Crossfit for size?
- 12-11-2008, 08:06 PM
Crossfit for size?
Im just curious what you all think about doing Crossfit while trying to gain size. Im 6'1" and around 190 lbs at 6% body fat and would like to get up to about 200 lbs and 4% body fat. I want to do this clean and not have to cut a bunch of fat at the end of a bulk. Would Cross fit be the best option?
- 12-11-2008, 08:43 PM
12-11-2008, 08:53 PM
Well not really bulking, but just putiing on like 10 lbs. I know it will take awhile, but i dont want to gain a bunch of weight, then have to try and cut fat off. Id rather just put on clean muscle.
12-12-2008, 10:23 AM
12-08-2010, 02:03 PM
12-08-2010, 02:16 PM
You want to drop 3.5lb of fat while also adding 13.5lb of muscle (this will get you from 190 @ 6% to 200 @4%). You're going to need something a lot more structured and planned out than Crossfit. Good luck.
12-08-2010, 02:35 PM
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-08-2010, 07:53 PM
crossfit will decrease bodyfat mass and muscle mass (getting stronger at something does always indicate an increase in muscle mass)
Unless your on a slew of injectables, then crossfit would work to increase muscle mass
12-17-2010, 10:35 PM
Personally, if you want to do this I think alternating would be your best option. Perhaps try a CF while doing a 5x5 3x a week with the Oly Lifts. Its just a suggestion. I am doing a mass cycle atm but I am doing TRX 3-4x a week as well to help burn some extra calories.
12-17-2010, 10:38 PM
12-17-2010, 11:28 PM
There is some program (Strength Based CF or soemthing) that focuses on heavy lifts in the 3-5 ranges and then has a few metcons per week which COULD gain some size but thats not really the typical crossfit.
Head Purus Labs Rep
12-17-2010, 11:33 PM
12-18-2010, 06:57 PM
The workouts are not well thought out: there is no attention to stabilizers or fixator muscles, there is no attention paid to form. The physiological objective of crossfit (despite what the gurus say) is fatigue. Fatigue can be a good thing, and yet, can be a debilitating thing. When it comes to olympic land other lifts that require a high degree of technique, spinal stabilization, and velocity of movement, fatigue should NOT be the ojective.
In fact, in training for neary any sport, fatigue is often a great way to reinforce incorrect form via poor motor programming. Remember, practice does not make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect.
So, let me suggest some ideas for your goals:
Set up a well thought out, periodized hypertrophy training program
Add conditioning (HIIT) work into it
Estimate how many calories you need to maintain body weight
Add an additional 300-500 calories on top of that to fuel growth
Eat healthy, clean foods: whole grains, lean proteins, vegetables, mono-unsaturated fats, omega-3's etc.
Keep an eye on the scale and your body fat, and if you are gaining more than a pound a week, cut down on the calories a bit, if you do not gain anyweight after the first month, then increase the cals.
You're not going (highly unlikely) to gain 13lbs of muscle and drop 5 lbs of body fat naturally; however, you can gain muscle while keeping body fat gain to a minimal, then when you're satisfied with your muscular development, you can cut down on calories, increase the conditioning, drop the body fat and then maintain from there.
12-18-2010, 11:29 PM
12-19-2010, 05:40 PM
Actually you have been saying for the most part that crossfit is pretty much useless or bad for you..lol
Rodja and I oft have difference in opinions on crossfit, but I must agree when it comes to whether or not crossfit is optimal for size because it really isn't. Now if general strength and conditioning was the goal it would be a good option.
As Zir Red mentioned following a good hypertrophy program would probably be your best option. You could throw a few CF workouts in there as your conditioning (HIIT) workouts of you really want to do CF as well. Just be sure to plan the various workouts appropriately in regards to what you are already doing. For example, if you went heavy on legs such as squats one day, Fran may not be the best CF workout to do the next.
01-01-2011, 01:09 PM
None of the crossfitters you see are getting large from doing CF. Don't care what you say. Yes, some of the guys are huge (and ripped) that are involved like Dave Lipson, but what they're doing is following an olympic lifting routine for strength and sometimes picking up on the WOD if it's oriented for oly lifting/strength. If you want to pick up CF to trim up that's fine, but if you're already muscular and are looking to add on lean mass, there are much, much better options out there.
09-08-2012, 03:30 PM
I also strongly disagree with everyone who think bulking is impossible with crossfit. I'd like to point out that not everyone is interested in doing bicep curls to get 22 inch arms of skin ripping useless muscle. I'm willing to bet those of you who are against crossfit haven't seen the crossfit games. If you did you would realize that the competitors are not all scrawny guys doing a bunch of kipping pullups. Just look at the bodies of guys like Rich Froning, Jason Khalipa, Dan Bailey, and Marcus Hendren to name a few. These guys are solid muscle. Yes they are now bodybuilders, but like i mentioned earlier sarcoplasmic hypertrophy is not the only means of muscle gain. Crossfit workouts can be tailored to your personal goals. Whether it be getting lean or gaining muscle mass. And another note is that the muscle is built with crossfit. Whether it be doing gymnastics, conditioning circuits, strength training or olympic lifts. That's what crossfit is. A combination of all, it isnt just the light weight conditioning circuits.
09-08-2012, 04:35 PM
What exactly is done within CF that focuses on either maximal strength development or speed-strength aka the dynamic effort? That's right...nothing. I don't know when it happened, but at some point, all conditioning and/or cross-training became CF, which is total bull****. There is nothing innovative or special about CF outside of their marketing schemes.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
09-08-2012, 05:14 PM
Holy thread resurrection, digging through those archives.Originally Posted by sgtz
Sorry though, when it comes to mass you just won't get it done with pure crossfit. I've gotta tell you Rodja's points are pretty spot on and good luck trying to argue.
I'm not a fan of "crossfit" (not cross training) but "crossfit" for numerous reasons. Conditioning and cross training as stated by Rodja are nothing new, that's not where the disagreement lies. The practices, program implementation, marketing approaches (specifically how it is marketed to everyone) and varying levels of knowledge base (cf certified through a weekend course, now I can teach and progress Olympic lifts, plyometrics and other technical and complex movements to people who have no business doing them) that fall under the umbrella term "crossfit" these are where a few of the problems with the newest trend lie. You also said it yourself all of the high level competitors train in other manners to achieve their physique and performance and most likely only cross train supplementally with programs that would now be deemed "crossfit" because of the huge/clever marketing movement. So with that said, where does your strong disagreement with what was said come from?
09-08-2012, 07:31 PM
Well the whole goal is bad IMO. Being under 10% BF for a time is unhealthy. Yet wanting to drop to 4%. Are you sure your at 6% now? Mr O stage fat% is in the 6-5% range.
09-08-2012, 10:53 PM
I think yall are just attacking my argument because I used the term crossfit. I guess the more proper term would have been cross training. I could care less where crossfit originated from or whether it is a new idea or not. My point here is that muscle can be gained through crossfit type training if tailored correctly towards your goals. I know crossfit will not create the most muscular body neither the most muscularly balanced physique. The purpose of crossfit is not to stand in front of judges and look incredibly fit. Im not part of the crossfit community but I do a lot of cross training and I vary my workouts continuously. My workouts are usually structured in the following manner: Power, Stregth, Conditioning. Begininng with olympic lifts, then some sort of squat, deadlift, or pressing movement with either weights, sandbags, or sleds, followed by some sort conditioning circuit usually a crossfit WOD. I am currently on a cutting phase but I have done a bulking phase in the past and I did see gains. I also know a few guys who have made pretty decent gain from a crossfit gym. Like I said, maybe not the type of gains you guys are used to with bodybuilding type routines but they were pretty solid gains. The original poster is asking whether it is possible and I'm here to testify that it is.
And yes there are a ton of people following crossfit prototypes who will not see any gains whatsoever and maybe end up injuring themselves but you guys act like everyone who steps into a gym and follows a bodybuilding 5 day split ends up looking like Arnold. In anything you do there will always be the most important factor of all which is your individual drive to succeed. Whether that be aiming for a bodybuilding physique or simply a strong solid more athletic physique. It all depends on your own personal dedication, the intensity of your workouts, and your diet. Eat big, get big.
09-09-2012, 02:08 AM
I've already written as to why CF has become scam marketing and I've yet to here a solid rebuttal. Perhaps you'd like to take that upon yourself to do so?
M.Ed. Ex Phys
09-09-2012, 04:49 AM
09-09-2012, 08:26 AM
There is no specificity in crossfit, and yet, the proponents of the program are steadfast in claiming it is an end-all-be-all of training. Their idea of specificity is to give it subnames and increase the reps or rest period (i.e.: crossfit endurance, crossfit football). In any case, specificity of training toward a goal is always lacking, and practitioners of it mistake a metabolic challenge with productivity, DOMs with summative results, and post-workout fatigue with performance etc.
With typical crossfit you create an athlete who can do a little of everything, but excels at nothing. And for those that claim "functionality" this jack-of-all trades contradicts the very essence of functionality. Functional in one sport or event is not functional in another. I.e.: being able to run a 400m in 1:30 after a series of burpees and high-rep cleans is not functional for football. Functional is tailoring the training objectives and goals towards improving performance in something (generally) outside of strength and conditioning, such as improving specific aspects of fitness and translating them towards improved football (or MMA, soccer, etc.) performance.
Even in non-traditional sports or activities will you ever need to clean and press for high repetitions. And when you do, as we see in the crossfit games and youtube videos, form breaks down quickly and it turns into an demonstration of a series of spinal flexions to extensions. THIS, is anything but functional, as it promotes a risky movement pattern that over many years will result in disk degeneration. For someone who trains crossfit, the poor movement patterns are carried over outside of the gym, resulting in a LOSS of functionality.
Even the crossfit games is not a valid nor reliable test of various types of fitness......which we can get into later.
09-09-2012, 09:33 AM
http://www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article...rbodycomp.htmlOriginally Posted by Jiigzz
Not sub 10 but there is a threshold of essential fat I think that's along the lines of what he was saying just happened to pick 10%. The comparison to Mr. O wouldn't be ideal as you said but the ratio of LBM to bodyfat% make it relative.
09-09-2012, 10:38 AM
Check your form: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/exercise-science/190675-proper-techniques.html
09-09-2012, 12:16 PM
Why did I have a feeling you would use my personal stats against me? Sorry I'm not 5'10 220 lbs bro.. But I have put on a good 10 lbs of lean muscle since I started which to me has been a great accomplishment in comparison to how skinny I used to be. And it says here you joined the site in 2006, that means you have quite the experience. You of all people should know that you don't gain 40 lbs of muscle after one bulking season. I've only been training for about 2 years with a ton of breaks in between because working full time and being a full time engineering student sometimes gets a little overwhelming so I'm left with no choice but to set my hobbies aside.
I will also like to point out that I'm not here to convince any to go join a crossfit gym. Like I said, I don't train in a crossfit gym and neither do I ever plan to do so. Personally I wouldn't pay 100+ a month for someone to tell me how to train. But if someone prefers doing crossfit or crosstraining over bodybuilding and they want to know whether they can gain muscle from doing so I am going to be that one guy who will say that it is possible. Now even with more classical bodybuilding type of training everyone knows that it all comes down to your diet. You can train as hard as you'd like but if you aren't eating the right foods and the right macros then your body simply will not grow. With that being said, you don't need to do endless bicep curls to get big arms. Go outside and pull a heavy sled, climb a rope with no legs, grab some gymnastic rings and try some straight arm work and tell me your arms wont grow with the right nutrition. Now if by crossfit the original poster meant doing the typical WODs of endless burpees followed by muscle ups then box jumps then no, then you are right, you will not grow.
Now since I know you guys will continue to disagree with my argument I will let you guys be. I just made the account to put in my personal input and say that I was able to gain muscle and strength from training in similar fashion to crossfit even though it wasn't technically crossfit. Of course I was following a very strict bulking diet.
Best wishes to all.
09-09-2012, 01:24 PM
09-09-2012, 02:06 PM
I think your numbers are off,Originally Posted by BigAL46
I've been under 10% body fat for most of my life,
And my health is pretty optimal.
09-10-2012, 01:59 AM
And also being 280lbs and trying to drop to 4-5% bf is very hard, and would probably require anabolics to reach, in fact i doubt anyone could reach around 280lbs without them
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