Pacemaker and TRT

[Punkrocker]

Ok guys here's the deal, I've posted about this recently. I got a 46 yr old friend who had AFIB his whole life without knowing it. He inherited it from his mom. He did coke and ecstasy when he was younger and got drunk alot. Then he'd get sober and do juice and get really jacked and lean for a few years and then fall back into drugs again for a couple years and then get sober again and do the gym etc. About a month ago he had a heart attack, the afib finally got to him. Good news is they saved his ass and gave him a pacemaker. He's been feeling good but due to trouble at home he started drinking again but I came in and stopped that. His doctor's told him he can't do anything. No drinking smoking working out steroids etc. Well he was already drinking anyway so screw it. We're punk rockers and he wasnt listening to the doctors anyways so I've taken matters into my own hands. He wanted to get back on test so he's doing sub Q test at 30mg every other day which is 120mg a week. I got him eating clean and going to the gym with me. He's doing my workouts which is a basic bro split except we keep him in the higher rep lighter weight range. 15-20 reps per set and then we do cardio. Since he's added the testosterone he feels way better and stronger and he's eating more and his heart monitor thing that he wears shows all perfect signs of heart rhythm or whatever. So, here's what next, some chick wants his dick and hes begging me to give him a cialis but I don't wanna kill him. I think if he's taking testosterone in small doses every other day which keeps him in the normal range that's just as safe as if his body was producing it naturally however I'm concerned if he were to take a pde5 inhibitor because that can affect the cardiovascular system directly however with afib that seems to be some kind of electrical signaling thing with the heart in which he has a pacemaker that would correct that if any problem were to arise so I figure he could probably take some Cialis because if anything went wrong the pacemaker would correct it right? And before you guys freak out at me just try to understand that we are old school punk rockers we ride motorcycles 150 plus miles per hour and do way more stupid stuff than this so don't get mad I'm just asking questions so at least give me some kudos for that

 

[match]

You said it yourself, you're both living dangerously.

He may die at any moment living a lifestyle that isn't in line with his doctor's instructions. It's his life, and he can regard or disregard the docs as he sees fit. If he drops dead during a work out, or falls from his bike and gets mangled, how are you going to feel if you enabled him? If you're fine with it, then I guess you're good. If it would cause you depression and grief, you might want to reconsider your role/choices.

So, no advice really, just some stuff to consider...

 

[ZLB70]

Does he actually need the Cialis or is he just wanting it? Regardless the risk / reward seems off so I’d go with whatever the doctor recommends

 

[Alan1]

I love the whole "yeaaaah man, I said **** them docs and cardiologist!" "My homey down the street is gonna' take over as my primary care physician, smart move, right yo!?"

There's a well known member on ProM who had a heart attack years back (under 40) and has documented his story and everything he's gone through, and continues to go through, since then. He's got an implanted defibrillator and has mentioned many times certain things that can set it off or get him close to experiencing tachycardia, including consumption of certain alcohol(s) and not-so-strenuous exercise. Yes, he eventually went back to low dose TRT but I believe that was after quite some time/recovery.

Like @match I've got no real recommendations OP, but personally I sure as hell wouldn't be playing doctor in this case. Just don't see how you can be okay recommending he hop on exogenous testosterone, workouts NOT overseen by a medical professional, and now potentially adding Cialis. Might all the above be okay and won't negatively impact him? Perhaps. But take just a moment and step back and think about how you'll feel if he does end up having another major incident with his heart. And unless you're an expert on the capabilities and limitations of a pacemaker, I'd say it's crazy to assume it will keep everything fine in the event things really go awry with his heart....

 

[Punkrocker]

I love the whole "yeaaaah man, I said **** them docs and cardiologist!" "My homey down the street is gonna' take over as my primary care physician, smart move, right yo!?"

There's a well known member on ProM who had a heart attack years back (under 40) and has documented his story and everything he's gone through, and continues to go through, since then. He's got an implanted defibrillator and has mentioned many times certain things that can set it off or get him close to experiencing tachycardia, including consumption of certain alcohol(s) and not-so-strenuous exercise. Yes, he eventually went back to low dose TRT but I believe that was after quite some time/recovery.

Like @match I've got no real recommendations OP, but personally I sure as hell wouldn't be playing doctor in this case. Just don't see how you can be okay recommending he hop on exogenous testosterone, workouts NOT overseen by a medical professional, and now potentially adding Cialis. Might all the above be okay and won't negatively impact him? Perhaps. But take just a moment and step back and think about how you'll feel if he does end up having another major incident with his heart. And unless you're an expert on the capabilities and limitations of a pacemaker, I'd say it's crazy to assume it will keep everything fine in the event things really go awry with his heart....

Well he's doing all of this anyway. The only thing im doing is saying "hey bro instead of injecting 250mg twice a week, how about doing 30mg every other day subcutaneous" and then I explained to him why TRT doses would be just as effective and safe for him. No matter what I say he's gonna do test so I'm just suggesting an easier way to doit. As far as cialis goes, he's on the fence with that one which is why im asking around. Since I got a hold of him he's been staying sober and going to the gym with me every day so I'd say that's a win. Also doctors always say no to everything anyway.

 

[Kronic]

maybe plan a trip to enjoy before he dies

 

[Punkrocker]

So he went upstate to some Motocross event and he's been doing Motocross the past two days I talked to him last night LMAO

 

[Kronic]

have you tried getting him to do bpc-157 by chance? this says it helps with some arythmias

Inhibition of methyldigoxin-induced arrhythmias by pentadecapeptide BPC 157: a relation with NO-system - PubMed

Pentadecapeptide BPC 157 (GEPPPGKPADDAGLV, MW 1419) reversed congestive heart failure and various arrhythmias, influenced the NO-system and showed no proarrhythmic effect. In therapy analogy, we challenged rats with digitalis, to show attenuation by BPC 157 and the relation between the NO-system...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

pretty sure it would be safe. causes some blood sugar reduction

 

[Punkrocker]

have you tried getting him to do bpc-157 by chance? this says it helps with some arythmias

Inhibition of methyldigoxin-induced arrhythmias by pentadecapeptide BPC 157: a relation with NO-system - PubMed

Pentadecapeptide BPC 157 (GEPPPGKPADDAGLV, MW 1419) reversed congestive heart failure and various arrhythmias, influenced the NO-system and showed no proarrhythmic effect. In therapy analogy, we challenged rats with digitalis, to show attenuation by BPC 157 and the relation between the NO-system...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

pretty sure it would be safe. causes some blood sugar reduction

So before he had his heart attack he always had AFib he just never knew that the symptoms that he was experiencing was AFib. 1 minute his heart rate would be like 70 beats per minute and then the next thing you know his heart rate would be like 140 beats per minute and it was like that his whole life but he thought he just had anxiety but it was undiagnosed AFib. So take that add in drugs and alcohol and a lifetime of partying like a tattoo artist Rockstar and then at the age of 46 he finally has a heart attack. The doctors told him he needed a pacemaker which would correct his arrhythmia thing and now he has a pacemaker and since he's had his pacemaker his heart rate has been steady and perfect. He has a little heart monitor thing on his Apple watch that keeps track of his heartbeats and rhythm which is linked to his pacemaker so if there's any issue his watch will alert him and so far everything has been fine during our workouts since he just started test, I really think that pacemaker is going to keep him in line and that doing a little bit of test are going to the gym is not going to affect him as long as he's smart about it. going out and getting s*** faced is probably worse for him then taking a trt amount of testosterone. I understand we should always listen to our doctors but at the same time doctors don't want to get sued and are afraid for liability purposes so they're just going to tell you no no no no no no to everything until you come back in and have insurance pay to see a bunch of specialists that in the end are probably going to tell you it's okay. We all know testosterone is a bioidentical hormone so why not he take just a tiny bit of it to get his total levels around 7-800ng and feeling good. I think he's going to be fine I'm not pushing him to do this he was going to do this anyway I'm just trying to help him do it in the most easy less stressful way on the body possible.

 

[Kronic]

So before he had his heart attack he always had AFib he just never knew that the symptoms that he was experiencing was AFib. 1 minute his heart rate would be like 70 beats per minute and then the next thing you know his heart rate would be like 140 beats per minute and it was like that his whole life but he thought he just had anxiety but it was undiagnosed AFib. So take that add in drugs and alcohol and a lifetime of partying like a tattoo artist Rockstar and then at the age of 46 he finally has a heart attack. The doctors told him he needed a pacemaker which would correct his arrhythmia thing and now he has a pacemaker and since he's had his pacemaker his heart rate has been steady and perfect. He has a little heart monitor thing on his Apple watch that keeps track of his heartbeats and rhythm which is linked to his pacemaker so if there's any issue his watch will alert him and so far everything has been fine during our workouts since he just started test, I really think that pacemaker is going to keep him in line and that doing a little bit of test are going to the gym is not going to affect him as long as he's smart about it. going out and getting s*** faced is probably worse for him then taking a trt amount of testosterone. I understand we should always listen to our doctors but at the same time doctors don't want to get sued and are afraid for liability purposes so they're just going to tell you no no no no no no to everything until you come back in and have insurance pay to see a bunch of specialists that in the end are probably going to tell you it's okay. We all know testosterone is a bioidentical hormone so why not he take just a tiny bit of it to get his total levels around 7-800ng and feeling good. I think he's going to be fine I'm not pushing him to do this he was going to do this anyway I'm just trying to help him do it in the most easy less stressful way on the body possible.

im just suggesting bpc-157 nothing about steroids.