Partial Rep Bench Press - what's the problem again?

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  1. Half-reps have there place in training. Chuck Sipes used them at the tail end of his bench workout.
    The only time I take exception with people that do partials is when the misrepresent themselves. "I can bench X amount of weight" And then you find out they are doing 1/8 reps or something.
    But if this is working why change it?


  2. if you want to say you bench 335 then go to the chest, no if's and's or but's about it. if you want to do partials then add some boards and say you can bench 335 off a 1 2 3 4 or 5 board. you're not using all the muscles if you're not touching the bar to your chest. it's kind of like when you see a guy squatting and he's 4 inches above parallel, it's not a squat.
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  3. I used to do partial squats because of an old back injury. I think it helped me in the beginning, but switching to full range made a world of difference. More muscles were recruited and my body responded. In time I was able to match the weight of my partials.

    As for X-reps, I've tried them and they worked for me. Although I can't seem to do them for more than 6 weeks before I feel overtrained...maybe if I would have tried them 20 or 30 years ago...
    Last edited by colkurtz_spf; 05-13-2006 at 05:32 PM.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by Beelzebub
    bobo, from your experience - do partial reps (specifically bench press) offer any additional benefit? and vice versa - does full range offer any additional benefit when in comparison to half reps?
    Maybe.

    I could make an arguement for it based on what I've seen and what has been studied but partials isnt the same as using boards because with boards your rep TUT isn't increased compared to many partials where the overall time/rep is increased. Generally when I've seen people do partials its a much slower pace and stopping mid rep is a pretty tough thing to do when weight is increased and there isn't anything supporting it. But these people are doing it for a specific purpose, not stating that is their "bench press". They incorporate partials into their full range of motion exercises. They arne't bodybuilders either. OTOH I've also seen where the weight is lightened and the reps are much faster such ascending strnegh curve type exericses such as bench press and squats where they work on explosiveness at the first half of the concetric action. THis is primarily for performance though and wouldn't do anything for mass.

    So overall I could see it working somewhat simply because the rep TUT is increased while the weight is increased but its usually a very slow controlled rep. At the same token you can probably accomplish the same tihng (in terms of muscle gain
    ) by slowing it down and performing the the rep with a full range of motion.
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Beelzebub
    i think i now see what you mean by mass. is it fluff (fat) that you're concerned about? mass (muscle mass) is what bodybuilders strive for. so, when you simply say 'muscle' and not 'mass', it doesn't add up to me. but if you are implying fat, then i digress.

    once again, never said it was best.

    comparing how technology advances to half reps in the gym is not a good comparison IMO. but we're getting off topic.

    mainly, my quarrel with half reppers is their total disregard for the other half of the rep. i've met and talked to many of them. and i'm willing to bet if i met you in the gym and asked you how much you bench, you would undoubtedly say "335" and not say "i half rep 335".

    eh, but what the **** do i know? i just lift. keep doing your half reps and if you're happy with it, don't worry about what guys like me say - we're obviously wrong and didn't advance with society.
    I completely agree with you on abusing half reps and people who say "I bench 400" and really are just half-repping. I guess I should have stated that half-reps should be incorporated into your routine to blast through sticking points, and they've worked for me. Not that Half-Reps are some sort of magic routine.

    No, I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just trying to keep an open mind. I think you're right everything you said in your last post, but the other ones it sounded like you implied half-reps had no place in training. We both misunderstood each other, but I see where you're coming from. I definitely don't want to see kids abusing the half - rep. And I definitely don't count my max lift in terms of half reps.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by guyfromkop2
    you're not using all the muscles if you're not touching the bar to your chest. it's kind of like when you see a guy squatting and he's 4 inches above parallel, it's not a squat.
    This is absolutely false, and i'll prove it to you right now.

    Stand in front of a wall with your hands slightly wider than shoulder width, or whatever width you use for your bench press. Now press your chest up against the wall. Try to flex your pecs. You'll find that only your outer pecs and delts are recruited. Now slowly step back. With each step you'll find your chest being more maximally recruited.

    Your pecs are not fully contracted until your arms are fully extended and hands out in front of you.

    A guy 4 inches above parallel with 500 on the bar is going to be able to squat 315 - 350 no problem for reps. I'm not talking about half - repping with 2 plates or 3 plates. I'm talking heavy weights - 500 and up.

    Again, bodybuilding. Not powerlifting or trying to win a competition in max lifts.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by peterson24
    Building muscle is the same as building mass. You can build muscle powerlifting or bodybuilding. I am going to assume you mean you rather look nice and ripped rather than strong.
    Building mass is not the same as building muscle. Mass is a combination of by-products from metabolism, water retention and muscle.

    Of course you build muscle with both bodybuilding and powerlifting. I don't remember implying that you can't, that'd be stupid.

    Anyone can be nice and ripped. That's not what bodybuilding was the last I checked. Bodybuilding is being able to show huge muscular development even in a depleted state with focus on proportion and balance.



    Quote Originally Posted by peterson24
    Bodybuilding stuff has its place, but IMO, especially if you participate in sports, body building stuff leaves you open to more injuries because you have a better chance of muscle imbalance as opposed to Old School such as powerlifting.

    I'm guessing what you mean by bodybuilding "stuff" is too many isolation movements. I agree. My routine has as it's backbone movements the bench press, squat and deadlift. The rest are added depending on what I feel needs to come up or down.

    But if you think a guy doing 50 pound dumbbell curls is less susceptible to injury then a guy trying to pull 800 pounds from the floor, then we have a disagreement.

    Then again, I'm not talking about general athletics. Just bodybuilding.

    Quote Originally Posted by peterson24
    If training for athletics, I can't see any other way of training, IMO. I can't recall one sport I have ever participated in which required me to make an isolated movement with one muscle.
    What method of training are you talking about? Powerlifting? So you're saying powerlifting is beneficial for general athletics but specificity training isn't?

    Quote Originally Posted by peterson24
    Powerlifters do things like this also, like floor presses, rack presses, etc but I stated this before.
    Didn't see where you posted that, but yes. Those are all examples of partial movements. That's why I'm fascinated when people get angry or defensive when I suggest partial rep benches and squats would be just as beneficial as partial rep deadlifts (I.e., RACK PULLS) and floor presses (i.e., HALF REP benches!)

  8. Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBB
    This is absolutely false, and i'll prove it to you right now.

    Stand in front of a wall with your hands slightly wider than shoulder width, or whatever width you use for your bench press. Now press your chest up against the wall. Try to flex your pecs. You'll find that only your outer pecs and delts are recruited. Now slowly step back. With each step you'll find your chest being more maximally recruited.

    Your pecs are not fully contracted until your arms are fully extended and hands out in front of you.

    A guy 4 inches above parallel with 500 on the bar is going to be able to squat 315 - 350 no problem for reps. I'm not talking about half - repping with 2 plates or 3 plates. I'm talking heavy weights - 500 and up.

    Again, bodybuilding. Not powerlifting or trying to win a competition in max lifts.

    you've spent too much time on bodybuilding.com

    and what's the point of this thread? is it going to help make someone stronger? build muscle better? anything related to strength? or are you just trying to get a point across that bench specialists across the world would laugh at if they saw this thread?

  9. I like to do heavy partials on the squat a couple times a month for my last set. I set the rails lower and lower each time and after a few weeks Im doing full reps with the heavier weights. I was able to get my squat over 400 this way. Which isnt much, but I was pretty happy

    I dont think a workout should consist of all partials unless its part of a powerlifting routine where your working chest a few days a week, and one of those days is partials/board presses. Working the muscle through its full range of motion is important - you might build a stack of mass with only partial reps but it would suck for strength and flexibility.

    BV

  10. Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    I like to do heavy partials on the squat a couple times a month for my last set. I set the rails lower and lower each time and after a few weeks Im doing full reps with the heavier weights. I was able to get my squat over 400 this way. Which isnt much, but I was pretty happy
    That's a pretty clever idea.

  11. Quote Originally Posted by thesinner
    That's a pretty clever idea.
    That's how I had my first knee injury. I admit it works, just make sure your joints are in order. As with steroids, push yourself too hard and you can get hurt.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by CDB
    push yourself too hard and you can get hurt.
    same with dropping a deuce

  13. Quote Originally Posted by Beelzebub
    same with dropping a deuce
    Yeah, but it's just unsanitary to do partials in that context.

  14. Quote Originally Posted by CDB
    Yeah, but it's just unsanitary to do partials in that context.
    Hey man, in disgusting public ****ters, the sky crane is a necessity. I'm simply not a nester.

  15. That's how I had my first knee injury. I admit it works, just make sure your joints are in order. As with steroids, push yourself too hard and you can get hurt.
    Oh I totally agree there - stoping halfway through a rep with heavy weight is stressful on the joint that's bearing the load...Ill only do those 1-2 times a month and only on my last set. Usually after 2 warm up sets and 3-4 sets of 8-12 full ROM reps. (well , a little below parallel for me)

    BV

  16. Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    Oh I totally agree there - stoping halfway through a rep with heavy weight is stressful on the joint that's bearing the load...Ill only do those 1-2 times a month and only on my last set. Usually after 2 warm up sets and 3-4 sets of 8-12 full ROM reps. (well , a little below parallel for me)

    BV
    Had I been that smart about this technique I might be squatting more than 300 these days. Whether it's a physical or mental block, I find it very hard to go beyond that weight in squats. Deadlifts are another matter, so I'm guessing it's mental, so be it. My knee hadn't been tracking right for a couple days, I came down too fast, felt a massive pain in my right knee, tried to stop and just fell back on my ass. Felt the bar scrape down my back a a little. Had I not leaned/fallen back that weight would have come down on my upper back or neck. Scared the living crap out of me.

    Point being one of the dangers of doing partials is that if you get too ****y you just may think what you're putting up on a partial you can full rep, and if you're wrong it can be your ass. These days I'm leary of any technique that lets people handle more weight than they can handle for a full 3 to 5 reps. Seems anything beyond that not only requires a compromise of form and often ROM, but safety.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by CDB
    Had I been that smart about this technique I might be squatting more than 300 these days. Whether it's a physical or mental block, I find it very hard to go beyond that weight in squats. Deadlifts are another matter, so I'm guessing it's mental, so be it. My knee hadn't been tracking right for a couple days, I came down too fast, felt a massive pain in my right knee, tried to stop and just fell back on my ass. Felt the bar scrape down my back a a little. Had I not leaned/fallen back that weight would have come down on my upper back or neck. Scared the living crap out of me.

    Point being one of the dangers of doing partials is that if you get too ****y you just may think what you're putting up on a partial you can full rep, and if you're wrong it can be your ass. These days I'm leary of any technique that lets people handle more weight than they can handle for a full 3 to 5 reps. Seems anything beyond that not only requires a compromise of form and often ROM, but safety.
    word

  18. Lots of good posts here- IMO the point is getting the fullest ROM possible while keeping the tension in the targeted muscle/s. During the Bench press when arms are at 90 degrees tension is maximal in the pecs. About 1/2 way up the the triceps come more into play. If I don't want to tax my triceps to much in the beginning of the workout than I'll do partial or more specific- from 90 degrees to half way up reps.

    Someone posted about inner and outer fibers contracting-"I think I read that in Muscle and Fiction"

    from what I understand one cannot have inner and outer fibers contract- If it's all one fiber it's going to contract. Which is the case for the example which was used for the pecs.

    Happy lifting- Whichever way you guys decide to do it.

  19. I don't feel any chest stimulation doing partials, I always touch, not bounce, my chest and come back up. My joints do not feel any different and actually I barely use my shoulders at the bottom of the movement. Most people I know that train mainly partials for hypertrophy are very weak at the bottom of the movement and although they can partial more than me on sets, they can not actually lift as much weight properly. Also, you do get more of a stretch if you go lower, and we all know what stretching does for muscle facia. I dunno to each there own but I never do partials unless it's a half range box squat or board presses, and I still train full range during this time as well. I don't understand how they train chest just as well since the lockout, which is 90 degrees and above is mainly based upon tricep and shoulder strength. Post failure partials are not bad to use every once in a while after or on the last set of your hypertrophy routine as a burnout technique, but do not need to be a mainstay of your routine. If you have joint problems, there are plenty of other full range machines you can use or that take stress off the rotator cuff and shoulder ligaments, so there really is no need for some to even do BB bench at all.

  20. I partially stick my **** in the *****...lol

  21. I partially stick my **** in the *****...lol
    Come on now...this is the Exercise Science forum. Plenty of room for that in the Adult section.



    BV

  22. same with dropping a deuce
    He's not kidding though - a lot of people die of heart attacks on the crapper.

    BV

  23. my bad...

  24. Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    He's not kidding though - a lot of people die of heart attacks on the crapper.

    BV
    like Elvis

  25. Quote Originally Posted by BLOODZ
    I partially stick my **** in the *****...lol

    i'm not sure if he knows it or not, but he's actually got good point, you wouldnt half stick it in there all the time would you? so why would you only half bench it all the time?
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