15 states petition to leave the USA
- 11-16-2012, 01:58 PM
If invention and innovations means 1T+ deficits, then you can keep em.
Left to their own devices, the only states that wouldn't make it in today's world is the utmost northern... only because they no longer have the land to produce food with.. that is the southern states primary economy force.
It was the people with degree's that knew better than the common working man that the Community Reinvestment Act was good for us... see where that got us? And the Wall street people with degree's who bet on the CRA failing miserably... yet another step in the right direction. We got away from hard work, and now people feel to high and mighty to get their hands dirty. (Oh, and yes I have and advanced degree )
I am not for the states leaving the union.. but they do have the right to make their voice heard that the direction of the this country is not on a sustainable course, and given the electoral college landscape, only two real states control elections.. of which are the biggest drain on our national economy and produce the most national debt.The Historic PES Legend
- 11-16-2012, 02:29 PM
Originally Posted by DAdams91982
Id be interested to see how the southern states would do without ag subsidies. Probably not too well. American grown food would be just about unaffordable.
I'm glad to see we can differ in opinion without getting personal. Not too many people can debate without hating the other person.Formutech Nutrition Rep----------------Check out my CONQU3R log!:
- 11-16-2012, 02:47 PM
The AG subsidies are a problem as well. That is Gov. stepping in and controlling what someone grows to "benefit" the US rather than letting the free market decide, and price point all crops. It was one of the reasons for swift inflation in the past, especially on food. Now ethanol is pretty much required in all gas blends, which has shot up food prices associated with corn astronomically... my G' Damn tortilla chips are getting spendy!
As a libertarian, to me we have just allowed too much encroachment into our daily lives, allowing people who are so far separated from the common man to dictate down to us what is good for us and our family's. This is easily visible by congress exempting themselves out of Obamacare as well as the unions that bought them into office.
Dammit, if I want to buy a 32oz diet coke.... best damn well be able to. Not to single out NY... just they have the most liberal laws on the books. Including the new ones that you cannot donate food to the homeless since NY Heath Agency can't regulate the fat and salt intake of homeless from donated food (Bloomberg is taking it way to far). (Just a vent about to much government intervention)The Historic PES Legend
11-16-2012, 03:15 PM
What I've always said and will continue to say, democrat, republican, libertarian, whatever, nothing will ever get any better if we don't ALL do the best we can as often as we can to make our own lives and the lives of those around us better every day. Until every single person in this country lives by that, nothing's going to get better
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11-16-2012, 03:26 PM
My understanding of this, being from Texas, is that because the land does not belong to the United States and Texas joined the Union as a sovereign state it is capable of seceding since the federal government does not actually own the land.Originally Posted by DAdams91982
11-16-2012, 03:59 PM
Fed's don't really own state land (They do have some).. but really the state is owned by the people of said state. The state is bound by the agreement to enter the US essentially. Ironically the states own the fed.. due to the 10 amendment... but it seems to have grown the other way around.
The Historic PES Legend
11-16-2012, 04:07 PM
11-16-2012, 04:16 PM
03-03-2013, 12:04 PM
And on a more serious note, an economic analysis has shown that as an independent nation we would be the 11th wealthiest, much higher up than the US as a whole, especially with our resources out of the equation. International shipping ports, OPEC oil numbers, farming and agriculture, multiple universities et cetera. Most of us don't agree with current politics and the direction they are taking us at the federal level and would love to "take our ball and go home".
The ****ed up thing is that people are running en masse from home states with failed economies to ours where the job, housing, retail et cetera markets are strong, but instead of accepting our obviously superior policies and ideologies, they bring their failed bull**** to us and try to apply political pressure here to bring about socio-economic changes they are used too. Then when they encounter significant resistence they bash Texas as backwards while reaping the benefits of Texas their familiar ideologies can't produce.
Step in line or let us go!
03-03-2013, 12:10 PM
03-03-2013, 12:20 PM
03-03-2013, 12:29 PM
03-03-2013, 08:29 PM
03-03-2013, 08:56 PM
03-03-2013, 09:17 PM
The fact that our country has become such a f***ed up socialist state kills me every day. My take on this is put all the politicians on minimum wage and take all their benefits. Eliminate welfare , food stamps and all the "support the lazy" program.
Our country needs to stop taxing the F**k out of us to give our money to a high school drop out or worst an illegal.
Trash me all you want for my views but I have lived out side of the USA in country were the government does not support laziness, guess what their taxes are lower and their government does not impose on their rights. Don't get me wrong I love my country, but I hate they way it runs and every day it gets worse.
I would love for just one state to leave the union and implement the gold standard just to see if people will wake up.
03-03-2013, 09:44 PM
03-03-2013, 09:50 PM
03-03-2013, 09:58 PM
03-03-2013, 11:01 PM
http://www.examiner.com/article/coul...-facts-say-yeshttp://www.examiner.com/article/coul...-facts-say-yes we could certainly pull it off. Militarily we wouldn't be the smallest army in the world and we are certainly armed. The US slapping an embargo on us is bull****. Our balls would be sucked harder than Saudi Arabias. We own not only huge oil reserves but nearly the entire refinery system for the US. Some of the most prominent defense contractors are located here and we are home to more fortune 500 hq's than any other state thanks to favorable tax environments, giving us leverage to pull the trade strings.
Sure there are plenty of variables but it wouldn't be the first time a new and resource rich nation formed and flourished against establishment odds.
This article is not a conclusive secession success plan by any means but makes some interesting discussion points from an economic perspective: well my phone is forcing the link in to the text.
03-06-2013, 01:13 PM
03-06-2013, 04:51 PM
Comments down there suggest Texas got 6.4 BILLION dollars from the stimulus as well in direct cash payments. Make no mistake about it Texas is hardly the rebel state not having the federal gov't do anything to help it out and beacon of economic freedom.
Still, they are just doing what everyone else does. But secession? Yeah that comes up all the time since we started this country. Someone call me when it isn't fancy dancy hyptheticals or some people signing a petition. The left wasn't serious about moving to Canada if Bush won in 04 and the right isn't serious about leaving the country now that we re-elected Obama. No matter how passionately they threatened.
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03-06-2013, 05:01 PM
A number of posters point to Texas as a member of an economically weak union which is inaccurate in the case of a secession. No, we wouldn't be eligible for aid but then we wouldn't be paying federal taxes either. Autonomy is the argument and our economy would have to be viewed from a completely autonomous stand point.
Our oil industry alone makes 6.4 billion look like a days work and that wealth concentrated within our borders, along with the tech, defense, health care, agricultural and chemical industries that we don't recieve credit for would show a completely different economic landscape in an independent Texas than being a big tit for a struggling country to suck from as we are now.
03-06-2013, 05:27 PM
This has 0 chance of happening and is nothing but a fairy tale fun hypothetical to play with. By all means play on. It was fun watching the left pretend they were actually getting up and getting out after Bush won in 04 and it's fun to watch the right discuss it now. I would bet ANY sum of money possible Texas is a state in the United States for the rest of your lifetime.
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03-06-2013, 05:36 PM
03-06-2013, 07:36 PM
03-06-2013, 08:38 PM
"Texas will again lift its head and stand among the nations. It ought to do so, for no country on the globe can compare with it in natural resources."
Sam Houston said that. A Texas revolutionist, a president of the nation of Texas and a guy who wanted an independent Texas in the 1800's post annexation. We hadn't even discovered oil yet.
If I could hop on a horse and rally support you can believe I would and we have had candidates for high state offices run with secession in their platform in the not too distant past. Our standing governer has mentioned it only half jokingly.
One major problem is that much of our population consists of people from other states (and always has) who have run here en masse in the last ten years especially for our prosperity and who would never consider leaving the nation.
Another is a very large hispanic population with illegal cousins and uncles who would fear a Texas gov't would be less friendly on illegal immigration than a state under federal pressure to look the other way. These legal hispanics would vote in the millions to stay with the US to protect their illegal counter parts.
I'm not debating the practicality of seceding itself, only discussing the fact that yes, we could stand alone given the opportunity and that this isn't an Obama inspired, knee jerk idea. At least not for us. "Lonestar" is the subculture for natives here and always has been. If I was actually asking the US gov't to let us go, it wouldn't be on a random bodybuilding sub-forum, it's just a discussion.
03-07-2013, 03:40 AM
03-07-2013, 06:46 PM
TG has made very valid points ITT.
As a Texas Native I can attest to the fact that the idea of an independent Texas is not recent. People have been discussing the idea since I was in grade school (and longer I'm sure).
03-07-2013, 07:29 PM
03-08-2013, 02:13 PM
Texas indeed has a long independent history, maybe more than any other state and that sense of state pride maybe more than any other state. That much is not up for debate. But Texas isn't going anywhere. And neither is any other state.
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