How to make the best of Defuse

helenbrown

helenbrown

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Hi everyone,

Newbie here.

I have discovered Defuse one month ago and have been reading every thread on Aanabolic Minds on Defuse. I simply could not believe it can work the way people described.

Received my package, enjoyed a massive cheat meal... No bloating, full of energy, no weight gain.

Defuse truly is a miracle.

I no longer fear vacations and holidays.

I do usually have some wiggle room leading up to my cheat meals.

What should I be doing to help Defuse doing its magic?

  • Glycogen-depeleting workout day before or same day?
  • Normal workout on cheat meal day?
  • Low intenstiy (walking) after cheat meal?
  • Fasting next day?
I can't always do what is best but if I can I will.

I was wondering if anyone figured out what worked better for them for cheat meal + Defuse.
 

timmy8888

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I think all those choices work, its a very versatile product. Depends on the day but before my cheat meal most of time I like to do my usual work out then take defuse before my cheat meal. Can't go wrong really.
 
helenbrown

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Can't go wrong really.
I am trying to understand what the best would be. Yes, all of that would work (actaully - no. dosing thread says that post-workout I would be wasting Defuse) but my question is what would work best. If walking for 5 hours post-meal has almost no affect than I'd rather not do it.
 
helenbrown

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The Solution has you covered on the basics of how to utilize defuse
I have read it, and I have no questions about dosing.

.. the product is meant to prevent those excess calories from immediately spilling over into fat cells and keeps them circulating to be burned off over a longer period.
To rephrase, my question is on srategies people found to work best to burn off those circulating calories.
 
JulzRulz

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I've only used it 30 min before a meal and today I will take 2 at 05:00 with my pwo drink and 2 later in the day.

Around 09:00 I'll take my fat burn and a second dose at 15:00. Probably will do the same tomorrow.
 
TheMrMuscle

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Great questions, would love to see these adressed.
 
helenbrown

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My friend never heard of Defuse and when we went for a breakfast buffet yesterday I told him I'd give him 3 pills to try and that he has nothing to fear.

He took 3 pills, ate a lot (I estimate he had his daily calories in one long 1.5 hr meal) + some Lean Xtreme (waiting on my DCP order!). We then went on a 3-hour hike (low intesity) and did not eat anything until the following morning.

He woke up 3lb heavier and is freaking out :)

I woke up a little heavier too which never happened before.

This got me thinking if hiking/fasting might be not the best strategy to deal with all those circulating calories :)
 
JulzRulz

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On another note, has anyone noticed increased gas (not foul smelling) when taking Defuse?
 

timmy8888

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My friend never heard of Defuse and when we went for a breakfast buffet yesterday I told him I'd give him 3 pills to try and that he has nothing to fear.

He took 3 pills, ate a lot (I estimate he had his daily calories in one long 1.5 hr meal) + some Lean Xtreme (waiting on my DCP order!). We then went on a 3-hour hike (low intesity) and did not eat anything until the following morning.

He woke up 3lb heavier and is freaking out :)

I woke up a little heavier too which never happened before.

This got me thinking if hiking/fasting might be not the best strategy to deal with all those circulating calories :)
Or could be the cause of increased and or excess carb intake, as well as excess amounts of sodium. Weight on the scale shouldn't mean much, focus on how you look in the mirror. I can fluctuate 5 lbs in a night by manipulating carbs and or sodium or way I eat.
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I had all this food this weekend Sunday and Monday within 24 hours time. Did normal routine lift 4x a week and cardio 4x a week for 12 mins at 4.5 mph. To be honest this last month I have had to decrease the weight and intensity due to having surgery not allowed to lift overhead or put alot of pressure on abdomen. Nonetheless I took defuse 30 mins before my meals and woke up Tuesday morning at 204.8 lb (196.6lbs is my usual weight consistent this last month leading up to). By today this week I'm back at 196.8 lbs and all I did was resume my normal routine of lifting and cardio as well as my eating habits. This product works keeping fat at bay but in my experience doesn't help in fluctuations when consuming higher carbs and or sodium. Almost all water weight those two day I will take it.

Everyone's scenario will be different based on fluid intake, NEAT, what your training routine is etc... Go back to you normal eating habits and routines and give your body time. Possibly all water weight and have nothing to worry about fat gain over one meal.
 
tyga tyga

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Since defuse is meant to keep the macros circulating for up to four hours (iirc - correct if I’m wrong) ideally you would lift within that four hours to use the excess up.

GDAs and this supplements alike are pointless post workout, your wasting product if your using them in this manner
 
helenbrown

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Everyone's scenario will be different based on fluid intake, NEAT, what your training routine is etc... Go back to you normal eating habits and routines and give your body time. Possibly all water weight and have nothing to worry about fat gain over one meal.
I understanding that there are many things that affect our weight (sodium, carbs, water, cortisol, some supplements and medication, volume of food, poop... did I miss anything?) and day-to-day fluctations do not matter much and I have nothing to worry about.

I was not worried, thank you either way.
 
helenbrown

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Since defuse is meant to keep the macros circulating for up to four hours (iirc - correct if I’m wrong) ideally you would lift within that four hours to use the excess up.
I believe it is up to 8 hours.

If we are talking about optimum strategy... why lifting? why not long low intensity walking, hiit, or something else?

GDAs and this supplements alike are pointless post workout, your wasting product if your using them in this manner
I believe Matt mentioned many times that Defuse is very different from GDA and even could / should be stacked with GDA because it does not really do what GDA does.
 
The Solution

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I believe it is up to 8 hours.

If we are talking about optimum strategy... why lifting? why not long low intensity walking, hiit, or something else?



I believe Matt mentioned many times that Defuse is very different from GDA and even could / should be stacked with GDA because it does not really do what GDA does.
Fasting all day long after a large meal is also not the most ideal thing to do when it comes to muscle protein synthesis. Eat your normal meals and supplement defuse before a large cheat meal. Varying your diet, long term fasting, doing hours of cardio wont help the product work better or vary the results. If anything you are over exaggerating excessive cardio and excessive lifting to try and negate the calories of the cheat because it sounds like you are feeling guilty of the large amount of calories.
(This is a red flag with a bad relationship with food).

Resume your normal diet, resume your normal training routine and cardio regime and just utilize the supplement as outlined in the dosing guide.

There is 0 need to stack a GDA with Defuse. Defuse itself is very powerful it would be a waste to add in extra to the fire. Use your slintensity (Evomuse GDA) or other GDA's before your carb meals and save the Defuse (3 caps before) your cheat meal. Or you can use the 2/2 dosing which is outlined in the guide above as well . Since there is an 8 hour half life you can dose in the morning and later in the day. or if you train fasted you can take first thing upon waking and later in the day (again as outlined).

I would use Defuse on a cheat meal (prior to the large meal with 3 caps or do the 2/2 dosing) and save your normal GDA for workout days (and negate the post workout GDA Dose) since insulin sensitivity is already high. tyga tyga already addressed this and he is dead on correct.
 
helenbrown

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Fasting all day long after a large meal is also not the most ideal thing to do when it comes to muscle protein synthesis.
I do IM so it’s 16-18 hours fasting for me either way.

Eat your normal meals and supplement defuse before a large cheat meal.
That’s what I currently do. I was wondering what is optimal. Not looking for an advice on my routine, just what is considered optimal.

Varying your diet, long term fasting, doing hours of cardio wont help the product work better or vary the results. If anything you are over exaggerating excessive cardio and excessive lifting to try and negate the calories of the cheat because it sounds like you are feeling guilty of the large amount of calories.
Not sure where you are getting this from but no – no guilt, no excessive cardio, no lifting, and no long term fasting from my side.

Resume your normal diet, resume your normal training routine and cardio regime and just utilize the supplement as outlined in the dosing guide.
Thank you but I already do exactly that

There is 0 need to stack a GDA with Defuse.
Are you sure? Quote from Matt below (can’t post links but this is from official Slintensity write-up, easy to find):

“EvoMuse Presents: Slintensity (writeup)

Drawing on my original concept, I'm proud to introduce Slintensity. You will notice several new angles on a fantastic product category, that is also a perfect fit to combine with Defuse, my Fat Gain Inibitor. Grow muscles, not Fat.”
 
The Solution

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Not sure where you are getting this from but no – no guilt, no excessive cardio, no lifting, and no long term fasting from my side.



Thank you but I already do exactly that



Are you sure? Quote from Matt below (can’t post links but this is from official Slintensity write-up, easy to find):

“EvoMuse Presents: Slintensity (writeup)

Drawing on my original concept, I'm proud to introduce Slintensity. You will notice several new angles on a fantastic product category, that is also a perfect fit to combine with Defuse, my Fat Gain Inibitor. Grow muscles, not Fat.”
If you had no guilt why would you ask in your initial question about fasting next day? There is 0 need to justify a cheat meal with fasting, extra low intensity cardio or hiking or full body glycogen workouts. None of those have an impact on how a supplement works or varies it’s properties . Again just do your original workout plan or cardio regime varying factors doesn’t have an influence on defuse or how it will work or help anything in regards to a cheat

As far as the GDA it says no where in your post about “Stacking” with defuse. Which is exactly what I wrote in using before carb meals (pre workout or other meals away from post workout) and using defuse before the cheat.

That’s like the people on here who ask about stacking other GDA’s on top of assassinate from OL as the OL reps tell people over and over again it’s not necessary. I can quite GNO on this one, but people still do it anyways.

There is a law of diminishing returns on all supplements but to just keep adding more pills and powders and thinking more = better won’t be the answer. In most cases more is a waste and not utilizing the product properly
 
helenbrown

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If you had no guilt why would you ask in your initial question about fasting next day?
I do not see how asking about fasting equals quilt but I’ll try to answer anyway.

If I asked in another thread if I should be doing cardio first thing in the morning to improve fat burning, would you conclude this is because I have some guilt because of eating or because I am trying to optimize fat burning / excersize?

Same here.

I am fully with you on “there is a law of diminishing returns on all supplements but to just keep adding more pills and powders and thinking more = better won’t be the answer”.

I am wondering what is optimal because I do not want to be that person who stacks up GDA with Defuse post-workout even though it does not make things better.
 
helenbrown

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As far as the GDA it says no where in your post about “Stacking” with defuse. Which is exactly what I wrote in using before carb meals (pre workout or other meals away from post workout) and using defuse before the cheat.
Correct, it does not. You mentioned that GDA should not be stacked with Defuse ("There is 0 need to stack a GDA with Defuse"), I replied that I've seen Matt saying otherwise.
 
The Solution

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If I asked in another thread if I should be doing cardio first thing in the morning to improve fat burning, would you conclude this is because I have some guilt because of eating or because I am trying to optimize fat burning / excersize?

I am wondering what is optimal because I do not want to be that person who stacks up GDA with Defuse post-workout even though it does not make things better.
You answered your own question (bold above)

As Timmy outlined the dosing thread, and shows you what is optimal. That is why the thread was made and to help yourself and others on proper dosing. I figured it was a good idea and Matt agreed.

low intensity in the morning won’t justify any additonal fat burning or optimize it. Total calories in vs out justifys fat burning and a caloric deficit. Fasted cardio has been proven time and time again to have no advantage over fed unless you are doing it with yohimbine (best use for stubborn fat) and when no insulin is present . So the anology for that and fasting is apples to oranges. Cortisol is highest upon waking, doing cardio which is catabolic in a fasted state will cause cortisol to rise. A higher rate of cortisol is a great way to set your body up to eat away at muscle instead of fat.

https://www.t-nation.com/training/fasted-cardio-eats-muscle

https://journals.lww.com/nsca-scj/Fulltext/2011/02000/Does_Cardio_After_an_Overnight _Fast_Maximize_Fat.3.aspx

Overtime, fat burning is not an immediate process, it is one that occurs over the course of days not hours, so as you burn more carbohydrate during your workout, the body will burn more fat post exercise.

The study has also showed that having food(carbohydrate) precardio has been shown to not slow down lipolysis in the individual and in the fasted state even going after the breakdown of more fat, the body will take those excess fats that aren't oxidized and become re-esterfied(be stored back to fat). Also with the consumption of food before training increases the thermic effect of exercise(EPOC will be the highest by having food in your body not in the fasted state), yet another good reason to eat a little something before cardio in the am. This basically means that you are burning more cals while you are standing around after the workout is over.

Another negative factor to training in the fasted state is the impact on proteolysis(breaking down proteins AKA losing muscle), nitrogen losses more than doubled in the fasted state as compared to having glycogen within the body. Another good reason to have a little bit of food when doing cardio, whenever you do it.

the last thing it goes on to say is that in the fasted state, it will cause lower energy levels, thus decreasing the fat burning process. Performance here will suffer, especially when trying to do the far superior style of training, which is HIIT, (HIIT vs LISS), more energy when doing cardio=more cals burned both during and after physical activity, thus more fat burned.

http://sciencedrivennutrition.com/fasted-training-is-it-better-for-fat-loss/

When we look at the outcomes of change in body mass, BMI, and body fat% both groups lost weight, lowered their BMI, and lost fat. But most importantly, there was no difference between the two groups. Zero, zilch, none, nada, nine.

It looks like performing cardio based training in fasted state does not provide any benefit for fat loss. Interestingly, there is a ton of research showing that consuming carbs before a workout can increase your training capacity, so it would stand to reason that if you can train harder you might actually get better performance and fat loss

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4242477/

To the authors’ knowledge, this is the first study to investigate body composition changes associated with aerobic exercise performed in the fasted versus fed state while subjects maintained a caloric deficit. It has been hypothesized that exercising when fasted forces the body to rely on using fat as a substrate rather than carbohydrate, thereby reducing body fat to a greater extent than performance of post-prandial exercise. Our results refute the veracity of this hypothesis. Although both groups lost a significant amount of weight and fat mass, no differences were seen between conditions in any outcome measure regardless of pre-exercise feeding status.

http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2014/11/new-fasted-cardio-study-falsifies-myth.html?m=1
bdcc who posts here has a great video on this

[video=youtube_share;AlLMEU6cZpI]http://youtu.be/AlLMEU6cZpI[/video]
 
helenbrown

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You answered your own question (bold above)
No. I have not. My question was not about using GDA or dosing Defuse.

As Timmy outlined the dosing thread, and shows you what is optimal. That is why the thread was made and to help yourself and others on proper dosing.
Except I have no questions about dosing?

Low intensity in the morning won’t justify any additonal fat burning or optimize it.
I did read many studies and I personally believe that fasted cardio does not have any advantage over fed. I am not really sure why you are bringing this up - any excersize after cheat meal would not be fasted.
 
TheMrMuscle

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I for one understand where you want to go with this thread helenbrown You probably did the same as I did before purchasing Defuse. That being: reading everything you can find on the product. And during that reading you pick up some tidbits here and there that hasnt been adressed in a way that you feel 100% certain about whats the optimal way of using it.

Dosing
This is not a part of your questions as we have a great thread about that from The Solution already. 3 caps 30 minutes before a cheat or 2 caps twice a day if you know your day will require it, and this can be done up to 45 days in a row.

Activity around Defuse
Matt has mentioned a couple of time that it is benificial to use the circulating calories before they eventually gets stored as normal. But we dont know what exactly this means. So I understand your question here. Should we go for a walk after our meal? Will hitting the gym be better? Will it infact make any difference?

I personally always have my cheats at the end of the day, so I dont do any activity post eating. I take my Defuse, then i proceed to eat for the next 4-5 hours, go to bed, sleep for 8 hours, get up, eat again, then hit the gym a couple of hours later. Whatever circulating calories Defuse gave me has stopped circulating a long time ago. Does this mean that for me, Defuse wont be as effective?

GDA's and Defuse
This wasnt part of your orginal post either, but it was brought up. Again, Matt has recommended several times that taking a GDA with Defuse is beneficial. But we dont know anything more than that. So more eleborating would be awesome.

Im also using Ori1gin and Assas1nate from OL and both of those are to be dosed before the biggest meals of the day and have GDA properties. So I take mine with my Defuse.

I hope dsade sees your post and comments. I always love to nerd out on supplements im taking, in hopes of drawing even more benefits from them.
 

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