Raynaud's disease

Mikey13 · 06-21-2008, 01:45 PM

Ok, I need a some scientifical / medical help here. My fiance has Raynaud's disease (primary Raynaud's) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raynaud's_phenomenon and we are pretty sure (so is her DR) that it is primary, so it would then be a vasospatic disease.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasospasm

She read a lot into the ingredients of Napalm and she is a bit concerned that their might be some adverse side-effects with the localized affects of Napalm and her disease. I am computer geek, so this science stuff boggles my mind, but while reading up on it, I do see a lot of info on Alpha and Beta blockers/antagonists/receptors... but who am I....

Can anyone give some insight as if there is any need for concern - and yes we already have the bottle of Napalm in front of us, so I am hoping we get the green light.

Sir Savage · 06-22-2008, 12:20 AM

Hmmm...

Where is she planning on applying the Napalm?

**jmh80** · 06-22-2008, 12:26 AM

Wow - EXTREMELY loaded question.

**DeerDeer** · 06-22-2008, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey13

Ok, I need a some scientifical / medical help here. My fiance has Raynaud's disease (primary Raynaud's) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raynaud's_phenomenon and we are pretty sure (so is her DR) that it is primary, so it would then be a vasospatic disease.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasospasm

She read a lot into the ingredients of Napalm and she is a bit concerned that their might be some adverse side-effects with the localized affects of Napalm and her disease. I am computer geek, so this science stuff boggles my mind, but while reading up on it, I do see a lot of info on Alpha and Beta blockers/antagonists/receptors... but who am I....

Can anyone give some insight as if there is any need for concern - and yes we already have the bottle of Napalm in front of us, so I am hoping we get the green light.

I would not even consider using any stims that have vasoconstrictive properties with a history of raynauds. The goal would be vasodilation with a medication, for example a peripheral vasodilator such as nifedipine.

These alledged "vasodilators" do nothing of the sort. IMO stay away.

Mikey13 · 06-22-2008, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Savage

Hmmm...

Where is she planning on applying the Napalm?

she is planning on stomach, and glutes.

Her raynauds affects her hands and feet, but we want to be sure first.

Mikey13 · 06-22-2008, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmh80

Wow - EXTREMELY loaded question.

eh not so much. I look at it as, hey it might trigger her disease more, don't take it : or, no need to worry, get at it!

And I do understand that these claims have not been approved by the FDA

just looking for an educated response, not cross your heart hope to die

Sir Savage · 06-22-2008, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey13

eh not so much. I look at it as, hey it might trigger her disease more, don't take it : or, no need to worry, get at it!

And I do understand that these claims have not been approved by the FDA

just looking for an educated response, not cross your heart hope to die

Well, if you want it in those terms, I'd say the former- "Hey, it might trigger her disease more."

I don't know that for sure, but this is just one of those things where it's best to err on the side of caution, you feel me?

dsade · 06-22-2008, 01:32 PM

You would also have to do the application for her, if the disease affects her hands.

SHOULD you decide to try it out, keep it at 1 squirt to assess her reaction.

Also, given the serious and unpredictable nature, I would not expect a hugely detailed speculation/answer from the Avant reps - liabiity and all - but the rest of us, without financial stake, can try to help YOU understand and make a decision.

Let me see if my rep, Trauma (an ER Nurse) knows anything further.

**jmh80** · 06-22-2008, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsade

You would also have to do the application for her, if the disease affects her hands.

SHOULD you decide to try it out, keep it at 1 squirt to assess her reaction.

Also, given the serious and unpredictable nature, I would not expect a hugely detailed speculation/answer from the Avant reps - liabiity and all - but the rest of us, without financial stake, can try to help YOU understand and make a decision.

Let me see if my rep, Trauma (an ER Nurse) knows anything further.

Deer Deer is a doc, Dsade. Traum would be a good guy to have input also.

Mikey13 · 06-22-2008, 04:26 PM

Sir Savage, and dsade - thats the type of answer I am looking for. As i stated, I know not too much about all this medical stuff, so I will definately apply it for her AND do testing with one squirt as well.. I appreciate the responses.

**DeerDeer** · 06-22-2008, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey13

Sir Savage, and dsade - thats the type of answer I am looking for. As i stated, I know not too much about all this medical stuff, so I will definately apply it for her AND do testing with one squirt as well.. I appreciate the responses.

It has yohimbine and synephrine, known potent vasoconstrictors. I woul dnot even consider in a person with potential vasocclusive disease.

In severe raynauds the vessels constrict to a point (typically cold induced) that they actually can cause necrosis of the distal digits.

Personal recommendation, diet and exercise, avoid the cold. If it severe, shee needs medical management.

**jmh80** · 06-22-2008, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey13

Sir Savage, and dsade - thats the type of answer I am looking for. As i stated, I know not too much about all this medical stuff, so I will definately apply it for her AND do testing with one squirt as well.. I appreciate the responses.

Deer Deer is a doctor. If you don't listen to what he says - you are a retard.

No offense, bro.

Mikey13 · 06-22-2008, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmh80

Deer Deer is a doctor. If you don't listen to what he says - you are a retard.

No offense, bro.

no offense BRO, but I don't listen to someone just because they are a "DR" - not all Doctors are smart and up-to-date on everything.

I am going to listen to DeerDeer because reading many of his other posts on this forum, and on this here thread, and his prompt and clear response to my PM regarding this matter has shown that he does in fact have the knowledge to give knowledgeable info without need to doubt him.

DeerDeer, thanks again for your input.

**DeerDeer** · 06-22-2008, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey13

no offense BRO, but I don't listen to someone just because they are a "DR" - not all Doctors are smart and up-to-date on everything.

I am going to listen to DeerDeer because reading many of his other posts on this forum, and on this here thread, and his prompt and clear response to my PM regarding this matter has shown that he does in fact have the knowledge to give knowledgeable info without need to doubt him.

DeerDeer, thanks again for your input.

No problem - the reality is that there are in fact plenty of guys here that are just as if not more knowledgeable int he realm of nutrition/fitness/health than the average physician.

I think jmh's comments were not meant to be offensive but rather to render some credibility to my comments - too many individuals say what they know, but don't quite know what they say if you know what i mean.

Cheers Mikey, cheers jmh.

Mikey13 · 06-22-2008, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeerDeer

No problem - the reality is that there are in fact plenty of guys here that are just as if not more knowledgeable int he realm of nutrition/fitness/health than the average physician.

I think jmh's comments were not meant to be offensive but rather to render some credibility to my comments - too many individuals say what they know, but don't quite know what they say if you know what i mean.

Cheers Mikey, cheers jmh.

I agree, which is why I responded the way I did, we all have met a Dr. once in our life, who knows not so much. And telling someone to listen to another person, solely based on the fact that they are a Dr. can be very misguided advice.

I wasn't meaning to be offensive either.... just explaining why I only listen to those who prove then have knowledge of the matter at hand.. thanks again to all who responded and lead us in the right direction.

**jmh80** · 06-22-2008, 09:07 PM

It was clear you were going to move forward. Deer Deer has proven to understand supplements - most doc's don't.

Hence a clear post was needed in my mind.

Calm down and stop lecturing on doctors.

I understand better than anyone. The doctor's at the VA hospital in Johnson City, TN had a large hand in my father's death this February.

Good luck.