Matrix Revolutions; no spoilers

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    Thumbs up Matrix Revolutions; no spoilers


    If you are contemplating this movie, go see it

    especially if you like the Matrix series and have seen the 1st and 2nd movie thoroughly...

    the end fight scene between Neo and Smith; as you've seen the trailers many times on TV and at other movies; is AWSOME... i've never ever in my life seen a better good vs evil, final battle... we're talking better than Luke vs Darth Vader here man... i was almost in tears because that whole scene was just so incredible...

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    yah I saw it last night too
    2 tumbs up

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    I'll definitely check it out this weekend, this feedback helps 'cause I was a little disappointed in part 2.
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    Originally posted by Iron Warrior
    I'll definitely check it out this weekend, this feedback helps 'cause I was a little disappointed in part 2.
    Same here.  Too much action and not enough story.  I was actually bored through some of it.  After the 99th copy of smith got smacked around I was ready to turn it off.
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    I didn't like it as much as I wanted too. Some of it didn't make sense. It seems to me that it was made just to make money.
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    what didnt make sense? it was unbelievable....there wasn't enough philosophy as the other two but that was because there wasn't any left. they needed to save Zion. what was done, was done and couldn't happen any other way
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    The thing with part 2 "Reloaded" is you have to watch it at least a few times, and on dvd is much better than the movie houses if you have a decent system. In spite of all the action in the 2nd half of Reloaded, there's a good taste of philosophy and religious symbolism throughout the first half. If you only watch it (and the first Matrix movie) once, you probably didn't catch it, I think it's too much for most people to absorb on one take. I knew beforehand that Reloaded was going to be a bridge to Revolutions, but I really liked it anyway.

    You'll also gain an appreciation for what went into all of the Matrix movies if you watch the 2nd behind the scenes dvd included with Revolutions. You'll see for example, that they shot Reloaded, Revolutions and the Video Game all at the same time over a 3 year period, 1 year in pre-production, 1 year to film, and 1 year in post production. I was blown away for example, to learn they built that entire 1.5 mile divided highway just to shoot the car chase scene. And that all the car flips and crashes were not cgi, they were live stunt drivers doing that stuff! Incredible.

    When you consider what went into making these movies..... the complexity of the storyline, the relevancy of the story line with respect to artificial intelligence today in the 21st century, the layers of symbolism, philosphy, religion (Buddhism, gnostic christianity), the 8+ months of daily training Reeves, Fishburne, Moss and Weaving (and others) put into Reloaded and Revolutions (plus 8 months alone for the 1st Matrix movies), the EXPONENTIAL raising of the bar with respect to cinematography/cgi and special effects (the genius of John Gaeta), to say nothing of the painstaking planning and execution of the car chase scene, these 3 films stand alone, WITHOUT EQUAL. Of COURSE the intent is to make $$ at the end of the day. But what a phenomenal success. As great as George Lucas Star Wars series films have been over the past 2 decades, The Matrix series has taken the art of cinematography way further down the field in all respects.

    And I haven't even seen Revolutions yet.

    These movies have raised the bar so much higher now for other movies to compete with that it's almost an impossible task. Of all the movies you think of that you consider "great", how many have blended aspects of religion/philosophy, kung fu, action, computers, chase scenes, a love story, and a struggle involving the survival of humanity? Not only have the Wachowski's done this successfully and kept it really interesting, I don't think it's been done at all by anyone else to date. And unfortunately, when I see other movies including some of the fight/wire work that was developed in the Matrix movies, and even some of the 360 degree cinematography developed by Gaeta, it all looks like baby stuff and copy cat at that. The special effects "work" in the sense that they occur IN the virtual reality of the Matrix, and so it's "believable". When I watched, for example, the 2nd Charlie's Angel's movie, seeing the angels do Matrix type moves here in the real world just kind of seemed tacky in comparison.

    I have a 2,400 watt home theater system I've assembled over the years with a widescreen hdtv in a 24x24 family room. I watch a lot of movies and I've intentionally held off from seeing Reloaded just because the experience of seeing (and feeling) it on my system goes well beyond that of seeing it in a movie house. I'll wait for the dvd to see Revolutions.

    My only disappointment with the Matrix dvd's is that the sound tracks were not recorded in 6.1 dts format, they're the older dolby digital 5.1. No excuse for this, and I've BITCHED to Warner Home Video about it, but that doesn't take anything away from the movies themselves.

    My guess is that once Revolutions is released on dvd, Warner will release the 3 in a box set, "remixed" in either DD or DTS 6.1 format, just so that I'll buy them again Smart financially, still it's annoying to a degree.

    Other than this, I have no opinion one way or another about the Matrix movies.

    Last edited by PC1; 11-07-2003 at 09:20 AM.
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    Originally posted by PC1
    These movies have raised the bar so much higher now for other movies to compete with that it's almost an impossible task. Of all the movies you think of that you consider "great", how many have blended aspects of religion/philosophy, kung fu, action, computers, chase scenes, a love story, and a struggle involving the survival of humanity? Not only have the Wachowski's done this successfully and kept it really interesting, I don't think it's been done at all by anyone else to date.
    I am a huge Matrix fan, and agree upto this statement. Barring the best "one-on-one" fight scenes, Jackson's Lord of the Rings trilogy surpasses everything, including the Matrix.
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    John,

    Maybe, maybe not. The point I was making in the segment you quoted me from was not about any 1 single aspect, but that the Matrix movies theme successfully incorporated ALL of those aspects into a really fascinating story. I really enjoyed the Lord of the Rings movies too by the way
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    PCI,

    I agree wholeheartedly with what you have said. Your home system sounds awesome, but you must have some really bad movie theatres around you. A well setup movie theatre will blow away any home system, any.

    I'm leaving today in about an hour to go to KC and see Matrix Revolutions at the IMAX. Can't wait.
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    Originally posted by motleybreu
    what didnt make sense? it was unbelievable....there wasn't enough philosophy as the other two but that was because there wasn't any left. they needed to save Zion. what was done, was done and couldn't happen any other way
    I didn't quite understand how he got in the train station or how he was able to stop the machines in the real world.
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    Originally posted by Sir Foxx
    PCI,

    I agree wholeheartedly with what you have said. Your home system sounds awesome, but you must have some really bad movie theatres around you. A well setup movie theatre will blow away any home system, any.
    Well actually, no I've been to several "really good" movie theaters.

    One of my hobbies is loudspeaker design and construction. I designed and built the system in my house. It is by all accounts, extreme

    All 4 of my surround speakers are full sized 3-ways, and are audiophile grade in terms of what most people use as their main audio speakers. They're timbre matched to my main left/right audio speakers which also are 3-ways. The main left/right are actually enclosed in 2 other larger cabinets that house my subwoofers. The cabinets each measure 53"H x 20"W x 24"D, all cabinets constructed in 1" mdf and finished with a beautiful natural cherry veneer. My dual 15" subs will play flat to about 22 Hz, that's FLAT, meaning there is no appreciable loss of volume at the depth of pitch that's close to the limit of what the human ear can hear. Each of those 15" subs are driven by 800 watts of power via a Crown Pro-audio amp, the type you'd find in a well designed movie theater, night club or in concert arenas (they use a LOT of them, daisy chained). Any low sound source, say an explosion, literally shakes the entire room. A low test tone shakes the walls in my master bedroom, located on the second floor all the way across a nearly 3,000 sf house. Without exaggeration, I literally have stress cracks in the plaster of my walls from my system. The HT receiver is a top of the line Pioneer Elite with 110 watts of power each channel, by 7 channels via Mosfett power amps, Do the math, that's about 2.400 watts of clean power in 1 24x24 family room.

    So with all due respect, most commercial theaters do not have the quality nor punch of sound my system delivers, in terms of sound or picture quality. Although I won't argue with the quality of an IMAX picture.

    Last edited by PC1; 11-07-2003 at 11:19 PM.
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    Originally posted by Ibanez


    I didn't quite understand how he got in the train station or how he was able to stop the machines in the real world.
    Do you mean the train station in the first Matrix movie?

    In Revolutions in terms of how he stopped the machines in the real world, I'm not sure if this is correct or not, but when he met the architect of the matrix, the architect spoke of how his travails in the Matrix had altered his consciousness, although he "remained irrevocably human". And supposedly Neo was to return through the other door, reinserting some new programming back into the system, and choosing 16 women + 7 other men to repopulate humanity. Of course he went through the other door to save Trinity instead. I think the programming he received as he's grown and mastered the Matrix has "altered his consciousness". At the end when the sentinels were approaching to kill them in the real world, he told Trinity things were different, and that he could feel them approaching. So somehow he has some new abilities that allow him to fight the machines (designed and built by the Matrix mainframe) others don't have. That's my theory anyway, but I did find myself asking the same question.
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    Originally posted by PC1


    Do you mean the train station in the first Matrix movie?

    In Revolutions in terms of how he stopped the machines in the real world, I'm not sure if this is correct or not, but when he met the architect of the matrix, the architect spoke of how his travails in the Matrix had altered his consciousness, although he "remained irrevocably human". And supposedly Neo was to return through the other door, reinserting some new programming back into the system, and choosing 16 women + 7 other men to repopulate humanity. Of course he went through the other door to save Trinity instead. I think the programming he received as he's grown and mastered the Matrix has "altered his consciousness". At the end when the sentinels were approaching to kill them in the real world, he told Trinity things were different, and that he could feel them approaching. So somehow he has some new abilities that allow him to fight the machines (designed and built by the Matrix mainframe) others don't have. That's my theory anyway, but I did find myself asking the same question.
    No, the train station in revolutions. When they are waiting for the trainman.

    Interesting theory.
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    If you can see the new Matrix Rev. movie on IMAX, do it. It was awesome. That was the first movie I've seen on IMAX that wasn't some documentary climbing Mt. Everest or swimming with whales, and it blew any movie experience I've had, away.

    PC, your system is something that I would love to hear. 2 800watt 15" subs in a 24X24 room? My god, what do your neighbors think Have you ever thought about adding "tactile sound" to your setup?
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    www.matrix-explained.com

    This site covers tons of possible angles on the matrix and talks about many of the finer intricancies. Itll get your mind going for the day anyway, check it out.
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    Originally posted by Sir Foxx

    PC, your system is something that I would love to hear. 2 800watt 15" subs in a 24X24 room? My god, what do your neighbors think Have you ever thought about adding "tactile sound" to your setup?
    Fortunately for me, I live on a 2.5 acre wooded lot 1/2 in the woods. When I have the audio cranked in the warmer weather with windows open, my neighbors behind me, and through the woods, in THEIR houses can hear it, lol

    I thought about tactiles when I was planning out my system but truth is, I really don't need them Any loud explosions are felt as well as heard

    Missouri is a long way from central Mass, but if you're ever in the area you're quite welcome to swing by for a demo.

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    Originally posted by Ibanez


    No, the train station in revolutions. When they are waiting for the trainman.

    Interesting theory.
    Sorry, I haven't seen Revolutions yet! I'm very much looking forward to it though
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    Part three is by far the best. Saw it last night. I didnt really like the 2nd one the first time either but This chick bought it for me and the second time It seemed alittle better. But holy **** Revolutions was the ****. The special effects and the fight scenes were awesome. Im fighting myself to not tell the plot but one things for sure the jellyfish looking robots dont ****ing play near the end. And Mr Andersen takes a serious asss whipping towards the end. Didnt really care much for the romance scenes but I like how neo added a little comedy to the movie this time.
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    The trainman, Now thats an ugly cat, but he's got a mean jab.

    db
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    I left a bit disapointed from the theater. Personally, I loved part 2, as it was chalked full of imagery and symbolism that really expanded the story. Not to mention the highway sceen that was, IMO, one of the best action sequences ever.

    I just thought the end was a bit ant-climatic. I guess I was expecting a bit more.
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    One more thing that erked me was the lack of questions answered. Supposedly, everything was going to be answere in Revolutions. Apparently not. Instead, we just got the Oracle spouting more non-sense. What about the dialog of the Architect, all of the symbolism; Trinity's name, Sereph, how did he see in code in the real world.

    I just felt that all the loose neds wren't tied up. Kind of a let down for a superior story.
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    Found this lengthy thought. VERY interesting.



    I have been watching the DVD, picking up on little things. I was going to write my take on it, but I found this posted at ABC Bodybuilding and thought it contained everything I thought plus a whole lot more. Very interesting...



    "Nothing in the movies is coincidental. The keymaker explains that they have exactly 314 seconds to do what they have to do; there has got to be some meaty explanation as to where 314 comes from. Matrix Essays links to killing the Buddha which has an article entitled Gnosis
    Reloaded, which offers this interesting tidbit: The crew at one point is given 314 seconds
    to complete a task, which could have several interpretations: In gematria, the study of numbers used by the Gnostics but most often by the Jewish mystics, 314 is the numerical equivalent of the name of God (Shaddai). Another possibility is that it refers to a passage in the book of
    Revelations in which the beginning and end of creation are described. I also find it somewhat interesting that 314 seconds is exactly 5:14, and the movie first publicly screened on 5/14/03. Yes, the premier was 5/15, but around here (In NY), it was available in most theaters on the night of the 14th. Probably insignificant, but intersting nonetheless. The numerology slant draws some interesting comparisons to another one of my favorite movies, Pi. Actually, there are a whole lot of visual, thematic, cinematic, and theological parallels between Pi and the Matrix
    movies; One day (hopefully soon), when I have tons of time on my hands, I'll devote a couple posts to comparing and contrasting the two, maybe with some screen shots. There's more. Although i am ashamed to say that i did not notice this....there are biblical allusions (verses) for each license plate of hero and villain, for those of you who havent already seen it: The Twins' truck on the freeway: DE2852. Deutronomy 28:52 - They shall besiege you in all your towns, until your high and fortified walls, in which you trusted, come down throughout all your land. And they shall besiege you in all your towns throughout all your land, which the LORD your God has given you. Trinity and Morephus' Cadillac on the freeway: DA203. Daniel 2:03 - I have
    had a dream that troubles me and I want to know what it means.(NEB) Agent Smith's Audi at the beginning: IS5416. Isaiah 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy." "Persephone is a character from Greek mythology, the daughter of Zeus and Demeter, who was abducted by Hades and taken to the Underworld. Her mother was so distraught at losing her daughter, that she punished mankind with cold winds and dark winter. She threatened to destroy the Earth if her daughter was not returned. Eventually, they came to a compromise (there's
    another character involved here who I can't recall), so that Persephone could spend half the year with her mother, and half with Hades in the Underworld. While she is in the Underworld, Demeter inflicts cold and darkness on the earth, and when Persephone returns, sunshine and warmth return to the earth. Thus the ancient Greeks explain the seasons." Zion is a program, just like the Matrix. How is Neo able to figure out that he is able to stop the sentinels in Zion near the end of the film? The spoon given to him earlier. It had obviously been bent loads, but how
    outside the Matrix? This gave Neo the inspiration and the understanding that Zion is still a matrix. The One explained: "The One" is a program, but has to be "attached" to someone in the Matrix. So Mr. Anderson got it in the 6th version of the Matrix. Then "The One" program's purpose is to allow Zion to be destroyed then to rebuild it. The reason for this is because of anomalies - the 1% of humans that don't accept the Matrix. These are all brought out of
    the Matrix program and into the Zion program by the "Morpheus" program and other similar
    "ship captain" programs. Then once all the anomalies are out of the Matrix (and in Zion), that is the time for Zion to be destroyed, thus killing all the anomalies off. The Matrix is then upgraded, thus creating the next version of the Matrix, but Zion must be rebuilt so that the next lot of
    anomalies can be brought out again so that they can be destroyed. This is the feedback-loop, and is the reason to retain a handful of people so that Zion can be rebuilt. So this is why Neo said the prophecy was a lie - the One's purpose was not to end the war as the prophecy stated. Unfortunately, "The One" program must be re-used each time, or copied, so it can be "attached" to a new anomaly inside the Matrix. So what happens to the old "The One" program? It faces deletion, and as the Oracle explained, it goes into exile instead, just like the French bloke (the
    Merovingian) did. He was the first One (probably from the second version of the Matrix), and once he fulfilled his duty, he became an exile program and "abdicated" his "Oneness" by choosing Persephone and power. This is evident in the bogs when Persephone asks Neo to kiss her.She says she wants him to kiss her so she can feel what it is like again to be kissed by something close to human, just like the Merovingian used to be. Then she says to Trinity that she envies her, but that these things are not meant to last. So the Merovingian used to be just like
    Neo - a One - thus proving further the feedback-loop explained earlier. The correct door in the Architect's room - Now there are two possibilities here: 1. All the previous One's chose the right door allowing a "temporary dissemination" of their code into the Matrix (i.e., the code they "carry" thus indicating Neo is indeed human), then he must select (unplug) 23 people from the Matrix to rebuild Zion. This takes away the possibility that stories from previous rebuilds of Zion will be carried through. But Morpheus indicated in the first Matrix that this is the case anyway. He said, "there was a man born inside, able to change things, it was he who freed the first of us," - basically the One previous to Neo. And this proves that the previous One chose the right door also.Neo's purpose is also to choose the right door, but he does not because he faces deletion afterwards and has the choice of going into exile - programs choosing to go into exile is the one thing that can't be accounted for in program parameters. Thus, he chooses the left door instead this time. How was Neo able to choose the other door? Because of his extreme willpower? - Even the Architect indicated that he'd noticed this - "Interesting. That was quicker than the others." Or more likely, because the Oracle upgraded his coding with the candy on the park bench. The candy/cookie was a method to change the One's program. She said he has made a believer out of her - this is quite human-like and perhaps the previous One's didn't accept the
    upgrade candy, now she has hope... hope that Neo will finally choose the other door. 2. All the previous One's chose the left door, saving Trinity and letting Zion fall. So this time is no different. But the Architect does say, "You are here because Zion is about to be destroyed. Its every living inhabitant terminated, its entire existence eradicated," and also, "this will be the sixth time we have destroyed it, and we have become exceedingly efficient at it," - assuming the Architect isn't lying, then they have already destroyed Zion (i.e., Zion has fallen) five times - i.e., the result of going through the left door. Morpheus and Trinity are programs. Morpheus's purpose was to find the One and deliver him to the Architect. Trinity's purpose is to control the One by getting in love with him. Trinity is supposed to be the mother of the new One every time the Matrix is Reloaded. That's why the sex scene was so important and why she was named Trinity. The Architect says, "she is going to die, and there is nothing that you can do to stop it." He was correct though because she did die just like Neo did in the first Matrix (Oracle said he or Morpheus would, and she didn't lie, but he came back to life). Trinity dies, but comes back to life (we are using medical definition of death in all this of course!). The Architect has already laid down an ultimatum for Neo choosing the left door: The Architect - "Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix, which coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the extinction of the entire human race." Neo - "You won't let it happen, you can't. You need human beings to survive." The Architect - "There are levels of survival we are prepared to accept. However, the relevant issue is whether or not you are ready to accept the responsibility for the death of every human being in this world." Looking at this further, the Architect does say "coupled" with the extermination of Zion will the human race be exterminated. So he says everyone connected to the Matrix will die, but if Zion is not exterminated, the human race will not necessarily die. Also, there is likely to be a time-window between not going through the right door, and the cataclysmic crash, thus allowing Neo to unplug as many as possible from the Matrix, then those people won't die. This will be the start of the next Zion. As for the Matrix, a cataclysmic crash doesn't mean the end of the Matrix - just needs rebooting or reloading! Agent Smith explained: Agent Smith is the only "human" in this world. He's the one spreading himself like a virus replicating himself over and over until the Matrix will finally get overloaded and fail. Smith is the one who wants to get out of the Matrix for good. He said so in the first Matrix, "I must get out of here, I must get free! And in this mind, is the key," squeezing Morpheus's temples, "my key! Once Zion is destroyed, there is no need for me to be here!" Smith knows that by killing Neo he can escape the Matrix because Neo is the key to resetting the Matrix, or to shut it off. It was originally killing Neo (in the first Matrix) that allowed Smith to become powerful (cloning ability) - so killing Neo again will allow him to gain Neo's powers completely, and thus again the power to shut down the Matrix. So where the hell did Smith come from if he wants to destroy the Matrix? He's obviously not meant to be there - he's a computer virus as he has every characteristic of a virus - he multiplies and spreads and infects (and emulates) other programs like one. He is exactly as he described humans at the end of the first Matrix - "You move to an
    area and you multiply and multiply until every natural resource is consumed and the only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus."But who put him there? This will only be revealed in Revolutions (Revelations?) I guess - but I'm betting on humans in the real real world, i.e., outside of Zion and the Matrix. They're at war with the machines and trying to destroy them by infecting them with this virus Agent Smith. So the irony with this theory is that Agent Smith represents the human race!! Neo represents the machines! Agent Smith says to Neo just after he's seen the Oracle that he became free when Neo destroyed him in the first Matrix (remember when Neo entered his body and exploded him from inside out) - as a virus, Smith has the ability to "inherit" other programs' abilities and thus inherited some of Neo's. The anomaly explained: The anomaly is all the humans that do not accept the Matrix. The Architect says "Your life is the sum of a remainder of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the matrix. You are the eventuality of an anomaly, which despite my sincerest efforts I have been unable to eliminate from what is otherwise a harmony of mathematical precision. While it remains a burden to sedulously avoid it, it is not unexpected, and thus not beyond a measure of control." This includes Neo, but Neo's Matrix avatar is attached with the One program so that he
    can follow his purpose as explained earlier under "The One explained". However, he is also supposed to protect himself and destroy anything that gets in his way - i.e., Agent Smith - so that he may fulfil his purpose. Further proving Neo - and other non-accepters of the Matrix - are the
    anomaly, the Architect says, "Your life is the sum of a remainder of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the matrix." The clue here is Neo's program name - "The One". Take one-third for example. 1 over 3 is 0.33333 recurring. A computer cannot deal with recurring numbers, so must accept a limit, let's say 0.33333 for argument's sake. Multiply by 3, you get 0.99999 - never 1.00000, where has the "remainder" 0.00001 (One) gone? This is the limitation of computers, this is the mathematical imprecision inherent in programming (of the Matrix) and the eventuality of the One anomaly unable to be eliminated. What is the equation then? Not sure, but it definitely involves pi. The Keymaker refers to the window of time to open the door to the mainframe as 314 seconds. 3.14 is pi to three sig. figs., or the number of radians in half a circle. Half a circle is like the cross-section of a womb, similar to the alcove of Neo and Trinity's love scene - conceiving the next One? "NEO", incidently, is an anagram of "ONE". Trinity and Neo - one on one; a choice - one or one. Leads us to 101. "101" is mentioned numerous times in Matrix 1 and Reloaded. Neo's room at the beginning, Merovingian is on the 101st floor, the 101 freeway of the car chase in Reloaded, then when Trinity is hacking into
    the power plant system, she resets the password to Z10N0101. Freaky. Indicates that she is a program because that's not some random password she's put in. 101 is binary for 5, which in zero-based binary counting: 000 is 1, 001, is 2, 010 is 3, 011 is 4, 100 is 5, 101 is 6 - And this is the 6th version of the Matrix! Then there's 303. 303 is the room Neo got shot in Matrix 1, the Oracle lives in room 303, it's also the hotel room number Trinity is in in Matrix 1 and it's seen at the end when Neo fights the Agents and Smith and begins to literally see the code that makes up
    the Matrix. 101 x 3 = 303, a trilogy, 3 + 0 + 3 = 6 = the 6th Matrix. Trinity means 3. Who is the "mother" that the Architect refers to? The Architect says, "Please," in an almost disapproving
    sense when Neo suggests the Oracle, but does not reveal who it really is or even directly that Neo is wrong. The architect was the one who created the Matrix; the co-creator is neither Persephone nor the Oracle. Both of them are only programs that have a purpose in the matrix, just like the rest. The Architect is in charge of the Matrix world and the co-creator is in charge of Zion. She has almost the same age as the Architect. Therefore, that woman is the Head Counsellor, the only woman of importance that lives in Zion and the one who asked for the two captains to volunteer at the council meeting. She's the one who knew all along about the Matrix. She was the one who told Zion's Defence Minister to cool off and to let Morpheus do his work so things could go as planned. Or alternatively, it could indeed be the Oracle. She is the only program that truly wants humans to have a free choice... at the same time, she sees the future, because she knows the program code - she is like God - which is why Seraph protects her - see "Who is Seraph?" below. What's so special about Neo's avatar? Neo is a skilled hacker, and his avatar in the Matrix is based on the person that founded the AI of the original machines that
    eventually took over the world... How? Take a look at the disc he gave to the bloke at the door at the beginning of Matrix 1. It said "DISC AI" on it. The hollowed book Neo takes the disc out of is "Simulacra and Simulation" - a collection of essays by the French postmodernist philosopher Jean Baudrillard. He opens it to the section "on Nihilism" (meaning nothing is truly known, etc.). "Baudrillard's concept of simulation is the creation of the real through conceptual or 'mythological' models which have no connection or origin in reality. The model becomes the determinant of our perception of reality--the real." And Morpheus says, "Welcome to the desert of the real," in Matrix 1. I'd say this book describes The Matrix to a tee. So this disc contains the key to the AI, and thus how to destroy the machines, so I think they'll use this info in revolutions to ultimately destroy the machines, which means he'll have to go back to the nightclub and find the guy he gave it to. Who is Seraph? The reason Seraph (the guy Neo meets before meeting the Oracle) had golden code and was so spectacular is that he came from the first incarnation of the matrix, which was heaven. "Seraph" is singular for the plural "seraphim". The seraphim are the highest choir of angels and included amongst others: Lucifer, Gabriele, Raziel
    and Malaciah, and they sit on the 8th level of Heaven just one below God. So Seraph will obviously have a big part in Revolutions, but whose side will he be on - the machines or the humans?? That is the question. The Twins They are exiled programs that emulate the human myth of ghosts as the Oracle explained. They are programs behaving badly. Persephone killed one of the Merovingian's bodyguards with a silver bullet because he was emulating a werewolf. So if the Twins could phase into ghost form, why didn't he when his arm was trapped in the door of the garage? Was it because he was wounded or because he can't phase when his arm is trapped? No of course not. The doors of that building, when shut, always led somewhere else (usually in the mountains) when opened again without the Keymaker's key. So if it were slammed shut due to the Twin phasing into ghost form, the Twin's arm would've ended up god knows where, but certainly not attached to the Twin's body.
  24. PC1
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    Custom........

    That post you quote is what is so cool about the Matrix movies, and why I feel they go so much further than any other movies. You think you have it so that you're comfortable with the "why" until you hear someone elses thoughts, and realize there are MANY other angles you haven't even contemplated. I didn't catch the license plates either, shame on me. But it's great stuff.

    I just can't imagine weaving a story line with the degrees and layers of complexity of the Matrix movies. Yet even if you don't get into all the layers (e.g. you have a life it's still just a great story and a great movie.

    And while I haven't seen Revolutions yet, I'm convinced The oracle is the mother. The architect is a pompous prick, very pleased with himself at the level of perfection he's attained. He ONLY sees things through his own eyes, no one else is worthy in his mind. When he responds "Please" after Neo sugests the oracle was it's mother, it's in a condescending tone. She's no "oracle" from HIS perspective, she's a "lesser mind" an intuitive program who was lucky enough to "stumble" onto a solution to his mathmatical anomoly.

  25. Hang'n & Bang'n
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    Originally posted by custom
    One more thing that erked me was the lack of questions answered. Supposedly, everything was going to be answere in Revolutions. Apparently not. Instead, we just got the Oracle spouting more non-sense. What about the dialog of the Architect, all of the symbolism; Trinity's name, Sereph, how did he see in code in the real world.

    I just felt that all the loose neds wren't tied up. Kind of a let down for a superior story.
    I totally agree... special effect is good but what made the matrix series really cool was the sublteties and symbolisms that had you watching it again and again so you can pick up things you missed before. I don't feel i got that this time around. I dunno, maybe if I watch it again i'll feel different.

    Originally posted by custom
    ... how did he see in code in the real world

    [/B]
    It was stated by the architect and the merovingian that choice was an illusion. They were never in the real world, it was still part of the matrix.
    Last edited by sikdogg; 11-11-2003 at 02:40 PM.
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