Time frame to reduce SHBG & feel normal again?

UCSMiami

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Hello everyone. New person here. Did a search and read many threads. Pardon my long thread but I am concerned.

Has anyone been able to retrieve their energy and libido pre-high SHBG?
I was 47 years of age, 5'11 and weighed 170lbs. Have always been healthy, sharp minded and with never ending energy.(I mean I had the energy of a 20year old through my 30s and early 40s.) Noticed a decline late last year in the attributes mentioned above. I thought it was due to my wife and I being separated and presumed I would snap out of it. I started a cardio routine in January 2012 and started going 4x per week with good results for overall energy but I will still had afternoon mental fogginess.
I was feeling tired every now and then and still had loss of libido and visited a Dr for full bloodwork and had the following results:

June 07,2012 Labcorp Tampa

Serum T 970, 348-1197 ng/dl scale
Free T 12.7, 6.8-21.5 pg/ml scale
Pregnenolone 14ng/dl scale not listed
Reverse T3 26.3, 30-100 ng/ml scale
DHEA 208.2, 44.3-331 ug/dl scale
SHBG 87.5, 16.5 -55.9nmol/l scale
Vitamin D 26.3, 30-100ng/ml

Otherwise all was in normal range. Estradiol was 16.1 on a scale of 7.6-42.6pg/ml

Dr. Started me on Pregnenolone,100mg, and Vitamin D and I started a serious strength training progam instead of cardio.(I have insomnia from the cardio due to be revved up at night after a workout) I have gained much strength and definition since the first week of June when starting lifting. Mental fogginess went away. Energy is usually quite good. Libido is low but then my wife and I are still separated and I presume it is because of that situation.

I recently, Sept 18.2012, went for a blood retest and had the following results:

Serum T 755, 348-1197ng/dl scale
Free T 9.8, 6.8-21.5pg/ml scale
Pregnenolone 32ng/dl no scale
Reverse T3 26.1, 13.5-34.2ng/ml
DHEA 243.1, 44.3-331ug/dl scale
SHBG 73.9, 16.5-55.9nmol/l scale
Vitamin D 38.5, 30-100 ng/ml scale

I was rather disappointed at the reduction in T levels and still high SHBG. I still have to continuing supplementing with Vitamin D and Preg. Dr. believes I have an inflamed liver or G.I. track and gave me a detox power to take every day until the next retest in 90days. Again, I truly worked hard at physical activity +zinc supplements, horny goat weed,food selection,etc. I was happy until the results were revealed. Now, I wonder how much progression can actually be done and what time frame I am looking at?
Anyone have input on these questions?
 

Mr.TT

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I was rather disappointed at the reduction in T levels and still high SHBG. I still have to continuing supplementing with Vitamin D and Preg. Dr. believes I have an inflamed liver or G.I. track and gave me a detox power to take every day until the next retest in 90days. Again, I truly worked hard at physical activity with zinc supplements, horny goat weed. I was happy until the results. Now, I wonder how much progression can actually be done and what time frame I am looking at?
Anyone have input on these questions?
Incase it works, will you share with us the name of this "DETOX POWDER"????? PLEASE...
 
tnubs

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If you want a short term shbg inhibitor u can stack something like exemestane and stinging nettle. Will drop your shbg significantly in a short time span but you can't run it long term with the same effects. But at least you can be certain shbg is the cause
 
UCSMiami

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^^Yes of course. I return for the results the first week of January.

^I purchase some stinging nettle yesterday. I note exemestane is a drug and would rather be all natural. Have never used a prescription drug. I have been that healthy all these years. I know I have to find the root cause of the high SHBG. Strange, I have been feeling wonderful the previous several weeks as I got into my stride with the workouts and the Vit. D and Preg. eliminated the mental fogginess. Not quite pre-2011 levels but a considerable improvement over earlier this year.
 

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Do you feel sad and depressed?
I think is because of the separation too, and although it has not much to do with test production since yours is almost 1000, I believe is the mental aspect that is the culprit. There are many chemical reactions taking place in your head and when our bodies are stressed mentally and physically other organs inside go array. Some ppl get very attached to their mates and when that bond gets broken the brain goes crazy.
I've been there and done that. It's quite annoying to say the least. Work on geting your head in the right place and get your spouse out of the picture and begin the mental healing first. How long has it been since separation if you dont mind me asking?

BTW, your test is lower because you prob traininig too hard. Back off it wont help you but end up overtraining. Do the same type training when your test was close to 1000.
I had same bouts with separation issues where my sex drive would plumed for 6-12 months then would come back on its own. It was all mental because it happened every time I would break up with a girl.
I mean in your case could be the liver anything is possible but I bet on the mental issue much more.
 

vassille

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Do you feel sad and depressed?
I think is because of the separation too, and although it has not much to do with test production since yours is almost 1000, I believe is the mental aspect that is the culprit. There are many chemical reactions taking place in your head and when our bodies are stressed mentally and physically other organs inside go array. Some ppl get very attached to their mates and when that bond gets broken the brain goes crazy.
I've been there and done that. It's quite annoying to say the least. Work on geting your head in the right place and get your spouse out of the picture and begin the mental healing first. How long has it been since separation if you dont mind me asking?

BTW, your test is lower because you prob traininig too hard. Back off it wont help you but end up overtraining. Do the same type training when your test was close to 1000.
I had same bouts with separation issues where my sex drive would plumed for 6-12 months then would come back on its own. It was all mental because it happened every time I would break up with a girl.
I mean in your case could be the liver anything is possible but I bet on the mental issue much more.
 
The Matrix

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Do you feel sad and depressed?I think is because of the separation too, and although it has not much to do with test production since yours is almost 1000, I believe is the mental aspect that is the culprit. There are many chemical reactions taking place in your head and when our bodies are stressed mentally and physically other organs inside go array. Some ppl get very attached to their mates and when that bond gets broken the brain goes crazy. I've been there and done that. It's quite annoying to say the least. Work on geting your head in the right place and get your spouse out of the picture and begin the mental healing first. How long has it been since separation if you dont mind me asking?BTW, your test is lower because you prob traininig too hard. Back off it wont help you but end up overtraining. Do the same type training when your test was close to 1000. I had same bouts with separation issues where my sex drive would plumed for 6-12 months then would come back on its own. It was all mental because it happened every time I would break up with a girl. I mean in your case could be the liver anything is possible but I bet on the mental issue much more.
Need to find the underlying cause which is driving it up. There is a possibility this may be linked back to a specific gene I am finding in people which have a higher probability of having higher SHBG. I need to do further research in evaluate this. Also need to look at medications currently taking. Coming down to conclusion it has to due with blockage in detoxification pathways. This trend has just been coming about in last 5-7 years which tells me its more environmentally related.
 
UCSMiami

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Do you feel sad and depressed?
I think is because of the separation too, and although it has not much to do with test production since yours is almost 1000, I believe is the mental aspect that is the culprit. There are many chemical reactions taking place in your head and when our bodies are stressed mentally and physically other organs inside go array. Some ppl get very attached to their mates and when that bond gets broken the brain goes crazy.
I've been there and done that. It's quite annoying to say the least. Work on geting your head in the right place and get your spouse out of the picture and begin the mental healing first. How long has it been since separation if you dont mind me asking?

BTW, your test is lower because you prob traininig too hard. Back off it wont help you but end up overtraining. Do the same type training when your test was close to 1000.
I had same bouts with separation issues where my sex drive would plumed for 6-12 months then would come back on its own. It was all mental because it happened every time I would break up with a girl.
I mean in your case could be the liver anything is possible but I bet on the mental issue much more.
I did feel considerable and intense sadness and depression at the commencement of the separation-August 2011. I only do so now if I dwell on the subject which I try mightily not to. We do communicate regularly and there is a sadness following our discussions. Otherwise, all is good and pleasant with life other than the reasons for visiting a Dr. and posting here.

Regarding overtraining-agreed. I compared my routine and schedule with a few regulars and I am exceeding recommended reps and weights. Scaled back and added cardio into the routine as of yesterday.

I will report back in January and advise what the results are from following the Dr's recommendation + own mental and physical exercise. I was wondering what type of time frame to plan for. Have never been ill,(other than a cold), and so find this experience unusual.
 
The Matrix

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Probably over training causing depletion of.glutathione which can start a whole cascade of issues.
 

vassille

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I did feel considerable and intense sadness and depression at the commencement of the separation-August 2011. I only do so now if I dwell on the subject which I try mightily not to. We do communicate regularly and there is a sadness following our discussions. Otherwise, all is good and pleasant with life other than the reasons for visiting a Dr. and posting here.

Regarding overtraining-agreed. I compared my routine and schedule with a few regulars and I am exceeding recommended reps and weights. Scaled back and added cardio into the routine as of yesterday.

I will report back in January and advise what the results are from following the Dr's recommendation + own mental and physical exercise. I was wondering what type of time frame to plan for. Have never been ill,(other than a cold), and so find this experience unusual.
Since it's has been a year so far I would say 3-6 more months if not better then is time to dig deeper.
Good thing is that your body is making a load of test which is a good thing.
One thing I would suggest and not to get too personal is to start dating around without being too worried of this issue. Just talk to other women and enjoy the new life. Time will heal the sadness and the stress you have been through. Love can be a powerful thing sometimes
Wish you the best and keep us posted.
 
UCSMiami

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I appreciate the courtesy but I am fully functional in my public life.Fortunately, I have a postive and cheerful disposition. I do not wallow in sadness.(Well, not now) I realize there are connections between emotional and physical injuries. I asked the Q.s above so to be able to forecast and plan around and after this predicament.

NB: I get your point and have passed it on many times to disconsolate acquaintainces in similar situations...Time Heals All Wounds.

Thanks Again.
 
Beau

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Can you please elaborate on the detox powder you mentioned above?

Thanks
 
UCSMiami

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I do not know if I am allowed to mention a non-sponsor source.(I just started here and do not wish to fall under the ban hammer) I noticed the ingredients are a mixture of vitamins, amino acids, herbal extracts and some others which I have not yet researched.
 

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Was Ornithine in you detox powder? Lipoic Acid? Milk Thistle(silymarin)?

Do you know your ALT and AST levels and ranges?
 
UCSMiami

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AST 20 IU/L scale 0-40
AKT 32 IU/L scale 0-55

Milk thistle yes

Lipoic Acid no.

Hurt my stomach terribly the first two days. No negative effects now.
 
The Matrix

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AST 20 IU/L scale 0-40
AKT 32 IU/L scale 0-55

Milk thistle yes

Lipoic Acid no.

Hurt my stomach terribly the first two days. No negative effects now.
Liver values are not accurate reading of how the liver is truly functioning. Dr had a case of 2nd stage cirhorrsis with normal values.
 
UCSMiami

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Hello Folks, back as promised. Just returned from the Dr.

Blood drawn on 12-27-2012. Work done by LabCorp Tampa

Serum T 820, 348-1197ng/dl scale
Free T 11.5, 6.8-21.5pg/ml scale
DHEA 218.4, 44.3-331ug/dl scale
SHBG 64.1 16.5-55.9nmol/l scale

AST 19 IU/L scale 0-40
AKT 21 IU/L scale 0-55

I feel wonderful and have been for the previous few months. Almost back to the pre2011 Jack Russell-like energy levels. I attribute the improvement to the continued weight training and Pregnenolone. Maybe the detox powder the Dr. insisted on. Maybe the Stinging Nettles helped. I do not consume the latter every day-on/off. Libido has improved.

Return in six months to see how the values above are. Also my Vit. D and Pregnelolone are within normal values now. Every other facet tested just plain shows good health.

Still trying to work things out with my wife. I am not a quitter. Stresses me when I think about it which is daily. Otherwise life is great.

I should mention I have been pushing/pulling/lifting every bit as hard as when I started. No letup. Still at it. Part of life like eating/sleeping. I stopped for one week prior to the blood draw date.

I would like to lower the SHBG to at least within the 55.9 nmol/L of the scale being used.

I will check back in at the next blood draw results.
 
The Matrix

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Hello Folks, back as promised. Just returned from the Dr.

Blood drawn on 12-27-2012. Work done by LabCorp Tampa

Serum T 820, 348-1197ng/dl scale
Free T 11.5, 6.8-21.5pg/ml scale
DHEA 218.4, 44.3-331ug/dl scale
SHBG 64.1 16.5-55.9nmol/l scale

AST 19 IU/L scale 0-40
AKT 21 IU/L scale 0-55

I feel wonderful and have been for the previous few months. Almost back to the pre2011 Jack Russell-like energy levels. I attribute the improvement to the continued weight training and Pregnenolone. Maybe the detox powder the Dr. insisted on. Maybe the Stinging Nettles helped. I do not consume them every day-on/off. Libido has improved.

Return in six months to see how the values above are. Also my Vit. D and Pregnelolone are within normal values now. Every other facet tested just plain shows good health.

Still trying to work things out with my wife. I am not a quitter. Stresses me when I think about it which is daily. Otherwise life is great.

I should mention I have been pushing/pulling/lifting every bit as hard as when I started. No letup. Still at it. Part of life like eating/sleeping. I stopped for one week prior to the blood draw date.

I would like to lower the SHBG to at least within the 55.9 nmol/L of the scale being used.

I will check back in at the next blood draw results.
What I have been mentioning all along. SHBG is a sign of inflammation which can indicated hidden liver imbalances resulting in altered detoxfication pathways. It may take another 6 months for it to come down completely. Kudos to your DR. Your Dr may want to get in contact with me about genetic SNPS in relationship to detoxification pathways. I have been using them very successful in Doctor's patients for a number of health related issues. PM me
 
UCSMiami

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Hello Everyone,

I am 30 days away from my next bloodwork. Thought to ask a few questions:

Q.1 How many days prior to the blood test should I discontinue weightlifting so as to achieve accurate results? I do not take any stimulants or supplements.

Q.2 Aside from those listed below what other values should I ask the Dr. to test for?
They currently consist of the: CBC With Differential/Platelet, Comp. Metabolic Panel (14), Urinalysis, Routine, Lipid Panel With LDL/HDL Ratio, FSH and LH and the various values as below

Serum T
Free T
Reverse T3
DHEA
SHBG
Estradiol

Should I request a test for thyroid? Other hormones not mentioned above?

I admit I feel wonderful. Do not wish to leave anything overlooked.
 
ELROCK

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Good to see you are feeling well! Keep on the right/good path!

Best of luck!
 
UCSMiami

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Hello Everyone,

Updating this thread. Blood draw on 4-21-2014. Labwork by LabCorp Tampa

Serum T 810, 348-1197ng/dl scale
Free T not enough blood for result, 6.8-21.5pg/ml scale
DHEA 240, 44.3-331ug/dl scale
SHBG 55, 16.5-55.9nmol/l scale

AST 40, IU/L scale 0-40
ALT 115, IU/L scale 0-55 I wrote AKT in earlier tests. I meant ALT

Full panel test. All other values within normal range. Dr. took me off 100mg pregnenolone as of 4-21-2014. I was consuming a 100mg capsule every two days.(I did not know it was a steroid!)

I was working out strenuously for 10 days prior to the blood draw. Dr. thinks that is why the liver values are high-due to the weight training. Took two weeks off weight training, only cardio and blood draw with results in today to see if there is a change. I use creatine as well but do not know if that will affect those values. I should have stopped but you know how it is.

Feel wonderful otherwise.

Will update thread as soon as I hear about the latest result.
 
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Beau

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Hello Everyone,

Updating this thread. Blood draw on 4-21-2014. Labwork by LabCorp Tampa

Serum T 810, 348-1197ng/dl scale
Free T not enough blood for result, 6.8-21.5pg/ml scale
DHEA 240, 44.3-331ug/dl scale
SHBG 55, 16.5-55.9nmol/l scale

AST 40, IU/L scale 0-40
ALT 115, IU/L scale 0-55 I wrote AKT in earlier tests. I meant ALT

Full panel test. All other values within normal range. Dr. took me off 100mg pregnenolone as of 4-21-2014. I was consuming a 100mg capsule every two days.(I did not know it was a steroid!)

I was working out strenuously for 10 days prior to the blood draw. Dr. thinks it is due to the weight training. Took two weeks off weight training, only cardio and blood draw with results in today to see if there is a change. I use creatine as well but do not know if that will affect those values. I should have stopped but you know how it is.

Feel wonderful otherwise.

Will update thread as soon as I hear about the latest result.
Thank you for the update.

Keep up the good work.
 
UCSMiami

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Bit of a downer. Dr. did not redo liver ALT/AST but rather various Hepatitits, IGF-1,etc.

Everything negative(Hep) or normal except
My IGF-1 is 262nl/ml on a scale of 67-205.

I am rescheduled for a full panel on May 23. No lifting until then. I requested he do a GGT.

Should I be concerned at the high IGF-1? IGFBP-3 was well within normal range
 

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what is the liver detox powder? what does it contain?
 
UCSMiami

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Bit of a downer. Dr. did not redo liver ALT/AST but rather various Hepatitits, IGF-1,etc.

Everything negative(Hep) or normal except
My IGF-1 is 262nl/ml on a scale of 67-205.

I am rescheduled for a full panel on May 23. No lifting until then. I requested he do a GGT.

Should I be concerned at the high IGF-1? IGFBP-3 was well within normal range
Liver values back to normal after one week off weight lifting.

GGT was low as well.

IGF-1 still high and Dr. says that is good.
 
UCSMiami

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Thought to update this thread. Annual physical exam results back. Blood work is fine.

Serum T 779
Free T9 (low but explained below)
SHBG 49

All other values in line except...

My Iron (Ferrintin IIRC) and related red blood values were low as in anemia levels which depress Testosterone. Apparently perennial vigourous exercise depletes iron more swiftly than otherwise. Drastically reduced the amount of red meat in my diet a few months ago.(I also regularly give blood as it is a special type) Previously I ate red meat 3 and 5x per week. I have to increase my intake of iron rich foods or supplement or both.

Thought to pass it on as an FYI regarding watch your iron levels. I workout very hard every day and only rest when CNS is an issue.

Strange, I felt no fatigue or other symptoms of low iron. Dr. said it was because I am in top shape.
 
UCSMiami

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Thought to update again. Bloodwork came back.

Iron levels are normal again. Serum T is 830, Free T11.3 SHBG is 60 DHT is 46-(top end of scale)

Clean bill of health. I did not know about DHT until advised on this occasion.

NB: I stopped donating blood.
 

v4lu3s

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thanks for the long term updates. too often these things never get shared and we all wonder what happened (especially if we are in the same boat).
 
UCSMiami

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Well annual physical results came back today to update this thread.

Total T 690 scale 250-1100
Free T 61.3 scale 46-224
Bioavailable T 123.5 scale 110-575
SHBG 50 scale 10-50
DHT 43 scale 16-79
Preg 32 scale 13-208
Estradiol 21 scale less than or equal to 29
DHEA 141 scale 80-560
LH 4.1 scale 1.5-9.3
My anemia is gone as Ferritin and Iron levels are back to normal. No longer donate blood.
Cholesterol values are outstanding
Picture of good health.

Dr. was happy. I am not as I see my T declining from when I first started back in 2012.(but I had high SHBG back then see first post) I recall what someone here wrote about their SHBG being in locked step with their total T. I feel good and train hard seven days per week. Eat well. Good libido. Sex every day. But I see the Free T on the low end of the scale and wonder if I could be better. Dr. Does HRT at his clinic but said no to me as I do not fit the criteria either in test results or factors mentioned above- energy, libido, mood, etc.


Dr. did say my DHEA and Preg should be higher and put me back on OTC Preg. I stopped for the previous 8 months or so.

Wonder what I can do to gain more Free T. I mean in 2012 I was more than middle range, then a bit less than middle range and now low end of the range.

NB: Not into selfie pics but I took a recent one from August so you see how much improvement there has been since pic in avatar. Its in the album. So I do not think it is BF that is causing the issue.
 

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Thanks for the update, your posts are useful to read.
 
UCSMiami

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You know I reread my posts and realized how miserable I felt in 2012 compared to how good I feel now. I should not be complaining about a test result if everything else is going well.
 

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If you feel fine and things are working, then you can relax a bit. If things aren't perfect, you can still pursue more information and improvements. I'm glad things became better for you.
 
UCSMiami

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Thought to update. Bi-annual blood draw for physical results are in

Total T 765 scale 348-1197
Free T 12.1 scale 7.2-24.0
SHBG 55 scale 19.3-76.4
DHT 43 scale 16-79
Preg 139 scale 13-208
Estradiol 19.8 scale 8.0-35.0
DHEA 214.9 scale 71.6-375.4
LH 3.6 scale 1.7-8.6

Everything else just picture of solid health at least as far a blood, lungs, etc can be tested.

Feel great. Well, except for a recent strained shoulder. But you know feel great in general.
 
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fweed

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Your testosterone has gone up significantly, and free T too - more importantly you are feeling good.

Has your muscle mass gone up?
 
UCSMiami

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Thanks. Folks say I appear so.(the pic is from 2012. Build is entirely different now)

I have gotten stronger.

My total T was 970 in 2012 before lifting weights but SHBG was very high then. see earlier posts.
 

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damn man good thread, thanks for the updates over time!
 

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Another guy on here said testosterone isn't the most important factor, and that it is more about the balance of hormones with one another. Sounds like yours is running really well now. I appreciate the info you drop here, I think most people when they solve things just disappear and we never see that knowledge.

Are there any other habits that have set you on the right track?
 
UCSMiami

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I would say solid sleep. Started taking 1000mcg of B12 before bed and it induces a deep sleep. Feel wonderful in the morning without drowsiness. Did have sleep issues on/off prior to using the above.
 

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That's quite useful to know, I've been sleeping badly for months, I don't know what's up. I'll look for b12 and try as you said.
 

mrmagoo2010

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so what do you think cause the lower SHBG and higher Free T?
 
UCSMiami

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Dr. thought I had an internal inflammation of the. liver. Attending to that brought down the SHBG in the first instance. Stress levels have also come down.(I was having wicked women issues) Total t went down as well. Do not know what comes first in terms of biological process ( or maybe they are intertwined.)- Total T or SHBG in production. When total t was high, shbg was high. I sleep quite well now and do not overtrain.-no late night training. Have a good woman with me now so life is calm.

Liver values were good at the outset. As mentioned that is not necessarily an indicator of other problems.

I still take milk thistle every now and then.
 
UCSMiami

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As an experiment this week I did not consume B-12 before sleep.(did the usual zinc, magnesium, vit b6) On all three occasions I awoke in the middle of the night, troubled by vivid dreams and awoke at 5am groggy. For the previous few months, I would sleep deep without interruption and awaken alert at 5am. I go to the gym in the early morning, 530am hence the early wakeup.
 

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How much b12, zinc, magnesium and b6 are you taking?

Your doctor sounds pretty capable, how did he isolate a lived problem, from blood results?

Did you feel any difference in terms of libido of energy during your experiment?
 
UCSMiami

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25mg zinc, 500mg magnesium, 1000mcg b12(acetylcholine version). Do not recall B6 as it is a B bundle without the b12.

I guess he surmised based on that and my history as I was super energetic prior to feeling poorly. I had intense stomach pain some days as well for for weeks prior to seeing the Dr.

this week:
Tired in the morning until consuming coffee. Fine the rest of the day. But no desire to go the gym in the early a.m.
No libido initial two days. Yes this morning.
 

fweed

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Thanks.

Could it be to do with some difficulty absorbing B12 or another mineral, does your doctor have any ideas.
How long will you keep the excitement going?
 
UCSMiami

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Thanks.

Could it be to do with some difficulty absorbing B12 or another mineral, does your doctor have any ideas.
How long will you keep the excitement going?
I do not know what you mean about difficulty. I stopped consuming B12 for the previous three nights. I typically stay up late, for a 5 am riser, and work hard at home at what may considered to be intense brain focused work- I do creative writing and translating. I imagine if I flopped at home after my day job and did nothing I would sleep well. My B12 levels were normal prior to supplementing. Now they are high but Dr. is ok with it. B12 stimulates melatonin and that is why I sleep deep. Why I do not sleep well otherwise is related to other-caffeine, stress, things to do, etc.Like I wrote in another thread I still have a young brain in doing things and not settling.

I do not know what you mean about excitement. You mean good health? We never discuss that. I think so long as health holds unrelated to physical exericse- you know no cancer or other type of maladies then I could be another Jack Lalane

back to B12 tonight. Expect to sleep deep without interruption. Well advise tomorrow.
 

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