People lying about gains made on cycle...
- 06-14-2004, 10:35 PM
People lying about gains made on cycle...
This is kind of a thread that resembles the "Lying about weights lifted" thread.
After all the reading I've done and continue to do, I've read through A LOT of cycle logs and personal experiences at numerous boards. I think that is a great additon when researching or just to answer a question you have about your cycle, etc, when you feel like you need more info, which is 99% of the time for myself...
So, I've read so many damn times that some of these guys say that they gained like 30-40lbs. in only 10 weeks on a first cycle.....and some even go on to say that they can continue to do this every single time they cycle and at low doses....and some with high doses...
Now, I'm sorry, but I fail to see how you can possibly gain that much from using AAS in only a short amount of time. I don't care if it's your first time cycling androgens, or you're running 10 grams total/week. I just cannot grasp how that would be physically possible.
I mean experience will come into play when making assumptions, and I know that I don't have that much usage behind me, and I realize that. But, this just seems WAY beyond an after-school special when some of these guys post.
I'm on my first cycle still which is prop, and entering week 5. I missed 2-3 workouts due to an injury but that shouldn't be holding me back THAT much. I'm up 6 lbs. from the start and have had about 15lbs. in strength increases....usually 5lbs. on each exc/week...eating close to 5500 cals/week on average, and training along w/ it is totally dialed in...
Now, I have no doubt that the prop is working its magic and I'm pretty happy with my cycle so far. I mean, how often do you have 5lb. increases each week when you're over 230lbs? But, these gains that people report just seem super exaggerated to me...anybody else? If so, let us know your thoughts on expectations, gains, strength, stacks, etc, that will directly effect what kind of results that you will get...
- 06-14-2004, 11:03 PM
Yea its certaintly sketchy to say the least. As IA pointed out if people could really continue this trend of 20 lbs a cycle then it would take about 6 cycles in about 2 years for someone to jump up to the upper 200's. And from what I see in the gym there are not many upper 200 lbs boybuilders. Power lifters yes, but LBM they are no where near upper 200's. (I am speaking locally)
- 06-14-2004, 11:40 PM
Well in the gym's around my area there are some pretty big guys, but you know what they all have in common? They're all older, like say late 30's to mid 40's...that is being both 250lbs. or over and incredibly lean....
Even with that said though, they have some serious experience behind their belts.
It just doesn't seem as though some guys are telling the truth...why??....I have no idea why you would lie about how much you gain...I mean, how boring must your life be?? LOL....
AAS aren't like the forbidden fruit, and while being on right now, I just can't grasp how the human body could possibly make such a drastic change in such a short amount of time...dunno, maybe it's just me, but unless they're gaining 10lbs. of water, 20lbs. of fat, and 10-15lbs. of muscle, then they're pants are on fire. I'm suspecting most of them also never hardly picked up a weight until then either...
Basically, until I see it with my own eyes, I'm not gonna and simply not able to believe it...
06-14-2004, 11:44 PM
yeah I've always found it strange also. I don't think people realize how huge of a diffrence 15 or even 10 lean lbs can make. I think if someone really gained 30 or 40lbs of lean tissue the stretch marks would be hideous.
06-14-2004, 11:45 PM
06-15-2004, 12:09 AM
I think people tend to stretch the truth about "net gains" (after PCT) from a cycle. Maybe people don't want to admit they slacked some on PCT or diet and lost more than they expected. Or they do something stupid like cut cals too low while taking TriMax like I did early this year! I'm happy if I can come away from an M1T cycle (love the ****, I get hardly any sides from it!) and net 3-5 solid(regardless of scale fluctuations) lbs after PCT is said and done. Doesn't sound like a lot, but at my age I take what I can get!
06-15-2004, 12:14 AM
Originally Posted by intv
Yeah I hear ya....M-1T was by far the fastest mass-gainer of all for me....I did gain around 13 or so lbs. in 2 weeks, but that was some fat and water that magically made it's way into my body somehow....After PCT I only had 4lbs. left of that, and that was my first and last time using it...
06-15-2004, 12:39 AM
I think that happens often. I know alot of guys do not keep their gains that well, and I wonder how many are bull****ting on forums saying they did/will. If I net 7-10lbs LBM per cycle I'm a happy camper (and not a short and light 2 week cycle, either).Originally Posted by intv
06-15-2004, 12:54 AM
Perhaps those who gained 15-20lbs were just starting out at the gym, did their research about ph, got some advice on proper training protocols, raised their calories faithfully to 4000 for the first time in their lives for a few weeks on cycle. Could happen that way.
06-15-2004, 01:00 AM
I could go on forever about this. I like to think about it like this; go to the market and buy 20lbs of steak and then hang it on your body, that would be roughly 20lbs of muscle. It is ALOT of steak.
People are always claiming to make these great gains cycle after cycle(especially with the new steroidal supplements). If this was the case, why are more guys not 300lbs? The guys who blow up often fail to recognize the fat gain and the water gain and even that tapers off in the end.
I think your cycle is going fine.
06-15-2004, 01:06 AM
06-15-2004, 11:20 AM
I think you hit the nail on the head. There are 3 reasons I see for these false reports.Originally Posted by Jergo
1. They did gain 30lbs, but 20lbs of it is fat & water. They are telling you their weight from the last day of the cycle.
2. They had decent gains & tell you they kept 100% of it, but they don't tell you the cycle just ended 3 days ago. Ask them again 4 weeks later how much of their gains they kept.
3. They are teenagers or noobs in the 150lb-175lb range who are just starting out. It's possible to shoot from 155 to 180 over a first cycle if you've never really trained before. Of course you will lose some after too. It's a lot harder to gain 10lbs or more if you are an experienced BBer & over 200lbs already.
06-15-2004, 02:06 PM
It depends on the drug they are taking too. If they are taking something like D-bol some of the weight will be water.
06-15-2004, 09:08 PM
people who say they gained 20 lbs of mostly lbm do not generally measure their bf and usually they just gained 10 lbs of muscle and 10 lbs or fat/water. then they lose 5 lbs of the muscle while cutting. so the net gain is a solid 5 lbs if they do things right.
of course there are exceptions, but there are also a ton of guys who lose all their gains because keeping gains you got by elevating you hormone levels to unnatural highs is tough when these hormone levels return back to normal - and just because you kept your gains during pct when you were pumped full of nolva, 6-oxo and other supps does not mean ****. your body will try to go back to where it was before naturally once you are off everything, so when **** comes up in life, be it women, work, travel, exams at school or whatever, people slack off from gym/diet and then they slowly return to their natural weight. older guys know the dedication it takes so they can keep that 5 lbs lbm per cycle. again, i'm sure there are exceptions, but this is the norm.
06-15-2004, 09:20 PM
yep, good points here...
I'm glad I'm not the only one who agrees with me...
Point is, juice or no juice, adding muscle takes time and hard work, period.
The longer the road you travel, the easier it will become due to the knowledge you pick up along the way...
06-15-2004, 10:23 PM
Lying about gains on cycle is also causing outrageous expectations. It's making people think that aas's are miracle drugs. People are taking them w/out first having their diet/training in check.
The real problem here is people using before they are ready. Newby's hear about how great m1t is and how it's legal so they jump on. And like it was already said the 160 lbm "bodybuilder" who's been training for 2 months gains 15 lbs. Then he posts about how great his cycle was, but doesn't mention he lost 15 lbs post cycle. I would be confident in saying this problem isn't coming from any vets. It's coming from the guys who have no business using any kind of hormone.
06-18-2004, 03:31 PM
i think most of the posts are exagerrated; but some of them are also people who claimed they gained 20-25lbs; and they're on the 4th or 5th day of PCT... and then its their last post...
06-18-2004, 09:30 PM
Im on my first cycle right now, 500mg TestE 12 weeks, M1T 1st 4 weeks, 50mgs Anavar for remainder.
When I started I was coming off a DNP cycle and weighed in at 177 lbs, 3 weeks later after starting my cycle, I hit 207 on the scale. I couldnt believe my eyes, last week I hit 215, then I ceased M1T and started Var, and now Im back to 205 and decreasing daily. Talk about a roller coaster.
I know that less 50% of this weight is pure muscle, but most newbies don't nor do they want to know. Hell they've never seen 5lbs of muscle or course they want to think its 30 lbs they got. Its all a mind game that people play with theirselves. Everyone wants to be that guy who says he gained 30 lbs on cycle, but for some odd reason they still weigh 180 when its all said and done.
People should throw the weight figures out the window, and start posting measurements. Thats all that matters.
06-18-2004, 10:46 PM
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