adding DCP to EC stack and switching to low carbs?

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    Question adding DCP to EC stack and switching to low carbs?


    hi there,
    I am new to this forum and was happy to find it.
    here is a short intro of myself so you see where I am coming from.

    Was in a car accident 2.5 years ago and put on 60+ pounds. Back got messed up and repaired then emotional and brain damage issues had the doctors put me on various anti depressants and "brain stimulant" if there is such a thing... bottomline I am now 60+ pounds heavier and the last months that I was on the meds I could litterally see myself get 1-2 pounds heavier each week...I weaned myself off any thing (4 months) and once that done I started controlling my food intake. after 2 weeks I added exercise ( moderate20-30min 3-4 weeks)
    and i noticed that exercise made me hungrier/tired defeating the pupose of me controlling food.
    So I looked around and found a post by Terracotta/ HOt and fit ( BIG thank you girl!!!) and added EC stck to my regimen... ( I had already tried Ephedra in 2000 to loose 5-6lbs, with great success)...I works wonder I am now controlling my food intake and exercise without problem-- went up 5/6 times a week and just have energy all day long.
    I make sure that I get 1200-1400 cal/ day ( I am 5'9 and currently 218) and I also lift weight on top of my cardio ( usually in the same session)

    so here my question :
    I am thinking of adding DCP , keeping the EC stack and switching to lo/no carb for a month...

    what do you think? and if it is a good idea should I cycle 6days lo carb/week or try going at it for the whole period.

    your input /comment would be greatly appreciated

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    Quote Originally Posted by justcurious09 View Post
    hi there,
    I am new to this forum and was happy to find it.
    here is a short intro of myself so you see where I am coming from.

    Was in a car accident 2.5 years ago and put on 60+ pounds. Back got messed up and repaired then emotional and brain damage issues had the doctors put me on various anti depressants and "brain stimulant" if there is such a thing... bottomline I am now 60+ pounds heavier and the last months that I was on the meds I could litterally see myself get 1-2 pounds heavier each week...I weaned myself off any thing (4 months) and once that done I started controlling my food intake. after 2 weeks I added exercise ( moderate20-30min 3-4 weeks)
    and i noticed that exercise made me hungrier/tired defeating the pupose of me controlling food.
    So I looked around and found a post by Terracotta/ HOt and fit ( BIG thank you girl!!!) and added EC stck to my regimen... ( I had already tried Ephedra in 2000 to loose 5-6lbs, with great success)...I works wonder I am now controlling my food intake and exercise without problem-- went up 5/6 times a week and just have energy all day long.
    I make sure that I get 1200-1400 cal/ day ( I am 5'9 and currently 218) and I also lift weight on top of my cardio ( usually in the same session)

    so here my question :
    I am thinking of adding DCP , keeping the EC stack and switching to lo/no carb for a month...


    what do you think? and if it is a good idea should I cycle 6days lo carb/week or try going at it for the whole period.

    your input /comment would be greatly appreciated
    If you're aiming for fat loss, and you're 218lb and training HARD 5-6 days a week, then 1400 calories is TOO LOW for you (even I would NEVER go that low if I was looking for fat loss; 1800 calories at the lowest tops (and never consistently), but usually around 2200 calories, amd I am only 112lb!), and you are likely to go into 'starvation mode' (where your body will fight you to hold onto the fat). And if you go low carbohydrates then you may just well make it worse (you do NOT need to eliminate carbohydrates to lose fat).

    I suggest that you start eating MORE. Look at your nutrition again; get a plan set up for you. Honestly, you DON'T need to exercise excessively or lower calories excessively OR cut carbohydrates to lose fat. And I wouldn't be using a fat burner just yet either. Calorie cycling is a good idea; so doing 2-3 days lower calories (i.e. FAT LOSS) and then 1-2 days higher calories (i.e. ABOVE MAINTENANCE) will help you as well.

    And doing cardio and weights in the same session; no wonder you get tired. For fat loss cardio is UNnecessary (more just for increasing or maintaining cardiovascular fitness; or personal preference). If you are going to do both, then I suggest that you do them in SEPARATE sessions. And definitely NOT lift weights 5-6 times a week, maybe 3-4 tops, so that you are giving your body enough time to RECOVER (since you DON'T get results when training, but in the RECOVERY time)!
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    thank you- more questions


    thank you for the answer

    I had used one of these calculator.. can't remember the site to find out what calories I needed
    for my height and my weight, it gave me 1700 roughly
    then I multiplied by 1.2 to get the BMR then multiply by 0.7 since when I started my exercise level was pretty low.
    that gave me 1400 roughly.
    since i was not exercising every day at the beginning I thought that doing 1200 some days and 1400 others in the week I would maintain a good caloric intake.

    i can increase my caloric consumption but I am not sure that i can go up to 2000 since I am also trying to lose weight ( mostly fat, I know)
    I know that in the past ,before my accident, although very athletic, I was a skinnny fat and going way under the caloric requirement would make me loose more than fat. But I honestly thought that the danger zone was under 1000 cal or so.

    where did I think wrong?

    I also thought that lo carb was good for fat loss


    as for my sessions... I have this old problem where if I don't sweat, I am frustrated so even if I plan to lift weight, I still need to start with 15 min cardio ( alternate moderate and high) on elliptical or treadmill. I can try to drecrease the time to 10min but in my current shape, i would think that I still need it


    I really appreciate your input
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    Quote Originally Posted by justcurious09 View Post
    thank you for the answer

    I had used one of these calculator.. can't remember the site to find out what calories I needed
    for my height and my weight, it gave me 1700 roughly
    then I multiplied by 1.2 to get the BMR then multiply by 0.7 since when I started my exercise level was pretty low.
    that gave me 1400 roughly.
    since i was not exercising every day at the beginning I thought that doing 1200 some days and 1400 others in the week I would maintain a good caloric intake.

    i can increase my caloric consumption but I am not sure that i can go up to 2000 since I am also trying to lose weight ( mostly fat, I know)
    I know that in the past ,before my accident, although very athletic, I was a skinnny fat and going way under the caloric requirement would make me loose more than fat. But I honestly thought that the danger zone was under 1000 cal or so.

    where did I think wrong?

    I also thought that lo carb was good for fat loss


    as for my sessions... I have this old problem where if I don't sweat, I am frustrated so even if I plan to lift weight, I still need to start with 15 min cardio ( alternate moderate and high) on elliptical or treadmill. I can try to drecrease the time to 10min but in my current shape, i would think that I still need it


    I really appreciate your input
    1. You still need to take some results you get in these 'calculators' with a grain of salt, because 1400 is DEFINITELY TOO LOW, even if you were doing NOTHING!

    2. Yes, you COULD probably get away with 2000 calories a day, actually, AND lose fat (especially given the heavy training regime you seem to be following). Trust me; NOT eating or being ridiculously low with calories is NOT the way to go! And yes, you are likely to lose muscle when you go too low, and the muscle may well go BEFORE the fat.

    3. Just because you don't sweat as much doesn't mean that you can't lift weights. However, as a 'beginner', yes, it IS a good idea to warm-up before weights. Or you can do a couple of light warm-up sets at a lighter weight for higher reps. As you get more experienced you will know what you can d and not do.

    4. I recommend that you get a personal trainer and see a nutritionist, to get you started on the right path. And this will help with motivation, having someone to be 'accountable' to; as well as get you your results FASTER.
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    To answer your original question yes, DCP can be used with the EC stack and low carb.

    However as Rosie suggested if you don't take in enough calories and protein then it won't matter what you use. Even on my competition diet I'm taking in over 6 meals a day at 122lbs.

    I'm not a sweaty person by nature either, it truly is no indicator of the work you put in. However you can find a plyometric trainer and you will likely feel the work you do, whether in sweat or heartrate.
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    Crader, Guejsn,
    Thank you for your replies, hope you had a sweet valentine day!
    I am increasing my cal intake.. up to 1800 today in 5 meals . I believe there should be enough protein since I got protein shakes and have counted 50g protein + 4oz chicken breast I got in my salad. I also got 20g of fiber ( from the same shakes).not sure about the evening though, I feel pretty full by then

    the following represent the alimentation I am trying to follow..may look boring put it allows me to keep control of my cal intake without having to guess on the up or down side( please feel free to tell me what is wrong with it)

    early morning
    coffee with 2 tsp sugar + 1 E(25mg)C(200mg)--- 30-50 cal?
    1 slice bread with 2tbspnatural peanut butter---- 300 cal ( added this today)

    fitness 40-60min
    after fitness
    2 slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)----360 cal( or 250 if GNC)


    lunch ( usually 3-4hours after fitness)
    1 E(25mg)C(200mg)
    2 slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)-----360 cal( or 250 if GNC)

    midafternoon
    slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)-----180cal ( or 125 if GNC)

    late afternoon
    slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)-----180 cal( or 125 if GNC)

    dinner **** does not always happen, will try to force myself*****
    salad ( or veggies) with 4oz chicken -----250 cal

    late evening **** does not always happen, nuts are my downfall *****
    some nuts ( not too often cause I can go crazy and eat the whole box) ( 200 cal?guess)



    i get 2liters(64 fl oz) of water a day and trying to increase it to 2.5 within the next 2 weeks
    I would also like to put a second fitness session in the evening 2-3/ week . that way maybe i can do cardio in the morning and weight in the evening and be able to follow Guesjn advice and not over do the weight.

    what do you think?
    regards
    Last edited by justcurious09; 02-14-2009 at 08:38 PM. Reason: spelling mistake
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    Quote Originally Posted by justcurious09 View Post
    Crader, Guejsn,
    Thank you for your replies, hope you had a sweet valentine day!
    I am increasing my cal intake.. up to 1800 today in 5 meals . I believe there should be enough protein since I got protein shakes and have counted 50g protein + 4oz chicken breast I got in my salad. I also got 20g of fiber ( from the same shakes).not sure about the evening though, I feel pretty full by then

    the following represent the alimentation I am trying to follow..may look boring put it allows me to keep control of my cal intake without having to guess on the up or down side( please feel free to tell me what is wrong with it)

    early morning
    coffee with 2 tsp sugar + 1 E(25mg)C(200mg)--- 30-50 cal?
    1 slice bread with 2tbspnatural peanut butter---- 300 cal ( added this today)

    fitness 40-60min
    after fitness
    2 slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)----360 cal( or 250 if GNC)


    lunch ( usually 3-4hours after fitness)
    1 E(25mg)C(200mg)
    2 slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)-----360 cal( or 250 if GNC)

    midafternoon
    slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)-----180cal ( or 125 if GNC)

    late afternoon
    slim fast optimum ( or GNC protein shakes)-----180 cal( or 125 if GNC)

    dinner **** does not always happen, will try to force myself*****
    salad ( or veggies) with 4oz chicken -----250 cal

    late evening **** does not always happen, nuts are my downfall *****
    some nuts ( not too often cause I can go crazy and eat the whole box) ( 200 cal?guess)



    i get 2liters(64 fl oz) of water a day and trying to increase it to 2.5 within the next 2 weeks
    I would also like to put a second fitness session in the evening 2-3/ week . that way maybe i can do cardio in the morning and weight in the evening and be able to follow Guesjn advice and not over do the weight.

    what do you think?
    regards
    Not to be an arse, but that is NOT going to get you the results you want! You are barely eating anything at all. You need to EAT REAL FOOD!!! Protein shakes do NOT count as real food (and most certainly do NOT get the same result with your metabolism as EATING!

    You need MORE than a piece of toast with peanut butter in the morning. Try oats with protein powder and nuts/seeds and yoghurt.

    You NEED to eat dinner; you are "trying" to have the 'best' meal you have on your list so far. Have what you would have for dinner for lunch.


    Read this and go from there:

    Tips on Diet for Fat Loss

    Just to help get you started in the right direction, here are some tips for you diet for fat loss. (These are the general guidelines that I give to my clients who are looking to lose BF (and they can be adjusted to suit muscle and strength gain, since the only difference in the two is the AMOUNT of calories that needs to be consumed); otherwise I write them a personalized diet plan (that takes into account personal preferences, allergies, etc.) to meet their needs):

    1. First, you needs to work out what you MAINTENANCE calories are (There are various methods and equations that you can use to calculate this (see post #2 at Help determine my calories most take into account current body mass, height, and activity level). Then, to lose fat, you need to make sure that you're having up to 500 calories LESS than maintenance. Depending on how fast or slow you lose the fat, you can adjust and tweak your calorie intake each week.
    2. Eat every 2-3 hours after waking. This helps keep the metabolism going throughout the day, as well as keeping insulin levels stable.
    3. EVERY meal should have complex carbohydrates [CHO] (i.e. kumara, rice, oats, etc.), QUALITY LEAN protein (chicken breast, fish, tuna, salmon, lean beef, egg whites, etc.), and FIBROUS CHO (i.e. vegetables, green ones in particular).
    4. Drink 4.5 litres of water per day. This will help keep the system clean.
    5. It has been proven that TWO servings of DAIRY per day helps lose MORE fat than if one avoids it altogether.
    6. Do NOT avoid fat (The only fat you should be avoiding is Saturated fat and Trans fats). You NEED fat in your diet, as fat plays major roles in energy metabolism and other parts of your body (Wardlaw & Hampl, 2007). Make sure to have at least 30 grams of GOOD fats daily (60g would be best) (i.e. flaxseeds or flaxseed oil, fish oils, peanut butter, nuts - especially almonds and walnuts, hempseed oil, olive oil, etc.) per day (i.e. this is ~2 tbsp of flaxseed oil or peanut butter).
    7. Don't drink tea or coffee. Try drinking GREEN tea instead; it helps with thermogenesis, and is especially good if you take it one hour before doing cardio first thing in the morning.
    8. Don't drink alcohol. Alcohol has NO nutritional value and is full of calories.
    9. Minimize adding salt to food. Instead, flavour a meal with herbs and spices (i.e. ginger, cumin, cayenne pepper, curry powder, chilli powder, and garlic all help thermogenesis a bit).
    10. The only sugar needed on a regular basis is the NATURAL sugars found in food; these are mostly found in fruit. Too much sugar plays havoc with insulin levels and these should be as stable as possible throughout the day. The best time to be having sugar is straight AFTER a RESISTANCE workout, when the body is trying to replenish muscle glycogen stores (Burke, 2006).
    11. Do NOT avoid CHO. You NEED at least 50-100 grams of CHO per day for your body to burn fat effectively. A good guideline is to have at least 1 gram of CHO per kg of body mass per day as a MINIMUM (Burke, 2006).
    12. Eat most food as 'natural' as possible. This means fresh fruit and vegetables, meat, grains, etc. Try not to eat too much packaged food, as it is full of extra calories and sugar.
    13. Most importantly, remember that it IS OK TO CHEAT every now and then. Actually the body NEEDS cheat meals and days (1-2 a week will get results; I have 3-4 8000 calorie days, and I am only 112 pounds right now!). By throwing all the guidelines I have just mentioned above out of the way and having a day where you eat what you want, it helps ; and it will also help prevent your body from going into starvation mode (which it will do on excessivley low calories, and the body will battle you to hold onto the fat as much as it can; and that's the last thing wanted). If you prefer NOT to 'cheat', then adding in 1-2 higher CALORIE days (i.e. go up to Maintenance, or even Bulking, or even slightly higher), with the extra calories coming from quality COMPLEX CHO, you should be ok.

    Supplements should NOT be a big deal, as most fat loss can be done through simply eating the right food at the right time. And unless everything that you're doing is already done to ensure the maximum results in the timeframe that you want to achieve it in, and then supplementation should not be the focus. However, there ARE a few supplements that I think are important to any regime:

    1. A multivitamin. (Although you should be eating as much of a variety of food as possible, in order to meet the RDI/AI of most nutrients from actual food).
    2. Creatine monohydrate. Creatine helps the body to recover faster, as well as aiding in increasing strength levels and lean body mass [LBM].
    3. Flaxseed/Hempseed/Fish Oil. This is the GOOD fats. Flaxseed or Hempseed oil is great with breakfast or in protein shakes.
    4. Protein Powder. This just helps for the in-between meals, or after the gym, and to make sure that you gets enough protein in (You should be having 1-1.5 grams of protein per kg of body mass per day; this is so that muscle loss is prevented, and can even assist in small gains in LBM).

    Apart from these 4 'base' supplements, you don't need a lot. And forget about using fat-burners or thermogenics; they are a waste of time unless you're ALREADY lean (say 12-15% BF) and wants that 'extra edge' to lose the last few% bodyfat (i.e. like a fitness competitor, etc.)
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    good last post covers it up basically
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    Absolutely listen to G's advice about the diet. I was feeling depressed for you just thinking about day in and day out of eating those crappy drinks. Everything, and I mean everything, in moderation. Mix it up. How about some fat free cottage cheese or yogurt with cut up bananas and granola for example as a "snack." Try fiber-one Caramel Delight cereal or oatmeal in the morning. Brown Rice, veggies with salmon for dinner.

    As far as cardio goes, I would say that at first 30 min of cardio 4 days a week, or more, is going to treat you well. No, it doesn't burn the fat calories primarily, but you are going to drop weight all around and see results. By keeping your weight training up, you'll increase your lean mass and burn fat cals here. But that cardio is going to take your weight down overall and keep you motivated.
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    WOW throw out the slim fast. As another user once said, the only thing those things slim is your wallet!
  

  
 

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