TRT Tip: Avoiding High Hematocrit

kenpoengineer

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TRT newbie here that's trying to avoid the increase in hematocrit that is a side from TRT.

I've read whole blood, plasma and double red blood cell donations recommended if you already have high hematocrit.

Mentions of turmeric and nangirin for avoiding the situation. Dosages?. Supplements?

Pros please give me a recommendation on avoiding the issue and what type blood donation to use if you already have the issue.
 
LMuscle

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Double red blood donation, and grape fruit juice help out tremendously
 

v4lu3s

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Normal donation works fine for me, but I'm about to start doing double red since I'm a rare blood type.
 

sammpedd88

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Normal donation works fine for me, but I'm about to start doing double red since I'm a rare blood type.
What blood type are you? I give double reds periodically.
 

v4lu3s

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B- apparently its about 1.5-2% of the population. It actually took about 3 and a half years for my hematocrit and hemoglobin to get high enough my doctor was concerned, that prompted me to start, but seeing my type is rare keeps me going.
The way I see it though, your type doesn't really matter, there are times that blood of any type is running short and the more everyone gives the better off we all are.
 

sammpedd88

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I enjoy giving blood because I know people need it. I have A- so mine is in need as well. I always say, "I have no money to give, but I have plenty of blood".
 
Gutterpump

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I'm A+ and the donation center keeps hitting me up for whole blood or platelets. They won't let me do double-red, the bastards
 

sammpedd88

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I haven't been able to find a difference in doing doubles or regular whole blood.
 

kisaj

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Double if you can, but a routine donation can help. Naringin and natto have helped me lower mine around 1.5%. I take it regularly, stay hydrated, and it has been level for years.

500mg naringin
2000 FUs natto
 
Gutterpump

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I haven't been able to find a difference in doing doubles or regular whole blood.
Double red blood donation should lower it more than a whole blood donation, and you're not donating plasma/platelets so it won't dehydrate you
 

j2048b

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Add in cardio 5 days per week, and it might also help to lower hematocrit, as well as a low iron diet
 
LMuscle

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Add in cardio 5 days per week, and it might also help to lower hematocrit, as well as a low iron diet
I've never heard that cardio can lower hematocrit, where did you read this? If it's true, might have to ramp up the cardio sessions
 

j2048b

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Some have shown lower hematocrit from adding in cardio, reall cardio, 30 min per day

But it may go up initially, but over time

Im trying a low iron diet, to see if that also helps

Im also starting cardio, got to try everything!

Some say adding in certain supplements such as

IP6 (comes from rice bran)

Drinking milk helps absorb iron,

I believe taking calcium in general also has been shown to bind to iron as well, ill have to research that a bit more

Adding in green or black tea has also been said to help

Changing the diet is also said to help a ton of course (less grains)

Chelation therapy- ip6, or edta etc....
(RESEARCH THIS ONE)
I want to find a doc who does this and give it a whirl!!
 

v4lu3s

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in 3 months when i go back for blood labs and normal follow up I will post my hematocrit, i started doing 30 minute cardio sessions, ~10 times a week for a contest prep i am on right now. I have already seen my resting heart rate go from 70 to 50, and bp has decreased even more than what losartan 100mg did.

10/13/14 labs
Hemoglobin 16.9 12.6-17.7 g/dL
Hematocrit 49.2 37.5-51.0 %

4/21/15 labs
Hemoglobin 18.2 12.6-17.7 g/dL
Hematocrit 50.6 37.5-51.0 %

GAVE WHOLE BLOOD

5/18/15 labs
Hemoglobin 16.0 12.6-17.7 g/dL
Hematocrit 47.5 37.5-51.0 %
 
Whacked

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Double if you can, but a routine donation can help. Naringin and natto have helped me lower mine around 1.5%. I take it regularly, stay hydrated, and it has been level for years.

500mg naringin
2000 FUs natto
Good info on the Natto
 
scherbs

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in 3 months when i go back for blood labs and normal follow up I will post my hematocrit, i started doing 30 minute cardio sessions, ~10 times a week for a contest prep i am on right now. I have already seen my resting heart rate go from 70 to 50, and bp has decreased even more than what losartan 100mg did.

10/13/14 labs
Hemoglobin16.912.6-17.7 g/dL
Hematocrit49.237.5-51.0 %

4/21/15 labs
Hemoglobin18.212.6-17.7 g/dL
Hematocrit50.637.5-51.0 %

GAVE WHOLE BLOOD

5/18/15 labs
Hemoglobin16.012.6-17.7 g/dL
Hematocrit47.537.5-51.0 %
Cardio CAN have the effect of reducing hematocrit, but generally this is only seen with running or other weight bearing cardio.
The step mill or exercise bike won't cut it
 
Whacked

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References please? Thanks
*Also wondering if HCT is decreased acutely / during exercise only in response to the increased cardiac load
 

v4lu3s

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Cardio CAN have the effect of reducing hematocrit, but generally this is only seen with running or other weight bearing cardio.
The step mill or exercise bike won't cut it
should be interesting to see since the science i have seen shows that increased blood plasma volume from endurance exercise will lower the hematocrit %, while at the same time actually increasing total hematocrit.
 

j2048b

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I believe its more of a viscosity thing moreso then a hematocrit lowering but ive seen it where hema rises, only to level out and fall due to cardio,

Also i take
Natto
Rutin (for blood clots as well)
Ip-6

Can add in :

Rice bran
Milk

Both are said to help with iron stores.....


Always remember narnagin is of the grapefruit type usually, and grapefruit and most orals and meds DO NOT MIX! Grapefruit can make meds not work and orals as well OR make both that more potent thus causing more strain on ones liver
 
kenpoengineer

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Double red blood donation should lower it more than a whole blood donation, and you're not donating plasma/platelets so it won't dehydrate you
Does double red blood donation really take 2 hours?
 

sammpedd88

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Same here. Maybe a little under an hour including the entire process.
 
kenpoengineer

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Thanks guys! Today is my first whole blood donation. You can't give double red until you are blood typed and tested. How long of a rest period do you need after giving blood before lifting?
 

sammpedd88

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Thanks guys! Today is my first whole blood donation. You can't give double red until you are blood typed and tested. How long of a rest period do you need after giving blood before lifting?
If I remember correctly they tell you no heavy exercise for the rest of the day.
 
LMuscle

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Thanks guys! Today is my first whole blood donation. You can't give double red until you are blood typed and tested. How long of a rest period do you need after giving blood before lifting?
I donate in the morning, and go easy on lifting that night. You're supposed to wait around 24 hours though.
 
Gutterpump

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I'm having trouble getting the blood center here in NY to do a double red donation. Apparently they like my platelets a lot. They want only whole blood or plasma/platelet donation from me. Opposite of what I need... Whole blood is fine, but double red is so much better. No dehydration, and gets levels down faster.
 

j2048b

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How do u guys hydrate before a whole blood donation? Im drinkin water like crazy had to quit chew, i guess i dehydrate very fast, last time and only time ive given i passed out and had to be sent to the er, 5 bags of saline and a whole slue of issues and a whole year later, and now i have to go donate, they wont give me saline until i start giving double reds, so is there any type of stuff to help u super hydrate without putting yourself in danger of over hydrating,?
 
Gutterpump

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I just make sure to have a lot of water the day before and morning before. Few liters in the morning if I'm going around noon. You could take some electrolytes (pedialyte) or something if you dehydrate that bad.
 

j2048b

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I just make sure to have a lot of water the day before and morning before. Few liters in the morning if I'm going around noon. You could take some electrolytes (pedialyte) or something if you dehydrate that bad.
Yeah i was thinking of drinkin some pedialyte just to cover my hydration issues!
 
kenpoengineer

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Yeah i was thinking of drinkin some pedialyte just to cover my hydration issues!
Consider donating double red. I donated yesterday and it was amazing. Smaller needle than normal whole blood donation. This machine pumps your blood out, runs it through a centrifuge to separate red blood cells from plasma/other then pumps plasma/other back into you. It even adds saline to make up for the red blood cells they extract. No issues at all.
 

j2048b

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Consider donating double red. I donated yesterday and it was amazing. Smaller needle than normal whole blood donation. This machine pumps your blood out, runs it through a centrifuge to separate red blood cells from plasma/other then pumps plasma/other back into you. It even adds saline to make up for the red blood cells they extract. No issues at all.
They wont take a double red until after u have done a whole blood donation, then the next time u can give a double red,
 

v4lu3s

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What type of cardio were you doing for this effect? LISS?
every day fasted for half an hour in the AM, 4 days of it is on an elliptical at work with varying intensity keeping heart rate above 120 with much og it above 140. then add a half hour session on an elliptical after weights which is 3-5 days a week, again same heart rate goals.
the rest are usually jog/sprint for half an hour or a road bicycle for however long I feel like going.
 

RockyP

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I can't donate because I lived in the UK during the 80s.
 
trtdoc

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Double red blood cells!

Do not donate too often as you will start to decrease your ferritiin levels
 

j2048b

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I just get phlems from my hemo and it should be g2g
 

RockyP

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I can't give blood so I am trying grapefruit, has anyone ever seen a drop with that?
 

j2048b

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I can't give blood so I am trying grapefruit, has anyone ever seen a drop with that?
Grapefruit really isnt that great for u, it can cause detrimental side effects to meds and other stuff, ive seen THE WHOLE TRT WORLD talk about grapefruit, its really not worth taking,

Glycerine i heard really helped, but need to be cautious with, but also check into cellular hydration, i know a guy on here who talks about it a lot and has his own functional medical clinic,

Not sure how to really hydrate at the cellular level myself?

If u smoke or chew tobacco stop, i have chewed for a long time and it doesnt help at all
 
kenpoengineer

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You will need to get a therapeutic phlebotomy then. You’re going to have to request a script from your doctor.
 

RockyP

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You will need to get a therapeutic phlebotomy then. You’re going to have to request a script from your doctor.
Ok cool thanks.
But I am not feeling as good as I did when I started. Can't sleep much, low sperm as I'm not on hcg, no END say it's needed for a man my age on trt, none that takes my insurance anyways and I have seen 4, with one being one of those who does lectures on the topic, low energy and panic attacks.
I know it sounds crazy but I feel I screwed myself, and I guess i would have been screwed without it too.
I am probably depressed but I can't really even think of getting on meds.
Sorry guys I am just really worried.
 
kenpoengineer

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Can you share what your protocol is and what other supplements you are taking? How about bloodwork? I’ve been a TRT user for 3 years and I’ll help.
 

RockyP

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Screen Shot 2018-01-25 at 8.45.22 AM.png


these are the latest labs from Dec. Last time I did E2 it was low, Endo doesn't test for that often unless there are signs.
I take 100ml per week, which is half the vial 0.5CL I guess. I take the test blood work the day before I inject, additionally, I had lowered the dosage on this specific test to lower my Hematocrit that was slightly out of range in sept.

Multi Vit twice a week, Vit D 4 days a week, Vit C 4 days a week, Fish oil every day, Magnesium 3 times a week, Tumeric 3 times a week, Co-Q10 2wice a week.

I have been on TRT since 2015 same dosage.
I eat clean for the most part, it all started with a high prolactin result. my test went as low as 196.
Did some HCG sporadically cause once i went to see a urologist and he prescribed it, but then one of my Endos said it was not part pf the protcol for a man my age. I still have the prescription but it is expensive and I am thinking about refilling it for a couple of months. Last time i did a month of it was back in Sept.

Thanks
 

kisaj

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I can't give blood so I am trying grapefruit, has anyone ever seen a drop with that?
Yes, naringin helped me to lower and keep lower hematocrit by 1.5-2 pts. It worked very well, but I no longer need it. I've been on TRT for a little over 7 years and now my hemo just stays in range. My endo said this is common and that many people spend the first couple of years trying to maintain it through blood donation and protocol adjustment. I live at 6500', so everyone has higher hemo around here- it's normal. I ride around 50-51 and doctors won't even flinch unless you are >55.
 

j2048b

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Yes, naringin helped me to lower and keep lower hematocrit by 1.5-2 pts. It worked very well, but I no longer need it. I've been on TRT for a little over 7 years and now my hemo just stays in range. My endo said this is common and that many people spend the first couple of years trying to maintain it through blood donation and protocol adjustment. I live at 6500', so everyone has higher hemo around here- it's normal. I ride around 50-51 and doctors won't even flinch unless you are >55.
Odd , ive not heard of naringin really helping, and my hemo doc is freakin out and wants me to get my hemo down to a freakin 43.....wth? Nwver had it that low and while on trt it is always around 51-54
 
kenpoengineer

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Here is a TRT management table published by ExcelMale. Notice that they say hematocrit levels are Ok until you rise above 53.
 

RockyP

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Here is a TRT management table published by ExcelMale. Notice that they say hematocrit levels are Ok until you rise above 53.
Thanks.
My blood is all within range as of last dec. I am just not feeling well.
 
ohiostate2827

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What is your trt dose? I'm at 80mg of test cyp per week
 

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