GDA's and fasted cardio

[Ripple2352]

I've used GDAs in the past, but I've never taken one, even low dose, and then not eaten.

So, my question is, has anyone here ever low-dosed a GDA and did some fasted cardio or anything like that? I have some SlinMax and was thinking of trying it out. I just dont want to pass out on the bike/treadmill/track lol.

My reasoning is:

- Lipoic Acid, Berberine, and cinnamon all activate AMPk, and of course exercise does as well
- PPAR delta is activated by the lipoic acid and berberine, along again with exercise
- PPAR alpha is activated by the lipoic acid and fasting, and exercise.

3 different fat-burning pathways activated by 3 ingredients in SlinMax.

Seems like there could be some real benefits here. Thoughts?

 

[JCR97]

Great question interested to hear from people my guess is that alpha lipoic acid is a fatty acid so technically wouldn’t be fasting cardio anymore because you’ve ingested a fat but then again it under like 9 calories because 1000mg of fat is 9 calories so say you would take ALA at 400mg you’re looking at less than 5 cals


Great question and hypothesis though not shutting you down or anything brotha just my guess.

 

[cubsfan815]

Interested to hear what others think. I cannot personally go longer than 40mins without meal on SlinMax or I start getting really shakey and cold sweats lol.

 

[The Solution]

I personally would not dose a GDA prior to a fasted cardio session as some people may go hypo from BG levels dropping so low. This is a side effect I would not want to have happen to someone because it can cause some issues. Save the GDA for prior to heavy carb meals (not post-workout) where insulin sensitivity is already high and the need for one is minimal.

Granted Fasted Cardio does not have a whole lot of merit in the grand scheme of things when compared to fed cardio. The only time I would suggest fasted is if utilizing Yohimbine HCL to target stubborn fat, besides that do your cardio as you please, but doing it fasted will only raise cortisol even higher in a fasted state not making it any more beneficial.

SS cardio burns fat the exercise. So why not do it when we wake up so we can burn the most fat since food isnt in the way?. The problem is cortisol, it will sky rocket with SS cardio, ESP when it's done every day and for a long time each session. When cortisol is high, the body lowers thyroid hormone output and metab naturally slows. Also, while fat is being burned muscle is also up for grabs and your body has no problem at all using that as fuel, and muscle loss also means- lowering thyroid hormone and slowing if metab. Studies have shown on tons of occasions that doing SS cardio fasted or with food resulted in zero difference in fat loss (due to the fact calories in/calories out for the day in a deficit means fat loss) but when you are in a fed state you can limit high cortisol levels and ESP chronic levels if you are doing a lot of it.

 

[JCR97]

I personally would not dose a GDA prior to a fasted cardio session as some people may go hypo from BG levels dropping so low. This is a side effect I would not want to have happen to someone because it can cause some issues. Save the GDA for prior to heavy carb meals (not post-workout) where insulin sensitivity is already high and the need for one is minimal.

Granted Fasted Cardio does not have a whole lot of merit in the grand scheme of things when compared to fed cardio. The only time I would suggest fasted is if utilizing Yohimbine HCL to target stubborn fat, besides that do your cardio as you please, but doing it fasted will only raise cortisol even higher in a fasted state not making it any more beneficial.

SS cardio burns fat the exercise. So why not do it when we wake up so we can burn the most fat since food isnt in the way?. The problem is cortisol, it will sky rocket with SS cardio, ESP when it's done every day and for a long time each session. When cortisol is high, the body lowers thyroid hormone output and metab naturally slows. Also, while fat is being burned muscle is also up for grabs and your body has no problem at all using that as fuel, and muscle loss also means- lowering thyroid hormone and slowing if metab. Studies have shown on tons of occasions that doing SS cardio fasted or with food resulted in zero difference in fat loss (due to the fact calories in/calories out for the day in a deficit means fat loss) but when you are in a fed state you can limit high cortisol levels and ESP chronic levels if you are doing a lot of it.

What about high dosage vitamin C with Ashwaghanda to lower cortisol post fasting cardio? Also isn’t some cortisol good because of the fact it is involved in lipolysis. My question to you is would those two supplements help bring cortisol to an optimal level for fat burning. If you were to design an optimal fasting cardio plan would you or would you drop it all together and just do it post lift?

 

[BOSSMAN]

Just got my daily tidbit of info ^^^
I do fasted cardio 5 days a week upon waking. Usually around 20 minutes before I workout, I do this to wake up...it's at 3am. Looks like I need to switch things up a bit, and yes I have that stubborn fat that won't go away.DAM. I may be my own worst enemy

 

[Ripple2352]

I personally would not dose a GDA prior to a fasted cardio session as some people may go hypo from BG levels dropping so low. This is a side effect I would not want to have happen to someone because it can cause some issues. Save the GDA for prior to heavy carb meals (not post-workout) where insulin sensitivity is already high and the need for one is minimal.

Granted Fasted Cardio does not have a whole lot of merit in the grand scheme of things when compared to fed cardio. The only time I would suggest fasted is if utilizing Yohimbine HCL to target stubborn fat, besides that do your cardio as you please, but doing it fasted will only raise cortisol even higher in a fasted state not making it any more beneficial.

SS cardio burns fat the exercise. So why not do it when we wake up so we can burn the most fat since food isnt in the way?. The problem is cortisol, it will sky rocket with SS cardio, ESP when it's done every day and for a long time each session. When cortisol is high, the body lowers thyroid hormone output and metab naturally slows. Also, while fat is being burned muscle is also up for grabs and your body has no problem at all using that as fuel, and muscle loss also means- lowering thyroid hormone and slowing if metab. Studies have shown on tons of occasions that doing SS cardio fasted or with food resulted in zero difference in fat loss (due to the fact calories in/calories out for the day in a deficit means fat loss) but when you are in a fed state you can limit high cortisol levels and ESP chronic levels if you are doing a lot of it.

Never took the cortisol and thyroid into account there. Good points.

 

[EMPIREMIND]

I've used GDAs in the past, but I've never taken one, even low dose, and then not eaten.

So, my question is, has anyone here ever low-dosed a GDA and did some fasted cardio or anything like that? I have some SlinMax and was thinking of trying it out. I just dont want to pass out on the bike/treadmill/track lol.

My reasoning is:

- Lipoic Acid, Berberine, and cinnamon all activate AMPk, and of course exercise does as well
- PPAR delta is activated by the lipoic acid and berberine, along again with exercise
- PPAR alpha is activated by the lipoic acid and fasting, and exercise.

3 different fat-burning pathways activated by 3 ingredients in SlinMax.

Seems like there could be some real benefits here. Thoughts?

I have done this alot and had minimal issues. I think it worked well for me, but I have also been able to achieve results using many different methods, so this wasn't necessarily a game changer for me. If used strategically I think this can be effective. I would ease into because as other wrote the risk of going hypo

 

[The Solution]

Just got my daily tidbit of info ^^^
I do fasted cardio 5 days a week upon waking. Usually around 20 minutes before I workout, I do this to wake up...it's at 3am. Looks like I need to switch things up a bit, and yes I have that stubborn fat that won't go away.DAM. I may be my own worst enemy

You have stubborn fat because you eat less then a bikini chick and your metabolism is wrecked.

You compensate too much cardio and daily NEAT with a subpar intake meaning your body is in shutdown mode and you won’t lose anymore fat until you take a long diet break and rebuild your metabolism.

For someone your size eating so little it’s doing
More harm then good

 

[BOSSMAN]

You have stubborn fat because you eat less then a bikini chick and your metabolism is wrecked.

You compensate too much cardio and daily NEAT with a subpar intake meaning your body is in shutdown mode and you won’t lose anymore fat until you take a long diet break and rebuild your metabolism.

For someone your size eating so little it’s doing
More harm then good

A bikini chick....hahaa....funny
Your are right, the last 2 weeks my appetite sukks

 

[Ricky10]

Interesting take on the detriments of fasted cardio! Like most people, I had always thought those were the optimal times for burning fat. Same case for HIT cardio?

On another note, my energy levels certainly take a decline post GDA dosage. It would definitely be a challenge for me to able to have enough stamina to engage in any kind of cardio session. Especially something on the extra potent side like Slintensity. Remaining fasted after 1 pill of that is not an option for me..

 

[The Solution]

Interesting take on the detriments of fasted cardio! Like most people, I had always thought those were the optimal times for burning fat. Same case for HIT cardio?

On another note, my energy levels certainly take a decline post GDA dosage. It would definitely be a challenge for me to able to have enough stamina to engage in any kind of cardio session. Especially something on the extra potent side like Slintensity. Remaining fasted after 1 pill of that is not an option for me..

Most people buy into dogma and tactics that have been disproved over the years. Just like eating 6 times a day, cutting off carbs at night.. etc etc...

HIIT is a worse idea fasted.
e. A common belief is that doing HIIT before you eat in the morning is going to really turn up fat burning, yet that's the farthest thing from the truth or what happens when you do HIIT fasted. HIIT doesnt burn much fat while it's being executed, it burns stored glycogen similar to weight training. Most of the fat burning with HIIT comes AFTER you do it for hours and hours (EPOC), while you are eating actually. When you are fasted and start any kind of exercise, cortisol is going to go through the roof, especially with something like HIIT and muscle breakdown is elevated resulting in muscle loss quite easily. To maximize your HIIT have food in your system since the session is fueled by glycogen anyway, and the harder the HIIT session means it results is more fat burning for hours later. IMO, and research shows this, training fasted holds no advantage for fat loss but a lot of muscle loss can happen. Plus it's hard to get hydrated enough for most that early and that can result in injuries much more easily.

If you love fasted cardio, knock it out, maybe you feel better that way and it is easier for it to fit your schedule Hell, if you wanna train fasted or do HIIT fasted by all means, do what YOU ENJOY. Just make sure you realize there are no special fat burning properties to them because if there truly was the research would show it with something this easy to monitor and test.

 

[Ricky10]

Thanks for the outstanding info! It certainly swayed my way of thinking..

 

[Rockzilla]

Most people buy into dogma and tactics that have been disproved over the years. Just like eating 6 times a day, cutting off carbs at night.. etc etc...

HIIT is a worse idea fasted.
e. A common belief is that doing HIIT before you eat in the morning is going to really turn up fat burning, yet that's the farthest thing from the truth or what happens when you do HIIT fasted. HIIT doesnt burn much fat while it's being executed, it burns stored glycogen similar to weight training. Most of the fat burning with HIIT comes AFTER you do it for hours and hours (EPOC), while you are eating actually. When you are fasted and start any kind of exercise, cortisol is going to go through the roof, especially with something like HIIT and muscle breakdown is elevated resulting in muscle loss quite easily. To maximize your HIIT have food in your system since the session is fueled by glycogen anyway, and the harder the HIIT session means it results is more fat burning for hours later. IMO, and research shows this, training fasted holds no advantage for fat loss but a lot of muscle loss can happen. Plus it's hard to get hydrated enough for most that early and that can result in injuries much more easily.

If you love fasted cardio, knock it out, maybe you feel better that way and it is easier for it to fit your schedule Hell, if you wanna train fasted or do HIIT fasted by all means, do what YOU ENJOY. Just make sure you realize there are no special fat burning properties to them because if there truly was the research would show it with something this easy to monitor and test.

I feel like there would not be a whole lot of muscle loss. Doesn’t cortisol burn fat by turning it into triglycerides to raise BG?
A sufficient protein feeding afterwards should essentially help your nitrogen levels gain balance and protein turn over would be equal(not greater unless you were adding enough calories to bulk)

 

[The Solution]

I feel like there would not be a whole lot of muscle loss. Doesn’t cortisol burn fat by turning it into triglycerides to raise BG?
A sufficient protein feeding afterwards should essentially help your nitrogen levels gain balance and protein turn over would be equal(not greater unless you were adding enough calories to bulk)

if fasted HIIT was so good, and had some much promise show me the research.
90% of people who do HIIT go through the motions. If you are truly doing HIIT you would be fried after 5 minutes, putting your body in that much of a catabolic state in a fasted state is going to push coritsol through the roof and BG will rise. As BG Rises you are losing insulin sensitivity which is also a major no no.

Just make sure you realize there are no special fat burning properties to them because if there truly was the research would show it with something this easy to monitor and test.
^^^^

Even the recent ISSN Research shows this as well:
High intensity exercise can compromise an athlete’s immune health. Infection risk and exercise workload follow a J-Shape curve with moderate intensity exercise reducing the infection risk, and high intensity exercise actually increasing the risk of infection.

Why would you want to increase the risk of your immune health in a fasted state by doing high intensity exercise? Not only are you increasing the chance of you being sick your also putting your body in a larger catabolic environment. That is not helping you with retaining LBM. The larger the catabolic state especially in a dieting phase is a risk for muscle loss. What athlete wants that?

https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12970-018-0242-y

 

[BennyMagoo79]

I feel like there would not be a whole lot of muscle loss. Doesn’t cortisol burn fat by turning it into triglycerides to raise BG?
A sufficient protein feeding afterwards should essentially help your nitrogen levels gain balance and protein turn over would be equal(not greater unless you were adding enough calories to bulk)

I dont think there would be much of an issue if one were working out fasted in the am whilst eating at maintenance, since you are only burning through stored glycogen anyway and unlikely to fully deplete it with HIT.

 

[Slims]

I've used SlinMax for fasted cardio in the past. The first two or three times were rough, but by day 4/5 I was fine. Was easily the most successful cut I've done at 2 caps 20 minutes prior to the training 5 days per week.

Note: I was also on Keto

 

[JCR97]

if fasted HIIT was so good, and had some much promise show me the research.
90% of people who do HIIT go through the motions. If you are truly doing HIIT you would be fried after 5 minutes, putting your body in that much of a catabolic state in a fasted state is going to push coritsol through the roof and BG will rise. As BG Rises you are losing insulin sensitivity which is also a major no no.

Just make sure you realize there are no special fat burning properties to them because if there truly was the research would show it with something this easy to monitor and test.
^^^^

Even the recent ISSN Research shows this as well:
High intensity exercise can compromise an athlete’s immune health. Infection risk and exercise workload follow a J-Shape curve with moderate intensity exercise reducing the infection risk, and high intensity exercise actually increasing the risk of infection.

Why would you want to increase the risk of your immune health in a fasted state by doing high intensity exercise? Not only are you increasing the chance of you being sick your also putting your body in a larger catabolic environment. That is not helping you with retaining LBM. The larger the catabolic state especially in a dieting phase is a risk for muscle loss. What athlete wants that?

https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12970-018-0242-y

I’m guessing it differs from enhanced athletes? Like if you were to use an anabolic with GH or peptides? Which might be where the idea originated? I think you’ve got the facts and I won’t be doing anymore fasted cardio that’s for sure lol so cardio post lift is best?

 

[DaeshDontSurf]

mr. solution has lots of good info. just do your cardio wherever it fits. i personally do it, but not because I think best way - just not hungry in am and only time to do it. cardio just energy waster and good for heart - can eat more food while still losing at good rate, and not die from cardiovascular event, lol. fat used at very low exertion levels - like all day just walking around. deficit is what cause bf loss. also not worry about cortisol unless you have medical condition - body very good at keeping healthy people in range and cortisol not bad unless metabolic syndrome, otherwise good. always remember - "there are no fat prisoners of war" (they pretty stressed!) = deficit rules bf levels.

 

[USPlabsRep]

I personally would not dose a GDA prior to a fasted cardio session as some people may go hypo from BG levels dropping so low. This is a side effect I would not want to have happen to someone because it can cause some issues. Save the GDA for prior to heavy carb meals (not post-workout) where insulin sensitivity is already high and the need for one is minimal.
t.

I agree. Probably the worst time to use an effective GDA is fasted. If blood sugar drops, you'll be weak and you'll be forced into drinking at least 75 grams of high glycemic carbohydrates to feel normal again.

 

[USPlabsRep]

I've used GDAs in the past, but I've never taken one, even low dose, and then not eaten.

So, my question is, has anyone here ever low-dosed a GDA and did some fasted cardio or anything like that? I have some SlinMax and was thinking of trying it out. I just dont want to pass out on the bike/treadmill/track lol.

My reasoning is:

- Lipoic Acid, Berberine, and cinnamon all activate AMPk, and of course exercise does as well
- PPAR delta is activated by the lipoic acid and berberine, along again with exercise
- PPAR alpha is activated by the lipoic acid and fasting, and exercise.

3 different fat-burning pathways activated by 3 ingredients in SlinMax.

Seems like there could be some real benefits here. Thoughts?

Its not how it works, if exercise increases it doesn't mean the supplement will increase it more.

 

[USPlabsRep]

I dont think there would be much of an issue if one were working out fasted in the am whilst eating at maintenance, since you are only burning through stored glycogen anyway and unlikely to fully deplete it with HIT.

That's not true, You're going to burn muscle with HITT. Its a perfect way to target muscle tissue, Fasted HITT...

 

[Ricky10]

Since morning fasted cardio is out now, what are thoughts on doing SS cardio post resistance training assuming one had a preworkout meal of some sort.

The common belief is that one should be done with resistance training within 40 minutes due to cortisol spike thereafter. My sessions last more than 40 minutes...

If I were to stay and perform some SS cardio, I assume I would be setting myself up for another less than ideal scenario?

This is why I don’t do cardio on a consistent basis. It’s too complex.
Trying to figure all this out is enough to raise my cortisol levels.

 

[The Solution]

Since morning fasted cardio is out now, what are thoughts on doing SS cardio post resistance training assuming one had a preworkout meal of some sort.

The common belief is that one should be done with resistance training within 40 minutes due to cortisol spike thereafter. My sessions last more than 40 minutes...

If I were to stay and perform some SS cardio, I assume I would be setting myself up for another less than ideal scenario?

I know plenty of athletes or guys who compete naturally & nationally and train way longer then 40 minutes.
how many people do you see on ESPN playing sports train less then 40 minutes? Almost none of them
Swimmers, cyclists etc.. do you think they would just stop working out after 40 minutes of resistance training? most likely not
Maybe John meadows has been doing it wrong his whole career but is one of the best program writers out there.
Layne Norton will train upward to 2+ hours.. I don't think his progress has been held back (besides injury)
You need to stop taking any article or thing you hear in a gym and separate the facts from the dogma in the industry.
SS is much better after compared to fasted. Or space it out and do it later in the day.

 

[Ricky10]

Where do you find such off the wall information?
I know plenty of pro's or guys who compete nationally and train way longer then 40 minutes.
Maybe John meadows has been doing it wrong his whole career but is one of the best program writers out there.
SS is much better after compared to fasted. Or space it out and do it later in the day.

Oh, probably a Men’s Health magazine many years ago. I never adhered to it though by any means. I am just getting into it after 40 minutes!

There we go, so post workout it is....or sometime later in the day. Sounds good!