think i've got my next madness cycle figured out

[UnrealMachine]

i don't get much from test, I figure I'll use it as a base underneath two oral cycles to get away with one less PCT and keep more weight after the first oral cycle (which is the bulking cycle)

it's a pretty simple Bulk then Cut

1-19 sustanon 325mg a week
2-5 SD 20mg straight
2-6 PheraPlex 30mg straight
14-20 Halodrol 75mg ---> 150mg i'll dose according to feel
14-19 T3 ramped up to 75mcg and back down

so by the 7th week, that weak ass dose of sust should be built up strong enough to at least help me maintain some of the big ass gains from my SD/PP bulking period. I got 7 weeks to recover my liver and workout with just the sust which is gonna be the same as natural lifting for me but I'll try to maintain my gains. Last phase i'm pretty confident with, high-dosed Hdrol with T3, and the appropriate diet and cardio. That should be long enough for me to get ripped up like last summer (my avatar picture) but hopefully at a higher bodyweight (i'm only 212 in my avatar!).

Been all natural since January so 5 months now, looking forward to 5 months on! Basically took Jan/Feb/March more or less off the gym and so I'm 2 months back at it getting it back, 220 and like 11% right now.

Tired of bitchin about how test doesn't work so i'm just not going to expect any gains from it, just the lack of a PCT and low test period. the point of this cycle is to get crazy with the **** that works for me (SD, PP) and use test just so that I can bridge that into a heavily assisted cut

any feedback guys? This is what my mind came up with and I'm just itching to stab myself with the first pin...

 

[nosnmiveins]

looks good, u know im along for the ride!

 

[UnrealMachine]

love ya nos. How fun do you think that bulking period is going to be? SD stacked with PP was so off da hook when i did it for like 2 weeks last summer. This time for a whole month... I'm getting a pump just thinking about it.

 

[ottoclif]

I have pplex, hdrol, epi, mdrol, and tren. I wanted to so something similar to yours but without the test. I just cant figure out which combo to use. Maybe I will follow yours amd just adjust the dosages a bit. I start my cyle June 15.

 

[nosnmiveins]

sd and pp together is going to be fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuun. watch out for those crazy back/shin pumps though...they kill me every time

PM heading ur way in a sec

 

[trippn]

I would bump the sust up to at least 500mg/week. Then have fun!

 

[nosnmiveins]

I would bump the sust up to at least 500mg/week. Then have fun!

u ever poke a sleeping grizzly bear before? because ur probably about to see what its like...
























hahaha. test doesnt do jack for Unreal besides keeping the libido normal....he's run high doses with zero to little effect on strength and mass gain

 

[trippn]

Lol. Not trying to poke the bear. The question for me is why bother with the test at such a low dose?

 

[UnrealMachine]

Lol. Not trying to poke the bear. The question for me is why bother with the test at such a low dose?

my response to test is very atypical, i get some of the effects, i get estrogen gyno, I get a crazy increase in libido, i get oily skin and some acne, but i just don't make any gains from it... This always leads to people questioning my diet/training hence the angry bear, lol, but it just really doesn't do much.

Anyway the purpose of it here is just so that I don't have to do a PCT after my SD/PP bulking phase. I don't have to go through any period of time with low testosterone levels so I should be able to keep more gains. Plus the libido boost is good old fashioned fun.

Last time I ran test I started at 750mg a week and it helped me keep some gains from my oral kickstart but didn't do much for making new gains... went to 1.2g or so and it didn't change anything...

 

[Silver3CSRT8]

How often are you planning to pin the sust? I have really been researching it and part of me wants to try it due to the cheaper price, faster acting esters and higher test concentration per ml. However, I heard some recommending eod dosing or min of 3x per week. Being my first cycle I don't want to pin that often so I prefer 2x per week injections.

Besides that, the layout looks great and I look forward to following along.

 

[Cassavus]

Oh man that's sick! Really looking forward to this. :thumbsup:

 

[UnrealMachine]

How often are you planning to pin the sust? I have really been researching it and part of me wants to try it due to the cheaper price, faster acting esters and higher test concentration per ml. However, I heard some recommending eod dosing or min of 3x per week. Being my first cycle I don't want to pin that often so I prefer 2x per week injections.

Besides that, the layout looks great and I look forward to following along.

I'm only going to inject 1x per week this time. To take advantage of the propionate, it should be dosed more frequently, cuz the prop will fluctuate a bit more. But sustanon is mostly long esters, and the 100mg decanoate component has a 2 week half life so I think i'll be stable enough, it's certainly been done before anyway... But i can report my results

 

[HumpTheCook]

i swear by the "cruise"!
i think you are going to love this, im planning on doing similar with my current cycle.
is there a particular reason you are using sust rather than just a test e or c? it seems to me that you are going to open yourself up to the possibility of alot more sides cause your test levels are going to fluctuating greatly between the weekly shots do to the short esters in the test. especially if you are prone to gyno as you mentioned.

 

[UnrealMachine]

yeah there's method to the madness, i'm using Sust and that much of it because that's exactly what I've got. I've got about 26mL of sust250.

As for the fluctuating levels causing gyno, eh, hopefully it's a low enough dose that my estrogen won't get so high, if it does then I'll just do what I usually do and add letro until it goes away and then taper the dose down to a few drops eod or so. In an ideal world, i'd have test cypionate. But i'm gonna try it out, i'm sure i'll be fine.

 

[warrenpeace]

I thought universally test injections lead to gains in healthy, young males. Are you expecting too much? Gradual, baby steps lead to long-term gains. Only you know your body, but this looks like overkill to me. Orals are nothing to take lightly, and I imagine some would even go so far as to classify this as a "suicide cycle". I wouldn't go that far, and you'll probably blow up to be sure, but at what cost?

If more people focused on how they're going to normalize after a cycle and took the necessary steps to expedite that process while on, then we'd have a lot bigger bodybuilders walking around. Too often the perception and focus is on "how do I get big as **** during this cycle?" rather than "how can I maintain reasonable gains and get my body back in working order quickly after coming off"

 

[UnrealMachine]

My cycles need to be overkill because I'm not the best responder around.

Test doesn't do much, in my log i was at 1.125g test and 600mg mast, also raised my cals past maintenance, made the most modest gains, like a 1-rep strength increase every few weeks, which is the same as my natural rate since i was topping out my natural limits

As far as a suicide cycle though lol it's really not so bad, it's just two oral cycles with a 7 week separation and a test base. It's cycle # 9 for me. My last cycle I was pumping almost 2grams a week and finished the cycle popping M1T, you wanna know how recovery was?
EASY! The last few months have been easy for me to go natural since i recovered so well, my test levels feel higher than baseline. Seriously I've had a better libido, more oily skin and acne in the last few months than before any cycle. It has given me much confidence because ever since transitioning to clomid-based PCTs, i've been able to come out of PCT with higher test than pre-cycle. It's like kickstarting your natural test levels into high gear. And the combination of clomid and PP's TRS stack was simply awesome.

So i'm not too worried about coming off. Granted I don't want this cycle to encourage any noobs to do something stupid. But i've used SD 4 times, PP 3 times, test 3 times, Halodrol once (at 50mg i couldn't even feel it).

Appreciate your concern though brother that's what it's all about here.

 

[HumpTheCook]

I thought universally test injections lead to gains in healthy, young males. Are you expecting too much? Gradual, baby steps lead to long-term gains. Only you know your body, but this looks like overkill to me. Orals are nothing to take lightly, and I imagine some would even go so far as to classify this as a "suicide cycle". I wouldn't go that far, and you'll probably blow up to be sure, but at what cost?

If more people focused on how they're going to normalize after a cycle and took the necessary steps to expedite that process while on, then we'd have a lot bigger bodybuilders walking around. Too often the perception and focus is on "how do I get big as **** during this cycle?" rather than "how can I maintain reasonable gains and get my body back in working order quickly after coming off"

as it pertains to Unreal's cycle, i have to disagree with you whole heartedly. yes there are alot of people you do not PCT properly and they should. by the sounds of it Unreal is not one of those people. PCT is to help fight the side effects that occur when your body does through rapid changes caused by removing the foreign compounds from your body and your body attempting to regulate itself. if you dont come off completely, then you do not have to worry until you do. at 375 mg a wk, he is going taking a low enough does that there should be no side effects directing related to the sust, thus allowing himself to bridge two cycles with an appropriate 7 weeks in between. his liver gets the rest it needs before introducing more orals to it.

i honestly believe by doing this you limit your chance for alot of side effects that occur during pct and also enable yourself to keep alot more of your gains. then Unreal will do a full and proper PCT im sure.

good luck Unreal!

 

[mooch2321]

I thought universally test injections lead to gains in healthy, young males. Are you expecting too much? Gradual, baby steps lead to long-term gains. Only you know your body, but this looks like overkill to me. Orals are nothing to take lightly, and I imagine some would even go so far as to classify this as a "suicide cycle". I wouldn't go that far, and you'll probably blow up to be sure, but at what cost?

If more people focused on how they're going to normalize after a cycle and took the necessary steps to expedite that process while on, then we'd have a lot bigger bodybuilders walking around. Too often the perception and focus is on "how do I get big as **** during this cycle?" rather than "how can I maintain reasonable gains and get my body back in working order quickly after coming off"

nice third post!

what up unreal!

 

[UnrealMachine]

PCT will be lots of clomid and half of a TRS that I've got left, last time this worked awesome. I suppose the prop and phenylprop causing fluctuations is my biggest concern at this point but IF i diagnose that as a problem, i will simply stab myself more... I just wanted to try to minimize the stabbing and jabbing over a frigging 5 month period.

MOOCH in da house! Its been a while man i hope u are off your injury and busting your ass in the gym once again

Anyway yesterday i was itching to start so after I got the first couple posts of encouragement I went right ahead and pinned the first shot of Sust, went in like a charm, I actually like pinning, just feel like it'd be a waste to pin 0.65mL twice a week.

Starting the Superdrol and Phera stack next Friday. I've got SD-1 and P-Plex from 2007, the 15mg capsules that are good stuff.

 

[HumpTheCook]

Anyway yesterday i was itching to start so after I got the first couple posts of encouragement I went right ahead and pinned the first shot of Sust, went in like a charm, I actually like pinning, just feel like it'd be a waste to pin 0.65mL twice a week.

i love pinning too!
i really think you'd be best shooting on the twice a wk sched bro.
good luck my man, you got everything covered! dont let the neysayers get to ya, this is gonna be a great 5 months for you!

 

[hard iron]

Haha the mad scientist, Unreal's back. sub'd for another rollercoaster kind of log!

 

[Dragon13]

Subbin' in. Hey Unreal, have you ever gotten a LFT post-cycle? On-cycle? Or ever at all? I'm curious - really curious - to see how your liver has responded to the high-dose orals.

 

[liftin4fun]

Subbed...

 

[UnrealMachine]

Subbin' in. Hey Unreal, have you ever gotten a LFT post-cycle? On-cycle? Or ever at all? I'm curious - really curious - to see how your liver has responded to the high-dose orals.

nope. Never got anything to indicate liver stress which I've seen so often here (no appetite, easy bruising, pale stool, side pain, yellow skin/eyes). Don't necessarily want to push to that point, but I'm very confident that as crazy as I go, I am staying well below that point. Liver stress/damage is a gradual thing, I know what to look for, so it can't creep up on me.

You curious about some liver #s, you should ask Jasen how his liver is doing, he's the one stacking anadrol with 30mg of superdrol, lol.

 

[HumpTheCook]

nope. Never got anything to indicate liver stress which I've seen so often here (no appetite, easy bruising, pale stool, side pain, yellow skin/eyes). Don't necessarily want to push to that point, but I'm very confident that as crazy as I go, I am staying well below that point. Liver stress/damage is a gradual thing, I know what to look for, so it can't creep up on me.

You curious about some liver #s, you should ask Jasen how his liver is doing, he's the one stacking anadrol with 30mg of superdrol, lol.

and contemplating m1t

 

[UnrealMachine]

and contemplating m1t

Oya i forgot about that, lolllll. I think he's gonna go for the halotestin finisher on that cycle. The more I read on this board and others, the more I am impressed with how much the human body can handle.

 

[HumpTheCook]

Oya i forgot about that, lolllll. I think he's gonna go for the halotestin finisher on that cycle. The more I read on this board and others, the more I am impressed with how much the human body can handle.

haha and he's going to do it tough man style. no supps and no water.

the human body is very very tough. its amazing.

 

[warrenpeace]

The liver can get run over by a dump truck and regenerate, it's the kidneys I'd try to keep in good condition. Mess them up and you're done!

 

[TheDarkHalf]

subbed

 

[crazyfool405]

i don't get much from test, I figure I'll use it as a base underneath two oral cycles to get away with one less PCT and keep more weight after the first oral cycle (which is the bulking cycle)

it's a pretty simple Bulk then Cut

1-19 sustanon 325mg a week
2-5 SD 20mg straight
2-6 PheraPlex 30mg straight
14-20 Halodrol 75mg ---> 150mg i'll dose according to feel
14-19 T3 ramped up to 75mcg and back down

so by the 7th week, that weak ass dose of sust should be built up strong enough to at least help me maintain some of the big ass gains from my SD/PP bulking period. I got 7 weeks to recover my liver and workout with just the sust which is gonna be the same as natural lifting for me but I'll try to maintain my gains. Last phase i'm pretty confident with, high-dosed Hdrol with T3, and the appropriate diet and cardio. That should be long enough for me to get ripped up like last summer (my avatar picture) but hopefully at a higher bodyweight (i'm only 212 in my avatar!).

Been all natural since January so 5 months now, looking forward to 5 months on! Basically took Jan/Feb/March more or less off the gym and so I'm 2 months back at it getting it back, 220 and like 11% right now.

Tired of bitchin about how test doesn't work so i'm just not going to expect any gains from it, just the lack of a PCT and low test period. the point of this cycle is to get crazy with the **** that works for me (SD, PP) and use test just so that I can bridge that into a heavily assisted cut

any feedback guys? This is what my mind came up with and I'm just itching to stab myself with the first pin...

alrighty here it goes....

i think you should run it for 24 weeks, 3 monnth bulk, then 3 month RECOMP, then PCT as maintence as same diet for recomp phase.

with that said, and knowing how you dont really respond to test, i think you should maybe bump the test up to 400-500mg and do 2x per week injections.

Reason for this is to constantly build up serum test levels, so it appears that your levels are getting very high, yet using less hormone. i think with will serve the best purpose for what you are trying to achieve.

when you get to the last few weeks start doing 1x a week injections to slowly lower serum levels and then dose down to ease into PCT.

i think you should run Hdrol and PPLEX together due to synergy, and the ability for both of them to increase t3 levels by lowering TBG and TBPA. thus the need for a little less t3 in the cycle.

you also may want to add your masteron in there for added hardness the last 10 weeks as well.

just some thoguhts though.

 

[crazyfool405]

may want to look into IGF for 3 weeks on 1 week off for the last 10 weeks and going into pct, at 40mcg per day.

 

[HumpTheCook]

may want to look into IGF for 3 weeks on 1 week off for the last 10 weeks and going into pct, at 40mcg per day.

ive always wanted to try igf-1 at the end of a cycle so the build up would help me keep growing through PCT.

 

[Jasen]

nope. Never got anything to indicate liver stress which I've seen so often here (no appetite, easy bruising, pale stool, side pain, yellow skin/eyes). Don't necessarily want to push to that point, but I'm very confident that as crazy as I go, I am staying well below that point. Liver stress/damage is a gradual thing, I know what to look for, so it can't creep up on me.

You curious about some liver #s, you should ask Jasen how his liver is doing, he's the one stacking anadrol with 30mg of superdrol, lol.

F U unreal LMFAO HAHAHAHHAHA JK yah im still alive doing great! good luck on this unreal. hey i was also thinkin in final 6-8weeks of cycle add in hdrol or winnie to cut up nicely. which would u go with. ofcourse hdrol at 100-125mg a day

 

[Jasen]

and contemplating m1t

IF i had some m1t i knew was 100% it would already be all up in my body i am makin a trip tomrrow to see if the neighborhood supp shop has any other orals i can put in my body i will outMASS you unreal! even if i end up in the ICU

 

[Jasen]

Oya i forgot about that, lolllll. I think he's gonna go for the halotestin finisher on that cycle. The more I read on this board and others, the more I am impressed with how much the human body can handle.

i WISH i had access to halostein!

 

[Jasen]

if i had acesss to more oral steroids this cycle would be quite a big one

 

[UnrealMachine]

lol. I dunno which finisher is best, i've never used winstrol and i've never used Hdrol at a proper dose so this will be my first time. I think Hdrol at that dose will be perfect for what I'm looking for anyway.

I'm not so sure if M1T would be so great it was kinda weak for me, i only ran 10mg and didn't notice much, next time i'll do 20 but if it doesn't work as good as SD i don't see why i would ever use it! Now halotestin LOL one day i will get my hands on some.

I can't wait to start my SD/PP stack. Last time I was on that it was only for a couple weeks, but i felt more jacked by the day, the hardness and vascularity i got was incredible. I dunno about 18 pounds in 2 weeks LOL but i'm expecting a pretty decent number.

 

[Jasen]

oh yah love the vacularity i got from this cycle its insane my arm looks like one of those photoshoped BB pics in those magazine. while i train! love it even of the gym

 

[gymaddict20]

I'm defn down for the ride Unreal. This is going to be sick. Rip it up brother!!!!!!

 

[Dragon13]

nope. Never got anything to indicate liver stress which I've seen so often here (no appetite, easy bruising, pale stool, side pain, yellow skin/eyes). Don't necessarily want to push to that point, but I'm very confident that as crazy as I go, I am staying well below that point. Liver stress/damage is a gradual thing, I know what to look for, so it can't creep up on me.

You curious about some liver #s, you should ask Jasen how his liver is doing, he's the one stacking anadrol with 30mg of superdrol, lol.

Well, you certainly have plenty of experience, but the apprearance of symptoms from liver damage usually means you're pretty far along. You can do quite a bit of damage and still be asymptomatic. Have you ever had any BW done since you started cycling to check for abnormalities (lipids especially)? Just curious.

And... holy **** on the bold above. Why?? There's just no need.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Well, you certainly have plenty of experience, but the apprearance of symptoms from liver damage usually means you're pretty far along. You can do quite a bit of damage and still be asymptomatic. Have you ever had any BW done since you started cycling to check for abnormalities (lipids especially)? Just curious.

And... holy **** on the bold above. Why?? There's just no need.

I have never had any bloodwork done. I know I am taking a risk. That's just the way it is. In an ideal world, things would be different. If I'm setting a bad example then I'm sorry, but I feel confident that this is a risk that I can take.

 

[HumpTheCook]

I have never had any bloodwork done. I know I am taking a risk. That's just the way it is. In an ideal world, things would be different. If I'm setting a bad example then I'm sorry, but I feel confident that this is a risk that I can take.

we all are making educated decisions, most likely some good and some bad. but they are our own decisions and we are sharing our experiences to help others make their own decisions. we dont try to convince others to do it or not do it, just to educate and share our experiences.

if we were in the gym to be healthy we wouldnt touch any of this and we would eat a balanced diet with all our fruits and veggies. but its not how we roll.

im stoked for you Unreal.

 

[UnrealMachine]

lol good. I am stoked too! Another week and i'll be poppin SD/PP and I am sure to blow up on that combo.
I know going by "feel" on cycle doesn't scientifically mean anything, but no matter how many methyls i pump, I always feel good and my sides are low. I get backpumps from enough SD and PP, and i'm susceptible to gyno, but besides that I don't really get any sides.

I don't get BP headaches, i don't get lost libido (except from Tren **** that stuff), i don't get lethargy, i don't get sleeping problems, i don't get appetite lost, i don't get "rage" i don't get emotional fluctuations, don't get hairloss... what are the other sides? I don't get them. I never feel like i'm pushing my body, not compared to how some people feel here. Some steroids just flat out don't ****ing work on me. I'm guessing my pattern of nonresponse indicates less taxation on my system. Perhaps this is naive of me... we will see.

 

[SouthernCharm]

this cycle is like robbing a bank, getting in a high speed chase and getting away to count that sweet chedda! definitely in for this crazy ride! im very upset that my superdrol will gather dust due to my possibly torn shoulder... so at least I can watch others have fun!

 

[gymaddict20]

we all are making educated decisions, most likely some good and some bad. but they are our own decisions and we are sharing our experiences to help others make their own decisions. we dont try to convince others to do it or not do it, just to educate and share our experiences.

if we were in the gym to be healthy we wouldnt touch any of this and we would eat a balanced diet with all our fruits and veggies. but its not how we roll.

im stoked for you Unreal.

Very nicely put Hump. I wouldn't consider UnrealMachine setting any bad examples. He has helped me set up and run some of my past cycles. He also wrote the book on injectables and superdrol lol. Rip it up Unreal, I am planning a sick inject/oral cycle myself and am very interested in your results. :fing02:

 

[appleyard]

Dude, you're nuts!


In for the ride!

 

[Dragon13]

I hear ya Unreal, just be careful. Good luck on the cycle, I'll be following with interest, as I have my 1st inject cycle planned for late summer. I'm prob looking at test E kicked with either SD, PP, or dbol. It will be my first run with any of the compounds.

 

[Dragon13]

Just had a thought Unreal: why sust again, and is it from the same source as last time? If it were me, I wouldn't go anywhere near another round of sust from your old supplier.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Just had a thought Unreal: why sust again, and is it from the same source as last time? If it were me, I wouldn't go anywhere near another round of sust from your old supplier.

Read post #9. If it increases my libido, if it aggravates my gyno (which is fixed by an AI), and if it gives me oily skin, then it's got to be TEST and not some other random steroid. If it were underdosed, then pumping 4.5mL a week should render that a non-issue. If i do that and make gains at a basically natural rate, what conclusions can you draw?

Consider that this has also happened with different test that worked for my buddy.

Alright good. This is the last I am gonna talk about this. I just accept that I am an anomaly, and do what works for me, hence this cycle.

 

[Dragon13]

Read post #9. If it increases my libido, if it aggravates my gyno (which is fixed by an AI), and if it gives me oily skin, then it's got to be TEST and not some other random steroid. If it were underdosed, then pumping 4.5mL a week should render that a non-issue. If i do that and make gains at a basically natural rate, what conclusions can you draw?

Consider that this has also happened with different test that worked for my buddy.

Alright good. This is the last I am gonna talk about this. I just accept that I am an anomaly, and do what works for me, hence this cycle.

PMing you.