[somewhatgifted]

Originally Posted by LakeMountD

We do that here at FSU for football over the summer. I lift for about 50-70 minutes around 11:00 am in the morning then we have to be back at the field at 5:00 pm to do heavy sprints or agility type work. I can tell you the fatloss is outstanding. I am a hardcore ecto, however, so it can be frustrating at times. Luckily since it was summer I was able to sleep a lot in between and eat like crazy. Here is what I looked like when I was doing it. I actually did gain about 6 more lbs than I am here (all lean mass) while I was doing all of this.

You look ripped and powerful, keep it up you abviously found something that works for you, given your admiration of your accomplishments.

[refrieddreams]

I got some of my best results with an expieriment I did a few years back. I was lifting twice a day and going no where so I...

Took 5 days off and lifted once a week. One movement/set per body part to failure.

It looked like this:

Weighted chins
Incline DB press
Preacher curl
Weighted dips
SLDL's
Squats
Calf raises
DB shoulder press

Every movement to failure.

I did this for 8 weeks, documented everything. My strength went way up, also my rep count went way up.

When I first started I could do 8 good chins with a dip belt blus 20#'s at the and I was doing 8-10 with 60#'s

My lady couldn't do any chins un-assisted, at the end she was doing 6 with 25#'s added...

Pretty cool.

Moral of the story...Do not overtrain!

[ginhead]

does anyone train the same body part twice a day or just different bodyparts?

I've been cutting for a while and have been able to keep (slightly) increasing weights on everything except chest. I really seem to run out of strength after doing two main pressing exercises. I really want to switch stuff up, so I was thinking of trying this:

AM:
Chest Pressing Exercise 1
Chest Pressing Exercise 2

PM:
Ancillary delt work (same as current workout)
Chest Isolation Exercise 2

I'd keep volume exactly the same, but see the benefit as 1) getting to have two pre/post workout meals and b) rest/recovery time should allow me to put more effort into the second half of the workout. Anybody think this is worth trying or just nuts?
-jeff

[Grunt76]

I wouldn't even try that. I think the goal is HIT and RUN, meaning, give the stimulus for growth, then REST. If you work the same bodypart again, you're just giving the same stimulus to a muscle that has just received it a few hours ago.

I think the main reason for the 2xD thing is the enhanced hGH pulse, and added INTENSITY to "second" bodypart. By this I mean if you do chest & triceps, you will be less intense with your tris if you were at max intensity with chest, unless you keep it REALLY short...

[MasterMind]

[Mason]

Alright well this summer I was thinking about going 2ce a day. This is how I would go about it.

Run 20-30 minutes at a fast pace.
Work out 1

HEAVIEST WEIGHT I CAN DO REPS ON
3x8 Seated Chest Press
3x8 Pec Dec
3x8 Pulldowns
4x8 Seated Row
6x8 Curls
3x10 Wrist curls
3x8 Leg Extentions
3x8 Chest pull downs
3x8 Leg Press
3x10 Dips
3x20 Millitary press.
500 Sit-up variations.

Work out 2
HALF OF MY MAXES
3x15 Seated Chest Press
3x15 Pec Dec
3x12 Pulldowns
4x15 Seated Row
3x16 Curls
3x10 Wrist curls
3x10 Leg Extentions
3x10 Chest pull downs
3x15 Leg Press
3x5 Dips
3x20 Millitary press.
500 Sit-up variations.

I would be taking protein and creatine.
I would also be swimming in the pool a good bit of the day.

[doggzj]

Honestly, I think working out twice per day is good for reason Grunt said. Hit one bodypart in the morning, and a different in the evening. Doing the same muscle twice in the same day is probably not the best idea.

[Mason]

So heavy in the morning and very light in the evening is a no-no? Even when intaking alot of protien and creatines and bcaa/eaas to help prevent muscle breakdown/ increase protein synthesis.

[doggzj]

The only two reasons I can think of doing 2 a days for is:

1) Improving metabolic rate
2) More energy for later exercises
2b) Possible manuplation of hormones...

There is no point to train light unless you are trying to improve endurance.

[Mason]

Originally Posted by doggzj

The only two reasons I can think of doing 2 a days for is:

1) Improving metabolic rate
2) More energy for later exercises
2b) Possible manuplation of hormones...

There is no point to train light unless you are trying to improve endurance.

1@2 are the main reasons, the morning work out is for stregnth and size. The after-noon is just for endurance and to keep blood flowing and some quick muscle twitch fibers.

[Grunt76]

What you need to do is stimulate growth, and then let it happen. By training again at night, even light, you are possibly preventing this from happening. Unless it's VERY light, and very far from failure. And even then, I think if your postworkout nutrition is sound, a second weights workout would be much better spent on kicking another bodypart than playing the fine line between creating a refeed effect and catabolism.

[Mason]

Originally Posted by Grunt76

What you need to do is stimulate growth, and then let it happen. By training again at night, even light, you are possibly preventing this from happening. Unless it's VERY light, and very far from failure. And even then, I think if your postworkout nutrition is sound, a second weights workout would be much better spent on kicking another bodypart than playing the fine line between creating a refeed effect and catabolism.

It will be no more than 20 lbs for each exercise and by no means will it be to fatigue-failure. I just guess I have to see how it goes for me.

[Grunt76]

Hey CROWLER bro, did you do your experiment?

[Fearhk213]

Good thread. I've done a few stretches at training twice a day. I saw an in increase in fat-loss for one. Of course that was directly related to diet but it definately helped. I tried to limit my time in the gym to 45 mins. give or take since I knew I'd be there later. Which is very interesting from what's been said about the hgh thing. When my workouts were quicker, in 45 min range rather than around 1 1/2 hours (which I'm known to do),I always felt my workouts and pumps were better. I wouldn't lose my pump, growth was good, and I just generally felt better. I felt like I had sufficiently worked the trained muscle without frying my nervous system. When going in for the second session I felt I could hit that muscle at 100% and not about 70%. I thought it interesting when I'd do two body parts in one sessions rather than over two sessions I inevitably take longer to do the same amount of sets (probably a mental thing). I definately found spending no more than 45 min on a major muscle group rather than an 1hour to do the same routine is definately the better workout. If I could get in twice a day consistently I'd stick with it, but the school schedule doesn't allow for that.

I do think it's wise to mostly stick to doing major and minor groups (ie: chest/am and tri's/pm). Although the occassional Chest and Back would be good. I think I'd be total wreck if I did the chest/back am and legs pm on a consistent basis.

I just thougth of something. Since nutrient timing is an issue do you think some of the benefit to training twice a day is because the 1st muscle trained doesn't have to wait going through 1 or 2 more body parts before you're feeding it? I'm sure pre-workout nutrition could affect this as well, but what are ya'lls thoughts on this?

[exnihilo]

Originally Posted by Grunt76

Yes. It is widely known that 2 exercise sessions in one day stimulate growth hormone release in MUCH greater amounts than one single session.

Moreover, when training sessions last above 45 minutes, cortisol release increases rapidly, as shown by ample research.

So it isn't as black-and-white as it seems on the surface...

Growth hormone release from exercise is a joke, supraphysiological doses of growth hormone have negligible anabolic properties.

This is actually useful for highly technical lifters such as olympic lifters, as the majority of training is technical in nature and you tend to perform better when "fresh" in technical endeavors.

For bodybuilders, I think there is a limit to how much you can break down your workouts into smaller and smaller pieces. I think there is a dose-response curve for exercise stimuli, and at certain points on the curve doing one third the work three times will add up to less than doing all the work in one sitting (this has been shown under certain circumstances in studies).

Edit: Just a note since I missed the portion of the discussion about workout duration... I notice that how I feel leaving the gym is highly correlated with my lift increases the next time I go in. If I leave the gym with a huge endorphin rush, I do great next time up. If I leave feeling drained, I do ****ty. Just a correlation, but it's significant enough that I try for it each workout. I find that 45-60 minutes of training with 2-4 minute rest periods and 3-5 warmup sets for each exercise, with 2-4 exercises (depending on what exercises I'm doing) tends to give me that feeling.

[phil216]

Originally Posted by Grunt76

What you need to do is stimulate growth, and then let it happen. By training again at night, even light, you are possibly preventing this from happening. Unless it's VERY light, and very far from failure. And even then, I think if your postworkout nutrition is sound, a second weights workout would be much better spent on kicking another bodypart than playing the fine line between creating a refeed effect and catabolism.

I can not agree more with the your first sentence, That put a very big smile on my face!!!!!1