Working the Back/Chest/Legs more than once a week?

  1. Working the Back/Chest/Legs more than once a week?


    I'm currently following AST's Max-OT and beginning in the 6th week it has it's users do a pull/push/leg split for the next 3 weeks and in each week you are to do one of the days twice a week, so it looks like this:
    Week 1
    • Monday: Back, Biceps, and Forearms
    • Tuesday: Chest, Shoulders, and Triceps
    • Wednesday: Legs, Calves, and Abs
    • Thursday: Off Day
    • Friday: Back, Biceps, and Forearms
    • Saturday and Sunday: Off Days
    Week 2
    • Monday: Chest, Shoulders, and Triceps
    • Tuesday: Legs, Calves, and Abs
    • Wednesday: Off Day
    • Thursday: Back, Biceps, and Forearms
    • Friday: Chest, Shoulders, and Triceps
    • Saturday and Sunday: Off Days
    Week 3
    • Monday: Legs, Calves, and Abs
    • Tuesday: Off Day
    • Wednesday: Back, Biceps, and Forearms
    • Thursday: Chest, Shoulders, and Triceps
    • Friday: Legs, Calves, and Abs
    • Saturday and Sunday: Off Days
    So I did week 1 this week which meant that back was the main muscle that got worked twice. Here's the problem though; all my numbers from Monday were way down on Friday-- especially deads. Is this a retarded idea to begin with and should I just stick with doing each muscle group once a week? Am I just recovering too slow (I am cutting ATM...)? Or should maybe my second workout each week incorporate different exercises...like instead of deads do good mornings and/or hyperextensions?

    As always thanks for your time.


  2. Seems to be overtraining to me. Every body is different. Personally, there is no way I would ever be able to train legs with my workout twice a week.

  3. i do somethign similar. Im a fan of priority training so my lats are worked more than once per week while i stay off killing delts since that's my strong point. The answer to your question all depends on how much volume of sets you are performing. I have my back day but i perform 4-5 sets of pullups another day before the week's over. So look at your set number, and adjust according. No its not a stupid idea to begin with.... it would be if you're insane in the volume on each day
    Sage
    •   
       


  4. Well my back sets look like this:

    Pullups 2x4-6
    Close-Grip Pullups 2x4-6
    BB Rows 2x4-6
    Deads 2x4-6
    Shrugs 2x4-6

    These are all performed with weight light enough that you can do 4 reps but heavy enough so you can't do more than 6 (Max-OT style).

  5. If I'm not mistaken, Max-OT has several different ways it can be worked, 4 day split, 3 day split, ect. but it's been a while since I've read through it. You have to take into account individual differences. This may work for one person and not for another. If it seems to not be working for you, re-read it and see if another configuration might not work better. I think the Max-OT is a great program but you have to modify it to fit your recovery abilities while keeping the basic tenants in place.

  6. Yeah you're right. Weeks 1-4 you do the 5-day split, week 5 you do a 3-day split, then week 6 is when the routine I quoted above starts.

  7. My feeling is if you are beating your workouts week after week on the 5 day split and making progress, unless that progress stops it is silly to change. For myself, if I quite progressing, I throw out the exercises that stall rather than the whole routine. I am 48 though and training to the Max more than once a week doesn't leave me enough recovery time. Point is, you have to determine what works for you, not take a blanket program and hope it works.

  8. I'm doing that workout 3 times a week and I've gotten much more growth than I used to get working 4, 5 or even 6 times a week. I think because I'm not on any anabolics right now, 3 workouts a week is the optimal for my body's muscle growth. I'll probably do the 4 or 5 day a week split when I go on either PH or AAS, but 3 is plenty for now.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Rock Lee
    Well my back sets look like this:

    Pullups 2x4-6
    Close-Grip Pullups 2x4-6
    BB Rows 2x4-6
    Deads 2x4-6
    Shrugs 2x4-6

    These are all performed with weight light enough that you can do 4 reps but heavy enough so you can't do more than 6 (Max-OT style).
    That looks like a lot of Volume for MAX-OT. It has been a long time since I've read through the MAX-OT plan so I could be wrong. Are you following it the way it was written?

  10. If I recall correctly, Max OT calls for 7-9 total sets per muscle group a workout. So while he could remove one of those exercises, that's not really overtraining.

  11. I agree that it's not very much volume, seems about right for average recovery abilities.

    The spinal erectors, heavily recruited in the deadlift, are among the more slowly recovering muscles in the body. It should be considered unsurprising that your numbers are down doing them twice the same week. That being said, I believe you are on track for surprising results, as the philosophy behind doing this kind of training is to shock - in that week, the back but in the other weeks, other bodyparts - into a temporary overtrained state and thus stimulate an INCREASED RECOVERY ABILITY.

    Recovery ability is not set, like everything else it is a variable, and with the proper stimuli, the body adapts. There is a way to do this, and it's not wall-to-wall overtraining. This is what these guys are trying to do with this program and I believe that the idea behind it is extremely valid. Over time, you NEED to increase your ability to recover if you're going to grow naturally because as your muscles grow, they require more recovery effort in order to grow.

    Just don't concentrate too much on how much weight you use. Yes, do keep it in mind, but also keep in mind that it is normal to have hiccups in your poundages when you change ANYTHING in your training. Keep at it and OVER TIME you will see the results. Heck, what if your poundages plateau for a couple months but you increase Lean Body Mass by 5 pounds?

  12. Quote Originally Posted by DieTrying View Post
    Seems to be overtraining to me. Every body is different. Personally, there is no way I would ever be able to train legs with my workout twice a week.
    So the moment your numbers drop in any way, you're overtrained?

    Lol.

    What exactly do you do for legs?

    Today I did 100 reps in the front squat for a total of about 20K in weight.
    Going to do the same tomorrow in the back squat.

    Typical week has me performing at least 400 squat reps.
    That's in addition to other movements.

    I've squatted for about 80 straight days, typically hitting about 75 reps.
    Ramp up to a daily max, and then the majority of reps are at 70-95% of that.
    There were days when I felt like **** and PR'd, days when I felt ok to good and my numbers dropped, days when I felt great and set multiple PRs.
    The point is, they are just days.
    Who gives a **** what happens on one day?
    It's not about one day or even one week.
    In those 80 days there have been dozens of PRs and rep maxes established.


    Overtraining is a myth.
    You're undertrained, underfed, and/or underslept.

    Overreach, deload. Repeat.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by LunaHotel View Post
    I agree that it's not very much volume, seems about right for average recovery abilities.

    The spinal erectors, heavily recruited in the deadlift, are among the more slowly recovering muscles in the body. It should be considered unsurprising that your numbers are down doing them twice the same week. That being said, I believe you are on track for surprising results, as the philosophy behind doing this kind of training is to shock - in that week, the back but in the other weeks, other bodyparts - into a temporary overtrained state and thus stimulate an INCREASED RECOVERY ABILITY.

    Recovery ability is not set, like everything else it is a variable, and with the proper stimuli, the body adapts. There is a way to do this, and it's not wall-to-wall overtraining. This is what these guys are trying to do with this program and I believe that the idea behind it is extremely valid. Over time, you NEED to increase your ability to recover if you're going to grow naturally because as your muscles grow, they require more recovery effort in order to grow.

    Just don't concentrate too much on how much weight you use. Yes, do keep it in mind, but also keep in mind that it is normal to have hiccups in your poundages when you change ANYTHING in your training. Keep at it and OVER TIME you will see the results. Heck, what if your poundages plateau for a couple months but you increase Lean Body Mass by 5 pounds?
    This man gets it.

  14. You'll adapt. One thing I don't like about MaxOt is the lack of variety in loading schemes. Theoretically you could work in the 4-6 range your entire life, but its probably more effective to work in rep-loading blocks of 2-4 weeks with your accessory movements
  

  
 

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