"So help me God!?!"

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B5150

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the "so help me god" came from Washington himself, as he fumbled through his inauguration
 
B5150

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I realize where it came from.

The oath was administered by the Chief Justice, as "So help me God". This was not a fumble. If it is not constitutional why perpetuate it. If it is perpetuated why not make it constitutional.

Did he swear to God? Did he need to swear to God? Why would he swear to God?
 
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actually most historians believe it was a George Washington fumble as it was never part of the plan for him to say.
 
B5150

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Let me be more direct. I am not looking to direct or insinuate anything in your direction.

God is politically incorrect. I no longer have a Christmas Holiday or Easter Holiday in my kids school. Americans want God kept of our schools via Creationism, prayer and the PoA. They want God out of our public buildings and public places.

Yet God is in our PoA, on our currency and in our courts and other state and federal buildings.

When Obama is in office and he enacts and repeals laws of the likes of abortion and gay marriage how will it be?

It is right for you to kill your unborn child for whatever reason you see fit..."So help me God"

It is right for a man to marry a man and a woman to marry a woman..."So help me God"

I see such a blindness and hypocrisy in so much of our government and our citizenship in this matter of God and faith.

How does the "So help me God" fly under the radar socially and politically in this case of our presidential oath?

Is "So help me God" and "God bless America" a selective soliloquy with selective literal implications?

I don't know if I am communicating my point like I would desire to.
 
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Let me be more direct. I am not looking to direct or insinuate anything in your direction.

God is politically incorrect. I no longer have a Christmas Holiday or Easter Holiday in my kids school. Americans want God kept of our schools via Creationism, prayer and the PoA. They want God out of our public buildings and public places.

Yet God is in our PoA, on our currency and in our courts and other state and federal buildings.

When Obama is in office and he enacts and repeals laws of the likes of abortion and gay marriage how will it be?

It is right for you to kill your unborn child for whatever reason you see fit..."So help me God"

It is right for a man to marry a man and a woman to marry a woman..."So help me God"

I see such a blindness and hypocrisy in so much of our government and our citizenship in this matter of God and faith.

How does the "So help me God" fly under the radar socially and politically in this case of our presidential oath?

Is "So help me God" and "God bless America" a selective soliloquy with selective literal implications?

I don't know if I am communicating my point like I would desire to.
You got it across with this post B. I understand what you are saying.

In most instances it seems to me that this topic is subjective. Its the Burger King generation. Your way, right away.

Its sad
 
Zero V

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Its disappointing to me. This country was built on certain principles, and through those principles it rose to be the most powerful nation on earth. Ever since we starting removing God from everything at the demand of certain groups, have you not noticed the country slowly die as God is more and more rejected? Our country was built on faith, for faith has won America its favor in wars, and in politics. Strip away that faith, and what do you have l left.

Since the 50's America has been like a brain cancer patient, slowly dieing and becoming more irrational in the process. The reason many of us know where America is headed, is because we see how hard atheists and such are pushing for God to be removed from everything. All they are really asking is for God to take his hand off this country and let it die. Well.... Patterns don't lie. The more atheists win the politics, the closer America comes to its deathbed.

Personally I think every president of our nation should swear in on the Bible, and under God. I am expecting a flaming for this part. But of every Christian/atheist i have met. Christians are likely to follow way more morals and are likelyto be more effective than the atheists I have met. I have seen every atheist fired from the places I have worked due to their ethics. Every one, always was fired. I know not every atheist is like that, but seeing such a large amount be like that...

I am uncertain of Obama's beliefs.Whether or not he chooses to use a reference to God will foretell a lot. He might fix our economy, but he may also murder the American spirit. Depending on how he runs things.

Ive been reading lately many things that describe what "Americans". We went from "God fearing, unbreakable light of hope" to "Most medicated and depressed and most likely to bleed cheeseburger grease if you shoot them". Congrats to all those who fight to make it like this...

If you build a nation on a rock, then once its finished, you yank the rock from underneath it. Just like a building it will crumble. America was build on "The Rock", on faith to God.

The word God is now thrown around without any real respect or homage to God himself.

:unitedstates:

Aight boys, got yer flamer throwers read, :23:
 
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Zero, I would love to rip this apart, and yes you gave a variety of angles to play, I will leave it be. I disagree entirely, in fact couldnt disagree more. However, you are entitled to your opinions
 
Bravoboy

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Let me be more direct. I am not looking to direct or insinuate anything in your direction.

God is politically incorrect. I no longer have a Christmas Holiday or Easter Holiday in my kids school. Americans want God kept of our schools via Creationism, prayer and the PoA. They want God out of our public buildings and public places.

Yet God is in our PoA, on our currency and in our courts and other state and federal buildings.

When Obama is in office and he enacts and repeals laws of the likes of abortion and gay marriage how will it be?

It is right for you to kill your unborn child for whatever reason you see fit..."So help me God"

It is right for a man to marry a man and a woman to marry a woman..."So help me God"

I see such a blindness and hypocrisy in so much of our government and our citizenship in this matter of God and faith.

How does the "So help me God" fly under the radar socially and politically in this case of our presidential oath?

Is "So help me God" and "God bless America" a selective soliloquy with selective literal implications?

I don't know if I am communicating my point like I would desire to.
I understand my friend. It's not that i don't think that obama will do a bad job I just have a hard time believing that he is our president. A man like McCain, and what he has been through, got beat out by Obama. just saying the name makes me clinch my fist.
 
B5150

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I feel I must clarify my statement and or point.

The Presidential Oath is written in The Constitution with specific language and verbiage. The Constitution is our country's law and I respect it as such.

Being in the field of quality assurance I am accustomed to adhering to the letter of the law when it comes to process and procedure. Unauthorized deviation from and or addendum to the specified process and procedure can be grounds of or for violation of contract.

In the case of the Presidential Oath, it is a process and procedure specified in The Constitution in detail. There has been and is an unauthorized deviation and or addendum to the oath. Technically, the oath that Obama affirmed it is not the oath that is specified in The Constitution.

Our American culture over the years has added addendums to include God. There are several examples which I will not go into in this context. But it seems to be implied at the origin of some of these to mean a most sincerity and or emphatic declaration.

As a Christian or a member of a God based faith, there is a God, an deity who is not an object to be used to express "selective soliloquy" or to express sincerity or emphatically. The point being that an oath before God (marriage, baptism, ect.) is indeed an oath before God and a contract with God.

Oboma is not in a contract with God but a contract with the citizens of The United States. The verbiage and language of that contract has be declared as an official governmental document and is the Law of the Land. He has sworn an oath to the Constitution. He has no need to swear an oath to God.

As a matter of fact even as a Christian I emphatically believe that he need to be in a contract with the citizens of The United States and swear an oath to uphold The Constitution separate from and regardless of his faith or spiritual conviction. This is his job not ordainment.

So I see it very ironic, considering the polarity of the civil, cultural and spiritual condition of our country, that "So help me God" flies right under the radar.

Zero - this country holds no God favor that any other country may or may not hold. It is a self proclamation and a self righteousness. The sins of the human beings and government of this country are no less or great than the sins of any other human beings or government on this planet. All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. Our righteousness is like filthy rags in Gods eyes.

Evil resides in the hearts of man and is indiscriminate of any borders, laws, constitutions or flags. So very well does righteousness.
 
b unit

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Before he enter on the execution of his office, he shall take the following oath or affirmation:--"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

LII: Constitution

Oath of office of the President of the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

God bless America...so help me God!?!:usa2::usa1:

:usa:
Discuss...
is it any different that the oath when giving a sworn testimony?

"put your left hand on the bible and raise your right hand. repeat after me . do you swear to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god"

just asking...
 
SoMdHunter

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Zero: I just happen to agree with ya! This country has turned its back on God a long time ago. It should come as no surprise the country is in the shape it is in. This country has lost its way and in need to redemption like never before.

B: I look at it this way, at least Obama did use the Quran to take the office pledge. I for one think it is a good thing in what he did. Can he fix the wounds of this country? Only time will tell.
 
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This country was built on certain principles,

Yes it was; Women should be seen and not heard, its perfectly fine to murder a whole race of people only if you really really want their land, and black people should be kept out back in a shed as property.

All created by your "moral" christians.
 
B5150

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Zero: I just happen to agree with ya! This country has turned its back on God a long time ago. It should come as no surprise the country is in the shape it is in. This country has lost its way and in need to redemption like never before.

B: I look at it this way, at least Obama did use the Quran to take the office pledge. I for one think it is a good thing in what he did. Can he fix the wounds of this country? Only time will tell.
Original point:
I feel I must clarify my statement and or point.

So I see it very ironic, considering the polarity of the civil, cultural and spiritual condition of our country, that "So help me God" flies right under the radar.
I don't disagree with you. Our country is not alone in being lost and turning away from God. We own no special righteousness in that regard.
 
DR.D

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... It is right for a man to marry a man and a woman to marry a woman..."So help me God" ...
An openly gay bishop offered the official inaugural prayer at the Lincoln Memorial too, but I guess you didn't get the memo huh? It's ok though, gayness is ok now! Besides Brian, you don't even know which God he was petitioning help from. You're SO presumptuous sometimes! Can't we all just get along and be happy and gay on this beautiful day?!!
:greddy2:
 
Caferacer

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Yes it was; Women should be seen and not heard, its perfectly fine to murder a whole race of people only if you really really want their land, and black people should be kept out back in a shed as property.

All created by your "moral" christians.
Don't encourage zero. Civil discussion are above this are arm chair professor who is an expert because he took some college courses on it.
 
DR.D

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Yes it was; Women should be seen and not heard, its perfectly fine to murder a whole race of people only if you really really want their land, and black people should be kept out back in a shed as property.

All created by your "moral" christians.
You can keep playing that same ol' victim card if you like, but you should understand that whites no longer buy that crap, or think they own blacks anything. As for women, I think they likely receive the greatest honor and treatment from Christian men. Women sure don't get much from baby's daddys that don't stick around, and what do you think happens to an Muslim woman when she get's outta line? (she get's smacked the **** up! that's what)

The Christian bashing has just officially ended on this board, at least until they ban me. You guys are clueless what's really going on these days.
 
mindgame

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It doesnt matter to me. I know some people who trying to have the supreme court stop him from saying it. I guess that didnt happen
 
Zero V

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Oboma earned some respect from me when he decided to say those words. Gives me a little bit of hope for this presidency. They are saying this depression will last 8 years before it turns around. And that by the end of 2009 unemployment will be 10%.

Obama stated himself that the means to Americas issues will be met, but that it will take time and hard work. Meaning he is looking beyond a quick fix, which is kind of relieving.

As for my earlier post, I guess I read your post a lil wrong B :D
It made more sense the second time I read through, and on your second post.

And to futurepilot. I aint touching any of that but the part about women. Go to a church and ask one of the ladies there about how they are treated. With more respect, love, and encouragement than they seem to find elsewhere. Were a family, and not after the same "things" the world wants them for. And older women are very prominent in my church. Powerful and loving, great people to seek advice from... Why do you think women value a guy who goes to church when they find one? They get treated differently. He will never cuss at them in an argument. Not to say they wont argue, but he will not insult them. FAR less chance of cheating(we have posers who play christian so..). And a willingness to do almost anything for their wife, and the only thing they put above them is God himself.

Yeah there are secular people who are like that too....just...not as many. Most guys especially in the age area of 18-24 are real jerks. Ironically, that is also the age gap in churches. hmmmm...

You are entitled to your opinion like I am mine.

I may be quite radical and sometimes over indulge my emotions into my posts. But that's me as a person. I write poetry, and novels. Emotions are the essence needed to make those good. I grew up loving America. And seeing what its becoming, deeply saddens me. Knowing what my kids may have to deal with, saddens me. I go to church, and we have had to look out the window and see the world slowly turning against us. It stings a little. Many people have misconceptions, and misinformation, or even irrational hate for Christianity. Think about the distaste for it some of you have, and think about how each generation gets more reckless and violent. Someday kids are going to get the snot kicked out of them for believing in God... And it will be in America that things like this happen...

We do missions at our church, feed and cloth hungry people, I have seen kids fight over food... and when were done doing it, I come home and see my christian friends getting bashed on and worse. Kinda stings when all we try to do is what's right and you get beat down for it. Missionaries die on some of these trips. And its becoming more common. Yes shoot me for bringing you food and water and speaking my opinion about my God... Read the book called "Jesus Freaks" by dc Talk... Then talk about Christians...

But that is a right in America. The freedom to use speech no matter how disgracing or insulting it is.

I apologize for posting more on spiritual beliefs. Back to Obama. He is speaking of change. With America as polarized as it is, he has to pick a side, and make us all one. Regardless. Yes there will be some people unhappy, but that will die down over the years. But if America is allowed to be as polar as it is, we will tear ourselves apart. The gay marriage, abortion, and other spot light arguments must find resolve, or it will dissolve us as a nation. I hold nothing against Bush. He got handed a bad deck of cards, and then made some dumb mistakes. He is human like all of us, why pelt him with insults? Obama is taking up office with America in one of its worst states ever. If he can pull this off and fix America and build into the world as a whole I will be both impressed and scared. Impressed because America will be recovering and my future job market will be safe. People see the government as their fall back, but they are realizing Social Security is not working. Unemployment is drying up, medical is harder and more expensive to get. I am interested in Obama's claims to see every American with insurance.

B you are talking about Obama saying "So help me God" in a nation that was fighting to keep him from even saying those words. It is interesting. The man the nation is heralding as a source of hope is being faced with oppression from the people he is trying to help... Go figure.
 
neoborn

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Your country is seriously f*cked just admit it, it's the first step to a solution.

NWO, Trilateral Commission, Bilderberg group, Council on Foreign relations.

What you think doesn't matter and what you do won't change anything......or will it. It makes me laugh how your options are groomed and basically chosen for you, plopped right down into your laps and then you think because you chose two candidates that were engineered into position, that you voted them in ......the whole system is corrupt and a sick joke.

If you vote blue and everything just gets worse, then you vote red and everything continues to get worse, then you're succeeding at failing. I have so much to say but.....blah it really comes to nothing.

No one is going to 'fix' america unless you mean making the poor, poorer, under more control of the government and making the rich wealthier and more powerful.

What about Marshall Law?

What about the Patriot Act?

Are you really free?

LOL land of the free, what a joke, when they send people to prison for 50yrs for a joint of a plant created by God (or whatever your version is)

Do you really think you can change things? Do you think you can change laws? Nah......it takes years and years of hardwork to get nowhere.
 
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Your countries seriously f*cked just admit it, it's the first step to a solution.

NWO, Trilateral Commission, Bilderberg group, Council on Foreign relations.

What you think doesn't matter and what you do won't change anything......or will it. It makes me laugh how your options are groomed and basically chosen for you, plopped right down into your laps and then you think because you chose two candidates that were engineered into position, that you voted them in ......the whole system is corrupt and a sick joke.

If you vote blue and everything just gets worse, then you vote red and everything continues to get worse, then you're succeeding at failing. I have so much to say but.....blah it really comes to nothing.

No one is going to 'fix' america unless you mean making the poor, poorer, under more control of the government and making the rich wealthier and more powerful.

What about Marshall Law?

What about the Patriot Act?

Are you really free?

LOL land of the free, what a joke, when they send people to prison for 50yrs for a joint of a plant created by God (or whatever your version is)

Do you really think you can change things? Do you think you can change laws? Nah......it takes years and years of hardwork to get nowhere.
Human societies always end up corrupt and unfair, without exception.

If you look at the current "societal model" it is retarded, but people love it, see humans are retards, so they need a retarded system to live in, hence the current situation.

Do not try to talk to people or change their minds, just agree with whatever comes out of their mouths and smile, don't waste time trying to "educate" people.

Strive to better yourself, f**k everyone else.
 
xtraflossy

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Perfect example of looking for meaning simply to look for meaning.
Good Lord ya'll (...as an example)

"So help me God" is both a phrase used to literally mean "help me God, as what I'm about to do requires more strength then I believe I have"

It will fly under the radar because of this. Despite it's true meaning.

Seperation of church and state was put into place as to not allow the Church to hold more politicial power then the govenment; as was the case before we created this country, but no one in this thread needs a history lesson on that I assume (although I'll take one lol)

There will never be a complete separation, as beleifs make up a person, and people make a government.

When Obama made his speach, he spoke as both a politicial leader AND as his own Man. When he decided to repeat part of a quote, I'll leave that decision to him, as we the people have decided to leave many more important things up for him to decide.
 
Bravoboy

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Merle haggard "ar we Rollin down hill like a snowball headed for hell"

I am an American citizen and even though I didn't vote obama I have hope and am optimistic. When someone has a family or a family they put stock in it and they try to find something positive about what there currently is! My country is on the down but it has before. Its in my nature to think this way and not accept failure! I raise my children the same. May god bless you all. Or whoever you choose!

BlackBerry8130/4.3.0 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/105
 
RenegadeRows

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Its disappointing to me. This country was built on certain principles, and through those principles it rose to be the most powerful nation on earth. Ever since we starting removing God from everything at the demand of certain groups, have you not noticed the country slowly die as God is more and more rejected? Our country was built on faith, for faith has won America its favor in wars, and in politics. Strip away that faith, and what do you have l left.

Since the 50's America has been like a brain cancer patient, slowly dieing and becoming more irrational in the process. The reason many of us know where America is headed, is because we see how hard atheists and such are pushing for God to be removed from everything. All they are really asking is for God to take his hand off this country and let it die. Well.... Patterns don't lie. The more atheists win the politics, the closer America comes to its deathbed.

Personally I think every president of our nation should swear in on the Bible, and under God. I am expecting a flaming for this part. But of every Christian/atheist i have met. Christians are likely to follow way more morals and are likelyto be more effective than the atheists I have met. I have seen every atheist fired from the places I have worked due to their ethics. Every one, always was fired. I know not every atheist is like that, but seeing such a large amount be like that...

I am uncertain of Obama's beliefs.Whether or not he chooses to use a reference to God will foretell a lot. He might fix our economy, but he may also murder the American spirit. Depending on how he runs things.

Ive been reading lately many things that describe what "Americans". We went from "God fearing, unbreakable light of hope" to "Most medicated and depressed and most likely to bleed cheeseburger grease if you shoot them". Congrats to all those who fight to make it like this...

If you build a nation on a rock, then once its finished, you yank the rock from underneath it. Just like a building it will crumble. America was build on "The Rock", on faith to God.

The word God is now thrown around without any real respect or homage to God himself.

:unitedstates:

Aight boys, got yer flamer throwers read, :23:
Great post.
 
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let me say this, it is not the values of "god" that have changed people, it is people that changed people. We have grown in acceptance of things that have nothing to do with religion. Also, it was not christian values that made us a great country. After WWI and WWII it was not those values that did anything, it was the people that did it. Regardless of their religious sentiment.

The problem is, right now we are looking at everything as a reason for our troubles. It has nothing to do with god, christians, jews, muslims or any other religious denomination, it has to do with us! Also, claiming it is something else is part of the problem as well!!!

rant over
 
Mulletsoldier

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Zero, I would love to rip this apart, and yes you gave a variety of angles to play, I will leave it be. I disagree entirely, in fact couldnt disagree more. However, you are entitled to your opinions
:lol:

This made me chuckle. I could not agree more.
 
DR.D

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... Most guys especially in the age area of 18-24 are real jerks. ...
Hey, wait a minute... aren't you 22? :p j/k bro

... Back to Obama. He is speaking of change. With America as polarized as it is, he has to pick a side, and make us all one. ...
Does this inspire unity or support tolerance? (see video) Politically speaking, I don't understand what this was really meant to demonstrate. That blacks, browns, yellows, reds, gays, leftist ministers, etc. are OK, but whites aren't OK?

[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tzhsfzXrZs"]YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.[/nomedia]
 
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You can keep playing that same ol' victim card if you like, but you should understand that whites no longer buy that crap, or think they own blacks anything. As for women, I think they likely receive the greatest honor and treatment from Christian men. Women sure don't get much from baby's daddys that don't stick around, and what do you think happens to an Muslim woman when she get's outta line? (she get's smacked the **** up! that's what)

The Christian bashing has just officially ended on this board, at least until they ban me. You guys are clueless what's really going on these days.

I dont think accurately portraying history is any sort of "victim" card.

If you dont like blacks just say so, that would have saved you a lot of typing.

You can't say every muslim women is subjugated by their husband. Just like you cant say that every christian has delusions of grandeur.
 
Zero V

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Does this inspire unity or support tolerance? (see video) Politically speaking, I don't understand what this was really meant to demonstrate. That blacks, browns, yellows, reds, gays, leftist ministers, etc. are OK, but whites aren't OK?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tzhsfzXrZs
All I am waiting for now is a Tony the Tiger to bust through the wall in tights and wearing a pink kerchief yelling "THEEEYYYRE GREAT you silly" in a loud yet girly voice... sorry had to say it, it seemed to funny in my mind.

Its already known that racism is reversed today. And this is kinda creepy, Obama has to watch his step. He could start dang near a civil war if he wants to act stupid. That video was quite insulting. You know I cant get a job or very much government aid because I'm white? We have a family friend who applied for government aid, and got declined. He did it again, and on the papers put he was black, BAM, got his help. Same thing with jobs.
 
dsade

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I realize where it came from.

The oath was administered by the Chief Justice, as "So help me God". This was not a fumble. If it is not constitutional why perpetuate it. If it is perpetuated why not make it constitutional.

Did he swear to God? Did he need to swear to God? Why would he swear to God?
How do you know which god he was swearing to/by?
 
B5150

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Another valid point.

Why is there any god in any of it and how has this be allowed to go on?

The God or a god isn't in our politics and our politics isn't in the God or a god.

This of course excludes the god complex politicians.
 
DR.D

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I dont think accurately portraying history is any sort of "victim" card.

If you dont like blacks just say so, that would have saved you a lot of typing.

You can't say every muslim women is subjugated by their husband. Just like you cant say that every christian has delusions of grandeur.
You are correct, I don't have contemporary experience regarding how Muslim women get treated (beyond what I see on the news) so forgive me if you thought I was over-generalizing. My intent was to just make a point that neither could you. Do you know where African slaves came from? They were first enslaved by their own people! Then made available for sale to the white man, so your argument is out of context. That's like saying I'm racist, because I bought a shirt that was made in some country that exploits a certain class to produce the material. If that's the case, we are ALL guilty.

I do not dislike (or like) any man based on any inherent trait. A man can expect fair consideration from me. You will receive based on whatever your intent was to give.
 
Fastone

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All I am waiting for now is a Tony the Tiger to bust through the wall in tights and wearing a pink kerchief yelling "THEEEYYYRE GREAT you silly" in a loud yet girly voice... sorry had to say it, it seemed to funny in my mind.

Its already known that racism is reversed today. And this is kinda creepy, Obama has to watch his step. He could start dang near a civil war if he wants to act stupid. That video was quite insulting. You know I cant get a job or very much government aid because I'm white? We have a family friend who applied for government aid, and got declined. He did it again, and on the papers put he was black, BAM, got his help. Same thing with jobs.

You are not even old enough to know what racism truly is, in fact you don't know ****. You spout out all of the stuff that's been put into your sheltered little brain like you've experienced something. Have you ever once been denied anything simply because of the color of your skin? Hell no. Come out of your shelter and travel into the real world, maybe you'll truly learn something. It's real easy when everyone around you thinks the same , isn't it? God is real but there are elements of religion rooted in arrogance that may someday end our world.

:bruce3:
 
thesinner

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An openly gay bishop offered the official inaugural prayer at the Lincoln Memorial too, but I guess you didn't get the memo huh? It's ok though, gayness is ok now! Besides Brian, you don't even know which God he was petitioning help from. You're SO presumptuous sometimes! Can't we all just get along and be happy and gay on this beautiful day?!!
:greddy2:
You know, there was a guy who played ball for the Supersonics in the mid-1990's, whose first name was God. Maybe he's really good friends with Obama.
 
DR.D

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You know, there was a guy who played ball for the Supersonics in the mid-1990's, whose first name was God. Maybe he's really good friends with Obama.
Haha, you crack me up sinner! You'd make a good politician. :)
 
Zero V

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You are not even old enough to know what racism truly is, in fact you don't know ****. You spout out all of the stuff that's been put into your sheltered little brain like you've experienced something. Have you ever once been denied anything simply because of the color of your skin? Hell no. Come out of your shelter and travel into the real world, maybe you'll truly learn something. It's real easy when everyone around you thinks the same , isn't it? God is real but there are elements of religion rooted in arrogance that may someday end our world.

:bruce3:
I spent my life growing up in a crap schools where a few times it was almost white on black warfare. Fights daily, etc, eventually no ones allowed to carry backpacks or coats anymore kinda deal. Sure I didnt see the crap from 20 years ago and on back. But things have changed since then. I would have hated to see other people, who just want work or medical help for their family struggling. I value equality, it is what America is about.

A man of any race can insult me, rob me, etc. But as a white guy, if I shoot a man who broke into my house. Unless he is also white, that persons whole neighborhood is screaming out that it was a hate crime. And I am at risk of facing charges. How is that right? The only funny thing I have seen is watching cops, when an African American cop was arresting an African American felon and he was spewing on about how he is being arrested just because he is black. That cop wanted to crack that idiots skull open.

Do we still have racist retards out there? Of course. But now its less and less an issue of whites on blacks, and more vice versa. My dad is racist, I have always argued with him over that. But he claims he grew up and had to deal with things I didnt. But I have been called quite a few things and insulted by other races, though I have never insulted another race. So, therefore I am a victim of racism? Bah I can care less because its all ignorance.

I hate racism. And why do you assume I am sheltered? Because I am Christian? Is that not assuming? I became Christian after high school, and into college. I grew up around drugs, beer, ignorance, idiots, etc. I have done my fair share of stupid things. I am one of the "rougher around the edges" Christians you will meet. I have done everything a secular guy does....then I got saved. :puke:

I know what I have seen. And at my old job, I was a trainer. I went through roughly 80-120 people in a year. We had to keep some of them on after training even if they were incompetent based on what gap we had to fill...

The race "card" needs to go. Its been overplayed. Everything is all messed up.
 
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Its disappointing to me. This country was built on certain principles, and through those principles it rose to be the most powerful nation on earth. Ever since we starting removing God from everything at the demand of certain groups, have you not noticed the country slowly die as God is more and more rejected? Our country was built on faith, for faith has won America its favor in wars, and in politics. Strip away that faith, and what do you have l left.

Since the 50's America has been like a brain cancer patient, slowly dieing and becoming more irrational in the process. The reason many of us know where America is headed, is because we see how hard atheists and such are pushing for God to be removed from everything. All they are really asking is for God to take his hand off this country and let it die. Well.... Patterns don't lie. The more atheists win the politics, the closer America comes to its deathbed.

Personally I think every president of our nation should swear in on the Bible, and under God. I am expecting a flaming for this part. But of every Christian/atheist i have met. Christians are likely to follow way more morals and are likelyto be more effective than the atheists I have met. I have seen every atheist fired from the places I have worked due to their ethics. Every one, always was fired. I know not every atheist is like that, but seeing such a large amount be like that...

I am uncertain of Obama's beliefs.Whether or not he chooses to use a reference to God will foretell a lot. He might fix our economy, but he may also murder the American spirit. Depending on how he runs things.

Ive been reading lately many things that describe what "Americans". We went from "God fearing, unbreakable light of hope" to "Most medicated and depressed and most likely to bleed cheeseburger grease if you shoot them". Congrats to all those who fight to make it like this...

If you build a nation on a rock, then once its finished, you yank the rock from underneath it. Just like a building it will crumble. America was build on "The Rock", on faith to God.

The word God is now thrown around without any real respect or homage to God himself.

:unitedstates:

Aight boys, got yer flamer throwers read, :23:

Ohh...the poor discriminated Christians!

You do know that the majority of the country is Christian, don't you?

You do know that if any politician declares he/she is an atheist their career is over don't you?

"Christians are likely to follow way more morals and are likelyto be more effective than the atheists I have met. I have seen every atheist fired from the places I have worked due to their ethics."

Most atheists I know are in the closet (including me) so it's odd to me that you know so many that openly admit it.

I guess I could say that when I was living in the south, every Christian I met was a hypocrite.

What are an atheists' ethics?

Just because they don't believe in a imaginary policeman, you think an atheist doesn't know wrong from right?

Is the only reason you're not going around raping, stealing, and killing people is because you think there is a god that is going to punish you?

Lastly,
If you hadn't noticed the last 8 years were "ruled" by the Christian Right and as you can see by the state of the country, we're not doing very well...
 
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I don't understand, why are you in the closet?
1. I lived in the south...I would say 99% of where we lived was hardcore Christian. They don't look too kindly to yankee non-believers.
2. I worked at a Christian Company. I would have to bite my lip when I would be handed a prayer pamphlet or would receive a email on some prayer day.
3. If you've seen some polls, atheists are the most "un-liked" group with one poll saying that it'd be easier for a homosexual to be elected for president than an atheist. I believe George H. Bush even said that atheists were not Americans.
 
dsade

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1. I lived in the south...I would say 99% of where we lived was hardcore Christian. They don't look too kindly to yankee non-believers.
2. I worked at a Christian Company. I would have to bite my lip when I would be handed a prayer pamphlet or would receive a email on some prayer day.
3. If you've seen some polls, atheists are the most "un-liked" group with one poll saying that it'd be easier for a homosexual to be elected for president than an atheist. I believe George H. Bush even said that atheists were not Americans.
In addition, many polls of "moral christians" said that atheists are not entitles to the same basic rights.

 
Fastone

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I think we might all be surprised at the revelation of people that don't specifically believe in God as a entity. It doesn't make them evil, it just makes them different. The being different is the thing that someday we just have to get over.

If a person treats you well and you find out that they don't believe in God are you going to feel that you are going to hell for associating with them? You may feel sorry that they don't have something to believe in but you don't have the right to judge.

Also the level of faith, do you really think that you are going to a better heaven because you have been saved? I don't think so.

The fact is there are plenty of people who follow the letter and spirit of the Ten Comandments who might be "slackers" in the eyes of the super holy or for that matter don't acknowledge any God but have respect for humanity, to me that's the bottom line.

:bruce3:
 
B5150

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This has gone way off track...or maybe not. But I do find there to be quite an irony in this whole thing.

As a Christian I do not want him to say "So help me God". To me it makes a profession of his faith, for as a Christian, if I would say "So help me God" it would mean literally with the help of God...my God...The God, and in my case a Christian God.

This man is hired to do a job. Uphold the Constitution, use his intelligence and his ability to practice reason and logic and sound judgment when running the business of this country. These are not characteristics that are exclusive to a Christian God fearing man, a Muslim God fearing man or any other deity fearing man. Nor are they exclusive to an atheist or agnostic or a scientist.

If he happens to be a Christian, so be it. I want a good President.

During the election campaign the atheist left was screaming bloody-political-blasphemy when Palen even mentioned God. She was mocked and scorned for it. They would have had her burned at the stake.

Yet the guy that they voted in just asked for his help. So help me God...he did.
 
Zero V

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Well im farther north, in Ohio. Plenty of open athiests here. And even weird things like wickens and pagans. I had one dude who was being a major jerk who kept showing off the 666 he had tattooed on the inside of his lip, and would write 666 on anything i left laying around. He was quite the atheist... Also dont mix up atheist with agnostics. I know many great agnostics. But if you lack all spiritual influence, then the only input you have is that of a human, which human ideals are completely flawed anymore to begin with...so... I have yet to meet an atheist who believed pre marital sex was wrong. Why, then they wouldn't be able to have a guilt free conscience is the only reason why.

If that rule there was followed, you would eliminate AIDS, and all other STD's after a few carefully watched generations. Abortion wouldnt be near as big of an issue. And insurance and medical would get a huge boost.... So outside of Christianity, it makes perfect sense, but its not fun so... Without a spiritual influence of law, the human mind based off of science functions only on "what feels good" and it places its priorities in such as to maximize that. There are exceptions of course. But that would be science explaining the function of the human mind in a nut shell. So to have someone in office who didnt have the "extra" laws, would be less likely to care about such things. Or many other things. If you get herpagonasiphilitis or some other STD or combo of them, you earned em.

I can see how you have to remain hidden a bit because your probably in the "Bible Belt". But I think that is one of the best places in America to be. But in your shoes I will agree they will be extremists down there. I have made a ton of Muslim friends, a few jewish ones, and some who I dont even have a clue who they worship. But I have yet to meet an atheist willing to be friends with a Christin here. Also consider our daily lives involve being different than what is normal. Abstaining from many of the things secular people find attractive.

And as far as I have seen from my old job, the atheists we blew through were the ones who could "care less". They didnt care if they wrecked a rider(the electric riding pallet jacks) or nailed product with the forklift. And it was a "curse free" environment for the most part, and they didn't care if they felt like cussing they would. I am more than open to meet someone who is atheist and hang out, play games, play sports. But jeeze...I am sorry, i really haven't met one yet who isn't a jerk. I am quite sure they arent all like that. You yourself may be an outstanding gentleman. But for the most part. I have seen nothing more a huge difference in moral conscience.


My only real issue with athiests is they are stripping other peoples rights. Such as "under God" in the pledge, trying to prevent Oboma from saying his statement. Using the term GD, as in Gosh Dang(but you know what I am getting at) which is an insult to Christianity. And some of our schools around here will make kids turn their shirts inside out or tuck in a necklace if its Christian. What the heck, is that your idea of equality?
 
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the only thing I will say zero is that the odds are Mr. 666 is not an athiest if
1. he believed in the devil

Most likely, he was an attention whore trying to act tough.

Moving along.....
 
Zero V

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the only thing I will say zero is that the odds are Mr. 666 is not an athiest if
1. he believed in the devil

Most likely, he was an attention whore trying to act tough.

Moving along.....

I asked him about that, he said no. He just believed 666 wasnt a bad number... But knowing I did, loved to abuse it lol. Definitely not the satanic type...he was pretty dumb though.
 
CopyCat

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I personally have no problems with what he said or how he swore in and I do not believe it to be a conflict of separation of church and state.
 
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Well im farther north, in Ohio. Plenty of open athiests here. And even weird things like wickens and pagans. I had one dude who was being a major jerk who kept showing off the 666 he had tattooed on the inside of his lip, and would write 666 on anything i left laying around. He was quite the atheist... Also dont mix up atheist with agnostics. I know many great agnostics. But if you lack all spiritual influence, then the only input you have is that of a human, which human ideals are completely flawed anymore to begin with...so... I have yet to meet an atheist who believed pre marital sex was wrong. Why, then they wouldn't be able to have a guilt free conscience is the only reason why.

If that rule there was followed, you would eliminate AIDS, and all other STD's after a few carefully watched generations. Abortion wouldnt be near as big of an issue. And insurance and medical would get a huge boost.... So outside of Christianity, it makes perfect sense, but its not fun so... Without a spiritual influence of law, the human mind based off of science functions only on "what feels good" and it places its priorities in such as to maximize that. There are exceptions of course. But that would be science explaining the function of the human mind in a nut shell. So to have someone in office who didnt have the "extra" laws, would be less likely to care about such things. Or many other things. If you get herpagonasiphilitis or some other STD or combo of them, you earned em.

I can see how you have to remain hidden a bit because your probably in the "Bible Belt". But I think that is one of the best places in America to be. But in your shoes I will agree they will be extremists down there. I have made a ton of Muslim friends, a few jewish ones, and some who I dont even have a clue who they worship. But I have yet to meet an atheist willing to be friends with a Christin here. Also consider our daily lives involve being different than what is normal. Abstaining from many of the things secular people find attractive.

And as far as I have seen from my old job, the atheists we blew through were the ones who could "care less". They didnt care if they wrecked a rider(the electric riding pallet jacks) or nailed product with the forklift. And it was a "curse free" environment for the most part, and they didn't care if they felt like cussing they would. I am more than open to meet someone who is atheist and hang out, play games, play sports. But jeeze...I am sorry, i really haven't met one yet who isn't a jerk. I am quite sure they arent all like that. You yourself may be an outstanding gentleman. But for the most part. I have seen nothing more a huge difference in moral conscience.


My only real issue with athiests is they are stripping other peoples rights. Such as "under God" in the pledge, trying to prevent Oboma from saying his statement. Using the term GD, as in Gosh Dang(but you know what I am getting at) which is an insult to Christianity. And some of our schools around here will make kids turn their shirts inside out or tuck in a necklace if its Christian. What the heck, is that your idea of equality?
I would say "most" atheists aren't into 666 (and don't believe in the devil) and def. would not tatoo that on their lip.
Sounds like an idiot, which of course there are many of those in all religions (and those without religion).

Most atheists follow the "do unto others as they would do unto you" / "Golden Rule" which is what I follow.
(This is not exclusive to Christianity but to many other religions as well)

I don't think pre-marital sex is wrong and not sure why most religious people are so "hung up" on sexuality.
In my past, just because I was an atheist, didn't mean I went around screwing everything that moved. I really don't care what people do as long as it doesn't hurt others.

If you've seen the most recent study on abstinence / purity pledges, you'll see that all of those who say they are going to abstain from sex until marriage, don't. They have as much sex as those who don't take a pledge.
In fact, those with abstinence only sex education are MORE LIKELY to have unplanned pregnancy, and more STDs.

There are also studies (one recent and I'd have to look it up if needed) that show the most single mothers / teenagers w/STDs are in the "red" states (most religious)
So so much for morality!

What atheists are stripping your rights?
The one guy who is trying to get "in God We Trust" off the money? (which wasn't there anyway until the 50's)...

same with the pledge:
"The Pledge of Allegiance was written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy (1855-1931), a Baptist minister, a Christian Socialist, and the cousin of Socialist Utopian novelist Edward Bellamy (1850-1898). Bellamy's original "Pledge of Allegiance" was published in the September 8th issue of the popular children's magazine The Youth's Companion as part of the National Public-School Celebration of Columbus Day, a celebration of the 400th anniversary of Christopher Columbus's discovery of America, conceived by James B. Upham."

"Bellamy's original Pledge read, "I Pledge Allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation indivisible with liberty and justice for all."

"In New York City on April 22, 1951, the Board of Directors of the Knights of Columbus adopted a resolution to amend their recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance at the opening of each of the meetings of the 800 Fourth Degree Assemblies of the Knights of Columbus by addition of the words "under God" after the words "one nation."

1954-
"Eisenhower opted to sign the bill into law on Flag Day (June 14, 1954). The fact that Eisenhower clearly had Docherty’s rationale in mind as he initiated and consummated this measure is apparent in a letter he wrote in August, 1954. Paraphrasing Docherty’s sermon, Eisenhower said:

These words [“under God”] will remind Americans that despite our great physical strength we must remain humble. They will help us to keep constantly in our minds and hearts the spiritual and moral principles which alone give dignity to man, and upon which our way of life is founded."

So, nobody seemed to have a problem with "under god" not being in it until the 1950's...

As far as being friends with Christians...as long as they're not preaching to me, I can be friends with anyone regardless of religioius beliefs.
I can almost guarantee anyone who met me (in the south especially) who found out I was an atheist would be shocked (due to their pre-conceived notions on atheists).

And what's the deal with some religious people who think atheists are devil worshippers? (which is odd, since we don't believe in the devil either)
 
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As far as being friends with Christians...as long as they're not preaching to me, I can be friends with anyone regardless of religioius beliefs.
I can almost guarantee anyone who met me (in the south especially) who found out I was an atheist would be shocked (due to their pre-conceived notions on atheists).
There are some of us Christians who had no negative preconceived notions about atheists until they demonstrated and or expressed their hate for God and believers. Like Christians that group has some members with less than becoming characters as well.
 
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