Which back workout is better and why?

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    Which back workout is better and why?


    Back workout number 1:

    Deadlifts - 10,6,4,4
    DB Shrugs - 12,10,8
    Weighted Close grip chins OR weighted Wide grip pull-ups - 10,8,6,6
    DB rows - 8,6,6
    BB rows, or T-bar rows - 8,6,6

    Back workout number 2:

    Rack-pulls - 10,10,8,6
    T-bar rows - 10,8,6
    Close-grip pulldowns - 10,8,6,4
    Hammer-Strength reverse grip pulldowns - 10,8,8

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    I know this does not answer you question specifically, but I remember reading (I think it was the M&F Training Notebook) that dumbell rows actually hit the most muscle groups simultaneously, so you may want to include that one in either.

    I would go with #1, using wide-grip pull-ups.
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    Yea a friend of mine had me run through he workout yesterday which is #2. To me it seemed like a Mickey Mouse routine. I was wondering why the hell we were doing the hammer strength machine right after we did close grip pulldowns.
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    workout 1 hands down. I dont like the order of the exercises though. Agree to start with deads, but finish with shrugs. If you do those back to back to start you'll not only be drained but you'll be lucky if you can grip a pencil after all that strain on your forearms.
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    Why can't you switch the workouts. I love all the exercises and would rotate them every other back workout.

    Each has there place in hitting the back at different angles. I would just add seated wide neutral grip rows in place of the HS pull downs.
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    Its hard for me to be sore from a back workout unless I do deads. Workout 1 is better.
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    Are those the only options or can we suggest our own?


    CROWLER
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    Hey Crowler, I'd like to here yours.
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    Well if you have a better suggestion go ahead and spit it, Crow'.
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    oh Nice now you put the pressure on me so if you don't have water wings in the next month I am to blame lol

    I am just posting what I do. Not saying it is the best.

    I do

    Wide Grip chins 3 sets 5 - 12 reps Upping or lowing the weight IF I even need any lol

    Bent over rows for thickness 3 sets 5 - 12 reps changing the weight for the 3 sets.

    I do shrugs on shoulder day.


    That's it.

    I don't do deads for me I don't see the need if I am doing squats, shrugs, bent over rows and wide grip chins.

    Ok now please don't ban me



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    I wish I could get away with just that.
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    do one one week and do the other the next week, basically rotate them every week
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyfromkop2
    do one one week and do the other the next week, basically rotate them every week
    I could. But think #1 hits both nails on the head with variety and targeting the back muscles from different angles.
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    Quote Originally Posted by handzilla
    I could. But think #1 hits both nails on the head with variety and targeting the back muscles from different angles.
    true, but after a while your muscles will adapt to that routine and you wont grow anymore, if you switch it up every now and then your body wont get used to the routine, plus pulling deads off the floor really shouldnt be done every week
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    Workout 1 is def better IMO. Deadlifts are king for back thickeness and strength.
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyfromkop2
    true, but after a while your muscles will adapt to that routine and you wont grow anymore, if you switch it up every now and then your body wont get used to the routine, plus pulling deads off the floor really shouldnt be done every week
    Workout #1 includes a switch weekly.

    T-bar rows or barbell rows
    Wide-grip pullups or close grip chins

    As far as deadlifting goes. I pull off the ground every week. But not always heavy. Sometimes I go for reps and speed.
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    Try this one:

    1 set of stiff arm pulldowns (8-12 reps to failure) SS to Close grip palms up pulldowns (6-10 reps to failure). Make sure to emphasize the negative(4 seconds or so) and to hold the weight in the fully contracted position for 1-2 seconds as well, and on the final rep make sure to hold in the contracted for as long as possible followed by a negative done as slowly as possible.

    1 set of Deadlifts (5-8 reps to failure)
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil216
    Try this one:

    1 set of stiff arm pulldowns (8-12 reps to failure) SS to Close grip palms up pulldowns (6-10 reps to failure). Make sure to emphasize the negative(4 seconds or so) and to hold the weight in the fully contracted position for 1-2 seconds as well, and on the final rep make sure to hold in the contracted for as long as possible followed by a negative done as slowly as possible.

    1 set of Deadlifts (5-8 reps to failure)
    3

    I don't think that is even close to enough volume for adding mass.
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    Volume is not what causes muscle growth, volume is a negative factor. As long as you are training to failure the volume listed is good as volume once again is a negative factor as the more sets you do cause a deeper inroad into your limited recovery ability.
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    But why no rows? I can see if you at least included those also.
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    The combination of the exercises that I listed will stimulate growth in the major muscles of the back.As long as you have gone to failure you can be certain that growth has been stimulated and once you ave done that there is no reason to do any additional work.
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    Any of you guys like using rack deads in substitution for floor deads in your rotation?
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    I have used them on occasion. They are good in the sense that it does allow for the use of very, very heavy weights, but then agian the range of motion is less.
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    I would go with workout 1 on this one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil216
    I have used them on occasion. They are good in the sense that it does allow for the use of very, very heavy weights, but then agian the range of motion is less.

    Sometimes I rotate them in if Ive been doing floor deads for a long time, and want to work the muscles differently. Its definately easier mentally then from the floor. especially when your as tall as me. But Sometimes I start to stagnate on floor deads, so I substitute w/ the rack deads from the knees.
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    I actually really enjoy doing deads from the floor but then agin I'm only 5'8. Be that as it may I think deads without a doubt one of the top 2 exercises that you could do along with squats.
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil216
    I actually really enjoy doing deads from the floor but then agin I'm only 5'8. Be that as it may I think deads without a doubt one of the top 2 exercises that you could do along with squats.

    I was thinking about that today. (I did rack deads today.) On one hand it felt good to rep out with all that weight. (I got 6plates a side for 8reps, where as I can only manage 6reps w 450-ish on floor deads) but I didnt feel that whole body intense effect like I do with the greater ROM. I could probably go down further on my Rack deads, but its still more of a low back, and traps exercise w/ out pulling from the floor. Not that thats bad. But its still kind of like substituting leg presses for squats, its easier then the real deal and you work fewer motor units, but you can move more weight. Im not taking a side for or against either exercise Im basically thinking out loud (or in print rather) about the interchangability of the two.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnicronSpawn
    Any of you guys like using rack deads in substitution for floor deads in your rotation?
    they are good to switch in every other week, like pull from the floor one week,then rack right below knee the next, then back to floor and so on and so forth. a guy who pulls over 700 told me about this and it works.
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    I like wide grip pulldowns, deadlifts and one arm rows personally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by exnihilo
    I like wide grip pulldowns, deadlifts and one arm rows personally.
    Deads rock, no back exercise compares. I actually prefer close grip pulldowns to wide, I just feel it a lot more and have gotten far more out of it over the years. As far as a rowing movement I love bent over BB rows.
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    I throw in wide grip pulldowns only when I'm feeling very weak...regardless of how much I weigh I always do pull-ups instead of pulldowns. Even 3 6-rep sets of pullups is more intense and stimulates more back muscles than say 3-4 10-12 rep sets of pulldowns, at least for me. I'm 265 lbs now and can still manage to rattle off 3 8-10 rep sets of pullups. When im bulking I'll add some weight and drop the reps to 6-8 for 2 sets. I usually start my back workout with them and go straight to deads, then bent over BB rows, 1 arm DB rows, and low cable rows. After that I'm usually bent over gasping for air, or in the bathroom puking.
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    i say rotate them. though workout #2 seems not as good as #1, but nothing beats variety.
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    Quote Originally Posted by handzilla
    Back workout number 1:

    Deadlifts - 10,6,4,4
    DB Shrugs - 12,10,8
    Weighted Close grip chins OR weighted Wide grip pull-ups - 10,8,6,6
    DB rows - 8,6,6
    BB rows, or T-bar rows - 8,6,6

    Back workout number 2:

    Rack-pulls - 10,10,8,6
    T-bar rows - 10,8,6
    Close-grip pulldowns - 10,8,6,4
    Hammer-Strength reverse grip pulldowns - 10,8,8
    They both have flaws because you're hitting the same bodyparts with similar movements. NO way will you be able to do any worthwhile amount of weight after doing HEAVY deadlifts and/or heavy rack pulls. You're just wasting time after that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBB
    NO way will you be able to do any worthwhile amount of weight after doing HEAVY deadlifts and/or heavy rack pulls. You're just wasting time after that.
    WHy do you say that? I go heavy on deadlifts and still go hard on my second back exercise of the day, and for my size I do a decent amount of weight. Depending on the day I may do Floor deads and then Weighted chins and have not only never had a problem, but my lats are my best feature.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mulletsoldier
    WHy do you say that? I go heavy on deadlifts and still go hard on my second back exercise of the day, and for my size I do a decent amount of weight. Depending on the day I may do Floor deads and then Weighted chins and have not only never had a problem, but my lats are my best feature.
    Right, I'm not saying you can't do it, I just think that your weights will stagnate and thus so will your progression. Is that your picture in your avatar? If so you have great definition but I wouldn't say your lats are your best feature. You have fantastic definition, but you could use a little more thickness. Not trying to put you down, I'm just stating my opinion which can be wrong. What is your routine like anyway, I'm curious? Maybe you've worked it out so that you aren't killing yourself on deads and can handle the weighted dips afterwards?
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    Yeah, well that was me at 160..I'm 171.5, so the thickness is dually noted..And I do a low/mid volume routine where on a certain workout I may work upto 405 x 2-4 on deads and then weighted chins..I am too lazy to post the whole thing, but that is what specifically pertains to this convo.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mulletsoldier
    Yeah, well that was me at 160..I'm 171.5, so the thickness is dually noted..And I do a low/mid volume routine where on a certain workout I may work upto 405 x 2-4 on deads and then weighted chins..I am too lazy to post the whole thing, but that is what specifically pertains to this convo.
    Sounds good, awesome pull too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBB
    Sounds good, awesome pull too.
    Thanks man, I try..I wanna be pulling 500 by my next b day
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    My problem has always been grip strength on deads.
    Once I get higher than 325 on deads my grip fails before Im done. With straps I've done up to 445 for 4-6, and 585 for 8 on rack deads (from bout knee height.) and 615 for a double on rack's. But I have long forearms that are very resistant to growth/strengthning. Sometimes when I refuse to use straps I'll work with whatever I can handle and I'll go up a measly 10lbs or so with the ammount I can hold on too. But then I plateu. Then after awhile I have to decide weather to continue to let the target muscle get under worked indefinately in hopes that the grip will start improving again, or to opt for straps so I can go beyond and work the target muscle. I've tried static holds, wrist curls etc. And I dont want to let my height (6ft 5 in shoes) and the subsequent long forearm syndrome hold me back, but it's been tricky. Im 248 lbs, so the stubborn arms throw my symetry off too.
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    Yeah, screw grip strength man..I am not a powerlifter, so really I would much, much rather have a nice back then work my grip strength. Without straps I too can only do about 85% of what I can with them, but if I had to choose between the two, and since I'm not gonna pull in a meet, I'll take the nice back over straps.
  

  
 

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