Epi/4andro first cycle

[Bigdare]

Hello all my first post here. I hope I'm posting in the right place...

I'm wanting to run my first cycle and I have already ordered almost everything but the pH themselves. I've been doing a lot of research on here trying to find the best route to go and I've decided on a 6 week epi/4andro cycle.

Here's the cycle I plan on running:

Epi- 30/30/30/30/30/30
4andro- 345/345/345/345/345/345
Epiandro- 225/225/225/225/225/225

Support (throughout cycle and pct):

Cel cycle assist
Cel tudca

Pct:

Nolva 20/20/20/20
M-test
Reduce xt
X-gels

With aromasin on deck just in case.

Any input would be appreciated.
A few questions I have are if I have to use the AI do I stay on it for the rest of the cycle or just quit using it when symptoms go away?
Is the cycle Im planning overkill or good for a first cycle? Reason I wanted the 4 andro and epiandro- was because I do not want to get lethargy and try to keep my libido up.

Im getting back into the gym pretty hard after about a one year off and on break. Prior to that I have about 7 years of lifting experience.

My goal is to put about 8 lbs of lean muscle mass on from this cycle and keep it. I'm in the gym 6 days a week about an hour to an hour and a half per day.

I'm 27, weigh 185. Any other info I'll be happy to share. Thanks for any input in advance

 

[Smont]

That dose for epiandro is a waste, you want 500 minimum. 750-1000 would be much better. If you can't swing that dose then drop it, the epi and 4 andro is plenty

 

[Smont]

And you don't need a 6 week pct but that's your call

 

[Smont]

You most likely will not need a ai

 

[Bigdare]

Thanks for the advice, I'll drop the pct down to 4 weeks. The epiandro I'll look into dropping, it would shave a few bucks off the cycle anyways.

 

[Smont]

Thanks for the advice, I'll drop the pct down to 4 weeks. The epiandro I'll look into dropping, it would shave a few bucks off the cycle anyways.

Ya, also epistane is very dry and epiandro at proper doses will dry you out like crazy. Most ppl don't want those 2 together

 

[Whisky]

Ya, also epistane is very dry and epiandro at proper doses will dry you out like crazy. Most ppl don't want those 2 together

Everything Smont said OP.....

Smart to have exam on hand, I’d agree it’s very unlikely you’ll need on cycle but epistane does cause rebound gyno for some so better to have and not need than need and not have. Just use it if hump flares up (normally around week 2-3 of pct I think I’ve seen).

Good luck with it bro

 

[Bigdare]

Wow I'm happy you replied whiskey, I've used alot of your threads as somewhat of a guideline to my first run, i think you wrote a post along the lines of "your first cycle" or something like that. It really helped me out.

I appreciate the info though. I'll be pretty much following through with what smont said, I'm gonna run a 4 week pct and I'm dropping the epiandro off the run.

 

[Whisky]

Wow I'm happy you replied whiskey, I've used alot of your threads as somewhat of a guideline to my first run, i think you wrote a post along the lines of "your first cycle" or something like that. It really helped me out.

I appreciate the info though. I'll be pretty much following through with what smont said, I'm gonna run a 4 week pct and I'm dropping the epiandro off the run.

Good plan brother, enjoy the gains

 

[Bigdare]

Hey guys just got everything but my ai in today and I'd like to start this asap. However I just ordered my ai today, should be here in about a week.

Should I wait or go ahead and start?

 

[Whisky]

Hey guys just got everything but my ai in today and I'd like to start this asap. However I just ordered my ai today, should be here in about a week.

Should I wait or go ahead and start?

You’ll probably not need it at all and even more likely not for the first week..:..

However it’s also the one thing that you don’t want to be without if you do need it. Plus you can’t always guarantee the delivery Of these things runs to time......

I’d wait the week bro

 

[Bigdare]

Thanks man. I'll play it safe and wait, I'm chomping at the bit but I'll listen to the wiser haha.

 

[Bigdare]

I finally got my exem in and I started yesterday. I've taken some before photos and will post them as soon as I figure out how to do it.

I don't feel any differences yet. Did leg day yesterday and rest today. Tmrow I will be hitting it hard with chest shoulders and Tris...I'm on a push, pull, legs and abs, rest rotation right now and will be for this whole cycle I think. Weighed in at 193 Monday afternoon with is pretty much my stopping point as far as weight goes. So I'm looking to push past 200 and keep it after everything is said and done.

Went to the doc Monday about lower back spasms and he scheduled me for a follow up in 2 weeks. Will my blood pressure be noticably higher by then?

 

[Bigdare]

Day 6. I know the epi takes a while to kick in but my chest and arms feel way "Fuller "than usual. Hard to explain and it may just be a placebo effect or the 4andro maybe?
There is a definite difference in size in my arms and shoulders.

Overall everything seems to be going good, still eating good, still working hard. I'm excited to see what the next few weeks brings.

 

[Bigdare]

 

[Bigdare]

 

[Bigdare]

 

[Bigdare]

 

[Bigdare]

These were taken the evening before I started my cycle

 

[Whisky]

Day 6. I know the epi takes a while to kick in but my chest and arms feel way "Fuller "than usual. Hard to explain and it may just be a placebo effect or the 4andro maybe?
There is a definite difference in size in my arms and shoulders.

Overall everything seems to be going good, still eating good, still working hard. I'm excited to see what the next few weeks brings.

Good stuff bro. Personally I definitely found (and I think most people do) that when your on cycle you dial in training and nutrition even more. Your pictures show a good base so you’ve obviously had a handle on that as a natty but just that little extra focus can make a difference early.....and then the drugs kick in lol

 

[Bigdare]

So I'm sitting at the doctor's office right now and he tells me my blood pressure is completely normal...I have gained only 2lbs at 2400 calories a day with about 230g of protein per day...

Honestly I was expecting a little more as far as weight goes, and I'm a little surprised my BP is normal... Ill post a pic from day 11..there is some progress for sure.

 

[Bigdare]

 

[Bigdare]

Day 13
I've 100% gotten stronger..Im doing weights with reps I've never done before and it's great. I feel like a beast in the gym right now and I actually feel a little bit bad for my family because I just can't get burnt out anymore ��I'm getting home quite a bit later than normal haha.

So sides...I've gotten a little bit more acne on my back than normal and I've been experiencing very mild headaches throughout the day. Gonna up my water intake I think.

Today is the day I'm really looking at my body and can see some major changes. My shoulders ( Wich I've been focusing on) have been coming along pretty good so far.

Overall I was expecting more weight gain but the bf being burned and thickness of my shoulders chest and legs are getting me pretty excited to keep rolling with this cycle.

 

[BloodManor]

You are only 2 weeks in
Enjoy the ride

 

[Whisky]

You are only 2 weeks in
Enjoy the ride

Haha, yeah exactly. Calories will dictate weight gain more than the stack as well. Epiandro won’t add size (strength and vascularity though) and the 4-Andro takes longer to kick in, that won’t add loads of size but will give some if your in a small surplus.

But yeah just enjoy the cycle, push some weights and you’ll see more change for sure. It’s a great feeling lol

 

[Smont]

So I'm sitting at the doctor's office right now and he tells me my blood pressure is completely normal...I have gained only 2lbs at 2400 calories a day with about 230g of protein per day...

Honestly I was expecting a little more as far as weight goes, and I'm a little surprised my BP is normal... Ill post a pic from day 11..there is some progress for sure.

Your only 11 days in at this post and only eating 2400 calories on what most would consider a cutting cycle. Its not magic, keep truckin on, bump up calories a little and be patient. By week 3 if not much changes bump up the epistane dose