THE END OF OLD AGE......L-carnosine

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    Sounds like there is hope still with the doctors. Do you take anything more then what the doc gives you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big boy D View Post
    Sounds like there is hope still with the doctors. Do you take anything more then what the doc gives you?
    Nope. They had me on the 200 mgs, ie one vial a week level but that was keeping me up over 1300 on my total Test. Now, using only 100, I am staying between 700 and 800 and they are happy. My VA Uro agrees with my using the Progesterone instead of Arimidex etc for my Estro and knew I was taking 200 mgs of DHEA in capsule form. Since my body only really assimilates a small portion of that I had considered going for Dermacrine instead and when the Transderm hit the market being much less expensive and lasting twice as long, I jumped on the wagon. I do do one additional thing in that I take 1 gm of Stinging Nettle Root which not only helps keep my PSA down and protect my prostate but also doubles my Free Test ie the good stuff and helps me get max results out of the above combo.
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    Abc?
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    Check out my END OF OLD AGE order.

    ~astaxanthin
    ~hydralauric acid
    ~beta alanine (dropped l-carnosine, hope works just as good)
    ~pregnenolone cream and oral
    ~progesterone
    ~resveratrol

    Comments appreciated.
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    Check out my END OF OLD AGE order.

    ~astaxanthin
    ~hydralauric acid
    ~beta alanine (dropped l-carnosine, hope works just as good)
    ~pregnenolone cream and oral
    ~progesterone
    ~resveratrol

    Comments appreciated.
    Looks good!

    Lucky,

    I'm currently spending 6 months on what I call a rejuv (reverse aging) program. I also use a couple of strong endurance supplements as I want to raise that too. I did buy some DMAE, COQ10 cream ($9 at SwansonVitamins) and 50 grams of carnosine along with the 200 grams of beta alanine. I plan to use the carnosine saturated in coconut oil as a skin cream as 3-4 grams goes a long ways. The Japanese make carnosine skin creams at about $60 to $80 per 1.5 ounces. I've never cared about the narcissist looks thing much, but I want to play with this and see what's possible.

    The endurance supps I use are cordyceps mushrooms (what the Sherpas use to climb high in the Himalayas without oxygen), and GPLC an amazing form of carnitine that is super for endurance. Both of these actually give you an edge in weigh training too, their effects are so powerful. They really shine with cardio efforts though.
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    Dutchman,

    My brother's doc gives him enough injectable test to keep him at the 1150 level. A lot of stuff has happened to me since I was on here before, and I hit a full sized deer with my car while driving home from work on my last drive home before a weeks vacation, on my birthday yet. Oh, well, as the song says, I'll roll with it. But probably using a different car.
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    Doesn't Carnosine absorb HORRIBLY?? I thought you needed huge amounts to get any decent amount in your blood
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    Quote Originally Posted by keyser View Post
    Doesn't Carnosine absorb HORRIBLY?? I thought you needed huge amounts to get any decent amount in your blood
    Not sure where you heard this. Have not read this anywhere yet. I could be wrong, however. I have mistakenly used it several years back thinking I was using l- carnotine. The effects were quite noticeable and pronounced right off the bat, first dose. Still remember the warm tingling sensation years later.
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    Quote Originally Posted by keyser View Post
    Doesn't Carnosine absorb HORRIBLY?? I thought you needed huge amounts to get any decent amount in your blood
    Carnosine does have some absorption problems, but not as bad as horrible. The price is the problem. That has been addressed on this tread with beta alanine being the cheaper solution, if you read the whole thread. It might have some other interesting uses as direct carnosine though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    Check out my END OF OLD AGE order.

    ~astaxanthin
    ~hydralauric acid
    ~beta alanine (dropped l-carnosine, hope works just as good)
    ~pregnenolone cream and oral
    ~progesterone
    ~resveratrol

    Comments appreciated.
    maybe you're mentioning a compound I've never heard of, but do you mean hyaluronic acid? I've read a lot of good things about the latter recently, although it seems oral availability is very poor unless it's derived in a superior way (most formulas are derived from rooster combs).

    As I said, I stopped fighting that war here years ago.
    DUTCHMAN, don't give up the fight! your wisdom and insight are worth more than you could imagine!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchman View Post
    Lucky,

    I guess I have to cheat and make it my favorite Baker's Dozen. I have spentwith no exaggeration, thousands of hours over the last couple decades trying tounderstand Mother Nature/God's Gifts etc. As a result, this nature loving,ex-seminarian firmly believes that Big Pharma is Bad and only God is Good! Iknow I sound hokey to the youngsters today but c'est la vie! Enjoy!


    Dutch’sDirty (Baker’s) Dozen of Vitamins

    I take dozens of different things but the followinglist consists of the most important to me. They all have some impact on my physical performance in the gym as theyaffect in some way strength/energy/recovery/metabolism etc. Butthey all make the list because they exert tremendous influence on my health,immune system, brain, heart, eyesight, joints, memory. They do a great job against the greatestthreats we face.
    1. Vitamin D3 15,000 IUs
    2. Omega 3s 3 – 6 gms
    3. Astaxanthin 10 mgs
    4. Ubiquinol(CoQH) 100 mgs
    5. Curcumin(Turmeric) 1 gm
    6. Green Tea Extract 2-3 gms
    7. Creatine 4 – 5 gms
    8. Beta-Alanine(Carnosine) 4 – 5 gms
    9. ALCAR 4 gms
    10. ALA 600mgs
    11. Coconut Oil 3 tbspns
    12. Cissus 1.5 gms @ 10% or 2.5 gms @ 5%
    13. Resveritrol (2 glasses of Cab or Merlot)


    Kudos and respect to you Dutchman for exemplifying that aging does not have to mean losing one's health.
    Thanks for providing a list of your natural supplements. Going to definitely look into making my own stack.
    And going to definitely try the eyesight improvement nutrients.
    Mine comes from having a job being at a PC all day and even breaks still don't stop all of the strain.
    On my days off my vision is noticeably better. Trying to get into another type of job.

    Anyway, great posts everyone.
    I learned a lot. Thanks.
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    (Doug Stanhope as Eddie on Louie)
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    Great info Dutchman! I just started taking 3.2g of beta-alanine a day and haven't felt the tingling effects at all. The first time I drank the 3.2g in 32fl oz of water in an hour and felt nothing. Now I drink the 3.2g in 64fl oz of water over the course of the day. Am I diluting it too much? I also bought some taurine but I'm not sure on optimal doses. I've been taking (i think) 5g of taurine intra-workout in my intra-shake which has pure karbolyn, protein, leucine, and creatine in it.

    Comments appreciated!
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    aTeam, not everyone gets those tingles and the lower the amount you take the less likely they are. I've been taking a good 4 gms daily for years and now take it twice a day for 8 gms. I also take it all at the same time. If you water it down and spread it out over the day that might just be the reason you don't feel it. What is important to feel is the results in the gym. I love it stacked with my creatine mono. I pump up, recover faster and just seem bigger and stronger. Maybe try taking a little more and all at once? Good Luck.
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    I'm so glad I found this thread. At 39 I'm glad I see that I can keep building and growing. Thanks to all esp. Dutch ;-) great info
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    Quote Originally Posted by aTeam View Post
    Great info Dutchman! I just started taking 3.2g of beta-alanine a day and haven't felt the tingling effects at all. The first time I drank the 3.2g in 32fl oz of water in an hour and felt nothing. Now I drink the 3.2g in 64fl oz of water over the course of the day. Am I diluting it too much? I also bought some taurine but I'm not sure on optimal doses. I've been taking (i think) 5g of taurine intra-workout in my intra-shake which has pure karbolyn, protein, leucine, and creatine in it.

    Comments appreciated!
    I also don't get tingles when i dose it anywhere near a meal with carbs in it. So if you're drinking it over the day then that may be the case.

    I cycle on and off but when i'm on i also use Citrulline Malate with Beta Alanine and start drinking it on the way to the gym and finish about halfway through. Drink plenty of water with it as well.
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    Thanks for the comments guys. My only concern is it isn't all getting absorbed when I drink it in so much water. I feel like the water just passes through me and I piss it out. Not getting tingles may be related to my ironclad stomach, very few things upset my stomach. I'm sure as I get older that will change, I'm 20. I'll try 3.2g in one 8oz drink and see what happens. Honestly I'm just curious what all this tingle business is about.
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    BTW people the reason why I use coconut oil like in the Dutchman's supplement list is that it too has many health purposes, but equally important is it sets you up to keep your test levels high. Of all the healthy fats, coconut oil is the best for this, although fish oil and extra virgin olive oil are decent too. Healthy fats lay the foundation for good hormone levels.

    Back to the original carnosine post. I intend to try an experiment. I purchased 50 grams of bulk carnosine, and have saturated 3-4 grams of it into 2 ounces of liquid coconut oil. I have a large, deep scar from a major knee surgery in January of this year. I intend to apply this oil with the carnosine powder in it to that scar twice a day for a couple of months as I'm interested in the effect of the carnosine externally. Just curious.
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    I realize this is off the topic of Carnosine but on topic with END OF OLD AGE. I have been applying NOW progesterone cream for 3 days now and what I have noticed is that the damaged ligament in my knee which I have been living with for 2 months now is feeling better. Upon googling ligaments and progesterone, there seems to be some correlation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    I realize this is off the topic of Carnosine but on topic with END OF OLD AGE. I have been applying NOW progesterone cream for 3 days now and what I have noticed is that the damaged ligament in my knee which I have been living with for 2 months now is feeling better. Upon googling ligaments and progesterone, there seems to be some correlation.
    Let me know if this continues to improve!
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    I realize this is off the topic of Carnosine but on topic with END OF OLD AGE. I have been applying NOW progesterone cream for 3 days now and what I have noticed is that the damaged ligament in my knee which I have been living with for 2 months now is feeling better. Upon googling ligaments and progesterone, there seems to be some correlation.
    Definitely going to be looking into that.

    Where are you applying the cream?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jag View Post
    Definitely going to be looking into that.

    Where are you applying the cream?
    Second day now that I have noticed improvent. The soreness has actually had me limping in pain and keeping me away from the gym.

    I am applying to back and side of my knees and shoulders, chest areas. 1/2 pump twice per day.

    I have been reading that progesterone is a great anti-inflammatory and a hood anti-estrogen. Both are evils we want to control. It's a big myth and misconception that it is solely a female hormone. I highly recommend it.

    Getting my END OF OLD AGE shipment today. Looking forward to using pregnenolone (mother of all hormones) and astaxanthin!
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    And my knee ligament keeps getting better everyday
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    Hey... I'm looking for some references on the op's claims...

    Where are the studies supporting the defeat of the hayflick limit?

    I'd like something to be able to use for citation in a conversation with my friend and father.

    Thanks
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sourdough
    Hey... I'm looking for some references on the op's claims...

    Where are the studies supporting the defeat of the hayflick limit?

    I'd like something to be able to use for citation in a conversation with my friend and father.

    Thanks

    I'm not sure if this is enough for you, but if not, there is plenty of reading on pubmed and through google.





    Carnosine reacts with protein carbonyl groups: another possible role for the anti-ageing peptide?

    AuthorsHipkiss AR, et al. Show all Journal
    Biogerontology. 2000;1(3):217-23.

    Affiliation
    Biomolecular Sciences Division, GKT School of Biomedical Sciences, King's College London, Guy's Campus London Bridge, London EC1 1UL, UK. alan.hipkiss@kcl.ac.uk

    Abstract
    Carnosine (beta-alanyl-L-histidine) can delay senescence and provoke cellular rejuvenation in cultured human fibroblasts. The mechanisms by which such a simple molecule induces these effects is not known despite carnosine's well documented anti-oxidant and oxygen free-radical scavenging activities. Carbonyl groups are generated on proteins post-synthetically by the action of reactive oxygen species and glycating agents and their accumulation is a major biochemical manifestation of ageing. We suggest that, in addition to the prophylactic actions of carnosine, it may also directly participate in the inactivation/disposal of aged proteins possibly by direct reaction with the carbonyl groups on proteins. The possible fates of these 'carnosinylated' proteins including the formation of inert lipofuscin, proteolysis via the proteasome system and exocytosis following interaction with receptors are also discussed. The proposal may point to a hitherto unrecognised mechanism by which cells/organisms normally defend themselves against protein carbonyls.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sourdough
    Hey... I'm looking for some references on the op's claims...

    Where are the studies supporting the defeat of the hayflick limit?

    I'd like something to be able to use for citation in a conversation with my friend and father.

    Thanks
    Pubmed and google. Here is one of a dozen in pubmed.



    Carnosine reacts with protein carbonyl groups: another possible role for the anti-ageing peptide?

    AuthorsHipkiss AR, et al. Show all Journal
    Biogerontology. 2000;1(3):217-23.

    Affiliation
    Biomolecular Sciences Division, GKT School of Biomedical Sciences, King's College London, Guy's Campus London Bridge, London EC1 1UL, UK. alan.hipkiss@kcl.ac.uk

    Abstract
    Carnosine (beta-alanyl-L-histidine) can delay senescence and provoke cellular rejuvenation in cultured human fibroblasts. The mechanisms by which such a simple molecule induces these effects is not known despite carnosine's well documented anti-oxidant and oxygen free-radical scavenging activities. Carbonyl groups are generated on proteins post-synthetically by the action of reactive oxygen species and glycating agents and their accumulation is a major biochemical manifestation of ageing. We suggest that, in addition to the prophylactic actions of carnosine, it may also directly participate in the inactivation/disposal of aged proteins possibly by direct reaction with the carbonyl groups on proteins. The possible fates of these 'carnosinylated' proteins including the formation of inert lipofuscin, proteolysis via the proteasome system and exocytosis following interaction with receptors are also discussed. The proposal may point to a hitherto unrecognised mechanism by which cells/organisms normally defend themselves against protein carbonyls.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sourdough View Post
    Hey... I'm looking for some references on the op's claims...

    Where are the studies supporting the defeat of the hayflick limit?

    I'd like something to be able to use for citation in a conversation with my friend and father.

    Thanks
    I'd seen some earlier studies which suggested that extra cell divisions did not happen with carnosine, but that in other ways it returned the cells to much healthier function, and created a longer time between cell divisions, thus increasing lifespan of the cells, and health of the cells during that lifespan.
    This one caught my by surprise. I would need this backed up, but certainly carnosine or beta alanine are remarkable.
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    Received my shipment.

    Been taking,
    Pregnonolone
    Progrsterone
    Beta Alinine
    Astaxanthin
    L-arginine

    Beta Alinine give nice body tingled. Boy oh boy. Really feeling it now!
    L-arginine feels nice and warm.
    Progesterone is healing my ligaments.
    Pregnonlone made me feel smarter for first few days, now nothing.
    Astaxanthin, nothing seems hyped.
    Hyaloronic acid, nothing much, hyped?
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    Received my shipment.

    Been taking,
    Pregnonolone
    Progrsterone
    Beta Alinine
    Astaxanthin
    L-arginine

    Beta Alinine give nice body tingled. Boy oh boy. Really feeling it now!
    L-arginine feels nice and warm.
    Progesterone is healing my ligaments.
    Pregnonlone made me feel smarter for first few days, now nothing.
    Astaxanthin, nothing seems hyped.
    Hyaloronic acid, nothing much, hyped?
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    Received my shipment.

    Been taking,
    Pregnonolone
    Progrsterone
    Beta Alinine
    Astaxanthin
    L-arginine

    Beta Alinine give nice body tingled. Boy oh boy. Really feeling it now!
    L-arginine feels nice and warm.
    Progesterone is healing my ligaments.
    Pregnonlone made me feel smarter for first few days, now nothing.
    Astaxanthin, nothing seems hyped.
    Hyaloronic acid, nothing much, hyped?
    Do you feel anything or get immediate results from fish oil? Not really. Vitamin D3? Only if you take a mega-dose of it, and then you will notice it. Health supplements are subtle, you get the results often from blood tests much later, and a quiet sense of well being. If you stop taking a health supplement that's working well for you, you will notice the lack of it in a fairly short time.

    Beta Alanine and to a lesser degree L-arginine are not just health supplements, they are also noticeable as sport supplements for endurance, recovery, and N.O. (arginine) effects. These kick in a few days after starting.
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    Agreed, Tuberman. I only posted about the possible hype of astaxanthin and hyalauronic acid because of the astonishing reviews and research stating energy increases, decreases in wrinkles, anti inflammatory claims etc etc. These are not subtle claims and noticeable claims. Others have a right to know. If I feel anything positive, I will post it.

    I am especially disappointed with astaxanthin as it has been promoted as a miracle supplement. So far nothing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    I am especially disappointed with astaxanthin as it has been promoted as a miracle supplement. So far nothing.
    Lucky, which brand of astaxanthin did you get and what doses are you using?

    I ordered some on Dutchmans results. Obviously, i read up on it first but couldn't find anything bad on it. Maybe it's one of those supps that works better over the long term.
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    Quote Originally Posted by luclyluciano View Post
    Agreed, Tuberman. I only posted about the possible hype of astaxanthin and hyalauronic acid because of the astonishing reviews and research stating energy increases, decreases in wrinkles, anti inflammatory claims etc etc. These are not subtle claims and noticeable claims. Others have a right to know. If I feel anything positive, I will post it.

    I am especially disappointed with astaxanthin as it has been promoted as a miracle supplement. So far nothing.
    Well, some people do claim to get fantastic results immediately from health supplements, and in most cases I take such claims with a lot of skepticism. You will notice that Dutchman said it took astaxanthin two years to normalize his vision, that is typical of even "miracle" supplements in the health category. Astaxanthin needs to be taken with high-fat meals otherwise absorbtion is minimal or less than 5%. I'm not picking on you here, but I'm saying I have different expectations then you. I feel thateven "miracle" health supps take weeks and even months to show their strength.
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    Good point, in fact I take my Astaxanthin every morning along with 2.7 gms of Omega 3s.
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    Would it be worth purchasing Beta-Alanine w/ L-Histidine?

    I found 500g of BA for about $24, or the same amount of a mixture w/~10% L-Histindine for about the same price.

    Should I opt for the mixture?
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3whitelights View Post
    Would it be worth purchasing Beta-Alanine w/ L-Histidine?

    I found 500g of BA for about $24, or the same amount of a mixture w/~10% L-Histindine for about the same price.

    Should I opt for the mixture?
    From what i have read our bodies suplly us with enough Histidine so supplementing with it should not be necessary.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3whitelights View Post
    Would it be worth purchasing Beta-Alanine w/ L-Histidine?

    I found 500g of BA for about $24, or the same amount of a mixture w/~10% L-Histindine for about the same price.

    Should I opt for the mixture?
    I too have read our bodies already had l-histidine. Having said that, I would have preferred to have ordered specifically l-carmosine. Simple for the "we do not know what we do not know" factor and the studies are on l-Carnosine not beta Alanine.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jag View Post
    Lucky, which brand of astaxanthin did you get and what doses are you using?

    I ordered some on Dutchmans results. Obviously, i read up on it first but couldn't find anything bad on it. Maybe it's one of those supps that works better over the long term.
    I ordered the healthy origins brand. It had the most positive reviews. I also cut out my fish oil supplementation to see the effects. I will try with fish oil again to see if the the effects are any different.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchman View Post
    The only thing Carnosine and Carnitine have in common is their latin root, carnis: meat/flesh/body. Think carnal/carnivore in english.

    I have been taking 5, size 00 caps of each for at least 5 years and swear by both. The carnosine I take in the form of Beta-Alanine because my body has more than enough Histidine and the Carnosine is 10 times MORE exensive. My best source on Carnosine would be Vitacost but even there it runs about $44 for 90 gms in caps. Here at NP I still buy my bulk B-A for $40 a kilo and my ALCAR for $60 a kilo and cap them myself.

    Beta-Alanine is what I combined with 5 caps of Taurine, another potent amino acid for the macula in our eyes, and Astaxanthin 10 mgs, some Zeaxanthin and Lutein 20 mgs to completely heal my eyesight. As I reported here a couple years ago, I went from 3.25 and 3.75 to 1.25 and 1.75 in a year and then to 20 - 20 the second year.

    I believe the recent article about the long lasting effects of B-A is "Beta-alanine effective for weeks after end of course" which is on Ergo-Log at http://www.ergo-log.com/betaalaninee...eforweeks.html

    Lucly, thanks for adding a great article for our use.

    Im very interested in putting your "vision stack" to the test...

    Ive had noticeable vision problems since I was 9 when I first had to get glasses... now a month and a half shy of 28 i have -4.00 in each eye as of an exam over a year ago (wouldnt doubt one bit its waned further) and I REALLY am worried about the outcome of my vision by the time im 50, let alone 70...

    Lasik is certainly on my list... I want to get it as soon as my health insurance kicks in(should be this next month)... BUT I want to maintain the results and not allow it to continue to decline at a similar rate...

    I see in your stack here you mention

    • Astaxanthin 10 mgs
    • some Zeaxanthin (how much?)
    • Lutein 20 mgs
    • Taurine (how much for these purposes, as I take 5g-10g every day during cycles)



    is this all you would suggest for someone as bad off as im getting?

    thanks for any info and your reasoning for use ahead of time
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    Sourdough, the whole gist of this thread was around Beta-Alanine/Carosine. I strongly suggest you add 5 gms of the BA daily to your list as well as taking 5 gms of the Taurine. I'm no Doc. but given your condition as you describe it, I personally would also be taking say 40 or even 60 mgs of the Lutein. If you buy it from Vitacost as I mentioned above, they have it combined with Zeaxanthin. You would then be adding 2 or 3 mgs of the Z which should be enough. Good luck, keep us posted. Oh yeah, I think I also mentioned it somewhere above, make sure you try to get 3 to 5 gms daily of Omega 3s, they are super vision helpers.
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    yup... DHA and EPA are essential for babies to properly develop their eyes and brains... I already supp with those though

    thanks for the input.... BA was in my use, but since dropped when I ran out... its currently in my cart at nutra


    Ill def report back to this thread/in general after putting this to the test through the next year... may or may not have the surgery by then... would be nice to see some natural progression though.
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