Next cycle - Test, Deca, EQ

saderboy80

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Hello everyone, I would appreciate some feedback on my next cycle (not doing it for a month or two), just planning and getting all my gear/ancillaries.

So I’m a 26yr old, 5’10” at 181lbs and roughly 10-12% BF (according to my bioelectrical impedance scale).

Previous max lifts...
Squat: 450lbs
Deadlift: 450lbs
Bench: 315lbs
Military press: 225 x 10 reps (can’t really get accurate 1 rep max, due to prior shoulder injuries).

Okay, so I’ve done quite a few cycles in the past including a couple of runs with straight superdrol, 2 test E cycles at 500mg/week for 10 weeks, my recent cycle was test E and some superdrol. Halodrol, epistane and trenavar combo.So I’m not a newbie but I’m not an advanced user.

I recently got a coach who plans my diet, training, supplement routine, and eventually my “other supplements”. We are currently working on reducing my body fat and then hopping on cycle and gain lean mass. Also, I do plan on competing either next October or next November.

So the cycle he originally proposed:

Test E 500mg/week for 12weeks
Masteron 300mg/week for 12weeks
Anavar 50mg for 6 weeks

I have clomid, nolvadex, arimidex and HCG. Plus plenty of ancillaries to maintain good health on cycle.

What are some off your opinions on this cycle? With the goal of doing a slow clean bulk while staying lean.
 
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BBiceps

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I’m just confused how you over head press 225lb 10 times but only bench press 315??! I need answers! Lol

I have limited experience with Mast but I ran Mast at the same amount as Test (I thought you were supposed to) and that’s what I will do for my next cycle (400/400), otherwise your cycle should be good.
 
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Whisky

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Haha, yeah agree with @BBiceps , the OH press in relation to the bench max is odd. Strong lifts generally though.

not saying it shouldn’t be there but just wondering what the logic is behind the mast? Outside of a cutting cycle I’ve never really understood the benefits of including. Prov would be my preferred choice in this situation if I wanted something of that ilk. Even epiandro pwo if I wanted a DHT to drive performance I’d probably prefer tbh

test and var looks solid though bro. You’ll have a good time off that cycle for sure
 

UNX

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just wondering what the logic is behind the mast?
At first I thought masteron was just like injectable proviron, but some guys use it for bulking as their main anabolic. I'm curious to see if it really works well for lean mass.
 
Hyde

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I would caution against mast if you still have your hair and want it to stay that way for now. You need pretty fat doses to grow from it allegedly. I would use like 50mg Proviron daily instead if trying to grow. Ditch all the Masteron sides and just potentiate the test with lower SHBG, maybe doing 600mg test instead.
 

BBiceps

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Why the hate for Mast? If you’re not having issues with your hair it should be a good add on a blast, no? Mast should be better at building muscle and strength than Proviron, at least from what have been reading.
 
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CroLifter

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Why the hate for Mast? If you’re not having issues with your hair it should be a good add on a blast, no? Mast should be better at building muscle and strength than Proviron, at least from what have been reading.
I get the worst breakouts from mast. Back, shoulders, chest...obnoxious. Test, barely anything. A little bit of tren, nothing.

but mast is horrible. And i do think i am shedding the most from it, way worse than either test or a bit of tren.


And unfortunately i have to disagree with @Hyde on 600 test idea 😀 Damn 500 test made me look like i was 30% bf in my face.

i will never run more than 250-300 test again. But again thats just me, i respond more favourably to a stack (most people would tbh), now after my 2nd go i dont think that test is that good at building muscle tbh.

I think i found my almost perfect stack as far as balancing sides and acquiring good gains goes.

Starting to side with guys who say test is pretty weak builder,
 
Hyde

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I get the worst breakouts from mast. Back, shoulders, chest...obnoxious. Test, barely anything. A little bit of tren, nothing.

but mast is horrible. And i do think i am shedding the most from it, way worse than either test or a bit of tren.
This is my experience with just 200mg mast in my stack. I get acne every cycle, fairly significantly I would say, but the natural of this acne was very different...like patches of it and perhaps cystic? It just lingered for so long compared to normal cycle acne for me. I mean, it was gross.

Seemed like anxiety was just barely barely there, bp was slightly higher on it, shedding worse. It’s bad for lipids. And OP isn’t getting shredded or anything where he can reap cosmetic benefits.

Like I said, if you aren’t bald yet (or give zero fux) then I would hold off. Probably anything would be a better musclebuilder, mg for mg.

Except Proviron of course, which adds nothing for size or strength - that only makes sense if you still desired estrogen antagonism, SHBG lowering, libido.

I just suggested a test bump as a simple alternative to help make up if Mast was taken out of the picture.
 
Mathb33

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There’s better options than masteron for off season / or when trying to gain weight. People often forget masteron is one of the most toxic compound someone can use. Absolutely 0 reason to run such a DHT in the off season there’s much more viable options that will yield you better results for less toxicity.
 
StarScream66

StarScream66

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Sounds good. One addition I might make is Competitive Edge Labs Cycle Assist, which contains the following ingredients:



It's helpful for your blood pressure, cholesterol, prostate and hair line, and liver. Since Var passes through the kidneys, you want it to be as healthy as possible during your cycle. You can buy 2 bottles for $50 at the link I provided.

You might also consider TUDCA and NAC.

Hope that helps!
-SS
 

saderboy80

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I would caution against mast if you still have your hair and want it to stay that way for now. You need pretty fat doses to grow from it allegedly. I would use like 50mg Proviron daily instead if trying to grow. Ditch all the Masteron sides and just potentiate the test with lower SHBG, maybe doing 600mg test instead.
I’ve tried proviron before and didn’t seem to get any benefits or side effects. So I most likely will not go with proviron.

Are you meaning just 600 test or with anavar?

Also I r never had hair loss as in issue and my dad and late grandpa have/ had good hairlines.
 

saderboy80

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Sounds good. One addition I might make is Competitive Edge Labs Cycle Assist, which contains the following ingredients:



It's helpful for your blood pressure, cholesterol, prostate and hair line, and liver. Since Var passes through the kidneys, you want it to be as healthy as possible during your cycle. You can buy 2 bottles for $50 at the link I provided.

You might also consider TUDCA and NAC.

Hope that helps!
-SS
Yes, thank-you!

I didn’t list my ancillaries or my PCT.

But I take year round:
Fish oil, turmeric, resveratrol, coQ10, Cissus, vit D, vit C, vit E, glucosamine and chondroitin, MSM, saw palmetto, multivitamin, TUDCA, NAC, milk thistle, green tea extract and alpha lipoic acid (I think that’s everything). Plus on cycle I use 5% nutrition’s cycle support.
 

saderboy80

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There’s better options than masteron for off season / or when trying to gain weight. People often forget masteron is one of the most toxic compound someone can use. Absolutely 0 reason to run such a DHT in the off season there’s much more viable options that will yield you better results for less toxicity.
What would you recommend for a lean gains cycle?
 
StarScream66

StarScream66

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Yes, thank-you!

I didn’t list my ancillaries or my PCT.

But I take year round:
Fish oil, turmeric, resveratrol, coQ10, Cissus, vit D, vit C, vit E, glucosamine and chondroitin, MSM, saw palmetto, multivitamin, TUDCA, NAC, milk thistle, green tea extract and alpha lipoic acid (I think that’s everything). Plus on cycle I use 5% nutrition’s cycle support.
That all sounds good. The only thing I might add is NOW Blood Pressure Health. It has hawthorn berry extract and grape seed extract, both of which can really help to keep your blood pressure levels at a normal range which helps out your kidney function.
 

saderboy80

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I’m just confused how you over head press 225lb 10 times but only bench press 315??! I need answers! Lol

I have limited experience with Mast but I ran Mast at the same amount as Test (I thought you were supposed to) and that’s what I will do for my next cycle (400/400), otherwise your cycle should be good.
I hate to say it but I think it’s genetics. My uncle (dads side), my dad, my brother and I all have naturally strong over head press power. And all 3 were power lifters. I was a power lifter in high school but do to the 3 shoulder surgeries I can no longer bench that well.


That and I have had 3 shoulder surgeries and believe it or not bench pressing hurts my shoulder more then any OHP work.

Typically a shoulder day would be:
Seated BB military 4x10 and that 4th set is a drop set down to 95lbs.
Seated DB military 4x12-15 (last 2 sets to failure but without spotter)
Arnold presses 4x10-12 (again last 2 sets to failure)
DB lateral raises
DB anterior raises
Pec deck reverse flies

And then a lift that I don’t know the name of, I just started doing it a few years ago.

So you take an EZ-bar and load it up with I don’t know anywhere between 65-95 lbs (depends how strong you are) grab the bar at the bottom and hold the bar vertical and then go hand over hand until you reach the top, then go hand over hand until you reach the bottom. I usually do about 3 sets all to failure.
 

saderboy80

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I get the worst breakouts from mast. Back, shoulders, chest...obnoxious. Test, barely anything. A little bit of tren, nothing.

but mast is horrible. And i do think i am shedding the most from it, way worse than either test or a bit of tren.


And unfortunately i have to disagree with @Hyde on 600 test idea Damn 500 test made me look like i was 30% bf in my face.

i will never run more than 250-300 test again. But again thats just me, i respond more favourably to a stack (most people would tbh), now after my 2nd go i dont think that test is that good at building muscle tbh.

I think i found my almost perfect stack as far as balancing sides and acquiring good gains goes.

Starting to side with guys who say test is pretty weak builder,
I agree! Granted I’ve only ever gone as high as 500mg/week of test E but have tried it a few times and didn’t seem to get much out of it.

But this go around I’ll be taking arimidex 1mg every other day and dandelion root in the morning to help with the bloat.
 

saderboy80

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This is my experience with just 200mg mast in my stack. I get acne every cycle, fairly significantly I would say, but the natural of this acne was very different...like patches of it and perhaps cystic? It just lingered for so long compared to normal cycle acne for me. I mean, it was gross.

Seemed like anxiety was just barely barely there, bp was slightly higher on it, shedding worse. It’s bad for lipids. And OP isn’t getting shredded or anything where he can reap cosmetic benefits.

Like I said, if you aren’t bald yet (or give zero fux) then I would hold off. Probably anything would be a better musclebuilder, mg for mg.

Except Proviron of course, which adds nothing for size or strength - that only makes sense if you still desired estrogen antagonism, SHBG lowering, libido.

I just suggested a test bump as a simple alternative to help make up if Mast was taken out of the picture.
Well I mean I do plan on competing in a bodybuilding show next October/November. My coach suggested masteron for low and slow gains while acting as a natural AI.
 

saderboy80

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Okay for those of you who disagree with my coach’s proposed cycle. What would you recommend?

On hand I have:
Superdrol
Epistane
M1A
DMZ
Msten
Test E
Masteron
DBoll
Oral tren clones
Trest transdermal
M1T

With the goal of lean gains and eventually contest prep.
 
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saderboy80

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Haha, yeah agree with @BBiceps , the OH press in relation to the bench max is odd. Strong lifts generally though.

not saying it shouldn’t be there but just wondering what the logic is behind the mast? Outside of a cutting cycle I’ve never really understood the benefits of including. Prov would be my preferred choice in this situation if I wanted something of that ilk. Even epiandro pwo if I wanted a DHT to drive performance I’d probably prefer tbh

test and var looks solid though bro. You’ll have a good time off that cycle for sure
Masteron for lean steady gains, while also acting as a mild AI.
 

BBiceps

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I hate to say it but I think it’s genetics. My uncle (dads side), my dad, my brother and I all have naturally strong over head press power. And all 3 were power lifters. I was a power lifter in high school but do to the 3 shoulder surgeries I can no longer bench that well.


That and I have had 3 shoulder surgeries and believe it or not bench pressing hurts my shoulder more then any OHP work.

Typically a shoulder day would be:
Seated BB military 4x10 and that 4th set is a drop set down to 95lbs.
Seated DB military 4x12-15 (last 2 sets to failure but without spotter)
Arnold presses 4x10-12 (again last 2 sets to failure)
DB lateral raises
DB anterior raises
Pec deck reverse flies

And then a lift that I don’t know the name of, I just started doing it a few years ago.

So you take an EZ-bar and load it up with I don’t know anywhere between 65-95 lbs (depends how strong you are) grab the bar at the bottom and hold the bar vertical and then go hand over hand until you reach the top, then go hand over hand until you reach the bottom. I usually do about 3 sets all to failure.
Interesting, you’re OHP is impressive, good job!
 
StarScream66

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Okay for those of you who disagree with my coach’s proposed cycle. What would you recommend?

On hand I have:
Superdrol
Epistane
M1A
DMZ
Msten
Test E
Masteron
DBoll

With the goal of lean gains and eventually contest prep.
Are you not planning on buying anything else? Because it would be ideal for you to use test prop instead of E for lean gains and strength. As far as strength goes, Superdrol and Masteron would be the best candidates, but be careful with Superdrol. It's a very hepatoxic drug.

How much of each of this stuff do you have and how long do you plan to run a cycle for?

Also what's your age/weight/height/bf/(current test levels if you've had a recent blood test)? I see you posted this in the thread at the top, my bad.
 

saderboy80

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Are you not planning on buying anything else? Because it would be ideal for you to use test prop instead of E for lean gains and strength. As far as strength goes, Superdrol and Masteron would be the best candidates, but be careful with Superdrol. It's a very hepatoxic drug.

How much of each of this stuff do you have and how long do you plan to run a cycle for?

Also what's your age/weight/height/bf/(current test levels if you've had a recent blood test)?
I can always get more gear, that’s just what I currently have.
15 weeks of 500mg test E
15 weeks of 300mg Masteron
30 days of transdermal trest
60 days of superdrol
30 days of DMZ
30 days of Msten
30 days of M1A
30 days of epistane
50 days of anavar
50 days of DBoll

Some left over tren clones (but I have severe insomnia, so I don’t use them.

Some M1T left but I had to stop that cycle because M1T would make me puke daily post 2hrs of taking it.

I’ve used superdrol plenty of times in the past and I listed my stats in the first post.

12 week slow lean gain cycle (monitored by a coach).
12 weeks test e 500mg
12 weeks Masteron 300mg
6 weeks of anavar 50mg
 

BBiceps

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Okay for those of you who disagree with my coach’s proposed cycle. What would you recommend?

On hand I have:
Superdrol
Epistane
M1A
DMZ
Msten
Test E
Masteron
DBoll

With the goal of lean gains and eventually contest prep.
I like the original cycle but if you want a little more extreme results you can add Dbol or SD. I never used Dbol but I like SD a lot. Also, you got a coach for a reason, listen to him.
 

saderboy80

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I like the original cycle but if you want a little more extreme results you can add Dbol or SD. I never used Dbol but I like SD a lot. Also, you got a coach for a reason, listen to him.
Yeah honestly I think I’m going to stick with my coach I hired. He’s had clients win numerous shows, transformations and peak week help.

Overall, he is a great coach, very meticulous. Just wanted some outside opinion ms!
 
Mathb33

Mathb33

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What would you recommend for a lean gains cycle?
I don’t know how many cycles you’ve done or how experienced you are brother but if it’s your first cycle test only of test anavar would be a very good choice. If you’ve got a few cycles under your belt and wanna add a second injectable into your cycle and goal is lean gains I would think of something like primo,EQ or even NPP which is a lot less watery than some people think it is.
 

BBiceps

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Yeah honestly I think I’m going to stick with my coach I hired. He’s had clients win numerous shows, transformations and peak week help.

Overall, he is a great coach, very meticulous. Just wanted some outside opinion ms!
I think it’ll be great, let me know how it goes, good luck!
 
StarScream66

StarScream66

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I can always get more gear, that’s just what I currently have.
15 weeks of 500mg test E
15 weeks of 300mg Masteron
30 days of transdermal trest
60 days of superdrol
30 days of DMZ
30 days of Msten
30 days of M1A
30 days of epistane
50 days of anavar
50 days of DBoll

Some left over tren clones (but I have severe insomnia, so I don’t use them.

Some M1T left but I had to stop that cycle because M1T would make me puke daily post 2hrs of taking it.

I’ve used superdrol plenty of times in the past and I listed my stats in the first post.

12 week slow lean gain cycle (monitored by a coach).
12 weeks test e 500mg
12 weeks Masteron 300mg
6 weeks of anavar 50mg
You have a whole pharmacy in your house! You have so much to choose from, I don't even know where to begin. But, I would recommend test prop for lean gains, unless you're comfortable with the water weight you're going to get from the test E. You could run Proviron or an AI with it to keep that water weight down.

Did you say 1-testosterone orally made you sick or was that another thread or did I imagine that? If that's the case, M1A is probably going to do the same thing for you. If I was you and I had what I had, I'd do 500mg of test e a week, whatever the dose for Masteron is (multiple injections throughout the week, but I forget the exact dosage), and run it alongside Anavar. You have a lot of PHs/DSs that are good, but I just don't know. You could add msten in there for strength and lean gains, but you're already going to be getting that from the Masteron. But you could use it to kickstart your cycle I suppose.
 

CroLifter

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There’s better options than masteron for off season / or when trying to gain weight. People often forget masteron is one of the most toxic compound someone can use. Absolutely 0 reason to run such a DHT in the off season there’s much more viable options that will yield you better results for less toxicity.
You mean as far as lipids go? Fortunately mine were in range on 500 test and 200 mast, and that was after 12 weeks of blasting lol (last year's cycle).


I honestly like it at a low dose when i want to maintain for a while. For example if i say i am going to run 250 a week total, sth like 150 test 100 mast, or 180 test 70 mast i feel better than just straight 250 test.

But i most likely wont run higher doses of it ever again, just didnt see a lot from it.

But as a low dose supplemental compound, i like it. I look better even on that tiny stack, harder and grainier, i attribute that to less water retention due to running less test.
 

saderboy80

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I don’t know how many cycles you’ve done or how experienced you are brother but if it’s your first cycle test only of test anavar would be a very good choice. If you’ve got a few cycles under your belt and wanna add a second injectable into your cycle and goal is lean gains I would think of something like primo,EQ or even NPP which is a lot less watery than some people think it is.
I’ve ran
Test 500mg for 10weeks - twice
Test 500mg for 10 weeks with 4 wks of superdrol
A couple superdrol only cycles (stupid I know, but I was young and did know what a PCT was)
I’ve run Msten
I’ve run epistane


I’m not an advanced user per se, but I’m not a newbie. This would be my first cycle running 2 injectables.

Primo is too expensive from my source (so unless someone can message me a new source )

How are EQ and NPP for a lean bulk?
 

saderboy80

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You have a whole pharmacy in your house! You have so much to choose from, I don't even know where to begin. But, I would recommend test prop for lean gains, unless you're comfortable with the water weight you're going to get from the test E. You could run Proviron or an AI with it to keep that water weight down.

Did you say 1-testosterone orally made you sick or was that another thread or did I imagine that? If that's the case, M1A is probably going to do the same thing for you. If I was you and I had what I had, I'd do 500mg of test e a week, whatever the dose for Masteron is (multiple injections throughout the week, but I forget the exact dosage), and run it alongside Anavar. You have a lot of PHs/DSs that are good, but I just don't know. You could add msten in there for strength and lean gains, but you're already going to be getting that from the Masteron. But you could use it to kickstart your cycle I suppose.
Yeah I always stock up when I see a sale going on. Damn,yeah I would be willing to switch to Test prop, as bloating has been an issue for me on test E. But I already ordered my test E and Masteron for the cycle.

Yes, you are correct M1T made me sick and puke almost exactly 2 hrs after taking it every day. So I stopped taking it. I posted this above, but you are correct I posted in another thread about M1T and superdrol comparisons.


My current cycle is:

Test E - 500mg/week for 12 weeks
Masteron - 300mg/week for 12 weeks
Anavar - 50mg for 6 weeks

Plus all my ancillaries which I listed above. Arimidex and dandelion root to control the bloat. Then I have clomid, nolvadex and HCG for my pct.
 

saderboy80

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I get the worst breakouts from mast. Back, shoulders, chest...obnoxious. Test, barely anything. A little bit of tren, nothing.

but mast is horrible. And i do think i am shedding the most from it, way worse than either test or a bit of tren.


And unfortunately i have to disagree with @Hyde on 600 test idea Damn 500 test made me look like i was 30% bf in my face.

i will never run more than 250-300 test again. But again thats just me, i respond more favourably to a stack (most people would tbh), now after my 2nd go i dont think that test is that good at building muscle tbh.

I think i found my almost perfect stack as far as balancing sides and acquiring good gains goes.

Starting to side with guys who say test is pretty weak builder,
What’s your perfect stack??
 

saderboy80

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Haha, yeah agree with @BBiceps , the OH press in relation to the bench max is odd. Strong lifts generally though.

not saying it shouldn’t be there but just wondering what the logic is behind the mast? Outside of a cutting cycle I’ve never really understood the benefits of including. Prov would be my preferred choice in this situation if I wanted something of that ilk. Even epiandro pwo if I wanted a DHT to drive performance I’d probably prefer tbh

test and var looks solid though bro. You’ll have a good time off that cycle for sure
Yeah, honestly I think it’s genetics but I’m not sure. My uncle (dad’s side), my dad and my younger brother were all powerlifters. I was a power lifter in high school but 3 shoulder surgeries later...I keep the reps high.

Also with the shoulder injuries it actually causes me more pain in my shoulder to bench then to OHP.

As far as the Masteron - my coach recommended I take it for lean mass gains, the AI effect, and keeping me nice and lean.

This whole next year is about keeping me lean, while trying to put on some size for a competition next October or November.
 

saderboy80

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So I just spoke with my coach about the upcoming cycle. He still wants to roll with 12weeks.

Test E - 500mg/week
Masteron - 300mg/week
Anavar 50mg/day for 6 weeks


But he also mentioned adding in another injectable. Either EQ, Deca or NPP.


Thoughts?
 

Whisky

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So I just spoke with my coach about the upcoming cycle. He still wants to roll with 12weeks.

Test E - 500mg/week
Masteron - 300mg/week
Anavar 50mg/day for 6 weeks


But he also mentioned adding in another injectable. Either EQ, Deca or NPP.


Thoughts?
for 12 weeks I’d go NPP but I’m a nandrolone fan boy. Most people seem to prefer NPP over deca and on a shorter run it makes more sense, I just don’t get the sides from deca and prefer pinning twice a week instead of eod though
 

saderboy80

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for 12 weeks I’d go NPP but I’m a nandrolone fan boy. Most people seem to prefer NPP over deca and on a shorter run it makes more sense, I just don’t get the sides from deca and prefer pinning twice a week instead of eod though
What would you estimate a good dose of deca or NPP per week? (I’ve never used either)

Alongside the test, Masteron and Anavar.
 

UNX

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Masteron could help with estro sides of TD trest if you give it a go. Trest is far better for mass that test or masteron.
 

saderboy80

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Masteron could help with estro sides of TD trest if you give it a go. Trest is far better for mass that test or masteron.
Yeah, I’ve been contemplating using up my transdermal trest, I have a 30 day supply. I’ve been waiting soo damn long to use it, because I tried oral Trest and didn’t get much out of it. Also, definitely need to get back some of my strength before starting trest. Otherwise, I would definitely tear something with the reported crazy strength gains.

I also think I would need to get my hands on some Raloxifine first, I tend to be gyno prone. Even when taking arimidex, arimistane, SNS inhibit E, SNS inhibit P and P5P. Occasionally, I’ll throw in a day of nolvadex in the middle of the cycle and that clears the gyno quick.

Need to find a source for ralox first though.


Isnt trest better for a straight bulk? Or do you guys think it could be used in a lean bulk?


I’m currently sitting at 5’10” 181lbs with my goal, for when I compete (which who knows how long that will be in the future) is to be about 205lbs and unattainable goal but I’m not in any hurry to step on stage.
 

Whisky

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Masteron could help with estro sides of TD trest if you give it a go. Trest is far better for mass that test or masteron.
trest is a great great compound but really hard to recover from. Imo it’s only worth using if you are already on trt or b n c......
 

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