Phera/Epi Log

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  1. Day 26 (yesterday), part 2
    I got up in the middle of the night and inhaled a box of granola bars so I need to update my food intake from yesterday.
    Food: 3206 cals; fat: 104g; carbs: 280g; protein: 302g

    Day 27
    Weight: 196.0 -2 from yesterday +10.0 from start
    Cardio: 35 mins.
    Food: 3240 cals; fat: 109g; carbs: 252g; protein: 322g
    Dose: 37.5mg phera; 30mg epi

    Felt pretty tired today. Hopefully, it was just the late workout from yesterday. Iím not too worried about the weight loss. It brought out more definition in my shoulders and upper chest. Tomorrow is my chest wo.

    DB


  2. I'm in!

    Are you going to go any higher on the Epi? 37.5 seems kinda the limit most go to. Hell i had great results (besides gyno) from 20mg per day.

    Nice log big fella, im watching with interest!
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by Australian made View Post
    Are you going to go any higher on the Epi? 37.5 seems kinda the limit most go to.
    That was 37.5mg phera, epi was still 30mg. As long as the sides stay down Iím pretty sure Iím gonna bump up to 45 phera and 40 epi. I probably wonít do it all at once. Maybe extra phera on my lifting days (for the androgenics) and extra epi on my other days.

    So far the only sides that have been a problem is sleep disturbance (but almost everything does this to me), and libido was too high. Both issues have settled down the last couple days.

    Itís nice you respond to 20mg Epi (or even pheri), Iím envious. Except for a 2 week cycle of sdrol/epi (didnít like, wouldnít recommend it) I havenít done anything this strong since the mid-eighties. But my experiences with hdrol and 1-AD have been I need the higher doses, so Iím planning on that probability. Maybe Iím just too close to my genetic potential.

    Today is chest day, the most important to me, so I may pull out all stops. Was it the epi or phera that gave you the gyno?

    Quote Originally Posted by Australian made View Post
    Nice log big fella, im watching with interest!
    Thanks

    DB

  4. damn i meant to say 37.5mg of Phera! and yes i was on 20mg of phera. Epi will def be in the next cycle though which will hopefully start end of next month. I'm tossing ideas of what i can add into a 4-5 week Epi cycle. Possibly pulse the second ph.

  5. Day 28

    Weight: 198. +12.0 from start
    Strength: Chest. Ah, man. This was the most intense chest work out I can remember for a long time. My spotters made me work for every frikkiní millimeter. My last three sets were brutal. My goal on the flat bench was +1 rep for the last 4 sets. I did about half that. I missed the sixth rep by about an inch. But the intensity made up for it. I should have held back a rep on my previous set, but sometimes I just can't say no. I did a little better than +1 rep on all 4 incline bench sets. The rest of the wo I did the same as last week.

    So my bench is up from about 310x3 for 2 sets to almost 310x6 and 310x5.
    Inclines Iím up about 20lbs, and flies about 30lbs.


    Next week's goal is 310x6x2. It might be doable. I've giving myself an extra day. Mondays are too tight time wise and I'm scheduled for deads then, so I'm going to do them Tuesday.

    Food: 2656 cals; fat: 104g; carbs: 144g; protein: 293g
    Dose 45mg phera ; 30mg epi

    Bold print means an increase over last week (I'm not taking credit yet for my almost 6th rep):

    Bench 235x12, 270x9, 310x5,5, 270x7
    Incline smith 225x11, 245x7,235x8,225x8
    Pull over machine 175x15
    Flies machine 180x12x3
    Time = ~60 mins, situps 90, calf raises
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  6. Day 29

    Weight: 198. +12.0 from start

    Strength: Legs. Started out good, about +5 lbs or +1 rep on everything since my last leg workout a week ago, but I pulled my upper thigh near my hip on my 11th rep at 610. Not that bad but bad enough that 695 was out of the question. Hopefully, Iíll be alright for deads on Tuesday.

    Work was hectic and long, Iím tired and didnít get to eat as much as I wanted.

    Dose 45mg phera ; 30mg epi
    Tomorrow is a day off, Iíll dose my phera back to 30mg.

    Food: 2474 cals; fat: 65g; carbs: 186g; protein: 299g

    Hereís what I was able to do.
    Leg raises 14x80;14x95;10x105
    Leg curls 105x15;120x7;105x10
    V squat 520x15;610x11

    DB

  7. Nice job on the log bro. I'll be following along.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  8. Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    Nice job on the log bro. I'll be following along.
    Trauma, Thanks.

    --------------------------

    Days 30-32:

    Day 30 was a no-train day
    Food cals\fat\carbs\protein:
    2512 96 181 245

    Dose 45 phera/30 epi
    ---------

    Day 31 arms and shoulders – I was able to increase almost every set by either 1 rep or 5 lbs. The wo is below.
    Food: 3300 102 237 362
    Dose 45 phera/40 epi

    ---------
    Day 32 – cardio. I didn’t do as much as I wanted, couldn’t get motivated.
    Food: 2591 81 192 272
    Dose 37.5 phera/40 epi

    I’ve been a little lethargic the last couple of days. I can’t tell for sure if it’s the cycle or just the hectic schedule and long hrs at work. I’ll up the stims slightly.

    Weight, appetite, and libido have leveled off, but strength and over-all appearance has still improved. I lost a little on my gut over the last week, so if I wind up with a little recomp towards the end, that’s fine. My wife noticed my back has gained size, she also noted that I’m deeply disturbed. Well, at least I know she loves me for more than just my muscles. She doesn’t know I’m “on” so I doubt she was imagining it.

    I've been playing with the doses lately. 45mg of phera is a little higher and 30mg is a little lower than I want to go.

    Current weight: 197 + 11 from start

    Because of work and school, I'm giving myself an extra day off from the gym tomorrow so I may not post tomorrow.

    Shoulders and arms:
    Close grips 13x205;10x220;6x220
    Dips: bw+35x14,+35x11,+35x11
    Angled Push downs: 120x12;130x10;130x8
    Time=30mins
    Standing st. bar curls: 55x6;95x14;115x11;125x10
    Pr curls: 85x12;90x10;90x9
    Incline DB curls 30x8;x7
    Time=35
    Seated smith press: 145x13;175x10;175x9;175x7;165x 8
    Uprite rows: 95x10;x10
    Flies: 30x10;x8;x10
    Time=35mins
    Last edited by DBinMD; 01-27-2008 at 07:08 PM.

  9. Nice progress brotha, wish I had gotten here sooner. I'm definitely subbed!!

  10. [
    Quote Originally Posted by Schism View Post
    Nice progress brotha, wish I had gotten here sooner. I'm definitely subbed!!
    Schism, thanks. Glad to be of help
    Days 33-34:
    ----------------

    Day 33 was a no-train day, I wouldnít have had the time to devote what I wanted to do for my back. Lethargy was pretty bad today anyway.
    Weight 197
    Food cals\fat\carbs\protein:
    2542 60 242 276
    Dose 37.5 phera/40 epi
    ---------
    Day 34 Deadlifts and back. Accomplished my goal to increase my heaviest set from 505x4 to 505x6. 6 times 505, thatís one and a half tons. I should feel pretty bouncy tomorrow or too tired to move, hard to predict. Lethargy was a little better today; Iím hoping to go another 18 days on this, so Iím going to have to get a handle on it. No back pumps, seems I only had them for a couple of days on day 23. With only 18 days to go I doubt theyíll become an issue. Workout is below.

    Weight has still flat-lined, but my beltís getting tighter.
    Weight 197
    Food cals\fat\carbs\protein:
    3250 95 306 304
    Dose 37.5 phera/30 epi I would have taken 40 epi but I forgot until it was too late in the day. Iíll make up for it tomorrow

    I'm not sure what my goal for my next deads will be. I start getting a little nervous at these weights. I hurt my self pretty badly a few years ago, don't desire to do it again.

    Work out:
    Deadlift 345x10, 410x8, 475x6, 505x6, 475x4 +2 at my set of 505
    T-Bar rows 90x10x3.
    Lat Pull-downs 200x10x3
    Lat Pull-downs Narrow 200x8x3

    DB

  11. Day 35
    I felt pretty good today, no lethargy at all. Maybe I wasn't getting enough calories, we'll see. Today was cardio. It was alright but I've done better, anabolics and cardio never seem to be a good combination for me. Tomorrow's chest, I'm gonna make sure I load up on calories tonite.
    Food: total/fat/carbs/protein
    2895 96 213 303
    Dose 45mg phera/30mg Epi

  12. Quote Originally Posted by DBinMD View Post
    Tomorrow's chest, I'm gonna make sure I load up on calories tonite.
    Food: total/fat/carbs/protein
    2895 96 213 303
    Dose 45mg phera/30mg Epi
    poor bench, lol, the way u hitting it dude, your chest workout will be off the charts, great log


  13. b unit,

    Thanks, but unfortunately I'm still at work, so I have to post pone 'til tomorrow. Really, pisses me off, first, I can't stand missing my chest wo and second, it's real iffy getting a decent spotter fridays thru sunday. Puts me in a difficult position for the rest of my cycle. MFSOB.


  14. Quote Originally Posted by DBinMD View Post
    b unit,

    Thanks, but unfortunately I'm still at work, so I have to post pone 'til tomorrow. Really, pisses me off, first, I can't stand missing my chest wo and second, it's real iffy getting a decent spotter fridays thru sunday. Puts me in a difficult position for the rest of my cycle. MFSOB.

    Sucks man sorry to hear that. Hope it works out for ya

  15. Quote Originally Posted by DBinMD View Post
    b unit,

    Thanks, but unfortunately I'm still at work, so I have to post pone 'til tomorrow. Really, pisses me off, first, I can't stand missing my chest wo and second, it's real iffy getting a decent spotter fridays thru sunday. Puts me in a difficult position for the rest of my cycle. MFSOB.

    yeah, a really good spotter is hard to find, i know what you are saying there, hang tough big guy

  16. Great log man! Looks like your still making some great progress. Other than the lethargy are you having any other sides ? How's your blood pressure, what level of suppression are you experiencing ? Hope all is well.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by Schism View Post
    Great log man! Looks like your still making some great progress. Other than the lethargy are you having any other sides ? How's your blood pressure, what level of suppression are you experiencing ? Hope all is well.
    Schism,

    Since you asked, I'll give an update on the sides:

    1) Lethargy
    I think I’m over the lethargy, at least I haven’t had any since Tuesday (day 34). I had it for about 5 days. Sometimes the lethargy didn’t start till late in the day (around the time I take the Epi) . Irish Cannon had similar issues after he added Epi to his cycle. I wasn’t eating as much as I was so my guess is that the lethargy had something to do with the Epi and not enough carbs. So my solution is to keep the Epi around 30mg, and take most or all of it after my workout, and up my calories. If I increase any doses it will be the phera. The Phera was always my main focus, anyway, but I think it is very androgenic. I can’t take anything highly androgenic or ergogenic late in the day or I’ll be up all night. I figured Epi, being lowly androgenic and highly anabolic would make sense for my late day dose.

    2) Libido
    My libido went from hyper drive at the beginning to about normal. I don’t know if that means I’m suppressed or not.

    3) BP – I haven’t check my BP. Those electric gizmos don’t work for me. When my doctor takes it with the pump the upper value is 30-40 pts lower (inverse white coat syndrome), been that way for a decade. I’m on a script anyway.

    4) Aggression – Generally, very slightly up, a little less patient. The exception was last night when I knew I was going to miss my chest work out. It was extremely hard to keep control.

    5) Painful pumps – Had them for a couple days, then gone. I’ll be ending this in about 15 days so, at this point, I doubt they’ll become an issue.
    6) Appetite – was way up, but now is about normal.
    7) Bulk – Was Up, but lost some of it.
    8) Sleep – A little worse than usual but I'm an insomniac. I try to take the Phera early because it’s androgenic; another complement to Epi.
    8) Shedding – Not generally an issue for me, I’m pretty sparse up top anyway, wouldn’t be much of a loss.
    9) Acne – None

    Let me know if I left anything out.


    DB

  18. No, I think you covered everything big guy. I like number 4, ain't nothin wrong with a little dedication bro. I fcukin hate missin a workout especially when I'm on a roll. But I'm glad you were able to control yourself.
    The world is a little safer tonight lol.

  19. I got behind in my logging, here's a summary:
    Day 37 Chest
    Weight: 197.0 +11 from start.
    Dose 45mg phera/30mg Epi
    Food
    3573 92 413 292

    Didn’t get the 6th rep at 310. I did better with inclines and flies.


    Day 38 Legs
    Weight: 197.0 +11 from start.
    Dose 45mg phera/30mg Epi
    Food
    2582 61 185 326
    I got to 700x5 before I felt the muscle pull from last week, better, but I was hoping for a set of 740x8.

    Day 39 Off
    Weight: 197.0 +11 from start.

    Day 40 off.
    Weight: 198.5 +12.5 from start. Finally, my weight went up again.
    Food cals\fat\carbs\protein:
    2625 75 182 316
    Dose 15mg phera (that’s not a typo).
    I decided the party may be over soon. I’m starting to feel a little over-stressed, over-trained, and over-medicated so I think I’m going to end this while I’m still feeling good.


    Day 41 arms and shoulders.
    Weight: 198.5 +12.5 from start.
    Food cals\fat\carbs\protein:

    2625 75 182 316
    Dose 15mg phera

    I went up about 5 lbs or 1 rep on everything except close grips.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Schism View Post
    The world is a little safer tonight lol.
    Yeah, really. I may have been legally insane, it's a good thing I wasn't stopped by a cop. But I'm much better now, thanks.

  21. Cycle Summary:
    Weight -------Start ----Goal---- Actual
    Height --------5’5”--
    Body weight-186 ------195 ----198.5
    Bench --------260x7---315x8 - 310x5 – missed #6 by an inch.
    V squat ------ 685x6 --700x8 - 735x8.
    Dead lift ------505x2 --525x6 - 505x6.
    Arms ---------17 ------17 4/8 17 3/8
    Chest -------- 46.5 ---- 48--- 47
    Waist --------36 -------36 --- 37
    Legs --------25.5 --- 26.5 --- 26 ĺ
    Neck --------16.5 --- none --- 17 ĺ

    Shoulders and upper chest area definitely got leaner, too.

    Average calories:
    Total fat/carbs/protein
    3110.514 95.648649 260.7027 309.64865
    Average Doses;
    Week 1 15 Phera, 15 epi
    Week 2 22 Phera, 20 epi
    Week 3 30 Phera, 30 epi
    Week 4 37 phera, 30 epi
    Week 5 42 phera, 35 epi
    Days 36-39 45 phera 35 epi
    Days 40-41 15 phera

    As I said earlier, I’m starting to feel a little over-stressed, over-trained, and over-medicated so I think I’m going to end this while I’m still feeling good. I think I peaked somewhere between days 28 and 36. That’s where I got my max bench, dl, and probably squat if not for the muscle pull. I feel like I could take a few days off from lifting and start up again but maybe 6 weeks is enough.

    I picked phera and epi because they seemed like a good complement to each other. But despite the weeks, maybe months, of research I still don’t know if phera is a Class I or Class II steroid. I assumed class II but I’ve seen others claim class I. Does anyone really know?

    Goals achieved were mixed, but acceptable. If I were to change anything I would keep the epi under 40 and phera under 45, maybe max doses of phera 40, epi 30 and plan this as a 6 week cycle. I think most of the lethargy I felt was from the epi, but I also could have been over stim’ed by the phera. The combination kicked in pretty fast so there wasn’t a need to plan a long cycle waiting for phera to kick in as I’ve read in other posts. However, I don’t plan on doing phera again anytime soon because of the reported effects on the heart, and I have a bunch of original 1-AD to use up before it turns to mush.

    Between work, volunteer work, and Lent there’s too much else to focus on. I felt pretty obsessed on this cycle and I just can’t do both. Besides, a close friend of mine is a priest and a gym rat. I’d like to say he’s PIA but, in reality, he keeps me from getting too insane.

    So I’ll be spending the next 4 weeks on post cycle therapy, and try not to be too obsessed about the gym. I’m due for a doctor’s visit about 4/1 as a follow up to the blood test on 12/22. After that I’ll do something with my 1-AD. I’m not sure what, any ideas?

    The sides were posted in #42. Since phera is pretty androgenic, I suspect my BP went up but I’m on a script so maybe it’s not too bad, and I don’t know what my cholesterol is at the moment, but it’s generally manageable if I eat right. Other than that, my chief complaints might sound strange to most but for the first 4 weeks my drive was pretty much obsessive-compulsive, and libido was just a little too distracting.

    PCT:
    Tamoxifen 40/40/20/10 (actually liquid tamoxifen citrate)
    HDX2
    Retain 2
    Long jack (pretty much a staple when not “on”)
    I’ve got some turkesterone I bought on an impulse; I might throw that in, too.
    I’ll keep taking the super cissus. I normally take glucosamine/chondroitin and I’m not convinced one is better than the other, but I’m starting to believe that taking both while cycling may have its merit.

    I may post again if anything note worthy happens, at the end of PCT or in between. Thanks for the interest.

    DB
    Last edited by DBinMD; 02-05-2008 at 11:58 PM.

  22. how do you dose your pp and epi... before and after workout or AM/PM

  23. Quote Originally Posted by wrkn4bigrmusles View Post
    how do you dose your pp and epi... before and after workout or AM/PM
    Anything hormonal gives me sleep issues, especially if it is highly androgenic, which I think phera is, so I took phera early and epi late. Hereís some examples:

    Low dose:
    Dose was 15mg Phera at 5:00am and 10mg Epi at 3:30 pm.

    Medium-high
    Pheri 15mg at 6:00 am and 12:00pm (30 mg total).
    Epi.. 20mg at 5:00 pm (right before wo) and 10mg post wo (6:00-6:30pm) (30 mg total).

    High (maybe too high)
    Pheri 15mg at 6:00 am, 10:00am, and 2:00pm (45 mg total).
    Epi. 10mg at 5:00 pm (right before wo) and 20mg post wo (6:00-6:30pm) (30 mg total).

    Even without the sleep issues, I think it makes more sense to take the highly androgenic pre wo and anablic post wo if you can. I'm not 100% sure though as I suppose there may be some issues I'm not aware of.

    Anything else?


    DB

  24. I also did a Epi/PP cycle and found that they complimented each other very well. Had very little sides too. Great log makes me want to pick a few bottles of PP, already got the epidrol. Well hope your PCT goes smooth and i hope your check up goes well.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by DBinMD View Post
    Anything hormonal gives me sleep issues, especially if it is highly androgenic, which I think phera is, so I took phera early and epi late. Hereís some examples:

    Low dose:
    Dose was 15mg Phera at 5:00am and 10mg Epi at 3:30 pm.

    Medium-high
    Pheri 15mg at 6:00 am and 12:00pm (30 mg total).
    Epi.. 20mg at 5:00 pm (right before wo) and 10mg post wo (6:00-6:30pm) (30 mg total).

    High (maybe too high)
    Pheri 15mg at 6:00 am, 10:00am, and 2:00pm (45 mg total).
    Epi. 10mg at 5:00 pm (right before wo) and 20mg post wo (6:00-6:30pm) (30 mg total).

    Even without the sleep issues, I think it makes more sense to take the highly androgenic pre wo and anablic post wo if you can. I'm not 100% sure though as I suppose there may be some issues I'm not aware of.

    Anything else?


    DB
    Thanks DB.,.. thats helpful... i was gunna move my workouts to the evening time when i begin next week so the timing should work well
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