Clomid needed post- T-1 Pro cycle?

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  1. Clomid needed post- T-1 Pro cycle?


    Can I get away with ZMA post-cycle or do I need Clomid? I plan on doing 4ml/day, 40 day cycle.

    Thanks.


  2. A 40 day cycle is long enough to shut you down, ZMA wont do the job. You'll need Ergopharms 6-oxo. found HERE, or you can go with liquid clomid, found HERE
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  3. im trying out tamoxifen at 20-30mg/day for my next post cycle. the two previous post, i used zma/trib combo...lost some strength and weight. i got one bottle of 6oxo also....Sage

  4. Thanks for the links YJ. And how about preferences? Do clomid and 6-OXO work equally well? I'd like to hear opinions.

    Thanks again.

  5. I prefer clomid, cheaper and more potent.
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  6. What would be the recomended dosing for liquid clomid, 1ml(50mg) a day for 30 days post cycle?

  7. tell me again YJ why you prefer clomid over novla?

  8. i prefer novla less emotions and just as big ole loads..lol..seriously llewellyn wrote a pretty well written article on this checkout avantlabs.com inthere back issues

  9. Originally posted by xXx
    What would be the recomended dosing for liquid clomid, 1ml(50mg) a day for 30 days post cycle?
    It comes with a 50mL dropper, so its easy to measure and yes, you would dose it just like tabs

    Originally posted by Frost
    tell me again YJ why you prefer clomid over novla?
    Not really 'perfer' it, I always have clomid it seems like, its like apples & oranges to me. I generally only use Novla. in case of gyno, and Im not prone to gyno, so I just have a hundred or so on hand in case, Bobo posted a great study on why you should take you clomid.....

  10. Originally posted by YellowJacket


    It comes with a 50mL dropper, so its easy to measure and yes, you would dose it just like tabs



    Not really 'perfer' it, I always have clomid it seems like, its like apples & oranges to me. I generally only use Novla. in case of gyno, and Im not prone to gyno, so I just have a hundred or so on hand in case, Bobo posted a great study on why you should take you clomid.....
    the dropper or measurement doesnt bother me, i just steal equipment from my organic lab.

    when you say you use nolva incase of gyno, what do you mean?
    Do you start to take it when you see gyno beginning to appear? would you take it durring your cycle to prevent that as well as post cycle?

  11. Originally posted by Frost


    the dropper or measurement doesnt bother me, i just steal equipment from my organic lab.

    when you say you use nolva incase of gyno, what do you mean?
    Do you start to take it when you see gyno beginning to appear? would you take it durring your cycle to prevent that as well as post cycle?
    ha, you get your from organic labatories huh...i get mine (just two beakers, so it aint a true fellony) from a chemitry lab which my old roommate is a TA for.
    the use of nolva wouldnt eliminate a case of gyno if you have it. what it does do however, is prevent gyno if you are known to have a minor case of it so i find it useful to start the use of nolvadex the last couple of days of your actual cycle (i also feel the same way for any other post cycle supplementation, to make a smoother transition from the unnatural testoterone production, back to getting your goods back) so novla is great (and could be had for cheap) for knocking away those estrogens and taking a minor minor case of gyno away. Sage

  12. is nolva a prescription anti-e?

    if not, link me to get it..hehe

  13. ha, nevermind, i found it....

    it says should not be ingested by humans.....clomid and nolva unsafe??

    how much mg nolva should you use a day?

  14. some peole should be given directions for common sense

  15. Originally posted by mauibuilt

    how much mg nolva should you use a day?
    Check out the FAQ sticky in the steriod section, dosage is mentioned in there aswell as for clomid. Just found that out myself tonight.

  16. thanks draven read up all about it...looks like when my 6oxo bottles go empty, im gonna have to try nolva in the future post cycle.

  17. Follow-up question that I don't see answered in the FAQ section... Usually a person starts Clomid 3 weeks after most common AS cycles but what about after a T-1 Pro cycle? Should Clomid therapy begin immediately after the four week cycle? If not, how many weeks after the cycle ends?

    Also, has anyone heard of anyone experiencing gyno on prohormones? I don't have Nolva on hand. Am I taking a risk? I just started T1-Pro 4ml/day.

    Thanks.

  18. Originally posted by dejansen
    Follow-up question that I don't see answered in the FAQ section... Usually a person starts Clomid 3 weeks after most common AS cycles but what about after a T-1 Pro cycle? Should Clomid therapy begin immediately after the four week cycle? If not, how many weeks after the cycle ends?

    Also, has anyone heard of anyone experiencing gyno on prohormones? I don't have Nolva on hand. Am I taking a risk? I just started T1-Pro 4ml/day.

    Thanks.
    The three week delay during a typical AAS cycle is based on the fact that most steriods have esters attached which keep them active in the body for several weeks after the last dose is taken. And since they are still active, they are still shutting down your natural test production. Hence, it makes sense to wait on taking clomid until the majority of the AAS has cleared from your system.

    Most pro-hormones are ester-less which means that they clear from your system in several hours. Consequently, one day after you stop taking t1-pro, you can start taking Clomid.

    As far as gyno goes, one of the common myths is that pro-hormones cannot give you gyno. They can. If you are experiencing nipple tenderness/itchiness or can feel any growth behind the nipple, that could be gyno. Start taking nolva immediately. Personally, 4-AD transdermally and injected give me gyno symptoms (and 4-ad doesn't aromatize, but some does convert to test which does) so I always have nolvadex on hand and take it at the the first signs.

    As far as ZMA, it should not be considered as a post-cycle recovery aid. When your body is deficient in zinc (which is the case in virtually every active person) then your natural test production is inhibited. So, ZMA should be taken during and after cycles.

  19. i always thought 4-ad does aromatize..im semsitive to it myself..god im sick of the zma thing

  20. Originally posted by RVEXLER


    As far as gyno goes, one of the common myths is that pro-hormones cannot give you gyno. They can. If you are experiencing nipple tenderness/itchiness or can feel any growth behind the nipple, that could be gyno. Start taking nolva immediately. Personally, 4-AD transdermally and injected give me gyno symptoms (and 4-ad doesn't aromatize, but some does convert to test which does) so I always have nolvadex on hand and take it at the the first signs.


    when you say, at the first signs of gyno you start taking it, would you continue your cycle if you were in the middle of it when this happened, and just take novla throughout the rest of your cycle?
    And if this is the case, why don't you just take novla throughout your whole cycle?

    THx

  21. Originally posted by Frost



    when you say, at the first signs of gyno you start taking it, would you continue your cycle if you were in the middle of it when this happened, and just take novla throughout the rest of your cycle?
    And if this is the case, why don't you just take novla throughout your whole cycle?

    THx
    I take nolvadex during and after my cycles. As far as discontinuing the pro-hormone or AAS, it depends on how severe the symptoms are. I recently made test prop from syno and was using it with fina. No matter how much nolva I was taking (and I went up to 80 mg a day) and I was also taking arimidex, the symptoms wouldn't go away. So, I stopped taking the prop.

  22. u do know nolva cancels out arimidex..right?

  23. Originally posted by wojo
    u do know nolva cancels out arimidex..right?
    That's news to me. Nolvadex prevents estrogen from binding to estrogen receptors. Arimidex prevents testosterone from aromitizing to estrogen. How does nolva cancel out arimidex? Not saying you are wrong, but I have never heard that before.

  24. ok seriously i did see this..im looking for it right now..i will come back with it by tonight i hope..if not feel free to call me pjorstad..lol..there does exist a abstract with this

  25. Found a study you might be looking for. It does show that nolva will lower arimidex levels in the blood when they are taken together, but that the reduction is not sufficient to diminish arimidex's anti-aromitization activity.

    1: Br J Cancer 2001 Aug 3;85(3):317-24 Related Articles, Links


    Pharmacokinetics of anastrozole and tamoxifen alone, and in combination, during adjuvant endocrine therapy for early breast cancer in postmenopausal women: a sub-protocol of the 'Arimidex and tamoxifen alone or in combination' (ATAC) trial.

    ATAC Trialists' Group.

    CRC and UCL Cancer Trials Centre, University College London, Stephenson House, 158-160 N Gower Street, London, NW1 2ND, UK.

    The ATAC trial evaluates in a randomized, double-blind design, Arimidextrade mark (anastrozole) alone or in combination with tamoxifen, relative to tamoxifen alone as 5-year adjuvant treatment in postmenopausal women with early breast cancer. Patients included in the pharmacokinetic (PK) sub-protocol had been in ATAC for > or =3 months, taking their medication in the morning and were 100% compliant for the preceding 14 days. Blood samples were collected 24 +/- 4 h after last dose. Trough (C(min)) plasma concentrations of anastrozole, tamoxifen and desmethyltamoxifen (DMT) were measured by validated methods. The PK results were based on a total of 347 patients (131 anastrozole (1 mg o.d.), 111 tamoxifen (20 mg o.d.), 105 anastrozole and tamoxifen (1 and 20 mg o.d. respectively)). The geometric mean steady-state trough plasma concentrations of tamoxifen and DMT were statistically equivalent in patients receiving tamoxifen alone or in combination with anastrozole: geometric mean tamoxifen = 94.8 ng ml(-1)and 95.3 ng ml(-1)in tamoxifen alone and combination groups, respectively; geometric mean DMT = 265.1 and 277.6 ng ml(-1)in the tamoxifen and anastrozole and tamoxifen groups, respectively. The geometric mean anastrozole levels were 27% lower (90% Cl 20-33%;P< 0.001) in the presence of tamoxifen than with anastrozole alone. Baseline plasma oestradiol levels were not obtained in the PK sub-protocol, however, such information was available from a similar ATAC sub-protocol, which evaluated bone mineral density. Mean oestradiol levels were 21.3, 19.3, and 21.6 pmol l(-1)prior to treatment and 3.7, 20.9 and 3.6 pmol l(-1)after 3 months in the anastrozole, tamoxifen, and combination groups, respectively (n = 167). On-treatment values were below the detection limit (3 pmol l(-1)) in 43.6 and 38.5% of the anastrozole alone and anastrozole in combination with tamoxifen groups, respectively. As a result of (a) the lack of effect of anastrozole on tamoxifen and DMT levels and (b) the observed fall in blood anastrozole levels having no significant effect on oestradiol suppression by anastrozole, we conclude that the observed reduction in anastrozole levels by tamoxifen is unlikely to be of clinical significance when anastrozole and tamoxifen are administered together. Copyright 2001 Cancer Research Campaign
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