To TRT or not to TRT
- 02-15-2013, 05:31 PM
To TRT or not to TRT
So, I have read an enormous amount on here, other forums, medical references, etc, about TRT. I have all the symptoms of Lo T; decreased energy/motivation, concentration and focus slipping, lack of libido, increased abdominal fat (even with good diet and exercise) and lo T, well about 300. I am 45, not sure I want to pin forever, but would like to try and see how this treats me. I have had extensive bloods done twice and I have been approved for TRT through a company I was picked up from a thread on one of the boards. Basically a TRT/Anti-aging company, seemingly legit, pharma grade stuff, mail order to me. Checked out the pharmacy they draw from, looks good, compounding pharmacy.
So my question is if I run this 3-6 months, can I do the HCG/Clomid/Nolva recovery route and be fine to go off the program? I know theoretically you can, but there are a lot more experienced people here that might beg to differ. My guess is once you run it for too long, it's forever, but can I get away with it 3-6 months only, without messing everything up ?
It's 200mg test /week, .5mg Anastrozole x1 week, and 500iu's HCG x2 week. My plan was to run it for the 3-6 months and take a break and see from there.
Thanks for any input...
- 02-15-2013, 07:42 PM
02-15-2013, 09:58 PM
I wouldn't, and 200/week isn't TRT. It's a crapshoot at 45 that running hcg/clomid/nolva will bring you back to even 300-400 range and youd be right back where you started IMO...
Either commit or don't...
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02-16-2013, 07:48 PM
02-17-2013, 12:20 AM
02-18-2013, 07:47 PM
You could attempt the Clomid route as that seems to work for some people and doesn't commit you to test. But, if you really do have low test and not something else causing it, then I don't know why you wouldn't want to commit. Do you like having all the symptoms that you described? Not me, man. Life's too short to not try and feel great.
02-22-2013, 11:36 PM
03-06-2013, 10:56 PM
03-06-2013, 11:00 PM
Thanks for the input guys...
04-09-2013, 12:20 PM
I'm certain that would bring you back ABOVE normal. At least give it a go before you commit to TRT ?.
If the low test feeling is due to a cycle you've run and not feeling recovered, I think it is HIGHLY LIKELY that the SERM/AI You used was bunk...
A lot of people go for the sites where you can get Clomid for like $14 but a lot of them wouldn't be Clomid at all, or severely underdosed.
You should try running another PCT but make sure its from a reputable site. There's one (which I think may be a sponsor on here?) which is one of the longest running and most reputable companies around and for a bit higher cost you can have peace of mind that your ingesting the substance you intended and it's doing it's job..
PM me if you want bro..
"I need your clothes, your boots and your motorcycle"
11-17-2016, 10:44 AM
11-17-2016, 11:04 AM
To TRT or not to TRT
200 mg test per week of Test Cyp would put you well above 500. Get your bloods after 4-5 weeks. Morning draw.
100 mg per week would put you at 650-700 easy.
200 would have you kicking past 1200.
How on earth did your doc explain you would hit 300. Natty test boosters can yield a 100-200 point gain for crying out loud.
Now pinning sub q gets you a 20% increase yielding you an extra 80mg of test every two weeks. I've got the research around here somewhere.
I bet you test at 1500> after 5 weeks if you use sub q.
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11-18-2016, 10:50 AM
This thread is three years old.
There are some inaccurate statements though. TRT dosage, like any medication, is an individual response and need for treatment. 200mg/T weekly gets me to ~650 blood levels from multiple testings. Also, TRT is for life, just like insulin. If you're deficient in production of a hormone you don't cycle the required medication.
Lift heavy and eat lots of dead animals! Yes, that's me in my avatar.
11-18-2016, 02:54 PM
11-18-2016, 03:28 PM
Sub-q is nothing new, it is just being recognized as an option to help stabilize some of the peaks and valleys that can be experienced even with 2x weekly injections IM.
11-18-2016, 03:48 PM
To a certain extent arent peaks and valleys "good/desirable" occurences, ie they more mimic natural rhythms? That is, as long as the high/lows are still within the normal physiological range.
11-18-2016, 03:58 PM
No, you really want to minimize this as the effects of exogenous test are not mimicking the normal daily fluctuations. The effects on TRT are much more pronounced as you are not going through a 24 hour hormone cycle, rather a high peak after injection and then a slow decline until the next injection. The difference in a day for someone not on exogenous test are generally 10-20% from waking until evening. That is much different than a 50-60% drop that can be experienced from inject day to inject day on TRT, even for someone with a frequent injection protocol.
11-22-2016, 11:34 AM
I would love to do sub q shots and read it's okay to do, however, my doctor is against it. Any reason why? as far as the 300 levels, my doctor has me on HCG as well which are sub q. He said if I ever stop the TRT, my levels would most likely go back to 300 (level prior to TRT) with clomid and HCG but probably will not go higher.
11-27-2016, 12:58 AM
I feel this pinning of testosterone for trt, even weekly, is the wrong way to go about it. I have a fair amount of experience in this area. I went to a Urologist and had all kinds of issues with peaks and valleys. too much testosterone then not enough. it didnt take long before I needed arimadex at 2mg a day to try and keep some crazy estrogen issues under control. I got some Clomid and got off that mess. What works pretty well for me is a home made testoesterone transdermal. I take 30ml of Salvo and put 6 grams yes 6,of a testosterone base powder. Then apply 1ml daily to my inner bicep. works great for me. goodbye to depression, low energy, brain fog, crappy erections and all the other problems.Testosterone went from 400 to 900.
11-27-2016, 01:18 AM
11-27-2016, 02:07 AM
i had to go as high as 2mg a day to get the estrogen back under control for a little while. Did I say I was downing everyone who used test? i did not. I am saying many physicians use old protocols that do more hard than good. If it wasnt so expensive Id just buy the name brand 2% testosterone transdermal and be done with it. A once or twice daily application of transdermal testosterone is easier to control than injections.
11-27-2016, 02:20 AM
To TRT or not to TRT
The sentence above is what you said. It says nothing about outdated protocols. Pinning weekly is not outdated. What you were doing to require you to take 2 mgs of arimidex a day had to be a bad protocol. I take .5 mgs a week of arimidex spilt in two doses. You had to have crashed your E2 within a couple of days take 2mgs a day. How long have you been on TRT? How long have you been using transdermals? Why are you so against pinning?
11-27-2016, 08:41 AM
To TRT or not to TRT
@MedRat are you obese? 2 mg per day of arimidex is a very high dose and I'm wondering if you have a high aromatization due to fat content (not being critical here). I take 0.25 mg per week and my E2 stays in the 20's. Also, if you use gels this puts your children and/or spouse/gf in danger of being exposed to testosterone.
May I suggest using this app to track your bloodwork tests:
myBloodTracker for IPhone and IPad
11-27-2016, 11:54 AM
11-27-2016, 11:56 AM
11-27-2016, 12:19 PM
You said something about peptides. I've never taken them although I am slightly interested in PT141. Before you start adding things to your protocol, get it dialed in first. There's so much more to TRT than just injecting test. You need to add other things such as DHEA, pregnenolone and vitamin D3 just to name a few. Before taking these, get your levels check with blood work. If your Dr won't check them or isn't familiar with them, then run as fast as you can to another dr that does. Take your healthcare into your own hands. Educate yourself and find an integrative medicine Dr in your area.
11-27-2016, 02:39 PM
i take 10k units of d3 per day along w 25mg dhea. 3.5 of cyp would have been much better but, he wouldnt increase the test cyp enough for it to be effective. Everything has risks and i completely understand the risks of each delivery method.
11-27-2016, 02:53 PM
12-01-2016, 11:41 PM
Yes the same Dr. Who now thinks I've adjusted my injections in such a way as to maintain test levels in the 900 free test range.
I understood about the 3.5 day dosing. I have years of college education in medicine and more in other unrelated fields.
If something is working for you that's excellent. Medicine isn't and should never be one size fits all.
12-02-2016, 02:19 PM
The only reason I explained the dosing frequency was due to your response. I read it as you may have thought 3.5 was the amount I was injecting. Just wanted to make things clear.
I have a college degree also and access to several medical professionals.
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