Education? Who really is smart
09-08-2013 09:30 PM
What is the real definition of smart? I want opinions lol
When someone goes to college or university to study a degree, example a doctors degree or a accountancy degree, medicine etc, how come people always say " he's really smart he is a doctor" " she's really smart she's an accountant". Why does this make them smart? Does this make them smarter than the average person? What I'm trying to say is, if I wanted to be a doctor, I would go to class, study and remember what I studied and answer questions on the given test day, if all I'm really doing is noting things down and trying to remember them when asked on the test, isn't education in field of degrees etc more in favour for people with good memory, does this necessarily make you smarter having a degree? I can understand when people say u need a certain level of wit about you to even do a degree as in not mentally challenged, also that its smart because they earn such and such amount of money, but thats off topic, im talking about the brain and not wages, if you take a mechanic and he knows all about cars, you take a doctor who knows all about the body and symptoms etc, who is smarter and why? Realistically your just more educated in your field of work, so why is it standard for people to think a doctor is smarter than a mechanic? A lawyer is smarter than a joiner? Or again are they just more knowledgeable in there field of work? Like anyone can study, which means anyone can pass a test if they remember what they studied and wrote the answer down, so what's your take? My take is the definition of smart lies Merely in more common sense, other definitions can't be explained because we are all gifted differently, some people are musically smart, some people are mathematically smart, some people are construction smart, its like taking an elephant a Lion and a monkey and a giraffe and asking them to climb a tree, who would win? obviously the monkey, is are education system really this stupid, you take all these different gifted children to take the same test and whatever the outcome, say a D the child then thinks that's all there worth?!!!!
09-08-2013 09:38 PM
i think IQ has somethin to do with it
is that a good answer?
09-08-2013 09:42 PM
That really leads back to how you adapt to a certain task and apply it, what I mean is take that story what Abraham Lincoln said "Give me six hours to chop down a tree and I will spend the first four sharpening the axe" which goes back to what I mean when I say it takes a certain wit to do anything and the average person would have that wit about them
09-08-2013 09:43 PM
That also makes me think of my opinion of common sense as defining a smart person lol
09-09-2013 04:37 AM
While I am often reading/replying to AM with my usual brand of wiseassedness and half-seriousness, this time it just might help someone, so I am going to put in my two cents in a serious manner.
This is not exactly what the OP addressed, but I feel the need to speak.
I am a first-line supervisor with a role in the hiring process (federal). This is my second government supervisory job within the past ten years or so.
With that said, I have sat on a few panels to evaluate applicants and review their CV/resumes, expressing our feelings both as a group and by our individual written recommendations. These are some of the most highly-sought job announcements in the world, often seeing around 100k applications for a realistic hiring of 100 individuals.
My colleagues and I agree that the best candidates bring to the table a good mix of education, employment, and life experience. Some of us are tempted to hire the 25-year-old wonder who earned a fast-track PhD, completed ROTC, and has a couple deployments as an Officer...but no real-life experience related to their education. Other supervisors like the 30-year-old who never finished school, but has shown a track record of increasing responsibility in a career, and tremendous life experience. But the one who will win our hearts will be he or she who has the degree(s), and the significant work experience, and the extensive life experience.
Your "definition of smart being common sense" pretty much sums it up in reality. Measured or perceived intelligence, and pieces of paper, only get you so far in life. I have seen geniuses who couldn't get out of their own way and had no people skills. I have seen people, like my good friend Brian, who would flunk any standardized test, yet can rebuild an engine or automatic transmission just by looking at it, and memorize all of the bolt torque specs without ever having to look at a manual more than once.
09-09-2013 08:56 AM
09-09-2013 09:46 AM
I am an engineering manager so I hire a lot of well-educated engineers. All are educated but not all are smart. The ability to quickly comprehend new concepts and apply them to real world situations is my definition of smart. Common sense is also involved. Some of the smartest people I know are not well educated. I have also hired highly educated engineers that cannot apply their knowledge to real world situations. They are great in an academic environment but lost in the real world.
09-09-2013 10:39 AM
Great response! Around where I live education was not a big thing 20 years ago, I know some self-made millionaires who own factory's shops and restaurants and have no form of education but can read and write and have nothing but experience to write on there C.V , What's your opinion on compulsory education ? Anything before Degrees or Alevels you have to do compulsory English, maths, French, religion Spanish, Art ,learning life and work, Physical education, technology, construction, science! This is compulsory for 5 years before you get to make a decision on your future! Do we really need all these? Lets be honest we forget most of it within a few months, how can a child cope with so many different things at once and remember them, then get marked and the mark affects the future study if they don't get the results, this is idiotic!!!!!
09-12-2013 10:35 PM
Just because someone has a college degree does not make them smart or intelligent. Trust me, talk to anyone who has a liberal arts degree or a masters/doctorate in psychology and you will seriously doubt their mental competence.
Lets be blatantly honest, human beings essentially break down into what could be described as complex biological computers. In regards to that some people will have nice aesthetics, such as some fancy gaming laptops or PC cases. This does not necessarily mean the insides are as good as the case, and often times it is the case that the insides do not match the outside. College is essentially nothing more than "Installing software" on the hard drive. You can install the most bad ass game of your dreams on a ****ty PC and say you have it, you got it, its in your hands now...but it does not mean it functions right, or is even remotely useful.
That is one of the biggest problems today people think college qualifies them for something. I have bounced around college as a confused young individual a few years back never settling on a path yet. Now I am in leadership at the company I work for with no college degree, but four of my employees have college degrees. Obviously its not serving them as well currently. Throughout the building I would say there are probably 40 people with college degrees working under people with no such degree...
Another main issue is that most colleges today teach strict regimes of what is "right". You get force fed quite a bit of the liberal agenda side of America and are taught to belittle anyone who thinks freely as being a right wing nut. College is mainly leftist individuals who are far worse than any catholic school nun could ever be. Its basically pick your poison. The individuals you meet who actually have "sovereignty" over their own minds are generally embittered and have a poor outlook on mankind and where it is headed.
Look back in history and most great poets, writers, inventors, artists, theologians, philosophers, and even military generals all have a negative and distrusting view of man. The arts focus on the darkness of mans soul and how he treats his fellow brethren. Philosophers and theologians prioritize redemption for mans failures and openly proclaim the failures of every man in the world. Generals and scientists make cold calculated decisions feeling confident that their distrust in man means that the losses or pain they cause is earned in at least some way and that progress justifies it.
Some of the most intelligent, useful things I have ever heard came from sources I normally write off on sight. You may be surprised when the quite drunkard in the bar corner who is there everyday finally opens his mouth during a moment of calamity and speaks wisdom that is worthy of the most aspiring guides of humanity such Martin Luther King or Ghandi.
Point being....college is nothing more than a tool, but most people who go to college actually become manufactured parts themselves to be used as tools instead of walking away from the experience with tool sets for their personal use.
The most successful people I know from high school did not go to college. They made their own rules and started their own businesses. To speak my honest opinion...some people are nothing more than cogs, and never will be anything more. They lack the presence, the mental capacity, and spiritual energy to mold anything around them into what they desire. They are simply play dough to be molded by others.
I used to feel bad for them, but I learned the greatest lesson in life in America over the last couple years. "Take what you can, give nothing back".
09-13-2013 01:31 AM
Take what you can give nothing back? That's the lesson you've learned over the last couple of years??
-I guarantee someone has "given" to you along your journey wether you know it or not.
As far as education and how it applies to capitalism and work or what people do for a living.... My belief is that most people fall into one of three categories the majority of the time.
Each category has pro's and con's and they all fight each other constantly.
Education drastically helps the technician. An example would be a doctor. They are technicians. Which is why most doctors are in debt up to their eyeballs and absolutely horrible businessmen. Same go for lawyers and other professions that requires a lot of technical know how.
Entrepreneurs can drop out of college or high school and still do very well because for them the education usually involves life experience and perception and the ability to "feel."
My point is simply that each one of us has something to offer and most if not all people have something valuable to give. It's up to you who perceives what they "know" as either being educated or smart or whatever.
My apologies for the lengthy comment.
09-13-2013 01:34 AM
The definition of smart is completely based on each persons own specific interpretation of intelligence.
-to answer your original question op.
09-13-2013 01:41 AM
To summarize my youth I lived giving constantly, doing missions, giving money to help people out(They lost a job, could not provide Christmas for their kids, car broke down, etc,etc), constant community work, volunteering for work at places like the Children's Hunger Alliance, dedicated to church for a few years...
Originally Posted by hardwork25
In the end after all the betrayals, lies, and frequent backstabbing that happened I simply no longer have a positive view of humanity and I judge each person on their usefulness to me. I mean I will stop and help and old lady or someone broken down, yeah. But anything monetary based or that requires a larger time investment than an hour and rules change. I see us as an overpopulated species that is under performing mostly because we hold back the best in order to subsidize the incompetent.
Guess I gave too much and accidentally gave away my humanity, huh? lol
Which by the way I am a trans-humanist when it comes to my ideals of where the species is going and what role technology will play in our development as a species.
09-13-2013 01:50 AM
Originally Posted by Zero V
We are not overpopulated regardless of what the media or certain people want you to believe. And as a species we aren't perfect but we are far from under performers.
Where did you do your mission? What specifically made you stray or leave the Mormon community?
I personally believe we are and have been making progress. Hell 50 years ago we didn't let blacks and whites drink from the same fountains or eat at the same places.
Lots of people seem to think the world is so much worse now than ever before or today's youth is so bad etc etc. people have very short memories and lack historical knowledge.
09-13-2013 02:02 AM
Most definitely NOT a Mormon lol. I did missionary work in Mexico(Piedras Negras). Christian, Pentecostal. As for the overpopulation I simply believe Nationalism is the most effective way to run a nation if you want to to be united, effective, and successful. But thanks to America and the U.N. Most Western countries are suffering from identity crises and focused only on special rights groups for cultures that are not their own. Nationalistic countries that are trending upward are Sweden, Switzerland, Finland, Russia, etc. Larger nations have to constantly pump money into 3rd world countries instead of letting nature take its course(disease, famine, etc). Half the time with no gratitude.
Originally Posted by hardwork25
The following is just an opinion, and a tangent based off of the whole "Making progress" bit.
And part of the main problem is that "Progress" has become perverted from its original intentions. Martin Luther King would **** gold bricks today if he encountered the black American culture of modern America. You also have issues with feminists, and every other special rights group you can imagine. With ever law passed to "secure rights" for one group another pops up. After homosexuality you will see pansexuals demanding public acceptance. Then you will see the arguments to lower the legal age of dating so that guys can nail younger girls. They will provide arguments such as the advanced rate of maturation due to education combined with exposure to hormones in food resulting in maturation to young adulthood sooner, etc. Trust me its already forming. Each step is met with resistance but thanks to the desensitization from the last one as well as people who are partaking in something who do not want to have to account for their actions they want to ensure the "Red line" moves farther and farther away. Remember cheating used to result in isolate and being shunned by your entire community. Today its "People make mistakes, don't judge me". I do not think failing more values counts as progress.
And with each step, we WILL take another. Things do not stop, they simply go and go until collapse happens. Every great empire falls, and so must we as we have lost any and all direction in the western nations. Polluted within by false "progress".
FYI, I have zero problems with race or skin color.(This relates to "Progress") I do have severe problems with certain cultures and if a specific shade of skin partakes in it more than others that is not my fault. Example: I love my friends from Guana, Benign, etc who work with me. Intelligent men, obviously African. They all hate black America because of the culture, the race cards, the disrespect, special rights, etc. And are very verbal about it and look down upon what goes on here and complain more about black on white racism than white rednecks do. None of the "Oh woe is me" race card self entitlement bull****. I do not want to subsidize entire swaths of the country that are incapable of sustaining themselves. But part of "Progress" is just that...subsidizing problem cultures.
But just by speaking that last part, I am now a racist by default to any democrat because I pointed out some painful truths. Progress should not mean we are bound by the shackles of tyrannical political correctness. Even though my last girlfriend was black. Once again though, she did not participate in that "culture" that affects a large portion, but not all. Wiggers are included in that culture as well.
09-13-2013 02:31 AM
Originally Posted by Zero V
I apologize as when I hear someone say mission I assume a Mormon mission since I live in an area with a large Mormon population.
Identity crisis? Who is anyone to say that any race or group lay claim to this country before or over another?
As far as 1st world countries helping third world countries and this idea of we give them everything and don't get anything in return is again in my opinion a lack of historical knowledge. Since the beginning of humans a dominant society has helped a lesser one. Think about technology that has been shared, ideas, philosophy, etc. no one country or population group can lay claim to any of those ideas. When America was first settled upon lots and lots of things we now have in abundance and use as resources aren't from America. ie; horses, pigs, buffalo. All were imported from other countries and society's early on. My point being Wealth and progress is at its peak when their is a free market for ideas and growth. Free market being open and open to all.
Martin Luther king would def not s**t gold bricks today. We have a black president for crying out loud. Blacks go to college and have a lot of the same rights as whites. Your version of black America is def not black America realistically lol.
Please share with me what you would consider a "problem culture."
09-13-2013 02:34 AM
As far as your statement about special rights groups I agree that people in special rights groups have one view and one view only.
The issue I am having is based off of your comments it seems to me like you are yourself in a special rights group that believes their rights or way is better or best.
But hey to each their own. I respect your opinions even if I don't agree with some of them.
09-13-2013 02:00 PM
I think everyone will have a different opinion based on personal experiences. Personally for me smart would be a person that has the ability to manage and control every single aspect of his life with passion, love, honesty and responsibly. IMHO smart for me is described as someone who is successful at work (with or without a college degree) successful at home (meaning with his family and friends). I love to see and hear stories of people who know how to juggle work, house, sports, etc and still have time to serve God and do good things for others. To me that's someone that's smart. But a person that is good at his work but a piece of **** outside of it I wouldn't consider smart. That's just my point of view. So basically i define smart as the ability to handle with success multiple tasks at the same time with balance. That's impressive!!
11-24-2013 10:00 PM
Smart is a broad term. A bachelor program will give most people, who apply themselves in the program, will end with a good knowledge base. People who pursue a graduate degree will finish as a expert in their field of study making them more smart than the average uneducated individual in regards to their specialization.
BUT people can self educate themselves also. Look what we are doing here.
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