Wacky chest injury - please read and advise...

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    Wacky chest injury - please read and advise...


    Hello,
    Ive been training hard for about 2 years now, been growing/gaining strength steadily. Back in august, I noticed I slight pain in my sternum when Id try to do dips. After a couple reps, it would go away so I didnt think anything of it.
    About a month and a half ago - if Id try to do a dip, at the bottom of the movement when I would try to push back up, Id get a searing pain through my sternum. It wasnt an excruciating pain, more like a 2 or 3 on a scale of 1-10, but enough so that I knew something wasnt right.
    Sometimes in the morning I hear a snap or crack in my upper chest when I move, right at the sternum-clavicle joint. No pain, though.
    After that, I figured that Id better stop all chest training until it healed up. Three weeks without any chest movements seemed to fix it, but then my truck broke down. When I went to push it, I felt it 'go out' once again. Another two weeks off, I felt fine. Decided I try to work out light and did a couple sets of flat bench at 135x30, and some bodyweight dips. No pain at the time, two days later it and hurts again.
    Obviously, I just need to stay off it until it feels 'fixed' and then stay off for another 2-3 weeks until its completely healed.
    My question is, what the heck did I do to myself? From studying anatomy books and researching on the internet - it looks like anything from a stress fracture to a pulled tendon to a muscle tear.
    I asked my doctor about it, and he didnt really have much to say, just that if the pain was associated with movement it was a muscle issue and not a skeletal issue. It does not hurt at all if I apply pressure directly to my sternum.
    Well, any advice on the matter would really be appreciated.

    Thanks,
    BigV

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    Maybe your muscle has separated somewhat from your ribcage near your sternum? My roomie had a friend do that to himself wakeboarding and he described similar symptoms regarding the pain when using the muscle and not when putting pressure on the bone.

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    BigV broke his man boob!


    not sure what to say to this one, never experienced anything even close to it... although if direct pressure doesn't hurt and movement does, I'm inclined to agree with the doc. surprised he didn't have more to say though. would be interested to hear other opinions.
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    It sucks, let me tell ya! Im pretty sure how I did it, too: Chest Flyes with 90lb dumbells, or heavy DB pullovers. Felt great, form was good, my strength just exploded after my T1 cycle and maybe the connective tissues just couldnt handle the load. I didnt feel any pain for some time afterward, however.

    Ive decided to take this whole week off - just work abs, calves, maybe some concentration curls at home, and some light cardio. The whole upper girdle is pretty much anchored to the sternum - I need to heal this fast and final.

    Manbeast - any idea how long it took the roommates friend to heal?

    Thanks,
    BigV
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    He can't remember, his separation was major, the muscle actually detatched from the bone almost completely, and he was confined to no upper body for "a good while" according to my roomie.

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  6. PC1
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    Big V

    What you're describing, if I understand it, is similar to something I had years ago.

    When you say you feel/hear your sternum cracking, are you talking about at or near the bottom part of it, right above your abs?

    If so, I think we had the same thing. I don't know what the heck that was actually, but I do believe it was more bone or cartilege than muscle, definately. It didn't occur from a specific injury but it was at the time when I was doing heavy weighted dips.

    It kind of feels like a joint cracking, right? Like a knuckle, neck vertebrae, etc?

    With me, it would feel tight. It I stretched out my arms behind me, like we all do in a good yawn, it would hurt right up until it "cracked", and then it would feel better, although not 100%.

    I concluded that whatever it was, it was attributable to doing heavy dips. Unlike cracking your neck or back, this one was more unpleasant. It only stopped when I got away from doing dips.

    I don't have anything to do dips any more and so I don't do them. And I don't have that problem either. My guess is that when we're on a dip bar at the bottom of the rep and using heavy weight with lungs filled with air, it puts pressure on the front of the sternum that it doesn't like. Maybe enough to cause it to become misaligned enough over time to cause problems like these.

    I know dips are usually a good staple in many routines but if this is causing you problems, get rid of them for awhile. Fly's will also aggravate it for the same reason. Slowly work your way back into benching or try incline benching instead, once you're able to.

    Good luck Big V
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    Well - I guess Im lucky in that my pain is minor.
    PC1 - the 'crack' is more toward the top of the sternum, maybe 2-3 inches down from the middle of the clavicle. Its pretty much as you describe, except there really isnt any pain. Sounds like a joint cracking in my sternum. The three positions where i experience pain are 1.)At the bottom of a dip, 2.)When Im holding heavy weight doing barbell shrugs. and 3.)If Im trying to do pushups with a fast pace - around 40 or so it will start to hurt.

    So, obviously I just need to stay off it for a week or two, and then work back in with very light weight. Its just a little unnerving - this is my first 'real' sports injury (other than a bad case of runner's knee running 10th grade track about 10 years ago). And its been going for months, Im used to minor aches and pains just healing themselves with a couple days of rest and a lot of good food.

    I notice that incline benches the bar seem to help it, 3 sets of 15 at a 4-0-2 pace. Perhaps it helps to pump blood into the affected area?

    Can you suggest any supplements that might help to repair the tissue? Glucosamine, Chondroitin?



    Thanks for your replies,
    BigV
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    You might want to consult a chiropractor that does Active Release or ART.
    The one that helped me with my neck injury was a powerlifter for awhile and was pretty knowledgeable about sports and weightlifting related injuries. Also, he may be able to do some work on to get it to heal faster.

    Good Luck
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    Thanks for the tip, IronViking. Im going to give it a couple more weeks, (I have a doctor's appointment next week so Ill talk to him about it as well) and then Ill check out the chairopractor. I think I just need some time off as well.

    I noticed today that my chest was feeling 'tight' - just like PC1 described. I reached behind my head , as if I were doing a bench pullover, and it popped. The tightness relieved itself.

    Good thing is I havent lost any chest mass. I think the time it takes to heal would be less than the time muscle takes to really atrophy. My problems has been, as soon as it felt better, Id start working it.

    I really think it just needs time to heal. Im sure the 5 hours of sleep Ive been getting a night isnt helping either.

    BigV
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    BIG V!!! I HAD THE SAME THING!!!

    dips caused me to get that too.. i was doing dips with a 110 dumbbell hanging between my legs and after about 2-3 months i couldnt do dips anymore without that excruciating pain through my sternum.. and i, too, had the cracking sound when i would flex my chest really hard..eventually the cracking sound went away and it still is but man that is kind of scary.. very weird..
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    LakeMountD,
    Thanks for posting bro. Its unnerving when I try explain this to people and they look at me like that chestburster from Alien is about to burst through my throax
    I think this injury is from DB bench pullovers, but seeing how the pain is greatest when I try to do a dip, maybe its from too much of both. I looked at a human skeleton, and the 'tightness' originates on each side of the sternum at the 3rd rib down from the clavicle. Check this out:

    http://www.yahooligans.com/reference/gray/27.html

    After reading through this, I was surprised to see what a complex structure the sternum is - I never thought of it as a 'joint', but it definately is. The pressure and 'cracking' are comming from where the 3rd rib attaches to the sternum. From studying the diagrams, I learned the the ribs connect to the sternum with 'costal cartilage' so that they can flex with the upper body.
    I think that this injury is some kind of damage to that cartilage - but then again when I press on my chest there's no pain at all.
    At the time I was doing pullovers with a 100lb DB and weighted dips with 3-4 plates on chest day. It wasn't like it was too much weight - I was doing sets of 10 without a problem. Also with the dips, Id never go down past parallel because I was afraid of an elbow of shoulder injury.

    So how long did yours take to heal? Im thinking Im going to stay away from chest movements for 6 weeks, then start working in slowly with light weight. Before Id let it go for 2 weeks and then feel fine, but obviously I keep reinjuring it so I need more time. Hey, that was a rhyme Im not going to do shoulders or back, or squats for two weeks either, I dont want to risk it Ive been laid up long enough.
    I guess my calves and forearms are going to get like an inch bigger this month

    Thanks bro,
    BigV
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    i never went past parallel on dips either.. it went away after i stopped doing dips and of course like i said before i got it from doing dips in the first place.. so i guess im gonna have to stay away from dips which is a shame cause i made good gains doing them..
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    LakeMountD-
    And I guess Ill have to stay away from them for a while too. Could be my body just demanding time off.
    bigv
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    I'd also be very careful with flyes as well.

    ManBeast
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    For a while I guess Ill have to. Im guessing this is a bone injury, and will take a good 6 weeks to heal. Ill keep flyes/dips/pullovers light for at least 2 months afterward.

    BigV
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    Started my 'full on' recouperation program today. 20 minutes of cardio to get the blood flowing, and then rotator cuff exercises with a 5lb dumbell. Then I did some light preacher curls and went home. Oh, the agony. I havent been underneath a bar with real weight on it in months.

    BigV
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    After 2 months of re-injuring myself and 7 weeks weeks of self-prescriped therpy and a few in depth discussions with a friend who's mastering in physical therepy, Im finally nearly 100% recovered. Im going to post back later with exactly what I think I did to injure myself, and the steps I took to heal it up properly. Hopefully it will be of some use!

    BigV
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    Glad to hear you're on the mend V.

    You're info will be useful as I think I walk the line between injury and training when I do dips. I've had to stop using the weight belt during dips which sucks but my shoulder and sternum couldn't hack it anymore. To lose that excercise is a shame, especially since my tri's are my strongest point. Perhaps they got a bit too strong, lol.
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    The lowdown on the wacky chest injury


    Ok folks, here's what I think the whole sternum soreness/popping this is, and how to fix it. At least, this is what Ive done so far, and Im almost to the point of being back to normal. (and ready to go kick some ass on chest day, which I havent had in over 2 months)

    After talking things over with a good friend who is getting his MS in physical therepy, it really seems like what happend was a tear, or micro-tear in the tendon that attaches the pectorals to the sternum. Im assuming I injured this doing heavy DB bench pullovers, it was the day after doing that excercise when Id notice mild sternum discomfort. The dips with 4 45's probably didnt help either.

    You muscle is at its weakest point when it is either fully contracted or fully extended. And when I was doing the bench pull over I was going all the way down, in an effort maximize muscle growth, etc,etc. Well, I didnt realize at the time, but when you're in that position and your pecs are fully stretched like that, most of the stress of pulling that weight back up out of the hole goes right to the tendon. Compound that with several reps per set and weeks of performing the exercise...
    Same would go for heavy dips when you go all the way down.

    Anyway, I didnt realize what I did so I just kept trying to work around it, and things just got worse. I had a really stressful month when I was having some major anxiety problems, I kept trying to work out and then things just fell apart. My rotator cuffs started to pop and crack, and my knees started to hurt as well. I was falling apart and it sucked!

    SO - I did what I should have done from day 1. I took a week off. During this time I read all I could about how to recouperate from tendon/joint problems. The first thing you should do is RICE. Rest, Ice, Compression(if it makes sense to do so), and Elevation. So Id ice my sternum and inner pecs down 2 - 3 times a day for 20 minutes or so. And I just relaxed and slept as much as I could.

    The following week, I started light low-impact cardio on one of those elliptical machines. This helped my knees out, and got blood moving throughout the body. A tendon injury sucks because, at first if you try to pump blood to your muscle, youll just add to the inflammation and irritation. You have to get it to the stage where the inflammation is reduced, and then slowly start working the injured area.
    So for three weeks all I did was 20 minutes of cardio, rotator cuff exercises, concentration curls and calf presses 3 days a week. I started feeling a lot better. There were certain things Id do that would cause pain in that area (lifting my hands over my head and pressing my palms together. Or laying down and pressing my palms together with my arms down), and little by little the pain would go away.
    I also kept an ice pack on my chest was I was lying in bed before going to sleep every night, and also right after working out. This is key. You're getting blood to that area to expedite healing, and then immediately reducing any inflammation with ice.

    Also, stretching every day really helped out. I would stand in a doorway and stretch out my pecs, and then put my hands over my head against the top of the doorway and lean foward, slowly stretching out the muscles and tendons of the chest. This is the position I was in that caused the injury, and it was also this stretch that seemed to help the most.

    So now, 7 weeks later, Im starting to bench with the bar and I can do pushups like I was before I was injured. I havent tried dips yet, although holding myself up on the dip rack dosent hurt like it did. Also, shrugging 200+ lbs isnt causing discomfort in my sternum area either. Although I was doing barbell shrugs with 400+ lbs before, Ill work my way back up slow.

    I had to cut cals way back, but I really havent lost any weight. My strength is a little off, but I know it will come back fast. To summarize:

    1.)ALWAYS do a light 10 minute cardio warmup before lifting. It gets blood moving through the body, which increases your pump and starts to warm up areas like the rotator cuffs, where blood flow is restricted.

    2.)ALWAYS warm up your rotator cuffs before doing any upper body exercise. http://familydoctor.org/265.xml

    3.)ALWAYS stretch adequately.

    4.)When your strength goes up quick, dont jump right into the big weights right away, even if you can lift them fine. Your muscles might be able to move the weight, but remember the tissue connecting them to the bone needs time to catch up.

    5.)When doing heavy weighted dips, don't go past paralell.

    6.)When doing heavy DB pullovers, dont go ALL the way back. A little less than parallell with the bench is more than enough. Get a deep stretch with a lighter weight.

    All this adivice seems like common sense but I can't tell you how on the ball I thought I was and Im sure many of us neglect proper warm up techniques. I was a 'no cardio while bulking' guy and that is a huge mistake. Your heart and other muscles NEED it. Ive read that you should always cool down with 10 minutes of light cardio after heavy lifting as well, because your blood pressure spikes when you move massive weights. Its good for the heart to push blood through dialated blood vessels after working out hard with heavy weights, it helps it 'come down' from the stress of lifting properly.

    If anything, just remember this: It can take an injured tendon anywhere from 6 weeks to a year to fully heal. I can tell you I will take every step I can to prevent this from happening again! What an extreme pain in the ass its been!!

    Ok well, Ive rambled on long enough. I hope somebody got something out of it

    Later
    BigV
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    It's called costochondritis (not sure of the spelling). It's when you damage cartiledge that attaches the ribs to the sternum. How do I know this? I had to talk to about ten doctors, and finally the head of orthopaedic sugery at the hospital knew something about it. He said the only thing that would help it is to not do anything that would aggrivate it for a while. And it does get worse if you keep doing exercises that upset it. Mine was already pretty bad, rowing exercises and shoulder exercises hurt the most. One day I tried to dumbell press an 85 with only my right arm, and I had to swing it up to chest level. While I was swinging the DB I heard/felt a crack and for about a week or more the pain in my chest was excruciating. It hurt like no other pain I've ever felt before, just by breathing, opening doors, sitting up to get out of bed, ect. I still trained around it and it was still there. I decided to suck it up, couldn't train back or shoulders for about a month and a half, but it got better. When I started training back and shoulders again, I had to start light (on top of losing strength already) because I could still feel it. Now I am up to full strength but it still acts up sometimes (heavy back workouts). It came back when I had the flu too, a different doctor said a virus can get in there and cause the same symptoms. All the docs seemed to agree that rest and anti-inflamatories (naproxen,ibuprofen) will help. Hope this helps you!
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    Supersoldier - I had though that my injury may have been cartilidge or bone related, but there was no pain unless I was in a certain position. No pain during breathing, and it wasn't excrutiating at all. It wasn't something that I felt 'happen' - like a bone snapping or a sudden pain. It just didnt feel right when I did dips one day. No pain if I pressed on my ribs or sternum either - which makes me think that it wasnt a bone or cartilidge problem. I would say any pain I felt was a 2 out of 10, maybe. But it was persistent, and the way it healed and responded to what I did makes me think it was tendon-related. But Im not a doctor, and I didnt specifically go to one either.

    Im sure any sort of injury to that area would result in similar symptoms, though. Perhaps it was a little of both.

    BigV
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    Mine started out only in certain positions, only when I trained my back really. I didn't think much of it so I trained through it, on cycle mind you, with ferocious intensity. And it progressively got worse. So it started out as kinda hurt only on back day, to hurts pretty bad on back day, to hurts all the time, to "Please somebody shoot me to end my misery". I'm pretty sure mine started because I had surgery on my left shoulder, and I didn't want to lose too much, and I didn't want my right side to atrophy, so I trained the **** out of my right side, and all I could do for my left side was DB curls and cable one arm cable pressdowns with moderate weight. Plus I was deadlifting and shrugging the heaviest dumbell in the gym with only my right arm, which thinking back was probably a bonehead thing to do.
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    Just got back from the gym. I tried to do dips and heavy shrugs today and that mother-fuc*er still hurts. Not nearly as bad as it was, but its defiantely sitll there. I think Im just going to take a month off from everything physical. That will suck balls, but I can't have this **** nagging me anymore. The best I can do with this is maintain, and I need to grow.

    Damn it!
    BigV
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    So this is interesting - after I got home, I took 800mg of ibuprofin and iced down my inner pecs for about 15 minutes. It didnt hurt at all all night, I figured due to the pain killer. I could even do some dips between two chairs without a problem. I was thinking I was going to wake up in agony and be back to square one, but...
    This morning I still felt fine. Feels a bit tender when I try to do a tricep (bench style) dip but otherwise most of the pain is gone.
    I was reading in on of my friend's physical therepy texts ("Thereputic Excercise"), that at a certain stage in the healing of a tendon,muscle, or bone, you have to start working the area to return it to its original elasticity. Im wondering if its just time to start working chest again, because I feel better than I have since this whole BS started!

    BigV
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    So this is interesting - after I got home, I took 800mg of ibuprofin and iced down my inner pecs for about 15 minutes. It didnt hurt at all all night, I figured due to the pain killer. I could even do some dips between two chairs without a problem. I was thinking I was going to wake up in agony and be back to square one, but...
    This morning I still felt fine. Feels a bit tender when I try to do a tricep (bench style) dip but otherwise most of the pain is gone.
    I was reading in on of my friend's physical therepy texts ("Thereputic Excercise"), that at a certain stage in the healing of a tendon,muscle, or bone, you have to start working the area to return it to its original elasticity. Im wondering if its just time to start working chest again, because I feel better than I have since this whole BS started!

    BigV
    In 9/2002 I completely avulsed my left pec major tendon, meaning I tore it right out of my humerus arm bone. In 1/2003 I completely ruptured my achilles tendon. Both required surgery, so I do have some experience with tendon injuries and what orthopedic surgeons recommend for them........... REST, until it heals.

    I really don't know what it is that you have but if it's a tendon or ligament, it needs to heal first. Next comes light full range of motion movements. Then comes light but progressive resistance weight training over the course of several months.

    If the thing is starting to feel good for you, don't dive back into doing dips again. Give it some time bro! You're a young man and you have the rest of your life to do dips, don't be in a hurry. Train around it for awhile, you can come up with other exercises to strengthen and grow your chest/shoulders/triceps.

    IF you did this by doing dips, stay away from them for awhile. Your chest will show it's appreciation 6 months down the road when you're injury and painfree.

    Be well.
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    Thanks for the advice PC1 - Rest assured I am in no way going to strap 200lbs around my waist and start doing dips anytime soon. I do believe this whole pain-in-the-ass injury is at the stage where some light training is required, though. I have felt progressively better since I gave it a little excercise. I am moving at the end of the month to a new city, so I dont think Ill be hitting the gym more than 1-2 days a week if Im lucky. Hopefully 4 more weeks of decent rest and ill be well on my way to recovery!

    So how did you rip those tendons?? THAT had to suck hardcore, my friend. I will definately take your advice on taking it easy for a while.

    Thanks again,
    BigV
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    Honestely man I have had this same injury for almost three years and it hasnt restricted me at all. It hurts a little when I do really deep dips and it hurts a little when I do really full ROM flys but other than that it just pops when I stretch and thats it. Supersoldier is right though there was a time I was trying to max out on machine flyes and i really ripped it bad and I couldnt do flyes for like 5 months. Other than that however my bench max has been going up and i have taken no time off of lifting. I went to a physical therapist and was told that it was just ay reaction tothe way my pecs had developed, they are not entirely symetrical so one tends to pull more of the tendons towards it causing a snapping sensation as they pull back int place in the center of your chest. I dont want to reccomend that you not take time off Im just telling you my experience with a very similar problem.
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    Hey maggmaster -
    I dont know if the two injuries are similar though - I really couldnt work through this at all. The pain wasnt terrible but it was enough that I knew something wasnt right. I remember a month or so ago when it was at its worst - I tried like hell to work chest but no matter what it seemed like my body was trying to make my delts and tries take the whole load, no matter how hard I focused. After that day, Id get this really 'tight' felling around my 3rd rib toward the left side of the sternum. I would feel the same tightness directly behind it next to my spine. Id reach my arms over my head and back, and everything would 'snap' back into place, and the pressure would be relieved.
    It wasnt until I took time off and started on my little 'recovery program' that it really started to improve. I don't know for sure if its just a tendon, or a comination of a tendon, cartilidge, etc. but the steps I took to heal it are definately working. I did a few sets of pushups last night with no pain at all, which I havent been able to do since August.

    I thought that it could have been what supersoldier described (costalchondritis), and maybe my costal cartilidge was damaged to some degree. I dont know for sure, there is a lot of connective tissue in that area, so if any of it is torn or stressed I think the symptoms would be similar.

    I also have to mention that through this whole process Ive been working 50+ hours a week at a job I really can't stand, and have been generally constantly stressed about one thing or another. I began to experience all kinds of tendon issues, that began shortly after my doctor prescribed this high blood pressure med to me. (My BP is 120/70 - go figure). It was then that the chest thing went from an annoying problem to a full on pain in the ass. I dont know if the med (norvasc, a calcium channel blocker) was to blame, but it sure seems like an odd coincidence.

    Thanks for your input bro. The more I learn about this the better off Ill be.

    BigV
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    Interesting, If I were you id jump on a cocktail of glucosamine + fish oil till you feel fully recovered both of these can help reconstruct connective tissues.
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    Interesting, If I were you id jump on a cocktail of glucosamine + fish oil till you feel fully recovered both of these can help reconstruct connective tissues.
    Already on it! 1tbsp flax,2000mg glucosamine per day.

    Thanks,
    BigV
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    OK - its janurary 10th and Im very happy to report that my 'wacky chest injury' is nearly healed. I have a slight (very slight) tightness on my left upper pec by my sternum, but that's it. I even repped out 10 dips last night without the nagging feeling that my pectoral was going to rip away from the bone.

    So, I would say from my first post, its going to be around 10 weeks before I can really start training with any intensity.

    An interesting run in with my first (and hopefully only) sports injury.

    Part of the game, I guess.

    BigV
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    Glad to hear it Big V ..... rock on
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    I reaggrivated mine trying to go too heavy on a machine shoulder press. I got the weight about half way up and it felt like the left side of my rib cage (the whole thing) was moving. That was Wednesday. I can still feel it but it hasn't hindered my training or gotten really painful during training, even while doing really heavy sets of rows today.
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    Supersoldier -
    I would ice that baby down and rest a bit bro - I would hate to have to go through all this again.
    Im also wondering if we experienced the same thing - Id love to have an MRI done on my upper thorax and see exactly what's going on in there. Symptoms sound similar but the degree of pain you felt makes me think that either you hurt yourself worse than I did, or its two different types of injuries in the same location. (But pains in our asses, nonetheless)
    As for me - Im in the process of moving (yes, in this fridgid ass weather) and Ive started working at a new location, and Im putting in stupid hours and for nearly 2 weeks I didnt get more than 1500 cals a day, and definately not in the right ratios. I havent been to the gym in 2 weeks either, just been working with light dumbells, body weight squats, etc. Im looking for a new job, let me tell ya.
    So I dropped some weight, I look like **** compared to a few months ago before this injury - but Im hoping 6 weeks of good diet and solid training will bring most of it back. Im not going really heavy on chest for a while though, until this feels 100% solid. And my beloved weighted dips will have to weight, as well. As PC1 said before - Ive got my whole life to do dips

    BigV
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    ****ed it up again This time it was cable side laterals. I think I'm gonna get some joint support stuff like glucosamine/chondroitin.
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    Quote Originally Posted by supersoldier
    ****ed it up again This time it was cable side laterals. I think I'm gonna get some joint support stuff like glucosamine/chondroitin.
    You can take every supplement under the sun, it's not going to matter. You've injured yourself! You need to rest that area for awhile and just let it heal. The more you screw around with this the more potential you give it to become chronic. Train AROUND it if you can without aggravating it.
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    I can second that PC1 I thought flax oil and glucosamine would help heal the chest faster, but nothing really helped except (ugh) TIME OFF. I read a lot about the shoulder girdle's mechanics in my friend's physical therapy texts - I couldnt believe how delicate and complicated the tendons and muscles are in that area, and how many different types of inuries there are.

    My chest inury is still there, but I slowly started to train again, and now light workouts are making it feel much better. Heating my inner pecs with a heat pad before I go to the gym, and icing the area down right when I get home - has really helped.

    Also - Ive been doing dips on one of those "reverse gravity" dip racks. The day after I did that the discomfort in that area dropped by like 50%.

    The scary thing is - it wasnt just my chest that was messed up. My rotator cuffs were clicking and poping like a bowl of rice crispies, my right knee hurt as well. And after not lifting for nearly TWO MONTHS and a lot of ice, stretching, ibuprofin, and rest - Im feeling pretty good.

    I would still like to know the cause of it - It was about 8 months after I completed my T1 cycle, so I dont think it was an andorgen related thing. I had gone from working 25 hours a week to about 55 four months before that, and my diet and rest were suffering (8-10 hours a sleep a night down to 5-6). Stressed out. Who knows. But it sucked and I cant wait to get my strength and size back.

    Chris

    Hey PC1- just got a pair of Paradigm Micro's for rear surrounds. Have you ever heard these things? Never heard such a deep sound from a pair of little bookshelf speakers.

    Im going to get a pair of Paradigm Monitor 3's for fronts, build a center channel out of a pair of Altec Lansing ALS693 6x9's (KILLER speakers) after I replace the surrounds, and also build the sub from an Emanance 12" with a 10" passive radiator.

    Im real excited to do the center channel - Im going to run all the tests myself to get the Theile/Small parameters and design the perfect enclosure for them.

    Any idea what kind of amp I could use to power the sub? Id like to build the amp into the enclosure so it looks like one of the more expensive self-powered units.

    BigV
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC1
    You can take every supplement under the sun, it's not going to matter. You've injured yourself! You need to rest that area for awhile and just let it heal. The more you screw around with this the more potential you give it to become chronic. Train AROUND it if you can without aggravating it.

    This is some of the best advice I have read in a long time.

    You can always take things to "mask" the injury, but as long as it is injured and you continue to abuse/use it , the injury will linger.
  39. PC1
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    Hey PC1- just got a pair of Paradigm Micro's for rear surrounds. Have you ever heard these things? Never heard such a deep sound from a pair of little bookshelf speakers.

    ..........


    Any idea what kind of amp I could use to power the sub? Id like to build the amp into the enclosure so it looks like one of the more expensive self-powered units.

    BigV
    BigV

    Good to hear the speakerbuilding bug still has it's hold on you! Don't know a thing about Paradigm Micros. I built 4 of my own 3-way surrounds, each have a 10" woofer...... overkill yes, but that's me If your Paradigm Micros sound great in your room and can be had for a good price, that's all that matters.

    On the sub amp, any good amp will do. I use a Crown Power Tech III, 760w x 2 @ 4ohms. My advice is to get the biggest amp you can find, even if it's output exceeds your driver's capability. You can turn the volume knob down a bit, but STILL have plenty of deep CLEAN power in reserve (headroom). Check out Madisound, Zalytron, Partsexpress, etc. if you want one that's built into the sub cabinet. Also consider building 2 subs, you get a much less "lumpy" bass sound throughout your room, especially if it's more square than rectangular. It's 2 cabinets, but 4x the bang bro!
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    You can always take things to "mask" the injury, but as long as it is injured and you continue to abuse/use it , the injury will linger.
    Exactly - only time and proper therapy will heal tissue damage. Of course its important to have your diet in order- but thats only half the battle. I strongly recommend anyone who is experiencing any kind of recurring pain or injury to either read up on physical therapy techniques or go see a sports doctor immediately.

    BigV
  

  
 

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