5AA,1-Test,4AD Cyp +4OHT
- 11-27-2004, 03:44 PM
Today was upper body. Went really well again, just about every lift went up another 10lbs. It took a while but I'm starting to see a little bit of acne breakout on my forehead. My skins been oily for a while now thanks to the 5AA Cyp. I'm surprised the acne took this long to show up. Could also be the Nolva. I usually breakout during PCT which always consists of Nolva. On another good note the mild gyno has disappeared already (Big sigh of relief!)
Started taking 1500mg nettle root and 1500mg of vitex a day starting yesterday. The nettle root is supposed to bind to the SHBG enzyme resulting in more free test circulating. I'll keep you guys posted on whether or not I can tell a difference.
One a side note, has anybody else ever noticed that it takes forever to bust a nut while on Nolva. It happens to me everytime. Sometimes thats a good thing, but damn I get enough cardio as is. I don't need that extra 45 minutes while bulking.
- 11-30-2004, 11:15 PM
Well, I don't know if it was the nettle root and vitex or placebo effect. But I had my best workout ever tonight. Went up 10 lbs on seated cable rows to 140 for 8 with a three second hold, incline fly also went up 10 lbs to 170 for 8. Then to top it off my personal record for mid grip bench press went up to 280 for 8. The first sent was clean but the 8th rep on the second set was sloppy.
Intensity overall was way up. I was so burned out afterwards I was shaking all the way home. A bouble dose of whey and some cottage chesse fixed that though. Wish I had included these supplements at the beginning of my cycle. I've also noticed an increase in libedo, like I really friggin needed that. A cute skirt walks by... boner, an ugly skirt walks by... boner, the wind blows... boner.
I gotta feeling I'm gonna be sore as **** tomorrow. Calgon take me away!
- 12-09-2004, 09:41 AM
Well today is the last day of this cycle. Overall I've been very pleased. I did not manage to bulk as much as I had planned, but then again 193 lbs at 5'6" 11% BF is seriously effecting my flexibility and speed. Now it's PCT time woopee!
I'll be switching back to my speed routine for the next 30 days. So we will see how much weight I keep. I had intended to run this PCT with IGF but I picked a bad time of year for it due to the expense involved. I'd rather spend that money on my daughter for Christmas. Oh well, maybe next time. One nice thing about leaving out the IGF is I'll be able to see exactly how effective the Swale HCG protocol is for recovery without out any other compounds besides Nolva involved.
12-09-2004, 10:37 AM
If your measurements are on, then there's nothing too bad about trading in 7.5 pounds of fat for 10.5 pounds of lean mass.
Start - 190 @15%BF = 161.5 LBM + 28.5 fat
End - 193 @11%BF = 172 LBM + 21 fat.
12-10-2004, 10:18 PM
I appreciate the comment. I know I should be happy with the results. I was just hoping for a little better. I guess most of us are never truly 100% satisfied with our physique or conditioning. Maybe thats why we keep at.... Nah I'm just a vain bastard myself haha.
I'll try and post some after pics this weekend. Maybe then I'll be able to see the difference. Everyone I know has been commenting on the changes, but looking in the mirror everyday its hard to see them.
12-12-2004, 09:05 PM
Well I promised some updated photos... so here they are. They were taken 11 hours after my workout. My apologies for the piss poor quality. Maybe some day I'll get a camera that's worth a ****.
On another note today was the first time I have switched to my speed routine while androgens were still in the blood stream. Big mistake, I got so pumped I didn't get halfway through my routine and had to call it quits. The stretching at the end was murder. I usually like to hold my stretches for 60 seconds but not today. I got to 30 seconds and said **** this ****.
12-13-2004, 08:45 AM
Very impressive! Good work. Sorry but you can't hide a good physique and good results from a cycle with a ****ty camera!
12-21-2004, 10:33 AM
Update on PCT
Wow, 10 days into PCT and all I can say is "Holy ****!" This has been the smoothest PCT I've ever had. If Swale wasn't a guy I'd find him and give a great big wet kiss. I will NEVER cycle again without using the Swale HCG protocol! I've kept all the weight and strength so far. My mood has been easy going and level. The family jewels seem to be working pretty good. Sex drive and stamina are still excellent. The nettle root and vitex at 1.5 grams each a day may have something to do with it as well.
I can only imagine what this PCT would have been like with Long R3IGF-1. Maybe next time.
12-21-2004, 11:45 AM
Wow, glad to hear PCT is going so well! You look much thicker and leaner in the new photos than the one you posted in the beginning of the cycle. Have you lost any weight in your first 10 days of PCT?
12-22-2004, 12:32 AM
I lost one pound on day 3 of PCT then gained it back on day 7 or 8. But my weight fluctuates like that sometimes if I dont drink enough water or eat to much salt etc... By the way Rob, big thumbs ups on your current cycle. Pretty impressive gains so far!
On another note, I tested this past Saturday to go from a regular blackbelt to a 1st degree blackbelt. The testing took 3 hours and 10 min. I just KNEW I was gonna be one sore ass sorry SOB for the next couple of days. But the Citrulline Malate seems to really do an awesome job of removing amonia and lactic acid buildup. At the end alot of people looked like they were ready to drop or keel over dead, but I felt like I could have gone another hour with little problem. I was a little stiff Sunday morning for about 4 hours but no soreness ever showed up. Where was this stuff when I played football in high school or how about Marine Corp boot camp? I really could have used the **** then.
12-22-2004, 07:42 AM
Awesome results, congratulations on both your cycle and your new belt !
01-09-2005, 10:30 AM
Well, PCT is now done. I dreaded getting on the scales and dragging out the calipers after the holiday season. I kept saying to myself "I tried to be good...I really did"
Final starts are weight: 192 lbs, body fat: 9.7% Whoopee! I been using my speed routine through out PCT until this last week. I modified my speed training by performing one heavy set for 8 reps followed by a speed set to evaluate strength. I'm happy to say I have not lost any strength post cycle. Bench press and EZ curls actually went up 10 lbs.
All in all I'd have to say this cycle was a mixed bag of results. Good body recomp, decent strength increases with very few sides other than the little gyno flare up. I also learned some very important things: CEE, CM, nettle root, and vitex all get a thumbs up. Swales HCG protocol combined with the above gets a big thumbs up, way up.
01-09-2005, 12:58 PM
Start cycle - 190 @15%BF = 161.5 LBM + 28.5 fat
End cycle -- 193 @11%BF = 172 LBM + 21 fat.
End PCT ---- 192 @9.7%BF = 173.4LBM + 18.6fat
Start to finish, about 100 days,
+12 LBM - 10 fat. +7.5% LBM, -5%BF.
Very impressive recomp!
If you have the spare time, maybe tally up how much this cycle cost you. I have a curiousity about such things, and it could help other people make a few decisions.
Lastly, if you have any way of discriminating, I would like to hear your evaluation of the role of each component in your cycle - which effects do you attribute to which substances, and if you knew what you knew now before this past cycle would you have done anything differently to save money or side effects or whatever?
01-09-2005, 03:07 PM
Total cost for this cycle was $449.72. That includes ancilliarys, pins, etc... everything except the M1T which I had on hand already. Real gear would have been cheaper I know, but I wanted to know how effective PH's could really be for me before they dissappear. Plus I wanted to have a basis for comparison should I ever travel the darker road.
I would evaluate each of the compounds as follows:
4AD Cyp - I actually prefered better as a transdermal. The amount of ml's you have to inject is a pain the ass, but water retention is slower to develop in the cyp.
1-Test Cyp - I also prefer as a transdermal. It is all but impossible for me to get truly pain free injections with this stuff no matter what I mix it with. Some pain would always show up a day later. I believe the dose being close to 1 gram a week was what caused the majority of my joint pain. It is long gone and shows no signs of returning.
4OHT - Too expensive for the gains it produced, but when you factor in it anti-e qualities a very nice compound. I also noticed a marked increase in libido shortly after application.
5AA Cyp - Was good at boosting strength and aggression, but I like M5AA better as it can be taken just before working out. 5AA Cyps effects are with you ALL day.
M1,4ADD - Really liked this stuff for a bulking compound. Water retention was not a factor at 100 mg a day with 4OHT and the 5AA keeping me dry. After using this for a week or so I threw that last bottle of M1T away.
HCG - Its the **** for keeping suppression at bay. I'll never cycle without it again.
If I were to redo this cycle it would be as follows:
10 week cycle 1200 mg 4OHT Transdermal, 500 mg 5AA Cyp, 700 mg 1-Test Cyp and 2300 mg 4AD Cyp with HCG throughout and kickstarted with 150 mg M1,4ADD
P = Prohormones
H = 250iu HCG twice a week
N = Nolva dosed at 40/40/30/20
M = 150 mg M1,4ADD split in 3 doses.
1 - P, M
2 - P, M, H
3 - P, M, H
4 - P, M, H
5 - P, H
6 - P, H
7 - P, H
8 - P, H
9 - P, H
10 - P, H
1 - N, H
2 - N
3 - N
4 - N
I would also definitely include CEE, CM, Nettle Root and Vitex at the begining of the cycle.
01-09-2005, 03:12 PM
Great feedback. Thanks for taking the time.
01-09-2005, 08:36 PM
But on second thought Strateg0s. If I were to redo this cycle in an alternate universe it also might look like this.
10 weeks 600mg Test E or Test Cyp, 400mg EQ (Boldenone) jumpstarted with 30mg ED of DBOL.
A = Test/EQ
D = 30mg DBOL split in 3 doses.
H = 250iu HCG twice a week
N = Nolva dosed at 40/40/30/20
1 - A, D
2 - A, D, H
3 - A, D, H
4 - A, D, H
5 - A, H
6 - A, H
7 - A, H
8 - A, H
9 - A, H
10 - A, H
1 - N, H
2 - N
3 - N
4 - N
Might also throw some Tren in there the last 4 - 6 weeks at 50 to 75mg ED. Total cost about $320.00 less the Tren. Speaking strictly theoretically of course.
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