- 10-24-2004, 10:53 PM
I'm watching a Fox special right now on eating disorders. All I see is people making bad decisions andblaming everyone else but themselves. Blame society, the fashion industry, models, etc.
I'm with Thomas Szasz on this one. Too many things that are really just bad behaviors, serious as they and their consequences may be, are just that. They aren't diseases.
- 10-24-2004, 11:22 PM
How sad your post is........Have you ever had a eating disorder??? I can answer that one, your post actually makes me sad........As I have suffered and right now as a matter of fact, in the middle of one........The whole can't eat thing....It goes deeper than you know or ever will know.......
It's a control thing, your life is so out of control, that you can't seem to cope, that the one thing you have control over is what you eat...Sick this I know, sad yes I know that to..........I never asked for cancer, nor did i ask for a bleeding ulcer, I never asked to have my hair start to thin, or have people stare at me, and tell me I look tired, I look to thin,.........but yes this is the hand that I have been dealt.......So for me, control, I don't/can't eat.......when I eat I get sick, it's the one thing in my life that i have a say over.......I work, I teach special ed, I work out everyday, I run, I am the strong one, the one all lean on when things go to ****, I am the best friend, the caring daughter, the kind one who loves all kids, challenged or not.........That is me........... <sigh>
I don;t tell you this to make you feel badly for me, but i say this because it is a issue, I cant control it, that;s just it, you have no control in your life, so this is the one thing that you have control over.....eating........or not to......Make sense????!!!!
You more than likely don't see what I am saying, to many it's just sit down and freaking eat, but it's not that way, at least I am one step ahead of most I know i have an issue, most don't or won't admit to it...............
I am not preaching, please don't take it that way, you just hit a nerve with me.......perhaps after reading this you may think twice..........
10-24-2004, 11:58 PM
One, the post I made was not sad, it was a statement of what I think. As for not 'understanding,' I went through a major depression that lasted for almost a decade, so I do have a point of view on mental illness that comes from experience. What it took to break that depression wasn't drugs, though I tried a few, but discipline and a lack of tolerance for BS, especially from myself.Originally Posted by wranglergirl
As for your example of cancer, that has an identifiable cause, it isn't a conglomeration of behaviors that some psyche major gave a name to. A disease has an etiology, mental illnesses do not. As for the lack of control you feel in your life, I used to whine about such things too until I realized I was bull****ting myself. I'm a human being with a will and the ability to make decisions, period. That's all it took, learning that to change things in my life I wasn't happy with. The change came with costs that I was once too scared or unhappy to bear, but that is an unwillingess to face reality, not a disease.
10-25-2004, 12:22 AM
First off, I'd like to wish WranglerGirl the best of luck and express much respect for her strength.
Now, I respectfully disagree. In your case you may not have control, but in most cases, people are definately responsible for their own fate, eating habits and weight included. For once, the media did a damn good thing with that show, "The Biggest Loser". The demonstrated to the nation that morbid obesity could be overcome with hard work, dedication, and self control. Self control and responsibility being major factors. Most people like to blame their weight problems or eating disorders on someone else or something else, but most of the time that's just an excuse for being weak, plain and simple.
If these people need to blame someone, they should put the blame on those who deserve it; mainly the morons who convince people that they're weak, have no control, and that it's not their fault. If instead of hearing, "I'm sorry, you have a disease...a mental illness." they heard "well, physiologically you're just just fine. Take a little responsibility for yourself and develop a healthy diet and lifestyle-- you'll be just fine."
The former instill's helplessness into a person while the later gives a person a sense of control; they may be ashamed, but shame can be a motivating factor. So if there is any responsible party, it's the people who have created this epidemic self-pity and helplessness. Just my .02.
10-25-2004, 12:59 AM
Exactly what I belie, Kwy. I don't deny the emotional pain a lot of these people go through, I went through quite a bit of it myself. The hardest part about getting depression for me has been admitting most if not all of that was self inflicted, and what the hell that means in the larger picture of just who the **** I am.
10-25-2004, 01:09 AM
Well, I'm glad to hear you've overcome your "weakness". Althought it sounds rude to say it that way, IMHO, it would be too incorrect to call it an illness so, I'd rather not use that term... I'm sure you understand what I'm getting at, lol.Originally Posted by CDB
Anway, out of curiousity, if you don't mind I'd like to ask you a couple questions.
1.) Did you seek professional help?
2.) Did you get some politicallly correct loon reinforcing your behavior by telling you "it's not your fault, its a disease"?
I've never been in the same boat as you, so all of my statements are based off of observation and theory, so that's why I ask.
LOL. I think the most classic example of a person inflicting their own illness is one case in which one of Freud's (I think it was Freud, maybe someone more educated on the matter can correct me if I'm wrong.) patients, a woman, lost the ability to use one of her hands. She came to Freud (?) as a last resort becaue her doctor could find nothing wrong with her. Well, eventually, this victorian lady admitted that she'd used that hand to perform sexual acts on her husband and shortly thereafter, she regained use of her hand again. That one is freggin' classic!
10-25-2004, 01:46 AM
Fine all I am saying is that sometimes there are other factors, that are beyond are control..........2 sides too all stories...????? I am just saying don't forget that although some have control, others don't..........
And for the record I don't whine........I never have, I dont expect help, nor do I belive anyone can, I can help me......ME ALONE, this much I know.......I feel for you and your depression, and very glad you overcame it........I can guess that was a tough ass thing to overcome........
Thanks for the well wishes KWY, i am trying like hell to hang in there....one day at a time right...........
So although i am sure you will have a responce to this post I am shutting down for awhile, so while i am upgrading my computer i can get the rest and relaxation I need....................thanks for all the well wishes and support........I have enjoyed this forum for the most part.....
10-25-2004, 01:46 AM
That's exactly what it was in the end.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
Saw a shrink. Basically it just helped to have someone who had to listen to me bitch about things. after a while I felt like an ******* for bitching about the things I could change, and learned ways to deal with the things I couldn't change. Took a while though.Anway, out of curiousity, if you don't mind I'd like to ask you a couple questions.
1.) Did you seek professional help?
No, he was actually very oriented on behavior modification, thankfully.2.) Did you get some politicallly correct loon reinforcing your behavior by telling you "it's not your fault, its a disease"?
Good, I hope you never are. Saying it isn't a disease isn't the same as saying it's easy. It's simple in the end, but not easy. Basically imagine every negative thought you've ever had about yourself and everything else, spinning in your head nonstop. Almost like a rain storm of ****ty feelings that you just can't seem to fight. In the end you can't fight it as you are because your response to it is negative, so it reinforces itself in your head. After years of this going on with few breaks, you can imagine what kind of mental shape I was in. And while it was ****ed up and I had some help, in the end it wasn't something like cancer, because I could choose to beat it. It all came down to whether I was going to learn how to change myself or wallow in **** for the rest of my life, which if things kept going as they were would have been very, very short.I've never been in the same boat as you, so all of my statements are based off of observation and theory, so that's why I ask.
10-25-2004, 01:55 AM
Not really, I wish you well, but lack of control is not a disease. The best way to overcome something like what you're dealing with is to realize the solution is simple. I am now and always will be against the labeling of every bad behavior as a disease. People do things on a daily basis that seem insance and no one considers them diseased, because they aren't.Originally Posted by wranglergirl
No one can simply choose to not have cancer, it isn't that simple. I could and did choose to change my way of thinking. You could and should choose to change your eating habits. You say your eating is the one part of your life you have control over, but since you can't choose to simply eat more or stop purging then you obviously don't have control over your eating habits. See the contradiction?
Like I said I wish you well, I wouldn't wish that kind of situation on anyone, but I disagree more strongly than I can put into words with your position on this issue. Choice is what seperates a disease from a behavior. I know how hard it can be to change a habit, to do something that goes contrary to what you want and what you've done for extended periods of time, but that difficulty doesn't change the fact that it does simply come down to a matter of choice.
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