1T/4AD Transdermal, m5aa

[candle25]

GOAL:

Cutting

EXPERIENCE:

1

WORKOUT:

Mon
Squats 4set @ 20,15,10,8
Hack Squats 3set @ 12,12,10
Leg Ext 2set @ 9,9
Leg Curls 3set @ 15,10,8
SLDL 3set @ 8,8,8
Crunches 3set 25,25,25

Tues
Flat Bench Press 4set @ 10,10,8,6
Incline Bench Press 3set @ 8,8,6
Weighted Dips 3set @ 10,10,10
Close Grip Bench Press 3set @ 8,8,8
Skullcrushers 3set @ 8,8,8

Wen
20min HIIT

Thurs
Dead Lifts 3set @ 15,10,8
Bent Rows 3set @ 8,8,8
Pullups 3set @ 10,8,8
Lat Dips 3set @ 8,8,8
Curls 3set @ 8,8,8
Rev Curls 3set @ 8,8,8
Forearm Curls 2set @ 20,18
Rev Forearm 2set @ 2

Fri
Military Press 3set @ 8,8,8
Side Lats 3set @ 8,8,8
Rear Lats 3set @ 8,8,8
Shrugs 3set @ 20,15,15
Upright Rows 3set @ 8,8,8
Calf Raise Standing 3set @ 20,20,20
Calf Raise Hack 3set @ 20,20,20
Neck Machine 3set (front & back) 10,8,8
Crunches 3set @ 25,25,25

Sat
20min HIIT

Sun
Rest

NUTRITION:

Diet
The plan right now is as follows:
Calorie breakdown: 45P/30C/25F
Week 1 3500cal
Week 2 3000cal
Week 3 2500cal
Week 4 2000cal

Carbs will be eaten mostly before 2PM and around wo. The rest will be protein & fat.

Supplements
ON Whey protein (post wo)
Dextrose (post wo)
BCAA's (pre wo)
EAA's (post wo)
Vit C (throughout day, pre, & post wo)
B complex (lunch)
Multi Vit (breakfast)
Creatine (post wo)

PH Stack
Transdermal 1T/4AD (1:1 ratio at 6g each)
Breakdown:
8.57ml/day = 429mg/day
Absorbance will be in the range of 128.57- 214.29mg/day
m5aa @ 30mg/day (Training days only)

HEIGHT:

6'1"

WEIGHT:

189.5

BF:

16%

MAXLIFTS:

Not Sure

This cycle is all homebrewed. I will be starting Mon.

 

[candle25]

Today's wo was awesome. I was super energized and my lifts reflected that. The transdermal matrix actually gives my skin a nicer glow to it as well. I'm loving this so far. I got a little over-confident today. On my 4th set of squats I went for 375lbs. I ended up having to drop it as I couldn't get back up out of the squat...lol. On my diet today I went a little to high on carbs. This is going to take some getting used to. My gym nominated me for member of the month today as well! That's kind of cool.

 

[candle25]

Nothing interesting to report today. I think I'm going to add some type of stimmulant to my plan. I still have a bulking appetite and It's getting hard to watch my caloric intake. I might start drinking coffee again or maybe green tea extract to help curb my appetite.

 

[candle25]

I did 10min of HIIT today. That was all I could do. I haven't done any cardio in 6 months and today it showed! All I can say is that HIIT is painfull...lol.

 

[candle25]

Day 4

Ok guys, you know how when you start a cycle that a day comes that you know the stuff has "kicked in?" Well that day for this cycle was today. I had the best wo in a while today. Super pumps and no fatigue at all. The most impressive lift of the day was on my 4th set of DL's. I pulled 390lbs for 5 reps! I could have went much heavier but didn't care to. I can't wait to hit the gym tommorrow. The only thing that is confusing me is that another bro ran the same cycle and he didn't report any major difference untill week 3. He did get hurt though and had to lay off the gym. We'll see!

 

[candle25]

Day 7

My weight is still holding solid at 189. Energy and stamina are great. The testicular atrophy kicked in on day 5 but libido is way up. More so than normal...lol. I had to switch application site due to a rash that was starting on my forearms. That was odd since I was applying to my chest. I'm using quads right now.

Today was leg day again and I got that 375 that I couldn't get last week. WO's are awesome. That's it for now.

 

[candle25]

Day 9

Today was another super wo! My energy is off the chart and I feel great. I moved some heavy weight today. I got 410 for 4 reps on my third set of dead lifts and 110 for 6 reps on my third set of bb curls. I'm loving this cycle!

 

[julius kelp]

i started m5aa + 1-test/1,ad transderm this morn. i like the looks of what your doing. i may add 4ad to the stack, i'm feeling the 1-test already.

 

[candle25]

Day 13

I think that is one aspect of transdermals that is interesting. You almost feel the effects of the PH's right away. I've switched back to my chest as the application sight as my quads were starting to peel from the tanning bed. The cardio is getting a little easier (as easy as it will get...lol). My weight is dropping slightly as well. I weighed in at 185.5 today. I think the PH stack is helping me to build muscle while I burn fat through cardio and diet. The physical change in my body is very obvious. I'm at 2500 cal/day now and the caloric limit is killing me. I didn't think I'd say this but I can't wait to bulk again...lol. 4500 cals/day sounds so good right now.

My knees and right hip were hurting a little today. I did 3 sets of squats and tried 370 on my 4th. After I finished my knees and hip were really hurting so I decided to call it a day and went home. I hate getting hurt! I realize that most of the time it happens because mentaly you feel like you can move a certain weight but physicaly you can't and you end up hurt. I don't think that's the case here, but I'm going to lighten up for the rest of the week to be sure.

 

[julius kelp]

are you noticing the m5aa much? (as in strength increases)

 

[candle25]

I do notice it within 1hr of injestion. It is nothing major but it seems best to describe it as increasing energy and motivation. It isn't like a stimmulant but it makes you feel like getting a few more reps or throwing on a little more weight. The 1T/4AD is working so well now that the m5aa is just a slight boost. When I first started this cycle the m5aa was very noticable. This is a little off subject, and I think it must be the 4AD, but my libido is off the chart...lol. Has anyone else had simmilar effects from 4AD?

 

[Ivan Drago]

This is a little off subject, and I think it must be the 4AD, but my libido is off the chart...lol. Has anyone else had simmilar effects from 4AD?

God yeah. When I took what use to be Super 1Test, by avant labs, even with the 1T, the 4AD had me going crazy.

 

[julius kelp]

4ad will do dat...

 

[candle25]

Day 18

Nothing special to report. I've been working 12-13hrs/day lately and my cals are at 2500/day so I've been really tired this week. I skiped the gym Tues & Thurs so I just worked back and bis today. My weight is holding solid at 187 which is great IMO since I can tell I'm dropping fat.

 

[bioman]

4AD + 4OHT turned me into a raging animal. Strong like bull!

 

[candle25]

Day 20

I weighed in at 184 today. I also dropped my cals down to 2000. I feel like I am starving to death...lol. Todays wo was good. I went lighter due to my hurting myself last week. My energy is still up as well as the libido. I'm looking pretty cut but not as much as I'd like to be. I'm having my fat checked Mon so hopefully all this will pay off.

 

[candle25]

Day 21

Weighed in at 183.75 today. My weight is still slowly dropping. I am feeling a bit weaker now that my cals are so low. 5 days to go and I'll be through with the cut...lol. Something really stupid happened to me today. After my shower I was shaving and had the rest of my transdermal sitting on the counter. I knocked it off the counter by mistake and it shattered all over the floor! Luckily I have enough supplies to last for years so I brewed enough to last for the remainder of my cycle. I figure that I wasted 1.08g 1T & 1.08g 4AD.

 

[Cuffs]

4AD + 4OHT turned me into a raging animal. Strong like bull!

I'm into my third week of a M-1T, 4Ad/4OT trans cycle, and am getting the same results with libido. However, I'm also feeling some agrgession, and have been moody. Not good with my job. I went off on a couple of dick-heads the other night. Had to take a step back and cool down a bit. Was wondering if anyone else has experienced these sides. Other than a slight bloat, and earlier lower back spasms, no other sides have been noticed.

Didn't intend to jack your thread Candle.

 

[candle25]

That's OK bro. I never get tired of seeing your avatar...lol. I can't really comment on agression as I always feel that way. It is intensified while I'm on cycle though. Example: The other night I went to the opening of "Secret Window" and it was packed. About 10min into the movie a group of teens came in (17-18?) and were just being very boisterous. Laughing, talking to each other very loud. I could tell it was bothering more people than just myself. I really felt like cleaning house, but I let it slide because of their age. They fianly quieted down but then everything started bothering me. A guy a few seats over was eating popcorn and the sound of him chewing seemed amplefied a million times. It was driving me crazy. I had to remind myself that I was overreacting mentally and that I needed to calm down.

 

[bioman]

OMG- yes those are the same sides I had. They really got bad towards the end of the cycle (M1T, 4Ad, 4OHT). My mood was nearly out of control and it was difficult for me to not go off on people. Haven't been that big of a hothead since I was 17.

Driving in tourist traffic nearly had me chewing nails.

The really bad part was I got very depressed during the first 2 weeks of PCT.

Has made me re-evaluate whether I want to add 4OHT to a stack again.

 

[candle25]

I've not gotten any of the PCT depression yet. I haven't really ran anything strong enough to cause it I suppose. What is the target hormone of the 4OHT that you're talking about? I quit keeping up with PH's since AAS are way cheaper...lol.

 

[bioman]

I don't know much about hydroxy test other than its mildly anti-estrogenic, stimulates libido, and is mildy anabolic. Most people have a positive experience adding it to a stack but for some reason it just didn't agree with my wiring, lol.

I didn't gain much weight with that stack but I did get a great body comp change.

BTW- I'm all better now..really.

 

[Cuffs]

I'm up 12 pounds so far in this cycle. Going for a 4 weeker. Strength has increased, body comp has deff. been changing, improved vascularity, and muscle hardness. So far this stack is working for me. I decreased my doses of my dermal and the agression and moodiness seem under control now.

One fact, I now get hard when the wind blows...if you know what I mean. Haven't been like that since high school. Like when the teacher unexpectedly called on you to give a presentation in front of the class and you needed to take some extra time to get things calmed down. Mind of its own, I'm tellin' ya.

 

[candle25]

I hear ya bro. I'm loving my hightened libido and so is my girl...lol. I'm about to order some cabergoline and experiment with it. I'm doing some viagra/GF juice experiments tonight.

Day 24

Today was a great day at the gym. Lifts were nice and my energy level is going back up. That alcohol Wen night really killed my program...lol. I weiged in at 184.5 which has been rather solid for 4-5 days now. I'll post up some pics later. I guess I'm about as cut as I'm going to get on this cycle.

 

[candle25]

OK here are the pics. What do ya think? I still have a bit more fat around the mid section that I care to have. I will cut for longer next time. I can't pose worth a damn...lol.

 

[candle25]

Day 25

Weiged in at 184 today. Tomorrow is the last day of my cut. I'm rather happy with the overall results. I have built a great base for my next bulk. I will be stopping all cardio after I run tomorrow. I'm afraid that with my cals so low I'd do more damage than good. I will be bumping my cals up to 2500 starting mon.

 

[candle25]

I decided to upload another pic as I feel that the last one makes me look fatter than I am...lol. This will be the last pic for a while.

 

[Cuffs]

Lookin' solid Candle. Good job!

 

[candle25]

Thanks bro. I have a ways to go to get to where I want to be, but I know we all have to start somewhere. I'll post up my final BF% later when I get back form the gym.

 

[candle25]

My BF% checked out at 10.7% at 185lbs!!! I am really happy with that being that I started this cut 4 weeks ago at 16% and 189.75lbs. That means that managed to lose 10.56lbs of fat and gain 5.81lbs of muscle during this 4 week cut! If any of you have cut before you know that it is difficult to gain muscle while losing fat. I am very pleased with the results of the transdermal and the overall cut cycle.

 

[sugashane]

great thread candle...exactly what I was looking for...this is the exact cycle I want to run. Couple questions...

1. Why didnt you go with a transdermal for both 4ad "AND" 1 test? as I really want to do 1test transdermally.

2. what product did you use for the m5aa?

3. and at what dosages were all these at, and for how many weeks? I think I may just follow whatever you did. think you can help me plan this cycle?

 

[candle25]

1. Well the 4AD helps to keep the libido up while on cycle and is a great compound. I love the stuff and so does my girl...lol (when I take it that is). I chose transdermal because I brew everything myself and I had seen good results from other bros.

2. Mix 0.5g M%-aa & 49.5ml of PEG-400. Heat and shake. You have 50ml @ 10mg/ml.

3. The dosage and absorbance is outlined on the first page of this thread. I ran it for 4 weeks.

Feel free to PM me if ya need any help or have any questions. Remeber that your diet will determine the outcome of your program.

 

[sugashane]

why did you only take the m5aa on training days, arent you supposed to take PH's everyday throughout the cycle, regardless of days off. Also how many weeks did you run this at?

and could you explain this to me...

Transdermal 1T/4AD (1:1 ratio at 6g each)
Breakdown:
8.57ml/day = 429mg/day
Absorbance will be in the range of 128.57- 214.29mg/day

I understand thst transdermals have a 30-40% absorbtion rate,but....also did you take 429mg of both 1 test and 4ad? exactly? how do you get to those exact numbers, im a bit confused.

could you give me an example of how a day would look for you, ie. wake up-shower-sqiurts 1t on chest, take 30mg m5aa, 12 hours later.....etc. and give the exact dosages. I would really appreciate it.

 

[sugashane]

I am thinking...
30mg M5aa all 4 weeks
300mg 1test week 1, 400mg week 2, 500mg week 3 & 4
400mg 4AD week 1,500mg week 2, 600mg week 3 & 4

40mg nolvadex 2 weeks
20mg nolvadex 2weeks

and I will look into the milk thistle for pct also.

only other supps Ill be taking is clebutrx or lipo 6 throughout, and maybe creatine during pct.

what do you think?

 

[candle25]

why did you only take the m5aa on training days, arent you supposed to take PH's everyday throughout the cycle, regardless of days off. Also how many weeks did you run this at?

M5aa is different than other PH's. It is only used pre wo. I ran it for all 8 weeks. That includes PCT.

and could you explain this to me...

Transdermal 1T/4AD (1:1 ratio at 6g each)
Breakdown:
8.57ml/day = 429mg/day
Absorbance will be in the range of 128.57- 214.29mg/day

I understand thst transdermals have a 30-40% absorbtion rate,but....also did you take 429mg of both 1 test and 4ad? exactly? how do you get to those exact numbers, im a bit confused.

ok, I put 6g of 4AD & 6g of 1T (for a total of 12g) in 240 ml of transdermal.

12/240=0.05g/ml . I ran it for 4 weeks=28days. 240/28=8.57ml/day.

8.57ml/day=429mg/day (214.5mg of 1T & 214.5mg of 4AD).

Of that 128.57- 214.29mg/day was absorbed (64.28mg- 107.14mg of 1T & the same for 4AD)

Hope that helps.

could you give me an example of how a day would look for you, ie. wake up-shower-sqiurts 1t on chest, take 30mg m5aa, 12 hours later.....etc. and give the exact dosages. I would really appreciate it.

Well the spray bottle I used sprayed 1ml/spray. So my day looked like:

Morning: 2.5 sprays. 5AM
Morning: 2 Sprays. 9AM
Afternoon: 2 Sprays. 1PM
After Shower: 2 Sprays. 5PM

I chose 5PM as the last because the stuff kind of hypes you up.

 

[sugashane]

you can run the m5aa that long...8 weeks?

 

[candle25]

I'm not sure how long others are running it. I just used it because I had it.

 

[propho]

ya m5aa a lot of people take preworkout since i've heard it's half-life is very short.. effects last only like 1 hour..

 

[sugashane]

ya m5aa a lot of people take preworkout since i've heard it's half-life is very short.. effects last only like 1 hour..

so I shouldnt take it on days I dont work out, and how long before I work out? a half hour maybe, and all 30mg at once?

 

[candle25]

so I shouldnt take it on days I dont work out, and how long before I work out? a half hour maybe, and all 30mg at once?

30min-1hr before wo is good. Start out at 30mg and go up if you don't feel it working.

 

[sugashane]

30min-1hr before wo is good. Start out at 30mg and go up if you don't feel it working.

how high can I go up? I thought anymore than 30mg was a no-no.

 

[candle25]

Well what I have seen is that either it is simmilar to creatine where some people are responsive to it and others aren't, or the dose needs to be raised for people with more body weight. I had a few people test it for me. Subject 1 was 190lbs and 20yrs old. At 30mg he hardly felt anything (although I think he was expecting too much). Subject 2 was 230lbs and 39yrs old. He said that he could tell a difference at 30mg but raised it to 40mg and got better results. I personaly went with 30mg, but I only weigh 180lbs. Sledge would be a good person to talk to about this. Try PMing him or search to se what you can find on the topic. The aformentioned testes were just something that I did.

 

[Manu20]

You ran the M5aa during pct...did that not affect your recovery at all?

 

[propho]

that's what I was wondering.. well when I think about it isn't M5AA a precursor to DHT? and not anything that would effect testosterone levels? I don't see why it couldn't be run through pct.. but I am probably wrong.. I think I asked this before..

as for me taking 40mgs it's only because the caps are 20mgs a piece.. 30 would likely do it for me =P but the bottle does state do not take more than 40mgs a day.. so i'm still following instructions =P

 

[candle25]

As far as I could tell the m5aa had no effect on my recovory. I was taking alot of nolva though. I had no blood work done so anyhting I could contribute regarding m5aa & PCT would be purely opinion. If it had any effect it wasn't noticable.

 

[Cuffs]

Hey Candle, good job on the cut in body fat. From 16% down to the single digits! That's my goal either by mid-summer, or next year. I just need to decide what I want.

 

[candle25]

Thanks bro. Cutting is the easy part of bodybuilding for me. It is bulking that is difficult. I'm really fighting genetics to be bigger. Now that I have a better understanding of diet and the biochemical functions of the body I think I'll see much better progress.