately, alot of the more vocal democrats are spineless and they give the whole party a bad name. i may not agree with some of their positions but i believe by and large they are as patriotic as anybody.

    what smiler51 doesnt seem to understand is not only has Saddam murdered his own people and poses a threat to us, but if he remained in power who knows how many more would die...i'd bet many more than will be killed in this war. also, where were these folks back in '98 when daschale supported clinton who was saying that we needed to force saddam out of power....all these folks didnt seem to protes then...but of course, clinton didnt have balls enuf to do anything about it. he was too busy usin 'em for somethin else.

    saddam has lied to the world for 12 years now...i'd bet has harbored God knows how many terrorists and no telling what else he's done we done know about.

    it jus frosts my ass to think we are trying to do the right thing, some 65% of Americans think we are doin the right thing with this war and all we hear about are the protestors....why not instead thank our soldiers who are making this work and showing the world America will stand behind her words and commitments.

    sorry about the length of this...and rants over

  8. ww7...were'd you get your avatar? man that is one of the coolest i've ever seen bro..

  9. Originally posted by windwords7
    I thought the majority of the bombs being used are JDAMs..

  10. There are a lot of JDAM's But the MOAB is over there.

  11. mother of all bombs, ow ow

  12. I personally dont think the war is wrong, although I would have liked to see the US wait a little longer and get more international support, so we dont end up footing the bill for the whole thing.

    Saddam Hussein has been in power since 1968 - if we were really all THAT concerned about the welfare of the Iraqi people we should have done something a hell of a lot sooner. Like when we had him in the crosshairs in 1991, maybe? I definately think he has to go, and I do think its respectable that they are doing everything they can to preserve civilian life and the country's infrastructure.

    You also have to wonder...this war will cost us ~50 billion dollars. They could have poured half that cash into R&D and perfected an engine that dosent run on oil. That would shut the mideast down for good. And all that money spent moving all that hardware halfway around the globe - and yet they tell us to run to Lowes and buy duct tape and plastic sheeting in the event of a chemical attack...That dosent really make sense either.

    We also have a lot of problems here at home that need to be addressed, but arent. The prison system, The horrible failure of the 'War on Drugs', the economy...

    Im really not a huge fan of President Bush, but I have to say the man has balls. And I do admire that. Something definately DID need to be done about this *******, I just dont think the US should have shouldered the whole load. I wonder where things will go from here. Who's next? Syria? North Korea? Could this be a 3 week operation or the start of WW3?

    In any event, I just hope things go smooth and the troops get home safely.

    I also hope they do something about those goddamn choppers that cant seem to stay airborne. Nearly all allied casualties so far have been in helicopter accidents.

    As far as the anti-war protesters, they really dont seem to have a clue what's going on. Im sure if any of them had friends or family in the World Trade Center when it went down they'd have a different opinion. It sickens me when a flock of college kids starts shouting out vietnam-era slogans. Like any of them really know what the hell is going on. This is definately not Vietnam. I just got out of college. And, let me tell you, if this is the future of this country, are we ever in trouble

    You'd think that after 12,000 years of human civilization, we'd be able to get along with eachother by now. I mean, its as simple as shutting the **** up and minding your own business. He's a christian, he's a muslim, Im an antheist. We're all human. Imagine where our species would be right now if we didnt have this internal desire to beat the **** out of eachother for not sharing the same viewpoint.

    But,then again, maybe we'd all still be swinging from the trees...

    Rant over with, Thanks for listening

  13. We didn't need international support...those are OUR weapons raining down on them...oh and the UK helped out some too so their cool.

    If we goto war with Syria,or North Korea expect it over within minutes...but actions speak louder then words.

    What we do now. resonates to other countrys.
  14. Nelson
    Nelson's Avatar

    Don`t get complacent.
    North Korea has a far larger army than Iraq.
  15. Talking

    Sorry to get a little sidetracked. Anyone see what happened in San Francisco. The filthy liberals were marching across the Golden Gate Bridge spewing their ignorance. One of the *******s fell off the bridge and died.

  16. We didn't need international support...
    I know, but in the grand scheme of things, it would be nice to have most of the Global community on our side. Helping to pay for things. I would also like to be able to travel someday, without being castagated. These maniacs were rioting in front of a McDonalds, because they saw it as a symbol of America. That sure as hell isnt my symbol, but its just another example of human ignorance.

    A lot of the countries protesting the war dont even realize how much aid the US gives them. Take Egypt, for example. Something like 90% of the population is against US action, and yet they get more foreign aid than any other country.

    How many have you guys have been to college yet...have you noticed how many foreign students get to go to US schools for free? I worked my ass off to get through school, while foreign kids got to sit in the computer lab and make minimum wage doing WorkStudy, because the US gov't paid for them to be here.

    They need to shut that **** right down.


  17. Totally agree with that BigV.. I don't think we need to keep supporting countries that will not support us when we need it or want it.

  18. I have heard a few tidbits on the news that suggest that there may be evidence that the France is SOOO in bed with Iraq that Saddam himself told Jaucqe that if he did not public condemn the war that he would go to the media and reveal how deep their realationship really is. If there is even shred of evidence to this, France will become the bitch of the world, mocked for both its severe *****ness as well as its lack of moral judgment. Get in bed with a dictator and end up getting screwed by the whole world....ouch!

  19. wow, didn't realize it could run that deep... now wouldn't it be interesting if that was confirmed? "bitch of the world" indeed.

  20. see i had that notion the whole time, that France was "in bed" with Iraq, it was sort of obvious.

    I agree with BigV on the point that we should have definitely waited longer to start the war. People will say yeah we waited 12 years, thats long enough. Well thats exactly why waiting another month or 2 would not have mattered in the least really. It would have given us a chance to get some of the bigger countries to back us. True we don't need other coutries support militarily, but economically we certainly do.

    I say yes to the start of WW3. I think that within the next 2 years something like that is going to happen. It will all be over money, without a doubt.

    But seriously don't get to complacent. If we were to ever fight on north koreas soil, or china's soil with our ground troops, we would definitely be in it for the long haul. China alone has 2.5 million ground troops.....thats a lot of people folks.

    I was in Manhattan yesterday, where they were protesting against the war. THousands of people were there. Some people had shirts on with fake blood, saying end the war blah blah.....

    one guy had a sign that said "BOMB texas, they have oil too".
    one sign said "END THE WAR, END THE SANCTIONS"....its like hello man ..why do you think there was sanctions ass hole.

    i got into somewhat of an arguement with this one moron shouting into a mega this point i was venting to a friend loudly..and getting annoyed at a lot of these people so i just kinda snapped...

    basically i said to the guy..and not so nicely....
    i said..hey you like standing on that pole, and being able to shout in a ****ing mega phone and bash your own country and more importantly bash your own head of government, president you ****ing like that man or what.........hes like yeah i like it, and Im going to keep doing then i just said..ok ******* over to IRAQ and do something similary to this..see what happens to you and your family within the next 24 hours.....

    of course the idot just turned around and started blabbering in his magaphone..but seriously, these people have no real basis for their protesting....

    I wish i would have known about it ahead of time, i would seriously have set up a station that just portrayed sadam for the evil person he is......held up huge signs with dead children in their dead mothers arms etc.. wonder if they even realize any of that has happened....

    i wanted to announce to the protesters....hey guys you did got them to send the troops home......but theres one slight change......the troops are actually going to start patrolling our own streets, and testing their new weapons on us.....they are going to start with for the next few weeks they are gonna shoot random people with semi-auto and auto matic weapons...and oh yeah they are actually going to start bombing guys got your point across about the whole bomb texas they have oil you know what..they are going to....they are gonna see what kind of destruction the moab can do on a heavily populated city,......................... ............*******s


  21. I hear people saying we don't need this war
    I say there's some things worth fighting for
    What about our freedom and this piece of ground
    We didn't get to keep 'em by backing down
    Now they say we don't realize the mess we're getting in
    Before you start your preaching let me ask you this my friend

    Have you forgotten how it felt that day?
    To see your homeland under fire
    And her people blown away
    Have you forgotten when those towers fell?
    We had neighbors still inside going thru a living hell
    And you say we shouldn't worry 'bout bin Laden
    Have you forgotten?

    They took all the footage off my T.V.
    Said it's too disturbing for you and me
    It'll just breed anger that's what the experts say
    If it was up to me I'd show it everyday
    Some say this country's just out looking for a fight
    Well after 9/11 man I'd have to say that's right

    Have you forgotten how it felt that day?
    To see your homeland under fire
    And her people blown away
    Have you forgotten when those towers fell?
    We had neighbors still inside going thru a living hell
    And you say we shouldn't worry 'bout bin Laden
    Have you forgotten?

    Now I've been there with the soldiers
    Who've gone away to war
    And you can bet that they remember
    Just what they're fightin' for

    Have you forgotten all the people killed?
    Some went down like heros in that Pennsylvania field
    Have you forgotten about our Pentagon?
    And all the loved ones that we lost and those left to carry on
    Don't you tell me not to worry about bin Laden
    Have you forgotten?

    Have you forgotten how it felt that day?
    To see your homeland under fire
    And her people blown away
    Have you forgotten when those towers fell?
    We had neighbors still inside going thru a living hell
    And you say we shouldn't worry 'bout bin Laden
    Have you forgotten? Have you forgotten? Have you forgotten?

  22. I agree hamper19.
    I also think that the US jumping to the point of wanting to oust Saddan Hussein, and then waiting 8 months to get things past the UN, gave the ******* plenty of time to build up his defenses. As we can all see now, things are getting ugly. No doubt, the US is going to kick his ass to kingdom come and I just see on the news they may have found a chemical weapons plant, but...
    My biggest problem with the whole thing is that there are SO many problems here at home that need to be dealt with. You're send billions of dollars of foreign aid to countries that could give a **** if our people live or die, and yet you tell us to prepare for a bioterror attack with saran wrap and duct tape. How about nixing some of those porkbelly government bull**** money holes (I dont even need to name a few, Im sure you all can name some huge waste of public money in your own communities), and buy everyone in the US some serious protection gear? Or howabout having the Army Reserves hold classes in all major towns in America, educating us on how to protect ourselves against that ****? Or subsidizing US students who want to go to college to learn how to build more efficient engines, or develop defenses and antidotes for chemical and other terror weapons? I could go on and on...
    I think that the threat to the US is very real, 9/11 proves that. I also think that the majority of the people here still dont have a grasp on reality, and that most are not ready to deal with the big **** fest the world is about to turn into.
    Bush should have kept quiet, beefed up intellegence on all these ass-hole extreemist wackos, and beefed up our military, and started working on the problems we face in the interior. THEN started kicking ass.
    US troops are getting killed by the day over in that **** hole. They're getting killed for us, and that includes all of these dumb **** anti-war protesters. A lot of them dont even know what they're protesting for. War for oil. That may be a part of it...the thing is the decision has been made and if the government dosent give it 100%, its going to suck real bad.
    Tell Bush he sucks now wont do anything...he's already made the decision, and I think its best if he follows through with it.
    Its time for these people to go home and educate themselves about what this world is really about. Those countries HATE america. It may be because of the actions of our government, and that may not represent how all of us think. But its ****ing obvious that these extreemist ****s dont give a flying **** about that. I bet you not one of those protesters had a friend or loved one in the world trade center. We're all americans, they want to see all of us dead or worse. That right there is enough for me.
    Im not pro-War. I hate violence. I hate seeing people die and Id like to see peace at all costs. But the world hasnt ****ing matured enough to see things that way.
    Some AMERICAN kids father, some AMERICAN lady's husband was KILLED, so that people can have the right to stand in the street and express their views. But hey, this america, they have the right to do that, so power to them.
    But that could be my brother over there, and it probably will be soon. I think the president made a mistake. But now that our bros are over there dying for us, I just want to see them get their job done and get home ASAP.

    Sorry about the rant, the freaking Oscars are on TV right now and some of these clowns dont even realize its the sacrifices of the people in our military that allow them to state their naieve viewpoints and its pissing me right the **** off.

    Last edited by BigVrunga; 03-23-2003 at 11:16 PM.

  23. The core of the First Amendment is the right to speak out against the government. Without that right we might as well also live under Saddam.

  24. Michael Moore got booed when he spoke out against the Administration's actions.

  25. People should be able to speak out against the administration. I can see why they cut him off, though. The show is for actors to talk about art and movies...going off on world events is best saved for the OffTopic forum here at
    But regardless of the decision made by those in charge, those are our troops over there. I just dont want to see them dying for nothing.

  26. People can speak out against the war, but to call our men and women war criminals is treason.

  27. Did Michael Moore say anything to that effect? Honestly, I wasn't paying that close attention to his speach and I may have missed something. As I recall, he wasn't called off by the show's producers more than anyone else, but he was booed by the crowd.
    It is certainly improper to call our forces "war criminals" as long as they don't commit war crimes. Although, if our actions are illegal, as almost all international law theorists (unemployed by the Executive branch) have stated, it is proper to call our President a War Criminal. Now, if there are such weapons as President Bush has said existed shown to really exist...then our action becomes a justifiable illegal action. Although, still illegal.

  28. There is nothing illegal in this war. We have a passed UN resolution. Futhermore, International law is a joke. A country has the right to defend itself, preemptively if necessary, to protect itself regardless of what anyone else thinks about it. I dont care what anyone else thinks of our actions. We are justified and thats all that matters. That said, we have the second largest coaltion ever supporting us in this war. Were going to be fine. Bush is not a war criminal and I resent the implication that he is.

  29. Originally posted by Hal
    Michael Moore got booed when he spoke out against the Administration's actions.
    because he was, in this circumstance, an idiot. even the anti-war majority of the motion picture academy saw that... it was simply extremely distasteful. what little time you are given to acknowledge your accomplishments, thank your peers and pat yourself on the back is just that. it is not a free reign pulpit from which you can assumably spew your own agenda and opinions regarding completely different matters.

  30. because he was, in this circumstance, an idiot. even the anti-war majority of the motion picture academy saw that... it was simply extremely distasteful. what little time you are given to acknowledge your accomplishments, thank your peers and pat yourself on the back is just that. it is not a free reign pulpit from which you can assumably spew your own agenda and opinions regarding completely different matters.
    My thoughts exactly...


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