furuza/m14add recomp

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    furuza/m14add recomp


    i started a recomp plan on wednesday of this week. the total layout of the plan is:
    furuza 200/200/250/250/300/300/300
    m14add 0/0/90/90/90/120/120

    pct:
    cycle support
    pct assist
    clomid (usp grade, not research chem) 75/50/50/25
    inhibit-e 2 caps / 2 caps / 1 cap / 1 cap
    reduce-xt 3 caps / 3 caps / 3 caps / 3 caps
    creatine, stims, NO product as needed

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    BASELINE:
    i'm starting out at somewhere between 10 and 12 percent body fat. i'm a former nacional class sprinter who still works out at the track 2-3x/week to stay in shape.
    my goal is to use this cycle as a recomp; i'm going to eat about 500 calories over maintenance on weight days, at maintenance level on track days, and 500 calories under maintenance on rest days.

    DIET:
    i'm currently eating a diet that has the following features:
    * complete separation of fat + carbs
    * partial separation of protein + carbs
    * carbs before and after workouts
    * morning carbs the day after weight workouts
    * no other carbs
    * at least 200g protein/day

    this diet may seem insane, but it got me down to about 6-7% body fat earlier in life.
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    1st two days report

    wednesday
    WEIGHT / BLOATING: i noticed no changes. i didn't weigh myself.
    WORKOUT: i did a track workout, 4 x 200m @ 24-25 sec pace, 4 x 150m @ 17-18 sec pace, with slow jogging in between. this workout felt normal, although i was running out of breath a little earlier than normal.
    when i've run previous cycles i haven't had as much speed endurance; i will keep an eye on this.
    FLEXIBILITY: i don't notice a change yet. i'm stretching for 15 extra minutes a day on furuza, and will stretch for 30 extra minutes a day once the m14add starts (week 3), in order to prevent tightness and injury.
    ALERTNESS: no changes.
    CRAMPS / JOINT PAIN: none.

    thursday
    WEIGHT / BLOATING: i seemed a little more "wet" than usual early in the day, but it went away later in the day. i don't think anything in my diet caused this (i don't recall eating anything salty). hmm.
    WORKOUT: i went to the gym and did the following:
    incline press 13x60kg, 10x65kg, 7x70kg, 8x60kg. (these are weak because i had shoulder surgery last year)
    arm curls lying facedown on an incline bench, 8x35kg, 8x35kg, 7x35kg
    decline press 13x100kg, 10x110kg, 8x120kg, 8x100kg
    hammer curls, two sets of 10x15kg/hand, two sets of 10x12,5kg/hand
    closed hand pushups, 2 sets of 30, 1 set of 25, 1 set to failure (i lost count, somewhere in the high 20s)
    forearm curls with dumbbells, 2 sets of 10x17,5kg/hand, 2 sets of 10x15kg/hand
    yes, i do more weight on forearm curls than on bicep curls. this is weird, no?
    FLEXIBILITY: not really an issue with this workout. i did 15 minutes extra stretching.
    ALERTNESS: no change in sleepiness. i felt an extra surge of aggression and focus in the gym.
    CRAMPS / JOINT PAIN: none.
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    Good luck ~ I'll be following your progress

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    friday:

    WEIGHT / BLOATING: no significant changes. looked a little bloated / deflated muscles after my first meal (0 carbs), but looked normal again a little bit after eating pre-workout carbs.

    WORKOUT:
    light day
    * abs -- circuit with decreasing intensity and increasing volume, 12 sets total
    --- 3 sets 8-12 reps of straight leg raises with 5-10kg dumbbell between the legs
    --- 3 sets windshield washers with 2kg dumbbell between the legs, 6-8 reps per side
    --- 2 sets of ... i don't know what it's called, the exercise where you lie on your back and then do a sit-up with your upper body while bringing the legs in so that the feet move horizontally close to the floor (heels consistently 3-5cm off the ground). 20 reps each, 5kg dumbbell between feet.
    --- 2 sets of body curls on pull up bar, bodyweight only, 12 reps
    --- 2 sets of bicycles, 25 reps per side.
    * rotator cuff exercises with 8-10kgs per side, 6 sets of 12-15 reps.

    FLEXIBILITY:
    20 minutes of stretching before and after workout. i felt tighter than usual, but this is probably not the furuza, it's probably the fact that i was sitting around for most of the day before doing the workout.

    ALERTNESS:
    i had an irresistible urge to take a nap at around midnight (which corresponds to about 5-6pm on a normal schedule -- i'm an evening shifter who sleeps from about 6a-1p on most days). i took about a one-hour nap.
    alertness for the rest of the day was good.

    the furuza seems to be giving me extra aggression, but only after i initially get going. i don't feel like i'm on edge the whole day, but once i get started (either in the gym or in the bed) there's definitely some extra energy there.

    i feel a little more irritable than normal.

    CRAMPS / JOINT PAIN: none. i'm taking 1g of taurine a day to ward off this complication.

    LIBIDO:
    the furuza is definitely increasing libido, especially later at night.
    wife and i are not slouches -- we usually manage to knock it out at least twice a day, even though we have little ones -- but it's been extra awesome lately. we went at it 4 separate times on fri, i was hitting it so hard that i actually drew a little bit of blood the last couple of times.
    both of those times (a) i thought i was spent for the day and (b) i was concentrating on these damned tax returns, but she started prancing around the house in stripper heels and a little miniskirt and ... it was on.

    the furuza is having the same effect sexually as it is having in the gym, namely, i'm a little slower to get going but the extra aggression is phenomenal once things get in gear.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    friday:

    WEIGHT / BLOATING: no significant changes. looked a little bloated / deflated muscles after my first meal (0 carbs), but looked normal again a little bit after eating pre-workout carbs.

    WORKOUT:
    light day
    * abs -- circuit with decreasing intensity and increasing volume, 12 sets total
    --- 3 sets 8-12 reps of straight leg raises with 5-10kg dumbbell between the legs
    --- 3 sets windshield washers with 2kg dumbbell between the legs, 6-8 reps per side
    --- 2 sets of ... i don't know what it's called, the exercise where you lie on your back and then do a sit-up with your upper body while bringing the legs in so that the feet move horizontally close to the floor (heels consistently 3-5cm off the ground). 20 reps each, 5kg dumbbell between feet.
    --- 2 sets of body curls on pull up bar, bodyweight only, 12 reps
    --- 2 sets of bicycles, 25 reps per side.
    * rotator cuff exercises with 8-10kgs per side, 6 sets of 12-15 reps.

    FLEXIBILITY:
    20 minutes of stretching before and after workout. i felt tighter than usual, but this is probably not the furuza, it's probably the fact that i was sitting around for most of the day before doing the workout.

    ALERTNESS:
    i had an irresistible urge to take a nap at around midnight (which corresponds to about 5-6pm on a normal schedule -- i'm an evening shifter who sleeps from about 6a-1p on most days). i took about a one-hour nap.
    alertness for the rest of the day was good.

    the furuza seems to be giving me extra aggression, but only after i initially get going. i don't feel like i'm on edge the whole day, but once i get started (either in the gym or in the bed) there's definitely some extra energy there.

    i feel a little more irritable than normal.

    CRAMPS / JOINT PAIN: none. i'm taking 1g of taurine a day to ward off this complication.

    LIBIDO:
    the furuza is definitely increasing libido, especially later at night.
    wife and i are not slouches -- we usually manage to knock it out at least twice a day, even though we have little ones -- but it's been extra awesome lately. we went at it 4 separate times on fri, i was hitting it so hard that i actually drew a little bit of blood the last couple of times.
    both of those times (a) i thought i was spent for the day and (b) i was concentrating on these damned tax returns, but she started prancing around the house in stripper heels and a little miniskirt and ... it was on.

    the furuza is having the same effect sexually as it is having in the gym, namely, i'm a little slower to get going but the extra aggression is phenomenal once things get in gear.
    Looks like aggression is starting to become noticeable. Libido protection/increase seems to be a major component of m14add, as you can see from suresha's log.
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    sat/sun/mon:

    WEIGHT / BLOATING:
    i'm about 2kgs heavier than i was last week, despite no increase in overall calories. therefore, i conclude that the furuza is making me gain water weight.
    this seems unusual -- i thought that furuza had a reputation as a dry-out compound? this is part of the reason i'm stacking it with the m14, actually. reps please comment, thx.
    it's possible that i just ate saltier food than normal, although i don't think that is the case; my diet stays remarkably constant from day to day, and i didn't have any cheat days this weekend.

    WORKOUT:
    sat:
    gym -- back and tri's
    * 3 sets barbell bench rows, 8-11 reps x 80kg, 90kg, 80kg.
    * 3 sets dips, 10 x BW+10kg, 14 x BW, 11 x BW. (dips are still suffering somewhat from my shoulder surgery last year)
    * 3 sets pullups, 12 x BW+10kg, 13 x BW, 11 x BW
    * 3 sets tricep pushdowns on universal machine, 11 x 70kg, 11 x 80kg, 9 x 80kg
    * 3 sets one-handed dumbbell rows, 8-10 reps x 30-40kg/hand
    * pushups, 2 x 30 closed fist, 2 x 25 wide grip open handed.

    sun:
    track day
    2 x 400m 56-57sec, walk 200m, jog 200m
    2 x 400m running forward on curves / backward on straights**
    5 x 25 steps, two-legged bounds up stadium stairs
    **sweet mother of god this hurt afterward, I had a hard time standing up to go #1 because my legs were shaking so hard i almost couldn't aim |:

    mon:
    gym -- chest and biceps. similar to previously posted workout, details if anyone wants to see them.

    FLEXIBILITY:
    20 minutes of stretching before and after workouts

    ALERTNESS:
    again i had a weirdly strong urge to take a nap in the middle of my day. i gave in to this urge on monday; on sunday i fought it off by doing the track workout at that exact time.

    CRAMPS / JOINT PAIN:
    i'm experiencing back pump in one very specific place, my lower right trap muscle. it is most crampy when i first get up from sitting/lying down, and it also cramps when i'm leaning over to stretch hamstrings.

    LIBIDO:
    furuza is making my erections unbelievably rock hard. so hard that when i'm tired it almost feels like i'm fxxxing wifey with someone else's rod. hehe
    on saturday wifey asked me if i was sneaking viagra, and, when i said no, she wondered whether i was also starting to fxxx some other woman and that's why i'm so hard for over an hour at a time lately.
    needless to say i'm not getting a lot of work done these days

    Libido protection/increase seems to be a major component of m14add, as you can see from suresha's log.
    just to make sure we're on the same page, i don't start m14 for another week or so.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    sat/sun/mon:

    WEIGHT / BLOATING:
    i'm about 2kgs heavier than i was last week, despite no increase in overall calories. therefore, i conclude that the furuza is making me gain water weight.
    this seems unusual -- i thought that furuza had a reputation as a dry-out compound? this is part of the reason i'm stacking it with the m14, actually. reps please comment, thx.
    it's possible that i just ate saltier food than normal, although i don't think that is the case; my diet stays remarkably constant from day to day, and i didn't have any cheat days this weekend.

    WORKOUT:
    sat:
    gym -- back and tri's
    * 3 sets barbell bench rows, 8-11 reps x 80kg, 90kg, 80kg.
    * 3 sets dips, 10 x BW+10kg, 14 x BW, 11 x BW. (dips are still suffering somewhat from my shoulder surgery last year)
    * 3 sets pullups, 12 x BW+10kg, 13 x BW, 11 x BW
    * 3 sets tricep pushdowns on universal machine, 11 x 70kg, 11 x 80kg, 9 x 80kg
    * 3 sets one-handed dumbbell rows, 8-10 reps x 30-40kg/hand
    * pushups, 2 x 30 closed fist, 2 x 25 wide grip open handed.

    sun:
    track day
    2 x 400m 56-57sec, walk 200m, jog 200m
    2 x 400m running forward on curves / backward on straights**
    5 x 25 steps, two-legged bounds up stadium stairs
    **sweet mother of god this hurt afterward, I had a hard time standing up to go #1 because my legs were shaking so hard i almost couldn't aim |:

    mon:
    gym -- chest and biceps. similar to previously posted workout, details if anyone wants to see them.

    FLEXIBILITY:
    20 minutes of stretching before and after workouts

    ALERTNESS:
    again i had a weirdly strong urge to take a nap in the middle of my day. i gave in to this urge on monday; on sunday i fought it off by doing the track workout at that exact time.

    CRAMPS / JOINT PAIN:
    i'm experiencing back pump in one very specific place, my lower right trap muscle. it is most crampy when i first get up from sitting/lying down, and it also cramps when i'm leaning over to stretch hamstrings.

    LIBIDO:
    furuza is making my erections unbelievably rock hard. so hard that when i'm tired it almost feels like i'm fxxxing wifey with someone else's rod. hehe
    on saturday wifey asked me if i was sneaking viagra, and, when i said no, she wondered whether i was also starting to fxxx some other woman and that's why i'm so hard for over an hour at a time lately.
    needless to say i'm not getting a lot of work done these days
    Good stuff.

    just to make sure we're on the same page, i don't start m14 for another week or so.
    Well at least you know what to expect lol.
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    bry & mw1, what are your thoughts on this (presumably water) weight gain?

    again, i had thought of furuza as a "dry" compound -- in fact, many others have used it in order to dry out the gains from other, wetter compounds. so i'm surprised at having gained 2kgs in less than a week on it (again, i'm not eating a bulking diet).

    thanks.
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    maybe add some formestane?
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    formestane ... hmm

    i do have it on hand, although i understood it to be for counter-acting more severe estrogenic sides.
    it's an idea; let's see what the reps have to say about this one.

    i have not gained any more weight in the last 2-3 days, but i am still about 2kgs over my pre-cycle weight. this is not having any noticeable effects other than to slow down my running just a little (about 1 sec/200m), which is not a big deal since i am not running in any competitions.

    my joints actually feel *better* so far, which from what i understand is not expected to happen on a cycle of any aas.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    bry & mw1, what are your thoughts on this (presumably water) weight gain?

    again, i had thought of furuza as a "dry" compound -- in fact, many others have used it in order to dry out the gains from other, wetter compounds. so i'm surprised at having gained 2kgs in less than a week on it (again, i'm not eating a bulking diet).

    thanks.
    A lot of dry compounds will give water weight. Dry does not have to do with water. It has to do with estrogen, presumably. M-drol, for example, is dry but water weight is quite evident.
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    hmmm ok. i had previously thought that dry meant... well ... dry. heh
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bry17 View Post
    A lot of dry compounds will give water weight. Dry does not have to do with water. It has to do with estrogen, presumably. M-drol, for example, is dry but water weight is quite evident.
    less estrogen=less water though
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    nice man im subbed

    im doing pmag 50/75/75/75/100/100
    Furuza 200/250/300/300/350/350

    on a lean bulk.

    do you think my furuza doses are high? i feel ya on the rock hard wood man, i get sooo horney at night
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    Quote Originally Posted by warbird01 View Post
    less estrogen=less water though
    Eh idk, it's more complicated than we make it. Intracellular water weight and Estrogen 'water weight' are different.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bry17 View Post
    Eh idk, it's more complicated than we make it. Intracellular water weight and Estrogen 'water weight' are different.
    ^Realize by different I mean lots of hormones control water weight, so a rise in aldosterone could contribute as much as estrogen, but you wouldn't notice feminine characteristics of the face and such. They both lead to increased cellular fluid though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bry17 View Post
    Eh idk, it's more complicated than we make it. Intracellular water weight and Estrogen 'water weight' are different.
    cant think of any "dry" compound that doesnt make you dry...you are making it way more complicated than it has to be lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by warbird01 View Post
    cant think of any "dry" compound that doesnt make you dry...you are making it way more complicated than it has to be lol
    Yeah, but my point was 'dry' compounds can still add water weight. Water weight from dbol would probably look different than water weight from m-drol. Dbol is wet, mdrol is dry, generally speaking. See my point?
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    will post more later -- here's the basic information from the last few days:
    * no more weight gain -- still sticking at about 2kgs over my previous weight (it has now been about 10 days)
    * back pumps have disappeared. they didn't even come back when i went for a weekend road trip without my taurine
    * strength seems to have increased a little bit
    * muscles are a little tighter -- even with extra stretching my stride length on the track is about 2% shorter (as measured by total number of steps per 100m)
    * water weight has dropped off somewhat, definition has increased. i am very happy with the furuza so far.

    starting the m14add component in three days, looking forward to it. will log in more detail when that starts, i've been very busy.

    speaking of very busy, sex has also been amazing on the furuza -- it's as if the compound were actually "furuza/viagra combo" lol.
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    Glad to hear its going well for you

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    here are some updates -- i'm now midway through the first week of both compounds (week #3 -- currently dosing at 250 furuza / 90 m14add).

    LETHARGY:
    i'm a little more tired on average. it's nothing debilitating -- certainly notihng by comparison to p-plex, which had me wanting to sleep almost 9 hours a day compared to my normal 6-7.
    basically, i've been getting an almost uncontrollable urge to take naps in my equivalent of the early evening. fortunately, my schedule allows for this most of the time, so i've been dozing off for about 1-1.5 hours about four to six hours before normal bedtime.

    STRENGTH:
    i've started to pick up strength in the lifts, i'm up about 5 to 10kgs on most lifts involving weights. bodyweight exercises i haven't gained many reps, but this is understandable because i'm still at a weight 2-3kgs over baseline. so far i haven't put on any additional water weight with the m14add, which is surprising because that compound seems to have a reputation as a water weight gainer.

    RUNNING:
    i'm not running time trials, or anything close to 100%, so it's hard to say definitively. but my repeat 200s are about 0.5-1 second slower than usual, and my repeat 400s are about 1-1.5 seconds slower than usual, probably because of the 2-3kg of extra bodyweight.

    AGGRESSION:
    i actually feel more laid back than usual on average, but my libido (and temper/anger) flare up more easily as well. so, in summary, i'm less "fired up" than usual, but once i get started -- whether that's in terms of workout, sex, or irritability -- i'm more extreme than usual.

    LIBIDO:
    see above -- i'm a bit slower to get in the mood, wifey has had to put on 7" heels and stripper outfits and prance around the house in her little seductive attempts. i'm thinking i'm going to train her to do this in general, haha.
    but once i'm started it's *on*. haha
    i have sported random erections an hour or two after taking the doses of furuza, this is significant because that's something that hasn't really happened much in the last fifteen years or so.

    BODY COMP:
    remember i'm not trying to gain much weight; i'm eating around maintenance on track days, 500kcal over maintenance on workout days, and 500kcal under maintenance on rest/light training days.
    i have not changed my body weight other than the initial 2kgs that i put on when i started the furuza two weeks ago, but visual inspection seems to indicate that i've lost about 1% body fat so far.

    SIDES:
    nothing dramatic.
    i've had erect nipples more than usual, and they are a more pink color (this is highly noticeable because i'm dark skinned). they are not accompanied by any puffyness or swelling.
    in response to this, i have started using 1/2 doses of formestane (2 squirts) daily. reps, thoughts?
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    here are some updates -- i'm now midway through the first week of both compounds (week #3 -- currently dosing at 250 furuza / 90 m14add).

    LETHARGY:
    i'm a little more tired on average. it's nothing debilitating -- certainly notihng by comparison to p-plex, which had me wanting to sleep almost 9 hours a day compared to my normal 6-7.
    basically, i've been getting an almost uncontrollable urge to take naps in my equivalent of the early evening. fortunately, my schedule allows for this most of the time, so i've been dozing off for about 1-1.5 hours about four to six hours before normal bedtime.

    STRENGTH:
    i've started to pick up strength in the lifts, i'm up about 5 to 10kgs on most lifts involving weights. bodyweight exercises i haven't gained many reps, but this is understandable because i'm still at a weight 2-3kgs over baseline. so far i haven't put on any additional water weight with the m14add, which is surprising because that compound seems to have a reputation as a water weight gainer.

    RUNNING:
    i'm not running time trials, or anything close to 100%, so it's hard to say definitively. but my repeat 200s are about 0.5-1 second slower than usual, and my repeat 400s are about 1-1.5 seconds slower than usual, probably because of the 2-3kg of extra bodyweight.

    AGGRESSION:
    i actually feel more laid back than usual on average, but my libido (and temper/anger) flare up more easily as well. so, in summary, i'm less "fired up" than usual, but once i get started -- whether that's in terms of workout, sex, or irritability -- i'm more extreme than usual.

    LIBIDO:
    see above -- i'm a bit slower to get in the mood, wifey has had to put on 7" heels and stripper outfits and prance around the house in her little seductive attempts. i'm thinking i'm going to train her to do this in general, haha.
    but once i'm started it's *on*. haha
    i have sported random erections an hour or two after taking the doses of furuza, this is significant because that's something that hasn't really happened much in the last fifteen years or so.

    BODY COMP:
    remember i'm not trying to gain much weight; i'm eating around maintenance on track days, 500kcal over maintenance on workout days, and 500kcal under maintenance on rest/light training days.
    i have not changed my body weight other than the initial 2kgs that i put on when i started the furuza two weeks ago, but visual inspection seems to indicate that i've lost about 1% body fat so far.

    SIDES:
    nothing dramatic.
    i've had erect nipples more than usual, and they are a more pink color (this is highly noticeable because i'm dark skinned). they are not accompanied by any puffyness or swelling.
    in response to this, i have started using 1/2 doses of formestane (2 squirts) daily. reps, thoughts?
    Great update. My bodyweight lifts like pull-ups and dips don't rise until around the 4th week usually on most compounds. High dose furuza seems to be kicking ass for you.
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    it does seem to be helping,
    the confounding variable here is a slight amount of increased carbs. i'm still restricting carbs to 25g before workout + 50g morning after weights + 50-100g after workout, but i'm going closer to the 100g after workout since i've started the cycle.

    it's not a huge change, i'm probably only eating about 20 grams more than before the cycle -- so it's probably the furuza.
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    reps, any thoughts on the whole pink-ish nipples / formestane issue? (see end of last post)
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    reps, any thoughts on the whole pink-ish nipples / formestane issue? (see end of last post)
    I would wait a couple days and see how sensitive they are. If they hurt/sting when you touch them or throb every so often etc., then start applying it.
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    ok, so the nipple thing seems to be subsiding, but something a little more worrisome has cropped up:

    For the last 3 days, so that would be starting about 1.5 weeks into the m14add stage (3.5 weeks into the whole cycle), I've been waking up with a somewhat sharp cramping feeling under my ribcage. What worries me about this is that that's the exact location of the liver, and this is a cycle of orals. Might just be stomach cramps, of course -- but might also be something more insidious than that.

    here are some additional specifics:
    * when i have gotten up, used the restroom, and drink 24-32 ounces of water, it has largely subsided within 10-20 minutes.
    * i have been sick with a cold for the last 3-4 days, basically concurrent with this weird pain. i took advil one night and benadryl another night -- could those drugs mess with the liver, if taken in conjunction with orals?
    * i have had zero alcohol on cycle (in fact, zero alcohol in the last six months) .

    the napping urges have also continued. in combination with having a cold, they were irresistible -- i fell asleep in the middle of a theater show earlier tonight.

    on the other hand, strength gains have been phenomenal. bodyweight lifts are through the roof (i was able to do 22 pullups today, even though i was still getting over a cold), and other lift weights are up sharply, too.

    which of the following options would you go for, if you were me:
    1) discontinue the cycle, start PCT, and get a liver panel done immediately;
    2) continue the cycle but go get a liver panel (note that the results will take about a week to come back)
    3) continue the cycle without lab work, monitor the pain until i'm fully well again, and maybe just drink a ton of water + extra taurine in case it's actually random stomach cramping.

    thanks in advance
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    another update: i drank double my usual water intake over the last 24-36 hours, and there was no cramping / liver area pain in the morning. so perhaps this problem really was just weird right-side stomach cramping ... or maybe my liver was being taxed by insufficient water intake (i have a hard time consuming enough fluids when i have a cold -- i just don't have the urge to drink things).

    i drank enough water throughout the night that i got up 2x to go to the restroom, but it was worth it for the reassurance.

    i will still monitor these signs of pain closely, and report on any further issues. the rest of the cycle is phenomenal.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    ok, so the nipple thing seems to be subsiding, but something a little more worrisome has cropped up:

    For the last 3 days, so that would be starting about 1.5 weeks into the m14add stage (3.5 weeks into the whole cycle), I've been waking up with a somewhat sharp cramping feeling under my ribcage. What worries me about this is that that's the exact location of the liver, and this is a cycle of orals. Might just be stomach cramps, of course -- but might also be something more insidious than that.

    here are some additional specifics:
    * when i have gotten up, used the restroom, and drink 24-32 ounces of water, it has largely subsided within 10-20 minutes.
    * i have been sick with a cold for the last 3-4 days, basically concurrent with this weird pain. i took advil one night and benadryl another night -- could those drugs mess with the liver, if taken in conjunction with orals?
    * i have had zero alcohol on cycle (in fact, zero alcohol in the last six months) .

    the napping urges have also continued. in combination with having a cold, they were irresistible -- i fell asleep in the middle of a theater show earlier tonight.

    on the other hand, strength gains have been phenomenal. bodyweight lifts are through the roof (i was able to do 22 pullups today, even though i was still getting over a cold), and other lift weights are up sharply, too.

    which of the following options would you go for, if you were me:
    1) discontinue the cycle, start PCT, and get a liver panel done immediately;
    2) continue the cycle but go get a liver panel (note that the results will take about a week to come back)
    3) continue the cycle without lab work, monitor the pain until i'm fully well again, and maybe just drink a ton of water + extra taurine in case it's actually random stomach cramping.

    thanks in advance
    I would definitely do option 2.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    another update: i drank double my usual water intake over the last 24-36 hours, and there was no cramping / liver area pain in the morning. so perhaps this problem really was just weird right-side stomach cramping ... or maybe my liver was being taxed by insufficient water intake (i have a hard time consuming enough fluids when i have a cold -- i just don't have the urge to drink things).

    i drank enough water throughout the night that i got up 2x to go to the restroom, but it was worth it for the reassurance.

    i will still monitor these signs of pain closely, and report on any further issues. the rest of the cycle is phenomenal.
    The cramping may just be bloat in your stomach. I've had this at night when running cycles. It's not uncommon, from my exp.
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    ****, i just wrote an entire post and then lost it -- i'll be more brief this time.

    "The cramping may just be bloat in your stomach. I've had this at night when running cycles. It's not uncommon, from my exp"
    -->i'm quite sure this is not the case, as i palpated the liver (the liver is a very easy thing to palpate) and that reproduced the pain more or less instantly and specifically.
    moreover, the symptoms don't point to that -- remember that i was experiencing these symptoms when i was (a) short on overall water intake, (b) taking other liver-taxing drugs because i was sick, *and* (c) taking my last dose of the compound right before bedtime (i don't think i mentioned this last time).
    so, i'm virtually certain that this was genuine liver pain. my hypothesis is that it was caused by the combination of (a) overall dehydration -- i was only consuming about 3L of water per day when i was sick, versus a normal consumption of 5-6L per day and a consumption of up to 8-9L per day on cycle -- and (b) taking the last dose right before bedtime, in other words right before 7 hours of complete dehydration. basically, the combination of these two factors meant that i was taking an oral steroid under conditions of moderate to severe dehydration, so it's no surprise that my liver was hurting.
    to fix the problem, i made absolutely sure to drink at least 8L of water per day, and i've started dosing the compounds so that the last dose is at least 5 hours before bedtime. taking these two actions has completely made the pain disappear, so i'm about 99,9% sure that my original hypothesis was correct. nevertheless, i'm going to get into the labs tomorrow to get my liver panel done; i only have one liver, and i need it for carnaval... |:
    finally, the last piece of evidence that it was a liver dehydration issue and not a bloating issue is the fact that it would completely go away within about 10 minutes of my getting out of bed and drinking 1 to 1,5 L of water.

    --

    other updates:

    libido / aggression: the addition of m14 to the cycle has not altered these two things. i'm still having the erections of a teenager, and a very happy wife with lots of bruises on her ass and lots of ... soreness.

    training: my lifts have gone up by about 10-15%; i'll post more details about these later. in terms of bodyweight lifts, the total load that i can handle per set has increased by about 20%.

    weight: i have put on another 1,5 to 2kgs since starting the m14add component of the cycle two weeks ago. as i have not increased calories or carbohydrates (and was sick for 3-4 days), i must attribute this weight gain to water weight.

    i aggravated a previously pulled hamstring during my most recent track workout, so i'm going to lay off the track for a week. as a result, i'm going to add in one more weight workout, for a total of 4 weight workouts in the next seven days; on the days off, i'm going to stretch and rehabilitate the hamstring, and also do rehabilitation exercises for my rotator cuff.

    sleepiness:
    with the addition of m14add my urge to take naps in the evening has become almost irresistible. however, my wife has been happy to take care of the whole household while i've been sleeping, and then, after the kids have gone to bed, she's been prancing around the house in slutty clothes to try to squeeze one more session of action out of me.
    hey look -- lots of aggressive sex, i'm sleeping all the time while my wife takes care of everything around the house, and then she's constantly dressing up trying to get even more sex out of me ... maybe you guys went wrong trying to market these things as muscle and strength boosters? you should have advertised them as marriage boosters instead.
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    Its the Furuza man. I am so tired all the time on P-mag and Furuza and i am taking naps like no other. cant stay awake during anything anymore. still worth it IMO. I however did not totally get off stims during my cycle because of it but Blood pressure feels fine.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    ****, i just wrote an entire post and then lost it -- i'll be more brief this time.

    "The cramping may just be bloat in your stomach. I've had this at night when running cycles. It's not uncommon, from my exp"
    -->i'm quite sure this is not the case, as i palpated the liver (the liver is a very easy thing to palpate) and that reproduced the pain more or less instantly and specifically.
    moreover, the symptoms don't point to that -- remember that i was experiencing these symptoms when i was (a) short on overall water intake, (b) taking other liver-taxing drugs because i was sick, *and* (c) taking my last dose of the compound right before bedtime (i don't think i mentioned this last time).
    so, i'm virtually certain that this was genuine liver pain. my hypothesis is that it was caused by the combination of (a) overall dehydration -- i was only consuming about 3L of water per day when i was sick, versus a normal consumption of 5-6L per day and a consumption of up to 8-9L per day on cycle -- and (b) taking the last dose right before bedtime, in other words right before 7 hours of complete dehydration. basically, the combination of these two factors meant that i was taking an oral steroid under conditions of moderate to severe dehydration, so it's no surprise that my liver was hurting.
    to fix the problem, i made absolutely sure to drink at least 8L of water per day, and i've started dosing the compounds so that the last dose is at least 5 hours before bedtime. taking these two actions has completely made the pain disappear, so i'm about 99,9% sure that my original hypothesis was correct. nevertheless, i'm going to get into the labs tomorrow to get my liver panel done; i only have one liver, and i need it for carnaval... |:
    finally, the last piece of evidence that it was a liver dehydration issue and not a bloating issue is the fact that it would completely go away within about 10 minutes of my getting out of bed and drinking 1 to 1,5 L of water.

    --

    other updates:

    libido / aggression: the addition of m14 to the cycle has not altered these two things. i'm still having the erections of a teenager, and a very happy wife with lots of bruises on her ass and lots of ... soreness.

    training: my lifts have gone up by about 10-15%; i'll post more details about these later. in terms of bodyweight lifts, the total load that i can handle per set has increased by about 20%.

    weight: i have put on another 1,5 to 2kgs since starting the m14add component of the cycle two weeks ago. as i have not increased calories or carbohydrates (and was sick for 3-4 days), i must attribute this weight gain to water weight.

    i aggravated a previously pulled hamstring during my most recent track workout, so i'm going to lay off the track for a week. as a result, i'm going to add in one more weight workout, for a total of 4 weight workouts in the next seven days; on the days off, i'm going to stretch and rehabilitate the hamstring, and also do rehabilitation exercises for my rotator cuff.

    sleepiness:
    with the addition of m14add my urge to take naps in the evening has become almost irresistible. however, my wife has been happy to take care of the whole household while i've been sleeping, and then, after the kids have gone to bed, she's been prancing around the house in slutty clothes to try to squeeze one more session of action out of me.
    hey look -- lots of aggressive sex, i'm sleeping all the time while my wife takes care of everything around the house, and then she's constantly dressing up trying to get even more sex out of me ... maybe you guys went wrong trying to market these things as muscle and strength boosters? you should have advertised them as marriage boosters instead.
    I would not take your last dose before bedtime. Not on any cycle. I would get the liver panel done as well. Good to hear the cycle is showing results.
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    good news, i got my liver panel results back and they were pretty much normal. i had somewhat elevated bilirubin levels, but that has occurred earlier in my life at various points so may just be an indicator of something more inherent.
    i just recently stepped the m14add up to 120 (we're entering the tail end of the cycle here). overall the cycle has been a smashing success: lifts up 15%, bodyweight lifts up as much as 25% reps. i've even managed to make good further progress with a longstanding shoulder/rotator cuff injury (mentioned earlier in the thread)

    BACK PUMPS
    i've started to experience these in the last week or two ... baaaaadd
    i've been doing heavier abs than usual (including straight leg raises with motorcycle boots that weigh 2kgs each + additional 2kg ankle weights), so i suppose i'm asking for it along with the cycle.
    i've been taking 1000-1500 of taurine daily to deal with this, but the back pumps have still been rather severe, especially when i'm sitting. (luckily i don't normally sit at work.)

    what else would you all do for the pumps?
    more taurine?
    should taurine be taken between meals or with meals?
    any other anti-back-pump wonder drugs?

    --

    i've also been taking water like it's cancer medicine (7-8L per day!) and this has pretty much caused the other nagging stuff to cease completely.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eluruguayo View Post
    good news, i got my liver panel results back and they were pretty much normal. i had somewhat elevated bilirubin levels, but that has occurred earlier in my life at various points so may just be an indicator of something more inherent.
    i just recently stepped the m14add up to 120 (we're entering the tail end of the cycle here). overall the cycle has been a smashing success: lifts up 15%, bodyweight lifts up as much as 25% reps. i've even managed to make good further progress with a longstanding shoulder/rotator cuff injury (mentioned earlier in the thread)

    BACK PUMPS
    i've started to experience these in the last week or two ... baaaaadd
    i've been doing heavier abs than usual (including straight leg raises with motorcycle boots that weigh 2kgs each + additional 2kg ankle weights), so i suppose i'm asking for it along with the cycle.
    i've been taking 1000-1500 of taurine daily to deal with this, but the back pumps have still been rather severe, especially when i'm sitting. (luckily i don't normally sit at work.)

    what else would you all do for the pumps?
    more taurine?
    should taurine be taken between meals or with meals?
    any other anti-back-pump wonder drugs?

    --

    i've also been taking water like it's cancer medicine (7-8L per day!) and this has pretty much caused the other nagging stuff to cease completely.
    From some of the m14 bloodworks i've seen, it seems to be fairly easy on the liver. Interesting. Taurine is good to take to combat back pumps. Lots of foods high in potassium as well.
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    Also, if you're liking formestane, I would check it out at Nutra. Likely the lowest price you'll see on it.
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    You need to get your taurine dosage up to 5g a day to stop the back pumps

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    I have ordered a couple of extra formestane's, thank you for the tip.

    5g a day of taurine! That's 10 pills -- how would you space that out? I will assume that I am not supposed to take 10 pills all at once.
    So far I have not been going over 1,5g (3 pills), a dose that has had moderate relief effects. (I have also been avoiding advil and other NSAID's completely, as I figure that the cycle is already taxing my liver enough as it is.)
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