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My blood tests scared me!

calibrated said:
Just got my results back and now I'm worried. Estrogen is 318, test was 2.1. Explains a lot about the way I have been feeling. If it gets much worse there will be a big crash.

All I take for sups is Sesamin, green tea, R-ALA, saw palmetto, lycopene and GF-Pro.

Seems like the Doc could care less, says test is a little low and estrogen is liveable. Anyone have any ideas?
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He said your estrogen is liveable? Its almost 3 times the top of the ref range
My estrogen is 108( ref range 40-115) and my test is 422 (ref range 241-827) My tsh is 2.36 and my doc said its all normal don't worry about it.
It may be normal but it is not optimal, I have been thinking about just taking my bloodwork around to some different docs just to get second opinions.
 
GOD ALMIGHTY!!!It is hard to believe these DRs went to medical school and are still practicing.:jaw:
 
OLD....OLD...WHAT DO YOU MEAN OLD???

Old's got nothing to do with it..theyre just stupid.

If calbriated's estrogen is 318 - hes not far off from lactating. If this wasnt so serious it would be funny.
 
You know, this get's me thinking
If you are a member of AARP, it would seem like an issue they might be interested in. In this case discrimanation based on gender and age. Some one brought up in another thread about how easy it is for women to get HRT(menopause).
In the mean time there are otc anti estrogens, but would be best follow the path of ageless there. Someone 57 should not have to go through this.
I'm guessing doctors must be under some pressure from the feds about illegally prescribing Test. It would be nice to get some political pressure the other way.(seniors have lots clout when they are organized).
You know ageless, you proablly should send them(AARP) your whole story(with pics), its a side they never hear I bet.
This is why people have to self medicate to begin with
 
I'll add my experience with my fam. doc. I had a blood test come back really low on testosterone. Still not sure if it's real or not.
But, the fam. doc. who's gotta be 50 ro so (who had the tests ordered after I bugged him to) wouldn't give me injectable test - only patches or fucking Androgel.
I told him I didn't want either as I'd heard they are worthless.

Bottom line - go to an endocrinologist.
 
Word up OK63!

Fight the power!

(I'm laughing thinking about a bunch of bodybuilding senior citizens storming Capital Hill throwing chairs and **** to get their enanthate.)
 
So your test level is in normal range and your estro is WAY too high. Probably wont get HRT, might just get anti E.


CROWLER
 
Get another blood draw just to be sure. I was the one who brought up the HRT for women being so easy to get. It's absurd that MD's will not listen or at least read up on something within their profession. Hell....I read up on all kinds of **** to keep up on my profession.

If your next blood draw is similar, I would definitely get another doc. An endocrinologist would be nice if your insurance covers it. If you have to be referred, then i would arm yourself prior to visiting the next doc. Walk in with a load of information for him. Let him sort through it and plan a return visit. You can always pay people like Swale to help you out as well but it gets a little spendy.

Has anyone had experience with a female doc with regard to HRT? Maybe they would be more receptive to it as they understand hormone imbalances after having to deal with them their entire lifetime (at least once per month). This is definitely discrimination at it's finest IMO.
 
I would assume that a doc would want to get your E under control first. Once that is stabilized you would think they would rerun total test, free or better yet bioavailable test and the E. Based on those results he should then be better able to gauge a path forward for you one would think.
 
calibrated said:
It was barely normal and the test was taken at 8:00 Am which should have been somewhere near peak for the day.

Does anyone have an idea what would make E levels that high? I thought the majority would be from conversion of test.
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Do you carry a large % of your body fat around your love handle area and chest area?

Do you have hairy arms or not so much?

As far as barely normal it still IS normal and at your age not unusual.


CROWLER
 
CROWLER said:
Do you carry a large % of your body fat around your love handle area and chest area?

Do you have hairy arms or not so much?

As far as barely normal it still IS normal and at your age not unusual.


CROWLER
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I have always carried a disproportionate amount of weight in the LV area and my arms are not that hairy. Are those symtoms of too high estrogen ?
I don't know if you know the answer or not but
When the doctors prescribre and anit-e do they go with an AI or a serm ?
If there was a way for him to very temporairly drive his test down(just for the test) that would be interesting.
I've heard that if someone took the origanl andro, (that woulkd spike estrogen)
 
I am sorry I don't know for sure. Just a guess. I too have had VERY little hair on my arms, carry almost all my fat in the love handle and chest area and have had a 'fairly tough time building muscle. Not sure if one has anything to do with the other or not.

As far as driving the test down I have seen people claim they have done that. What it seems almost all have reported success with is going without sleep, WAY over traning and drinking alcohol. Not sure if it is true or not. Hey wait a minute that sounds like college life to me lol

Good luck and keep us updated.


CROWLER
 
jmh80 said:
I'll add my experience with my fam. doc. I had a blood test come back really low on testosterone. Still not sure if it's real or not.
But, the fam. doc. who's gotta be 50 ro so (who had the tests ordered after I bugged him to) wouldn't give me injectable test - only patches or fucking Androgel.
I told him I didn't want either as I'd heard they are worthless.

Bottom line - go to an endocrinologist.
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The gel works exceptionally well.
 
Your body might just be converting an excess of T into E and you may not have naturally high levels to begin with. You might start with an AI and see if that brings your test levels up just having less aromatased. If that doesnt work you'll probably get put on nolva and see what happens. You may want to get onto some ephedrine and get as lean as you possibly can if the anti E's actually do the trick, getting lean alone may solve the problem long term. A good EC stack will be your friend.
 
On second thought if you get fed up with doctors you could always look at getting your own clomid, I dont know dosages scheme's when its used as a stand alone and not as part of a PCT. You would probably want to start with a low dose and taper up to a moderate over the course of a week or two so your body can adjust to the lower E levels, then get more blood work done. You'll probably not be using a SERM as a long term fix, but it might help identify the underlying issue.
 
Clomid and Nolva aren't worth taking for someone in your situation IMO, as they are somewhat toxic to the liver. 6-oxo transdermal will help as it is an AI. Letro might be best although there's a product called "Metacort" by a company called "Dermabolics" which is 6-oxo and 7-oxo in a transdermal, which I highly reccomend. 7-oxo upregulates the thyroid and reduces cortisol, so it's an added bonus. It is fairly inexpensive.
 
I know this isn't optimal but the Ergopharm product SKULPT contains 6-OXO in a DMSO base.....so might help as an off-the-shelf way to get a topical 6-OXO (for application to pecs for example).
 
I think you may have really high levels of SHBG to aromatize test into that much estrogen. You need a decent endo to run a comprehensive steroid panel as a simple test:estrogen panel leaves out too much information to make a good diagnosis.

Letro or Arimidex are good options for getting the E down, however they will not address the primary cause of such high aromatization. If you have a high bf percentage, that can also aggrevate the situation.
 
I'd stop a good 3 weeks out to let levels come back kinda close to where they had been. Glad you are feeling better. Too much estrogen is a drag.


I have been having decent luck with Ester-C as per Dr D's advice. I'm using 2 grams per day while on my 4AD/19 Nor/1 test stack and so far, at the 4 weeks in, I have no nipple puffiness which is very unusual. I ran this same stack for my last cycle minus the Ester-C and had constant puffiness in the nipples and even got a very mild case of gyno. I am running no other AI or serms during this cycle...so my guess is that it's the Ester-C keeping aromitization in check. I NEVER would have guessed that it could do this.
 
Are you eating any soy products? If so stop. Have throid levels checked and see if you get them bumped up. It will help lose weight.
 
walt said:
Could you post more info on the Ester-C, Never heard of that before??
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Ester C is just an improved a form of vitamin C.
I'd be curious to know the reasons for bioman's results.
 
here's what you should run.

clomid at 50mgs a day for three weeks(wks 1-3)
HCG at 120 units sub q for three weeks (wks 1-3)

Followed by clomid for 25mgs a day for the next two weeks (wks 4-5) and clomid 12.5mgs a week after that for a total of 6 weeks.

Nolva is optional but its rather harsh so if you can go without you'll be better off. That will get you boys working guaranteed. This cycle is tried and true:thumbsup:
 
Sorry for jumping in here, but I too have a question. I got my T levels tested and the Dr said I had low test and free test levels. (I don't know the numbers). He prescribed Clomid, 50 mg three times a week (MWF). It brought my levels back up to "normal range". I have another appt w/ him in a couple of weeks. I have heard concerns about being on Clomid for extended periods of time. Any thoughts? I also started looking into SD cycle and after posting here and other forums, the advice is to stay clear. One suggestion was NHA stack. Again, any thoughts? Thanks for any help.
(40 years old, workout 4-5 days per week, good diet)
Again, sorry for jumping in, not trying to hijack.
 
gettingold said:
Sorry for jumping in here, but I too have a question. I got my T levels tested and the Dr said I had low test and free test levels. (I don't know the numbers). He prescribed Clomid, 50 mg three times a week (MWF). It brought my levels back up to "normal range". I have another appt w/ him in a couple of weeks. I have heard concerns about being on Clomid for extended periods of time. Any thoughts? I also started looking into SD cycle and after posting here and other forums, the advice is to stay clear. One suggestion was NHA stack. Again, any thoughts? Thanks for any help.
(40 years old, workout 4-5 days per week, good diet)
Again, sorry for jumping in, not trying to hijack.
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If I had a pre-existing HPTA problem, I'd stay clear of ph use myself.

The NHA stack increases free test but lowers overall test slightly (look at the bloodwork they posted). Since you've got a doc working with you, why don't you try talking to him/her about ways to get your test to optimal levels? Clomid (or some other prescription) may do you more good than any sup you could buy.
 
I've talked to my Dr (Urologist) and he "doesn't know much/anything about those things". I was thinking of looking for a different doc that might be able to help me out. Test levels w/ clomid are up around 530. (don't know the range) Thanks for the input.
 
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