old school ph cycle from the preban stash!

  1. New Member
    sweet-physique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    44
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    307
    Level
    16
    Lv. Percent
    10.65%

    old school ph cycle from the preban stash!


    Getting ready to use some old ph stuff from before the ban. Unfortunately I have no more 1 test as I have used it all so I will be guessing this to be a pretty wet cycle. My last cycle ended in August.
    This one will start after January 11.

    Weeks 1-6 4ad 600mg TD ED
    Weeks 1-6 19nor 600mg TD ED
    Weeks 1-3 M1T 20 mgs ED
    Weeks 4-6 M14add 180mgs ED.

    Nolva and Adex PRN

    ancillaries as follows
    NAC, R-ALA, Milkthistle for liver
    Red Rice yeast, Niacin for lipids
    Taurine, Multi, and ALCAR

    PCT will be nolva 3 weeks 40/30/20

  2. Registered User
    Neuromancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Age
    35
    Posts
    954
    Rep Power
    615
    Level
    24
    Lv. Percent
    79.4%

    I like it. Are you TD dosages absorbed or applied amounts?
  3. Registered User
    CDB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    38
    Posts
    4,543
    Rep Power
    2676
    Level
    47
    Lv. Percent
    20.36%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Six weeks of methyls is not a good idea, even if they aren't stacked andyou're on antioxidants, especially if one of them is M1T. It's possible mixing the 19nor and 4Ad isn't a good idea either. I remember reading the nor products can aggravate estrogen related side effects of test and test precursors. No idea if that's true but if so it could be a concern in this cycle.

    The dosing on the M14 seems high to me. If you're thinking in terms of conversion it's important to remember that no matter what the percentage is that converts to the target hormone in a ph, it's the original dosage of ph that your liver is dealing with in terms of processing a methylated hormone. I do remember people dosing M14 pretty high sometimes, but I honestly don't know how high or what's considered the safe limit for this product. It's something to look at though if you haven't already. Three weeks of 20mgs of M1T followed by three weeks of 180mg of M14 seems like it could be pretty stressful on your liver.
    •   
       

  4. New Member
    sweet-physique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    44
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    307
    Level
    16
    Lv. Percent
    10.65%

    Quote Originally Posted by CDB
    Six weeks of methyls is not a good idea, even if they aren't stacked andyou're on antioxidants, especially if one of them is M1T. It's possible mixing the 19nor and 4Ad isn't a good idea either. I remember reading the nor products can aggravate estrogen related side effects of test and test precursors. No idea if that's true but if so it could be a concern in this cycle.

    The dosing on the M14 seems high to me. If you're thinking in terms of conversion it's important to remember that no matter what the percentage is that converts to the target hormone in a ph, it's the original dosage of ph that your liver is dealing with in terms of processing a methylated hormone. I do remember people dosing M14 pretty high sometimes, but I honestly don't know how high or what's considered the safe limit for this product. It's something to look at though if you haven't already. Three weeks of 20mgs of M1T followed by three weeks of 180mg of M14 seems like it could be pretty stressful on your liver.
    The 4ad and the 19 nor together I expect to be wet and yes I anticipate the aromatization, thus the reason for the anti E and SERM while on cycle.

    As for the 6 weeks on methyls, this is an outside range, but not much different than running another oral only cycles like 3 weeks PP followed by 3 weeks SD. While the M1T is harsher on the liver than other methyls it is the dilemma with M1T. Many run 6 weeks methyl only cycles at higher doses. I may make the run 2-4 in favor of the M14add.

    As for the M14dd conversion is about 15% so its like 27 mgs dbol. Any less seems rather pointless especially for someone 245lbs. It is also a compound that is much less harsh on lipids and liver function than most other methyls except for maybe var or MOHN. Still the effect on androgens on liver and lipid levels and functions are important concerns. I do get blood work done by my doctor every 6 months and while liver functions have been elevated on cycle, he assures me they are not in the danger zone and always are normal after PCT. Also I limit my self to 2 cycles per year and they are generally no longer 6-7 weeks. Thanks for your feedback CDB. You have been here a while and always seem to have useful input.
  5. New Member
    sweet-physique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    44
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    307
    Level
    16
    Lv. Percent
    10.65%

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuromancer
    I like it. Are you TD dosages absorbed or applied amounts?
    applied TD, but i make my own homebrew penetrator and carrier and the recipe is really really good.
  6. Registered User
    Neuromancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Age
    35
    Posts
    954
    Rep Power
    615
    Level
    24
    Lv. Percent
    79.4%

    Gotcha.

    I don't think 6 weeks of a methyl is that out of hand at all. I usually do run my methyls for 6 weeks. However this is the longest I would suggest.

    I would actually up your M1,4 dose. I ran it all the way up to 300mgs ED if I remember correctly. Around 220 - 250 seemed to be the best dose, anything higher than that didn't really seem to have any effect.

    I have never ran M1T and won't for obvious reasons so I can't commnet on it, but if you like it... Personally I would just run the M1,4 for the entire 6 weeks, you certainly won't be disappointed with that. It was my favorite methyl PH by far.
  7. Professional Member
    motiv8er's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Age
    36
    Posts
    3,188
    Rep Power
    26297
    Level
    42
    Lv. Percent
    46.4%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    I would like to make the suggestion of sticking to one methyl. Run either one longer, but only one.
    Of the M 1, 4 diol 120-week 1 160-week 2 200-week 3 and go from there. Or run the M1T For something like 20, 20, 30, 30. I am not a big fan of satcking anyother Methyl with M1T. I am pretty crazy, but thats just me. The gains should be nice. Your LDL probably won't be.
    My The 1 LOG: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/254164-my-one-log.html
  8. Registered User
    CDB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    38
    Posts
    4,543
    Rep Power
    2676
    Level
    47
    Lv. Percent
    20.36%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by sweet-physique
    The 4ad and the 19 nor together I expect to be wet and yes I anticipate the aromatization, thus the reason for the anti E and SERM while on cycle.
    Seems other people like the high dose of M14, guess I did read about high doses somewhere. My concern with the nor and test precursors though is that progesterone seems to aggravate estrogen related sides. Negative synergy kind of thing. If you've never tried it before the cycle may turn out to be a whole lot wetter than you were expecting. While the progesterone doesn't seem to be too big a problem minus the estrogen, I do remember quite a few posts of people who were using decent doses of nolva, vitex, etc, but still couldn't control the sides and cut cycles short.

    If you've run a similar one before then you should know generally what you're in for. If you haven't though I think it'd pay to look for some of the older 19nor posts.
  9. Professional Member
    motiv8er's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Age
    36
    Posts
    3,188
    Rep Power
    26297
    Level
    42
    Lv. Percent
    46.4%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    For better synergy, I feel a 4ad+19nor+SD would be a badass stack. I only listed what I thought was a better option from what was being offered. I agree CDB, I would run like M5aa or something drier with what he is applying td.
    My The 1 LOG: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/254164-my-one-log.html
  10. On my grind
    3clipseGT's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  182 lbs.
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    10,002
    Rep Power
    1212410
    Level
    70
    Lv. Percent
    66%
    Achievements Posting VeteranActivity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuromancer
    Gotcha.

    I don't think 6 weeks of a methyl is that out of hand at all. I usually do run my methyls for 6 weeks. However this is the longest I would suggest.

    I would actually up your M1,4 dose. I ran it all the way up to 300mgs ED if I remember correctly. Around 220 - 250 seemed to be the best dose, anything higher than that didn't really seem to have any effect.

    I have never ran M1T and won't for obvious reasons so I can't commnet on it, but if you like it... Personally I would just run the M1,4 for the entire 6 weeks, you certainly won't be disappointed with that. It was my favorite methyl PH by far.
    I remember running my M1,4ad at 230mgs a day to get like 30 mgs of dbol or somethin to that effect?
    E-Pharm Rep... PM me with any questions or concerns
  11. Registered User
    Neuromancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Age
    35
    Posts
    954
    Rep Power
    615
    Level
    24
    Lv. Percent
    79.4%

    Quote Originally Posted by 3clipseGT
    I remember running my M1,4ad at 230mgs a day to get like 30 mgs of dbol or somethin to that effect?
    I can't remember exactly how high I pushed it, but I do remember really liking it, especially after the 200mgs mark.

    If I remember correctly, just by feel 250mgs felt about like 40 - 50 mgs dbol. Certainly not scientific but that was my estimate.
  12. On my grind
    3clipseGT's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  182 lbs.
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    10,002
    Rep Power
    1212410
    Level
    70
    Lv. Percent
    66%
    Achievements Posting VeteranActivity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuromancer
    I can't remember exactly how high I pushed it, but I do remember really liking it, especially after the 200mgs mark.

    If I remember correctly, just by feel 250mgs felt about like 40 - 50 mgs dbol. Certainly not scientific but that was my estimate.
    Yea im pretty sure ur right on target with assuming this. I know i read where like 230 was like 30 or so mgs of Dbol. So ur math is like spot on.
    E-Pharm Rep... PM me with any questions or concerns
  13. New Member
    sweet-physique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    44
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    307
    Level
    16
    Lv. Percent
    10.65%

    The reported conversion for M1,4DD is 15% so 200mg equals a 30mg dbol dose. Obviously the conversion rate is an estimate but this seems a pretty accurate guess based on feedback. I have run M1,4 ad before at 150mg then bumped it to 180 and 180 seemed to work well.

    As for the 4Ad and 19 nor together I have never done this combination before but I would speculate it should act similar to running test and deca together. Certainly wet but I wouldn't expect it to be unbearable. Only time will tell.

    As for the SD I have plenty of that but I am trying to utilize the bulk powers I have.
  14. Registered User
    Neuromancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Age
    35
    Posts
    954
    Rep Power
    615
    Level
    24
    Lv. Percent
    79.4%

    I have run a fairly high dosage of deca/test and didn't have any prog related problems. I always run 10 - 15mgs tamoxifen ED all throughout regardless, just for precaution.

    IMO, just keep ancilliarys on hand and chances are you won't have any problems.
  15. New Member
    sweet-physique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Age
    44
    Posts
    354
    Rep Power
    307
    Level
    16
    Lv. Percent
    10.65%

    Quote Originally Posted by CDB
    Seems other people like the high dose of M14, guess I did read about high doses somewhere. My concern with the nor and test precursors though is that progesterone seems to aggravate estrogen related sides. Negative synergy kind of thing. If you've never tried it before the cycle may turn out to be a whole lot wetter than you were expecting. While the progesterone doesn't seem to be too big a problem minus the estrogen, I do remember quite a few posts of people who were using decent doses of nolva, vitex, etc, but still couldn't control the sides and cut cycles short.

    If you've run a similar one before then you should know generally what you're in for. If you haven't though I think it'd pay to look for some of the older 19nor posts.
    I have run 4ad many many times, but never with the 19nor. I purchased the 19nor right before the band as it was dirt cheap bulk powder.

    My reasoning for using them together are as follows:

    Would these not interact similar to a test/deca stack?
    They utilize different conversion enzymes.
    Since 19 nor is suppressive wouldn’t it make sense to use 4ad to realize the benefits in libido and energy etc. ?




    Nandrolone:
    19-Nor-4-AD: Pros: Highly anabolic and cannot convert into Estrogen. Good for cutting or bulking Cons: Target hormone may convert into progesterone. »16% Stays attached to the AR longer than Test, as potent as 4-AD milligram per milligram In lower doses, it does not suppress Test production, and will not cause premature stoppage of growth in the long bones. Cannot convert into Estrogen or Progesterone in a plain (unconverted) state. But Nandrolone can convert into progesterone.

  16. New Member
    Rock's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Age
    39
    Posts
    89
    Rep Power
    172
    Level
    9
    Lv. Percent
    37.5%

    I ran a 4AD-19nor transdermal last year and started to develop a hard lump under one of my nipples. It was pretty scary. I stopped the cycle and chugged down nolva for a few days and it went away. So make sure you watch for signs of gyno.
  17. Board Supporter
    wastedwhiteboy2's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  195 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Age
    40
    Posts
    2,990
    Rep Power
    3015
    Level
    38
    Lv. Percent
    59.12%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    I've seen lots of deca + test + winny stacks. they seen to work well. I'm running m1,4 at 180 and like it. I'm also running prostan with it. You might think about reducing the m1t dose to 10mg.
  

  
 

Similar Forum Threads

  1. PH cycle without the wife knowing?
    By StangBanger in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 60
    Last Post: 03-31-2012, 12:26 AM
  2. Any old school PH users out there?
    By maniac0614 in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 06-08-2011, 12:40 AM
  3. Need feedback for my current cycle from the pros
    By Duffman77 in forum Cycle Info
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-04-2010, 02:46 AM
  4. some old school PH advice
    By Max32 in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-17-2008, 10:47 PM
  5. Best cutter cycle from the PH market?
    By sourcheese in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 02-12-2007, 03:24 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Log in
Log in