Napalm safe with andropen and tren?
- 02-19-2009, 09:18 AM
- 02-19-2009, 12:12 PM
I'm not familiar with andropen but Napalm can be used while on androgens as the carrier is localized,not systematic.There is a minute amount absorbed systematically,but not nearly enough to cause any concern.
By good fat burner I hope you're not referring to ECA and/or Y Hcl.Stronger stimulants really shouldn't be used while on androgens as androgens and stimulants can be a bit too much for the heart.I was diagnosed with an enlarged heart a couple years back while on test enthanate,oxandrolone,Adderal and caffiene.I'm in fine health now though and enlarged hearts are actually quite common among athletes.
Since you have no reservations with grey area stuff,I'd suggest a low dose of DNP with Sesathin and fish oil.The latter two are cardio protective and have ridiculously sweet synergy together.See the supporting reference for this claim below.Sesathin also liberates FFA to be oxidized via DNP and/or cardio,in preference to LBM.
My suggestions are made after taking into account proper precautions while on gray area drugs;NAC,milk thistle,a multivitamin with extra B vitamins,fish oil,Sesathin,hawthorn berry,COq10 and GTE.GTE also is about as potent WRT fat loss as ECA,if dosed properly (like a product such as Lean Green)
B vitamins (particularly thiamine) are IMO essential for all athletes,especially those who use androgens.I have a bunch of abstracts saved on them WRT staving off heart problems and the like.I'll post a couple examples below,mainly because this is such an overlooked supplement.
Metabolism. 2006 Mar;55(3):381-90
Dietary sesamin and docosahexaenoic and eicosapentaenoic acids synergistically increase the gene expression of enzymes involved in hepatic peroxisomal fatty acid oxidation in rats.
Arachchige PG, Takahashi Y, Ide T.
Laboratory of Nutritional Biochemistry, National Food Research Institute, Tsukuba 305-8642, Japan.
The interaction of sesamin, one of the most abundant lignans in sesame seed, and highly purified docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) or eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) in the form of ethyl ester in affecting hepatic fatty acid oxidation was examined in rats. In the first experiment, 3 groups of rats were fed with purified experimental diets free of n-3 fatty acid ethyl ester and containing 0%, 0.2%, and 0.4% sesamin (1:1 mixture of sesamin and episesamin), and 2 groups of animals were fed with a 2% DHA ethyl ester diet containing either 0% or 0.2% sesamin. In the second trial, 4 groups of rats were fed with either a 0% or a 2% EPA ethyl ester diet containing 0% or 0.2% sesamin. After 15 days of feeding, DHA and EPA ethyl esters added to a sesamin-free diet little affected the activity and messenger RNA (mRNA) levels of various enzymes involved in fatty acid oxidation. Sesamin increased the activity levels of various hepatic enzymes involved in fatty acid oxidation irrespective of the presence or absence of n-3 fatty acid ethyl ester in diets. However, the diet containing sesamin and DHA or EPA ethyl ester in combination increased many of these parameters synergistically. In particular, the peroxisomal palmitoyl-coenzyme A oxidation rate and acyl-coenzyme A oxidase activity level were much higher in rats fed with sesamin and DHA or EPA in combination than in animals fed with a diet free of n-3 fatty acid ethyl ester and containing sesamin. Analyses of mRNA levels revealed that a diet simultaneously containing sesamin and n-3 fatty acid ethyl ester increased the gene expression of various enzymes involved in peroxisomal fatty acid oxidation in a synergistic manner. However, the combination of sesamin and n-3 fatty acid ethyl esters was ineffective in causing a synergistic increase in mRNA levels of enzymes of mitochondrial fatty acid oxidation, microsomal cytochrome P-450 IV A1, and cytosolic liver-type fatty acid-binding protein. It was concluded that sesamin and DHA or EPA ethyl ester synergistically increased hepatic fatty acid oxidation primarily through up-regulation of the gene expression of peroxisomal fatty acid oxidation enzymes. The results essentially reproduced those observed in our previous study with a diet containing both fish oil and sesamin despite the fact that DHA and EPA ethyl esters were much less effective than fish oil in increasing hepatic fatty acid oxidation.
1: Kokyu To Junkan. 1991 Jan;39(1):89-94.Links
[A case of beriberi heart--with special reference to the rapid effect of fursultiamine on hemodynamics]
[Article in Japanese]
Oimatsu H, Okada T, Sawai K, Satoh R, Mukai H, Kudoh C.
Department of Cardiology, Kushiro City General Hospital.
A 33-year-old man was admitted to Kushiro City General Hospital on February 27, 1989, because of palpitation, shortness of breath and anasarca. Eight months previously he had noted the onset of pretibial edema, which had progressed to anasarca. He had had a meal only once a day for nine months. Physical examination revealed a blood pressure of 114/46 mmHg and pulse rate of 80/min. The 3rd sound was audible. No rales in the chest and no hepatosplenomegaly were noted. Ascites, pretibial edema and anasarca were present. Vibration sensation was diminished, and the deep tendon reflexes were absent in the legs. The blood thiamine level on the 4th day of hospitalization decreased to 2.9 micrograms/dl. The red cell transketolase activity and TPP effect on the 10th hospital day were 0.76 IU/gHb and 11%, respectively. A chest roentogenogram showed pulmonary congestion and cardiomegaly (CTR 61.3%). The electrocardiogram showed non-specific T wave changes. On the echocardiogram, remarkable pericardial effusion and diffuse hypertrophy of the left ventricular wall were observed. In addition, the left ventricular wall motion showed a hyperkinetic state. On the basis of these findings, the diagnosis of beriberi heart was made. The hemodynamic study performed on the 10th hospital day showed a remarkable high cardiac output (CO) of 10.7 l/min and an extremely reduced total peripheral resistance (TPR) of 352 dynes.sec.cm-5. 15 min after intravenous administration of Fursultiamine 100 mg, CO decreased to 7.24 l/min and TPR increased to 848 dynes.sec.cm-5. Following the administration of Fursultiamine 75 mg, po/day, his symptoms and abnormal findings of clinical examination data rapidly improved.(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED AT 250 WORDS)
Ann Cardiol Angeiol (Paris). 2001 Apr;50(3):160-8.Links
[Is thiamine supplementation necessary in patient with cardiac insufficiency?]
[Article in French]
Blanc P, Boussuges A.
Service de réanimation polyvalente, service de cardiologie, CHD Félix Guyon, 97405 Saint-Denis, La Réunion, France. [email protected]
Interest has recently risen regarding thiamine deficiency in patients with cardiac deficiency who are receiving long-term diuretic therapy. Thiamine deficiency can lead biventricular myocardial failure (cardiac beriberi), and treatment consists of thiamine administration. Studies have shown that long-term furosemide use may be associated with thiamine deficiency through urinary loss, contributing to cardiac insufficiency in patients with congestive heart failure. Thiamine supplementation could improved left ventricular function. However, the results of those studies are controversial, and none study have till proved the clinical impact of a systematic administration of thiamine in a cohort of patients with cardiac insufficiency. To date, and waiting for available literature, thiamine administration should be consider in patients at risk for thiamine deficiency (elderly, malnourished, alcoholic), and in patients receiving very large doses of diuretics.
02-19-2009, 03:39 PM
well im taking the cycle assist by cel and i plan on mega dosing fish oils! eh i was taking hyperdrive 3.0 in small doses along with jack3d to get me a nice sweat at the gym. i havent been taking the 3.0 and the pre workout on cycle. ran out of the pwo. DOH! anywhos i dont want to give the old ticker the boot so you think the good multi maybe lean green or something to that nature would be fine?
02-20-2009, 03:35 PM
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