Cardio beyond confused

SigEp05 · 06-22-2005, 02:06 PM

I've always known that doing low-intensity cardio on an empty stomach is not that big of a deal when it comes to muscle loss, but that doing a HIIT routine on an empty stomach is a big NONO.

Its been recommended over and over that some form of carb/protein preworkout is optimal, but I was recently told that for those with a high BF% (>16%) it isn't necessarlily optimal to have food precardio. The reasoning behind this was that in a fasted morning state, adipose tissue is the main source of energy (thats why low-intensity on empty stomach is no big deal) but doing a high-intensity type routine would turn to glycogen stores as the main energy source, and not the target adipose tissue.

Basically, I was told that with a high BF%, and doing high intensity in the morning, my body will burn the excess fat (glycogen wasn't mentioned at all...i dunno why) so having food precardio is just a waste of the time spent doing the cardio since you are burning the recently ingested nutrients.

Should I just stick to my normal low-intensity morning cardio on empty stomach or should I do HIIT on empty stomach?

DieTrying · 06-22-2005, 03:26 PM

HIIT on an empty-stomach is a terrible idea.

Keep doing the low-intensity cardio first thing in the morning. Just keep the HR low.

**TheCrownedOne** · 06-22-2005, 04:04 PM

Definitely no HIIT without a couple meals in.

SigEp05 · 06-22-2005, 07:00 PM

so when would be an optimal time to do HIIT considering I usually walk on an incline immediately after weights for about 20minutes along with the morning low-intensity cardio.

nodgodbod · 06-23-2005, 04:06 PM

I'm no cardio expert but as far as I can gather - HIIT should be treated like a weights session with proper preworkout and post workout nutrition. HIIT cardio on an empty stomach will destroy muscle - definitely a good way to lose weight if your going for the POW look.

**Iron Warrior** · 06-23-2005, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SigEp05

so when would be an optimal time to do HIIT considering I usually walk on an incline immediately after weights for about 20minutes along with the morning low-intensity cardio.

If you wanted to do HIIT cardio then do it on your non weight training days. You can also just increase the length of your low-intensity cardio sessions and ditch the HIIT, which is what I would do.

DieTrying · 06-23-2005, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nodgodbod

I'm no cardio expert but as far as I can gather - HIIT should be treated like a weights session with proper preworkout and post workout nutrition. HIIT cardio on an empty stomach will destroy muscle - definitely a good way to lose weight if your going for the POW look.

Agreed!

prld2gr8ns · 06-23-2005, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SigEp05

I've always known that doing low-intensity cardio on an empty stomach is not that big of a deal when it comes to muscle loss, but that doing a HIIT routine on an empty stomach is a big NONO.

Its been recommended over and over that some form of carb/protein preworkout is optimal, but I was recently told that for those with a high BF% (>16%) it isn't necessarlily optimal to have food precardio. The reasoning behind this was that in a fasted morning state, adipose tissue is the main source of energy (thats why low-intensity on empty stomach is no big deal) but doing a high-intensity type routine would turn to glycogen stores as the main energy source, and not the target adipose tissue.

Basically, I was told that with a high BF%, and doing high intensity in the morning, my body will burn the excess fat (glycogen wasn't mentioned at all...i dunno why) so having food precardio is just a waste of the time spent doing the cardio since you are burning the recently ingested nutrients.

Should I just stick to my normal low-intensity morning cardio on empty stomach or should I do HIIT on empty stomach?

HIIT training requires a more immediate source of energy for fuel, since it is indeed high intesity. The body naturaly runs more efficient off of carbohydrates, and as such is better at utilizing it as energy at a much quicker rate then fat. That's why Pre and post workout nutrition is essential for HIIT, it requires the presence of a lot more blood glucose and glycogen stores then normal low intensity cardio. If the sugar isn't present (your fasted) then the body turns to not only fat for fuel sources, but Amino Acids and protein as well i.e. muscles, in order to properly attain the much need demand for said energy use. It's catabolic heaven. Low intensity cardio doesn't require as quick a need for energy thus the body has adequate time to utilize more energy rich sources (fat=fatty acids), and is the preferred method for attaining the body's "go juice". Being at a higher BF % will enable you to burn more fat with either method, but you'll also be sacrificing alot of muscle mass with HIIT fasting.

SigEp05 · 06-23-2005, 05:50 PM

If I must consume an extra two meals (pre/post cardio) just to minimize any muscle loss before I do HIIT, what is the point of even doing the cardio (which will burn anywhere from 500-800 calories) if I am adding an extra 500calories just in the two extra meals...I just do not see the logic.

I guess good old walking will have to do for now...

dsl · 06-23-2005, 06:32 PM

you don't add any extra meals, you should incorporate those two into your 6 meals.

SigEp05 · 06-23-2005, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsl

you don't add any extra meals, you should incorporate those two into your 6 meals.

Would a preworkout shake about 30minutes before weights be enough for weights+HIIT?

dsl · 06-23-2005, 08:17 PM

I always eat my meal about an hour before, otherwise it seems like the pre and post meals would come way too close together. Just eat some oats and milk w/whey for both.

prld2gr8ns · 06-23-2005, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SigEp05

Would a preworkout shake about 30minutes before weights be enough for weights+HIIT?

30min-1hour is a good time for preworkout, what's your shake/meal consisti of?(Macronutrient ratio)

SigEp05 · 06-23-2005, 09:20 PM

If I have a shake, usually its usually a whey/milk shake with 4 strawberrys. About 35protein, 25carbs (15 from sugars and like 4grams fiber), 0 fats.

Im thinking maybe I should have my flax/fish oil to slow it all down a bit?

SigEp05 · 06-23-2005, 09:22 PM

Oh, when I dont have a shake its because I am having a meal: usually grilled chicken on 2slices whole wheat and fat free cheese: 45protein, 25carbs, 2fats(whatever is in the bread)

dsl · 06-23-2005, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SigEp05

Im thinking maybe I should have my flax/fish oil to slow it all down a bit?

it won't slow it down if the fat is already a liquid, besides you shouldn't be eating a lot of fat before or after your workout.

the only thing you need for you shake is a slow digesting carb (oats) and a fast digesting protein (whey/eaa's)

SigEp05 · 06-24-2005, 12:05 AM

sounds good, info appreciated.

prld2gr8ns · 06-24-2005, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SigEp05

If I have a shake, usually its usually a whey/milk shake with 4 strawberrys. About 35protein, 25carbs (15 from sugars and like 4grams fiber), 0 fats.

Im thinking maybe I should have my flax/fish oil to slow it all down a bit?

It looks ideal to me Sig. On a personal front I usually mix my whey with just water(if you can handle it) before working out. Milk acts as a slow digestive source of protein due to coagulation and clobbering of milk in the presence of stomach acid(think cottage cheese). But for you personaly it probably isn't such a big deal, I just figured I'd throw that in for a FYI.