advice on clean bulk plan

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    advice on clean bulk plan


    advice on clean bulk plan
    This is my first venture into what is less "working out" and more so "body science" and I'm feeling a little overwhelmed with info. I just got done losing a little over 70lbs and now I'm looking to do a relatively clean bulk for the next couple of months at least and I just want to see if you guys think I'm on the right track so far.

    Stats:

    Age: 27
    Weight: 166 (~10%BF)
    Height: 5' 10"
    Goal (for now): 180lbs ~10%BF

    Current maintenance calories: 2200 (was thinking 2550 to start for bulking)

    Thinking ratio of 40-35-25 (C-P-F) to start out. (255g Carb - 223g Pro - 71g Fat)
    All calories burned by exercise are replaced within macros (as opposed to just adding carbs)

    Main calorie sources:

    Carbs: Oats, wheat bread, fruits and veggies
    Protein: chicken and fish mostly, some lean beef, pork, and occasional venison
    Fat: nuts, peanut butter, olive oil, other healthy fats
    Supplements: whey protein, casein protein, multis and seperate B complex, C, and trying out MusclePharm Assault pre-workout

    Workout schedule:

    Lifting: Monday (legs), tuesday (arms and chest), thursday (arms and back), saturday (arms and chest)
    Cardio: Wednesday (moderate 30-40mins), thursday (light/moderate 30-40mins), friday (moderate 30-40mins), saturday (light/moderate 30-40mins)



    Few ?s:

    1) Opinion on cardio after weights? I want to minimize my fat gain as much as possible!
    2) Just started on bulking diet a couple of days ago and looking a little bloated (definition reduced somewhat), I'm wondering if this is normal when you come off a cut?
    3) How long should I wait to judge whether these macros/calorie levels should be adjusted? I was thinking 2-3 weeks or so...

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    I'm only familiar with 1-2 but first off, cardio is going to significantly effect how much you gain. Your gonna have to realize that while gaining weight, your gonna get a little more fat and lessen definition. Now, its winter time so who gives a ****? When you go to cut again, you will look significantly bigger. You can't gain size and tone, unless your on the ****, sorry my friend. Happy bulking. Worry about the abs in may, hulk up everywhere!
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    I guess I can't have everything! Maybe ill reduce the cardio a little..
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    Why you over training your arms so much bro
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    the "arms and back" just refers to the secondary arm workout from most of the compound exercises done for the back. Anyhow, this is my first real go at trying to bulk up and my bis leave a lot to be desired. lol

    Any suggestions on my lifting schedule would be appreciated!
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    I personally think that going up from 2200 cals to only 2550 isn't sufficient enough. You need to get that intake up closer to 3000 or even more. If your worried about putting on fat, your bulk is going to be a long one. Putting on some fat isn't going to hurt anything. Just make sure you keep in it check and come summer time, you call peel that back off with a cut.

    Quote Originally Posted by cswalczakny View Post
    advice on clean bulk plan
    This is my first venture into what is less "working out" and more so "body science" and I'm feeling a little overwhelmed with info. I just got done losing a little over 70lbs and now I'm looking to do a relatively clean bulk for the next couple of months at least and I just want to see if you guys think I'm on the right track so far.

    Stats:

    Age: 27
    Weight: 166 (~10%BF)
    Height: 5' 10"
    Goal (for now): 180lbs ~10%BF

    Current maintenance calories: 2200 (was thinking 2550 to start for bulking)

    Thinking ratio of 40-35-25 (C-P-F) to start out. (255g Carb - 223g Pro - 71g Fat)
    All calories burned by exercise are replaced within macros (as opposed to just adding carbs)

    Main calorie sources:

    Carbs: Oats, wheat bread, fruits and veggies
    Protein: chicken and fish mostly, some lean beef, pork, and occasional venison
    Fat: nuts, peanut butter, olive oil, other healthy fats
    Supplements: whey protein, casein protein, multis and seperate B complex, C, and trying out MusclePharm Assault pre-workout

    Workout schedule:

    Lifting: Monday (legs), tuesday (arms and chest), thursday (arms and back), saturday (arms and chest)
    Cardio: Wednesday (moderate 30-40mins), thursday (light/moderate 30-40mins), friday (moderate 30-40mins), saturday (light/moderate 30-40mins)



    Few ?s:

    1) Opinion on cardio after weights? I want to minimize my fat gain as much as possible!
    2) Just started on bulking diet a couple of days ago and looking a little bloated (definition reduced somewhat), I'm wondering if this is normal when you come off a cut?
    3) How long should I wait to judge whether these macros/calorie levels should be adjusted? I was thinking 2-3 weeks or so...
    I also think that you aren't going to be able to put on 14lbs of lean muscle in the next couple of months. That's just not really realistic naturally in that quick of time. Going up 14lbs with gaining no bodyfat takes a long time man. I personally don't do cardio on my bulk, but someone else might have a better opinion on that. I would adjust your macros after a week or two. Play around with your macros and see what's working. I personally go up at least 1000 cals over my maintenance on a bulk but putting on some fat doesn't bother me because I don't have much trouble getting it back off.
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    If I don't start putting on some mass in a couple weeks I'll def up the cals. My goal of 14lb lbm gain is for the year! Lol would be awesome to do that in a few months, right? I appreciate the info. I think I'm going to cut cardio to 2x per week after hearing what u guys have told me so far.
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    if you want to "bulk" i think that by NOT increasing your cals to around 3000 earlier than in an few weeks will be pointless and somewhat frustrating once you realize that "a few weeks" were kinda wasted....ive ran your TDEE a few different ways and 3000-3300 is the outcome almost every time. despite what some believe, i think the bulking phase is more crucial to maximize the outcome of your body comp and alot under count cals and wonder why they dont gain mass........just my opinion
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    When u figure it as tdee I'm def around 3k cals, my net cals are at 2550. Wondering if I should eat the same on rest days too...?
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    always use your tdee to obtain your caloric needs...eatn the same on off days is up to you, the only difference really should be your post workout shake, on non training days you obviously wont have one....
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    Quote Originally Posted by cswalczakny
    advice on clean bulk plan
    This is my first venture into what is less "working out" and more so "body science" and I'm feeling a little overwhelmed with info. I just got done losing a little over 70lbs and now I'm looking to do a relatively clean bulk for the next couple of months at least and I just want to see if you guys think I'm on the right track so far.

    Stats:

    Age: 27
    Weight: 166 (~10%BF)
    Height: 5' 10"
    Goal (for now): 180lbs ~10%BF

    Current maintenance calories: 2200 (was thinking 2550 to start for bulking)

    Thinking ratio of 40-35-25 (C-P-F) to start out. (255g Carb - 223g Pro - 71g Fat)
    All calories burned by exercise are replaced within macros (as opposed to just adding carbs)

    Main calorie sources:

    Carbs: Oats, wheat bread, fruits and veggies
    Protein: chicken and fish mostly, some lean beef, pork, and occasional venison
    Fat: nuts, peanut butter, olive oil, other healthy fats
    Supplements: whey protein, casein protein, multis and seperate B complex, C, and trying out MusclePharm Assault pre-workout

    Workout schedule:

    Lifting: Monday (legs), tuesday (arms and chest), thursday (arms and back), saturday (arms and chest)
    Cardio: Wednesday (moderate 30-40mins), thursday (light/moderate 30-40mins), friday (moderate 30-40mins), saturday (light/moderate 30-40mins)

    Few ?s:

    1) Opinion on cardio after weights? I want to minimize my fat gain as much as possible!
    2) Just started on bulking diet a couple of days ago and looking a little bloated (definition reduced somewhat), I'm wondering if this is normal when you come off a cut?
    3) How long should I wait to judge whether these macros/calorie levels should be adjusted? I was thinking 2-3 weeks or so...
    Lose the wheat bread, that's why your feeling bloated. Wheat bread is a manufactured bread which is not easily digested. Stick with potatoes, oats and brown rice.
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    If it doesn't cut it out by the end of the week, I guess I'll go w/ Chicken and rice instead of my beloved chicken sandwiches.
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    Or just get eziekel bread, also way to much arm work. also way to much anterior work, there should an equal balance between posterior and anterior work to avoid future injuries. This is assuming you dont have any huge imbalances already. Equal quad to hamstring work also. Alot of cardio, dont need it just control your diet. Also add some coconut oil or other sat fats in your diet to maintain ur hormones ect.
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    Just weighed in and I dropped a pound (probably water) since a couple days ago but I'm back to exactly the same weight I was a week ago when I started my bulk diet. I'm now upping my daily cals to minimum of 3100 on lifting days.

    Also, dumping the wheat bread in favor of quinoa as of today. Hopefully that keeps the bloat down.

    Sweetlou - I'll make sure to keep my leg days more well-rounded. They're just not as much fun as upper body! Changed routine to only 1 day of concentrated arms since most of the compound chest/back/shoulder lifts work arms too.

    Also reducing cardio to 30 mins of VERY LIGHT 2x/wk on non-lifting days only (lifting m-t-th-sa, cardio w-f, sunday rest) just because I can't get going for the day without doing SOMETHING!

    Is this starting to sound a little better?

    Hopefully by the end of next week I'll have another lb on me or so. I'm done going backwards, I just need to get all in and do it!
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    If you are worried about keeping some of the fat gains down make sure you do cardio first thing on an empty stomach. Nothing too intense though. You can then eat your heart out the rest of the day. Doing cardio with weights is not good for bulking or lifting in general. You want all the nutrients in your body to fuel the muscles you are working and not to disperse over your entire body. All the advice you have gotten is pretty spot on and good for you for researching first before getting frustrated with no gains. Keep it up and eat eat eat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TAURUS NUTRI
    If you are worried about keeping some of the fat gains down make sure you do cardio first thing on an empty stomach. Nothing too intense though. You can then eat your heart out the rest of the day. Doing cardio with weights is not good for bulking or lifting in general. You want all the nutrients in your body to fuel the muscles you are working and not to disperse over your entire body. All the advice you have gotten is pretty spot on and good for you for researching first before getting frustrated with no gains. Keep it up and eat eat eat.
    Doing cardio with weight training is not good fr bulking?? How about doing cardio after weight training?? Those moderate intensity type cardio.. Will it be detrimental to one's muscle gain??
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    Quote Originally Posted by noob2die View Post
    Doing cardio with weight training is not good fr bulking?? How about doing cardio after weight training?? Those moderate intensity type cardio.. Will it be detrimental to one's muscle gain??
    Anything that burns calories in excess of what is needed to cause an increase in muscle/protein synthesis is technically wasteful and will not help you to gain LBM. Unless you are eating in excess of even that expenditure. Also, if you are not training in the 70% Vo2max level then a lot of times you are not doing much.. just burning cals and perhaps enhancing healing by the extra blood flow you are getting to the muscles that would other wise be at rest. All depends on the person though. If you cant gain a pound of muscle with the cardio drop it. If you start getting to fat w/o it either taper down the cals, or start it up again. All about what's not working.
    RecoverBro ELITE
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    Taurus- anything worth doing is worth doing right! There is so much info out there about every aspect of lifting and bodybuilding, I'm just glad to be able to get real advice from people who have been there already.

    Is there anything else I can do to aid recovery time? I make sure to eat regularly (every 2 hours or so) and I have some casein w/ almond milk or some cottage cheese before bed. Drink so much water i can't get halfway down the street without feeling like I'm going to piss myself. Any supps that actually help?
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    Anaerobic glycolysis(weight training)- uses glucose and free fatty acids as fuel.

    Aerobic glycolysis(cardio)- uses free fatty acids and lactic acids as fuel.

    You do burn fat doing both lifting weights and cardio, however if you need carbs(glucose) to get the most out of your weight routine and you do not need carbs(glucose) to fuel your cardio workout makes more sense to lift and then do cardio sense you only need fatty acid to fuel that exercise doesn't it?
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    Just tried a semi-fasted lifting workout this morning. I don't care what anyone says, I won't be doing that again! Yikes, talk about fatigue coming on strong! I was almost dizzy at times. Fasted cardio is way different, no negatives to that in my experience so far.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cswalczakny
    Just tried a semi-fasted lifting workout this morning. I don't care what anyone says, I won't be doing that again! Yikes, talk about fatigue coming on strong! I was almost dizzy at times. Fasted cardio is way different, no negatives to that in my experience so far.
    Everyone us different i guess.. i perform the best on a semi fasted training... Especially in early in the morning... Well u gotta find wat works fr u...
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    Don't do cardio after weights- you'll never build any muscle that way.
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    I'm running between 3500-3800 calories/day and still havent made any weight gains. Added 10lbs to standing row and deadlift and 5lbs(2.5lbs/arm) on curl bar/dumbell curl though. I attribute the bigger strength gains in deads and rows to the fact that I just started doing them a couple weeks ago so the muscles strengthen very quickly at first without really adding much mass (i think).

    Been trying to bulk for 12 days, started at 166.5lbs, weighed in at 166.5lbs this morning.
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