Dealift vs powerclean

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    Dealift vs powerclean


    Which one is overall better for mass and strength!

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    I say Deadlift!
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    Mass wise probably the deadlift since it overloads the body better. And strength wise, beats me.
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    Dead lift will have the greatest effect on hypertrophy, especially if that is the main goal. The power clean is an explosive movement with reps < 4-5, and generally is abused in a lot of training circles (a la crossfit). In addition, it is a very technical exercise and requires much longer to teach than the dead lift. Thats not to say getting better at the clean will not increase size, it will, though not as directly as the dl.

    Br
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    Rofl, the deadlift is superior in these regards. But the poweclean is really great for developing coordination and explosive strength in a single move/rep scheme, whereas to develop burst strength with the deadlift you might have to do different things with your programming (speed reps, bands, etc). Additionally, I guess you can use the powerclean for a dynamic movement in a powerlifting-type routine, but they shine in an olympic weightlifting routine where you repeatedly do similar movements (cleans, snatches, jerks); these small but frequent abuses to the back muscles, leg muscles, and shoulders lead to great increases in their strength and size.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia View Post
    Rofl, the deadlift is superior in these regards. But the poweclean is really great for developing coordination and explosive strength in a single move/rep scheme, whereas to develop burst strength with the deadlift you might have to do different things with your programming (speed reps, bands, etc). Additionally, I guess you can use the powerclean for a dynamic movement in a powerlifting-type routine, but they shine in an olympic weightlifting routine where you repeatedly do similar movements (cleans, snatches, jerks); these small but frequent abuses to the back muscles, leg muscles, and shoulders lead to great increases in their strength and size.
    Agreed on the power and coordination. The clean, or any other movement with triple extension is vital to building every type of athletic performance and power.

    In regards to the bolded portion: Clean pulls are a great exercise for those who are either not experienced or building cleaning technique. In fact, you need to learn how to perform a clean pull before you can perform any kind of clean.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Dead lift will have the greatest effect on hypertrophy, especially if that is the main goal. The power clean is an explosive movement with reps < 4-5, and generally is abused in a lot of training circles (a la crossfit). In addition, it is a very technical exercise and requires much longer to teach than the dead lift. Thats not to say getting better at the clean will not increase size, it will, though not as directly as the dl.

    Br
    That is exactly what my beef is with crossfit.. They have this belief that only oly lifts can develop explosiveness and dedicate hours upon hours of their athletes performing ridiculous amounts of reps with these VERY technical lifts. I have no problem with oly lifts per se, but people tend to not realize that oly lifting is a sport in itself and it takes years for some if the pros to perfect their form on a movement like a snatch but yet crossfit will have a person who is their first time lifting performing this highly technical move for reps.

    They are many other ways to develop explosiveness. Oly lifts aren't the only way. One of my favorite movements to work your triple extension is a overhead throw with a keg or sandbag. Loads of fun outdoors
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    That is exactly what my beef is with crossfit.. They have this belief that only oly lifts can develop explosiveness and dedicate hours upon hours of their athletes performing ridiculous amounts of reps with these VERY technical lifts. I have no problem with oly lifts per se, but people tend to not realize that oly lifting is a sport in itself and it takes years for some if the pros to perfect their form on a movement like a snatch but yet crossfit will have a person who is their first time lifting performing this highly technical move for reps.

    They are many other ways to develop explosiveness. Oly lifts aren't the only way. One of my favorite movements to work your triple extension is a overhead throw with a keg or sandbag. Loads of fun outdoors
    Preach on. 100% agreement, and I think most strength and conditioning coaches feel the same way.

    I cringed watching the crossfit games the other day everytime they did an olympic movement. Even the deadlifts were done with poor technique.

    Br
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    Mass: deadlift
    Power: cleans (when done properly)

    However, the clean takes a lot of coaching and takes a lot longer to master the technique. Deadlifts are relatively easy to master compared to cleans.
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    As stated: deadlifts.
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    That's what I thought a few of my liftin buddies are convinced, that power clean and morning glories , are the best 2 excercises . Even over squats and deadlifts. I told them there ****in crazy! But thanks for the post fellas . Very informative
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    Agreed on all aspects of the DL being the superior lift. In addition I am still amazed at just how many trainees, of varying degrees of experience, still perform this lift incorrectly.
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    I love deadlifts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Dead lift will have the greatest effect on hypertrophy, especially if that is the main goal. The power clean is an explosive movement with reps < 4-5, and generally is abused in a lot of training circles (a la crossfit). In addition, it is a very technical exercise and requires much longer to teach than the dead lift. Thats not to say getting better at the clean will not increase size, it will, though not as directly as the dl.

    Br
    What about the swinging chinup they do? Its Quickest way to a shoulder injury i could imagine
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docmattic View Post
    What about the swinging chinup they do? Its Quickest way to a shoulder injury i could imagine
    You mean the muscle ups that go from a chin-up to a dip?

    Once again, great in theory, but terrible in practice. If you watch gymnasts the form is immaculate and tight - elbows are close to the body.

    Most times I watch cross-fit trained people do them, the form is sloppy and the elbows are flared out in front, and like you mentioned, places the shoulder at high risk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docmattic View Post
    What about the swinging chinup they do? Its Quickest way to a shoulder injury i could imagine
    Kipping chins are interesting. I'm not sure who decided they were the "way" to do chums except its somewhat military origins. Very much not good for the shoulders.
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    They have their purpose, as seen in gymnastics, but require a high level of technique and are not something to be used in sets or for conditioning. Not to mention, when done in gymnastics its one fluid motion created by the momentum of the lower body, and not the pull of the arms. In fact, I don't think gymnasts train the kips directly, but rather do ancillary and core strengthening movements in order to be able to do a kip.

    Br
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    I meant something like this: Its quite ridiculous (read retarded). Watch for at least 30 seconds.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBTHI5ehJuc
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    Oh, yes very.

    It would be more functional to swim the butterfly stroke, since that is what it almost looks like
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    Agreed dl=mass, pc=power
    Docmattic watched the clip. lmfoa!
    so anyone down for talking proper technique for a power clean. The way I learned in highschool seems to be the most utilized movments, Start in deadlift position, controlled pull upward until your in a position similar to a front squat and finish with a military press. Most of the clips I seen on youtube ppl forget the finish military press kicking one leg back ?
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    Quote Originally Posted by westhockey32 View Post
    Agreed dl=mass, pc=power
    Docmattic watched the clip. lmfoa!
    so anyone down for talking proper technique for a power clean. The way I learned in highschool seems to be the most utilized movments, Start in deadlift position, controlled pull upward until your in a position similar to a front squat and finish with a military press. Most of the clips I seen on youtube ppl forget the finish military press kicking one leg back ?
    The clean ends before the pressing portion. When you dip under into a split stance is a clean and jerk; feet still together is a clean and press. As you progress to heavier weights, the jerk becomes a necessary component.
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    Man, I was wondering why I felt like blacking out after doing 3 sets of 10 at 135. I always thought when this guys say there doing this on there powerclean, im thinking this guys are beasts. But it beacuse there doing half of what ive been doing!

    This is how I learned :
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pondy...eature=related
    Just not as sloppy as this kid! But you get the idea.
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    Quote Originally Posted by westhockey32 View Post
    Agreed dl=mass, pc=power
    Docmattic watched the clip. lmfoa!
    so anyone down for talking proper technique for a power clean. The way I learned in highschool seems to be the most utilized movments, Start in deadlift position, controlled pull upward until your in a position similar to a front squat and finish with a military press. Most of the clips I seen on youtube ppl forget the finish military press kicking one leg back ?
    That's not part of the clean/power clean, though. You're talking about a clean and press, or from your comments about kicking a leg back, the clean and jerk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by westhockey32 View Post
    Man, I was wondering why I felt like blacking out after doing 3 sets of 10 at 135. I always thought when this guys say there doing this on there powerclean, im thinking this guys are beasts. But it beacuse there doing half of what ive been doing!

    This is how I learned :
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pondy...eature=related
    Just not as sloppy as this kid! But you get the idea.
    Cleans shouldn't be done above 4-5 reps. Technique gets sloppy and the weight is more "muscled up" than done in an explosive fashion. All major power oriented movements are ATP-PCr system and you can't do many reps with this energy system.
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