Is The Keto Diet Just a Fad Diet?

DS3317

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It’s just another means to an end. With that being said fatloss has been shown to be no faster than a low fat moderate carb diet. The health benefits touted are negligible unless you’re prediabetic or suffer from epilepsy or bipolar disorder.
It’s not a miracle like some people think though. You lose a ton of water going low/no carb so most people confuse this with fat loss.
I always lost strength and looked flat until I tried Dave Palumbos keto and had protein at 2grams a lb. yes protein was way higher than fats, yes I still got into keto. Gluconeogenesis does not happen easily at all contrary to what I read in forums. Hell I’ve done high protein only chicken breast, egg whites, tilapia, and hydrolyzed whey with no added carbs or fats for 2weeks finishing up a cut and was in ketosis. You will get in ketosis with little to no carbs period. Your body will burn your own fat for fuel.
How do you know if someone is doing keto? Don’t worry they’ll tell you.
 
zunteck

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I do keto and use gear and I dropped 60lbs from nov2018 to present day. It works I was 250 now 185 solid I would say imo lol. Still have the lower torso to finish up on. If you can stay with the diet you will be good and don’t use anything to help you with ketosis just do it naturally and you drop weight fast
 

DS3317

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I do keto and use gear and I dropped 60lbs from nov2018 to present day. It works I was 250 now 185 solid I would say imo lol. Still have the lower torso to finish up on. If you can stay with the diet you will be good and don’t use anything to help you with ketosis just do it naturally and you drop weight fast
It’s not the fact that Keto works but the fact that you ate in a caloric deficit. When you remove a whole macro, you remove a whole food group of the stuff people tend to overeat.
It’s great that you found a way of eating in a deficit that works for you and great job in losing weight but 60lbs in close to a year is nowhere near miraculous if you really add it up it’s around 5lbs a month that you lost. I wouldn’t agree with you on you saying that’s fast.
I think what really makes it fall into the fad category is the people who talk like it’s the best thing since the invention of the wheel or turn their way of eating into their identity.
 

nãomiguel

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It’s just another means to an end. With that being said fatloss has been shown to be no faster than a low fat moderate carb diet. The health benefits touted are negligible unless you’re prediabetic or suffer from epilepsy or bipolar disorder.
It’s not a miracle like some people think though. You lose a ton of water going low/no carb so most people confuse this with fat loss.
I always lost strength and looked flat until I tried Dave Palumbos keto and had protein at 2grams a lb. yes protein was way higher than fats, yes I still got into keto. Gluconeogenesis does not happen easily at all contrary to what I read in forums. Hell I’ve done high protein only chicken breast, egg whites, tilapia, and hydrolyzed whey with no added carbs or fats for 2weeks finishing up a cut and was in ketosis. You will get in ketosis with little to no carbs period. Your body will burn your own fat for fuel.
How do you know if someone is doing keto? Don’t worry they’ll tell you.
this dude gets it. keto is a cult. :3
 
LvlUpStrength

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It undoubtedly gives results! I’ve seen multiple regulars that come into my bar that have lost 50+ pounds. It’s crazy these people aren’t even really working out. With that said they have gotten results but it’s not the best look. It’s very noticeable in there neck and shoulders. But they sacrificed a lot of muscle and look scrawny but at the same time they have a lot of loose skin. It would be a lot easier on gear. 😊
Do you think it is because they were in a caloric deficiency with a lack of macronutrients rather than the keto diet?
 
BennyMagoo79

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In have lost 25Ib using keto/atkins approach. For me, its easier to maintain a caloroie deficit when I restrict carb intake, and one thing I have found with keto/atkins approach is srength and muscle mass are much easier to maintain.

It certainly has a cult following, and I have found various groups on social media with different and strong ideas about what keto is. However, it is not a fad diet, and its an important way of life for many people like me who are probably addicted to sugar and processed food.
 
Smont

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Jillian Michaels Urges Fans to Stay Away From the Keto Diet!

""The reason that keto has been getting so much attention is because it helps significantly to manage your insulin levels. Very high insulin, very bad thing," she explained. Because of this, keto works well for people who struggle with high insulin levels, especially those with polycystic ovary syndrome, type 2 diabetes, and infertility, but it's not appropriate for most people, she said. "If you’re not eating a bunch of processed carbs and processed sugar and you’re not eating too much food in general, you won’t have insulin levels that are going through the roof,” she explained."

"Her advice? The same as it's always been: "Just work out, eat clean, and don't overeat," she emphasized. "I promise you: Balanced diet—it's that simple."


Is she correct?
It has been used as early as the 50's it just wasn't called keto
 

DS3317

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It’s also a fear based diet. In fact it actually increases resistance to insulin. If you want to be as big as possible you need carbs. Also most people aren’t insulin resistant they’re just fat because they eat too damn much.
Keto also gives people hypothyroidism.
 
boo99

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Bit late to reply but studies have found that Keto isn't superior for weight loss.

A simple, consistent, caloric deficit is all that is required to lose weight.
 

danielvp

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I just quit keto because my total cholesterol came back at 400. My doctor is threatening to put me on a statin so I think that's the end of keto for me.
 

danielvp

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Wow that is high af, what was it before keto, that is if you know?
170, so it more than doubled. I've reduced my daily animal fat consumption from about 150 g to less than 20 g, and started quite a few LDL cholesterol lowering supplements.
 
boo99

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170, so it more than doubled. I've reduced my daily animal fat consumption from about 150 g to less than 20 g, and started quite a few LDL cholesterol lowering supplements.

That's a big jump up. Good you began some supplements.

You might be a hyperresponder which is peeps that can't eat too much fat/cholesterol laden foods without effects.

There are those non-responders who's lipids are unaffected by intake of high cholesterol foods.
 
boo99

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170, so it more than doubled. I've reduced my daily animal fat consumption from about 150 g to less than 20 g, and started quite a few LDL cholesterol lowering supplements.

That's a big jump up. Good you began some supplements.

You might be a hyperresponder which is peeps that can't eat too much fat/cholesterol laden foods without effects.

There are those non-responders who's lipids are unaffected by intake of high cholesterol foods.
 
DieselNY

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For decades this is what I have seen: (I'm keto since 1995)

1 -Often cholesterol levels rise in the early stages of a keto diet then they start to level off if not drop a little.

2 - If you follow "butter chugger" 75%/25%5% keto you will see unfavorable changes in cholesterol levels.

Also, regardless of what keto zealots tell you, saturated fat is still bad with regards to lipids. With keto/ low carb diet quality and fat sources still matter.

3 - Those who lose a good amount of fat, workout, do some cardio and continue to lose fat, eat "good fats" more so than "bad fats" do not eat a "lot" of fat but "moderate" and eat plenty of protein will see favorable changes in cholesterol.
 

danielvp

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For decades this is what I have seen: (I'm keto since 1995)

1 -Often cholesterol levels rise in the early stages of a keto diet then they start to level off if not drop a little.

2 - If you follow "butter chugger" 75%/25%5% keto you will see unfavorable changes in cholesterol levels.

Also, regardless of what keto zealots tell you, saturated fat is still bad with regards to lipids. With keto/ low carb diet quality and fat sources still matter.

3 - Those who lose a good amount of fat, workout, do some cardio and continue to lose fat, eat "good fats" more so than "bad fats" do not eat a "lot" of fat but "moderate" and eat plenty of protein will see favorable changes in cholesterol.
I agree with you for the most part, but I am in great shape and was/am eating very clean.

Points you've made that could apply to me:

I was 5 months into keto at the time of the 400 cholesterol score

Eating 4-8 eggs a day

Eating tons of coconut products

What would you consider moderate fat on a 3500 calorie diet?
 

sammpedd88

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I agree with you for the most part, but I am in great shape and was/am eating very clean.

Points you've made that could apply to me:

I was 5 months into keto at the time of the 400 cholesterol score

Eating 4-8 eggs a day

Eating tons of coconut products

What would you consider moderate fat on a 3500 calorie diet?
You were eating 3500 calories a day on keto? How many grams of protein per day were you eating?
 

sammpedd88

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I agree with you for the most part, but I am in great shape and was/am eating very clean.

Points you've made that could apply to me:

I was 5 months into keto at the time of the 400 cholesterol score

Eating 4-8 eggs a day

Eating tons of coconut products

What would you consider moderate fat on a 3500 calorie diet?
You were eating 3500 calories a day on keto? How many grams of protein per day were you eating?
 

danielvp

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That's a big jump up. Good you began some supplements.

You might be a hyperresponder which is peeps that can't eat too much fat/cholesterol laden foods without effects.

There are those non-responders who's lipids are unaffected by intake of high cholesterol foods.
Missed your post at first, is it a hyper response to cholesterol, saturated fat, or both?

I've always had a meat rich diet, but it wasn't until keto my blood cholesterol skyrocketed, which makes me think high animal fat intake is the culprit, and not the actual cholesterol content of my diet.
 
dallasboy22

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I’ll give my keto experience. Started Keto first of the year, loved it, then had my physical in May. Surprisingly my test went from 850 to 1197...which I put down to all the fats I was eating. My BP was a little on the high side as well, but then my labs showed a 100+ spike in LDL (70’s to 170’s), with total cholesterol almost 300.

My GP likes the keto diet, believes like a lot of recent information that many if not all diseases come from inflammation (which sugar/carbs can spike), but railed me on my boarder line high BP and LDL. I was eating eggs, butter, mct oil, olive oil, 80% lean beef, etc....defiantly getting 200g of protein in, but the rest was pretty much saturated fats.

So, I told her I’ll clean it up and come back in 1 month for bloodwork. Basically went to lean white meats, no mct/coconut oil, use EVOO for majority of my fats. Cut down a little on the eggs, but still had a lot of them. I mainly skewed my fats to non-saturated and tried to eliminate saturated.

I think this helped a ton too: took Niacin 500mg everyday and beta-steriols (NOW brand for both). Labs rocked - LDL came down back to 73. HDL 59 and Trig’s 107.

Soooo....I call it clean keto, cut out saturated fats as much as you can (I still eat them), but go for EVOO, avocado oil, etc for your fats. With the Holiday’s I’m off keto for the most part, but back full swing in 2020.
 
HIT4ME

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Yeah this.

I hate the expression keto diet, it’s not actually a thing. Being in a state of ketosis is. Fundamentally whether it is beneficial comes down to how metabolically flexible one is, for some people the use of fasting plus keto to force an improvement in metabolic flexibility will be optimal, for others (with good metabolic flexibility) it will make little to no difference in fat loss (assuming the presence of a calorie deficit).

As ever with these things - there is no one ‘best’ diet or way. Far too many variables and individual aspects to consider
I have been avoiding this thread because, it isn't a fad but it is a somewhat misguided effort.

Whisky, you are on the right path, except that keto diets don't require metabolic flexibility. They actually make metabolic inflexibility worse, as your very thoughts show.

Metabolic flexibility is the ability to switch between carbs and fats for fuel. Ketosis is brought about because you have to few carbs available and your body has to convert its machinery over to only burn fats.

As you point out, someone who is not "fat adapted" needs to hinder this flexibility even more by limiting carb sources until the body turns up fat burning and hinders its carb burning.

This is fairly basic biology. An enzyme called Pyruvate Dehydrogenase Kinase is responsible acts as a "switch" to utilize fat for energy instead of carbs.

In obesity, the overabundance of fat in the blood stream causes increased PDK levels and hinders carb burning - hurting metabolic flexibility.

Starvation will also, logically, elevate PDK. Lack of food means you have to use stored fat as your preferred fuel, so elevating pdk to make fat burning more efficient is a logical survival response. And metabolic flexibility is a bad thing in this case as well because you don't have the carbs to burn anyway. It would be like having half of your tools be drills and half be hammers when all you have is nails. Having all hammers would be ideal.

So, this is what people miss - obesity causes elevated PDK. Starvation elevates PDK. Low carbs elevate PDK.

Low carb diets basically give into the problem that obesity created - all I have is hammers so I am only going to use nails (fats) and avoid buying any screws (carbs). In other words, low carb diets are effective because they accept metabolic inflexibility and don't require it. But they make the problem of metabolic flexibility (the true issue) worse.

But ultimately I think you are on the right path and I agree with your "there is no one best way" comment. Keto is a tool and can be used appropriately. If someone lacks metabolic flexibility and needs to lose weight, it may be the shortest route to take to get them healthier, and then you can work on the flexibility issues after the fact.
 
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HIT4ME

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It’s just another means to an end. With that being said fatloss has been shown to be no faster than a low fat moderate carb diet. The health benefits touted are negligible unless you’re prediabetic or suffer from epilepsy or bipolar disorder.
It’s not a miracle like some people think though. You lose a ton of water going low/no carb so most people confuse this with fat loss.
I always lost strength and looked flat until I tried Dave Palumbos keto and had protein at 2grams a lb. yes protein was way higher than fats, yes I still got into keto. Gluconeogenesis does not happen easily at all contrary to what I read in forums. Hell I’ve done high protein only chicken breast, egg whites, tilapia, and hydrolyzed whey with no added carbs or fats for 2weeks finishing up a cut and was in ketosis. You will get in ketosis with little to no carbs period. Your body will burn your own fat for fuel.
How do you know if someone is doing keto? Don’t worry they’ll tell you.
If gluconeogenesis were easily induced, I would be all over it. If optimal fat loss were a desire, I would much rather convert every gram of fat on my body to a carbohydrate anand burn it as a carb than to burn it directly as fat. You would more than double your rate of fat loss even if the conversion was 100% efficient, which if it were possible wouldn't be.
 
Smont

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Pretty sure Japan is the thinest country in the world, not talking about sickly ppl. There diet is about 70% carbohydrates I believe
 

Whisky

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I have been avoiding this thread because, it isn't a fad but it is a somewhat misguided effort.

Whisky, you are on the right path, except that keto diets don't require metabolic flexibility. They actually make metabolic inflexibility worse, as your very thoughts show.

Metabolic flexibility is the ability to switch between carbs and fats for fuel. Ketosis is brought about because you have to few carbs available and your body has to convert its machinery over to only burn fats.

As you point out, someone who is not "fat adapted" needs to hinder this flexibility even more by limiting carb sources until the body turns up fat burning and hinders its carb burning.

This is fairly basic biology. An enzyme called Pyruvate Dehydrogenase Kinase is responsible acts as a "switch" to utilize fat for energy instead of carbs.

In obesity, the overabundance of fat in the blood stream causes increased PDK levels and hinders carb burning - hurting metabolic flexibility.

Starvation will also, logically, elevate PDK. Lack of food means you have to use stored fat as your preferred fuel, so elevating pdk to make fat burning more efficient is a logical survival response. And metabolic flexibility is a bad thing in this case as well because you don't have the carbs to burn anyway. It would be like having half of your tools be drills and half be hammers when all you have is nails. Having all hammers would be ideal.

So, this is what people miss - obesity causes elevated PDK. Starvation elevates PDK. Low carbs elevate PDK.

Low carb diets basically give into the problem that obesity created - all I have is hammers so I am only going to use nails (fats) and avoid buying any screws (carbs). In other words, low carb diets are effective because they accept metabolic inflexibility and don't require it. But they make the problem of metabolic flexibility (the true issue) worse.

But ultimately I think you are on the right path and I agree with your "there is no one best way" comment. Keto is a tool and can be used appropriately. If someone lacks metabolic flexibility and needs to lose weight, it may be the shortest route to take to get them healthier, and then you can work on the flexibility issues after the fact.
so yep I can agree with the point around permanently low carb being bad for metabolic flexibility as to be in ketosis for fat loss, only works well when one can include carbs and be back into ketosis quickly (I.e low carb during the day, one carb refeed in the evening, back in ketosis within 2 hours). Now that only works when one has metabolic flexibility (otherwise it takes too long to get into ketosis) but to get to that point one has to become fat adapted (I say fat adapted as my understanding is that the body will become ‘carb adapted’ way quicker and easier and it’s just not an issue for the vast vast majority of people anyway).

but, how does one become fat adapted without forcing the body into ketosis (either low carb or fasting or both) and staying there for periods of time?


ive always seem metabolic flexibility as the nirvana really, benefits of fat loss from keto (plus better endurance performance for those who train that way) but the performance and aesthetic benefits.

the other points above around high protein (rather than high fat keto) are interesting as I’ve looked my best off a very high protein diet. For years I was 400g protein a day (220 bw) with approx 150g - 200g carb and 100g fat - same Cals with lower protein and higher carb and I look softer with no noticeable performance gains (this isn’t backed by anything scientific- just my own experience)
 
HIT4ME

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so yep I can agree with the point around permanently low carb being bad for metabolic flexibility as to be in ketosis for fat loss, only works well when one can include carbs and be back into ketosis quickly (I.e low carb during the day, one carb refeed in the evening, back in ketosis within 2 hours). Now that only works when one has metabolic flexibility (otherwise it takes too long to get into ketosis) but to get to that point one has to become fat adapted (I say fat adapted as my understanding is that the body will become ‘carb adapted’ way quicker and easier and it’s just not an issue for the vast vast majority of people anyway).

but, how does one become fat adapted without forcing the body into ketosis (either low carb or fasting or both) and staying there for periods of time?


ive always seem metabolic flexibility as the nirvana really, benefits of fat loss from keto (plus better endurance performance for those who train that way) but the performance and aesthetic benefits.

the other points above around high protein (rather than high fat keto) are interesting as I’ve looked my best off a very high protein diet. For years I was 400g protein a day (220 bw) with approx 150g - 200g carb and 100g fat - same Cals with lower protein and higher carb and I look softer with no noticeable performance gains (this isn’t backed by anything scientific- just my own experience)
I am not sure what I said about protein? or maybe you were referring to others' points?

You are somewhat incorrect about the carb adaptations. People who are skewed toward carb adaptation tend to be lean (see the Japanese thread above).

This makes sense with some thought and some basic biology. Basically, you have to choose what you are going to use in the Krebs cycle to create ATP - fat or glucose. The control switch for this is Pyruvate Dehydrogenase Kinase. If PDK is elevated, it is switches on fat burning and switches off carb burning - like the switch on a train track.

Now, this is not to say it is all or nothing, it is almost always a mix of carbs and fat being used, but elevated PDK = more fat for fuel and less glucose.

The point here is that elevated PDK is a big part of metabolic flexibility and ketosis or not, people who are fat have elevated levels of PDK and are thus better at burning fat and worse at burning carbs than someone who is metabolically healthy.

This is also a big reason why high fat diets and not high carb diets are the most reliable method of inducing diabetes.

If you follow it through, people overeat, blood sugar elevates, glucose stores become full, glucose becomes stored as fat, fat stores become full, PDK elevates to help burn off excess fat, this makes it harder to burn carbs, cells that do get carbs burn them more slowly and it this takes fewer carbs to elevate blood sugar as they aren't being burned in the cells and the cells just remain full as fat is burned preferentially, elevated blood sugar is thus stored as fat, fat is elevated, PDK goes up more, etc.

In other words, people who are obese are pretty good at burning fat already and not carbs.

Now, the brain cannot burn fat, so fat people don't go into ketosis because they don't need to.

In other words, I get that people use "fat adapted" as a means of describing the idea that our brain switches away from using carbs as an energy source - but this is the only difference between an obese person and a person who is either starving or in ketosis. People who are obese are already burning fat preferentially because of elevated PDK.

But this is probably part of the reason keto can be effective - if you suck at burning carbs and you are good at burning fat...then eliminating carbs will eliminate that part of the problem.

This strategy, however, only serves to elevate PDK and hinder your ability to tolerate carbs even more.

At some point, if you follow the logic, you would need to convert and store carbs as fat before you could even burn them for fuel.

This situation, with elevated PDK can cripple your metabolic flexibility - it is not easy to reverse. PDK inhibition has shown potential for cancer treatment, diabetes treatment, etc.

But basically, some of the metabolic derrangements of obesity are imitated with starvation and ketosis, which seems counter intuitive at first but makes sense with a little thought.

Or, I could be crazy :)
 

Derek Wilson

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There are studies of low carb, not ketogenic diets. Low carb diets can be healthy but a lot of evidence shows that more plants and fewer saturated fats are healthier. Of course, it depends also on what you might eat instead of low carb. You can do a lot worse than a diet of lean meat and a ration of green vegetables. However, I’m not convinced that this ideal low carb dieter is a real thing. If they are, then we should compare them to an ideal low-fat dieter, and from what we know low fat wins. [ProvenPeptides]

So if you are looking for the healthiest diet based on the evidence we have, it’s neither keto nor low carb. Claims to the opposite are based on theoretical results or cherry-picked advantages (like ketosis helping with some types of epilepsy) that have little real-life application.
 
muscleupcrohn

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We are on Anabolic Minds, which is largely a fitness/bodybuilding forum, and, while keto diets can have their benefits, multiple studies seem to show they’re suboptimal for building muscle.
 

sammpedd88

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We are on Anabolic Minds, which is largely a fitness/bodybuilding forum, and, while keto diets can have their benefits, multiple studies seem to show they’re suboptimal for building muscle.
Lawrence Ballenger has stated he eats a keto diet and he’s huge. Granted he’s using gear, but he still has to have the diet to build the muscle.
 
Smont

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Lawrence Ballenger has stated he eats a keto diet and he’s huge. Granted he’s using gear, but he still has to have the diet to build the muscle.
So I doubt he got huge eating that way, and some ppl can stay lean eating garbage and not exercising. Don't mean everyone else can do those things
 

sammpedd88

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So I doubt he got huge eating that way, and some ppl can stay lean eating garbage and not exercising. Don't mean everyone else can do those things
Of course the guys is using AAS but you still have to have the diet to go along with it if you want positive results.
 
muscleupcrohn

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Lawrence Ballenger has stated he eats a keto diet and he’s huge. Granted he’s using gear, but he still has to have the diet to build the muscle.
I said it’s not optimal for building muscle, not it’s impossible to build muscle with while using gear...

Not to mention almost everyone on a keto diet who is huge now got huge and THEN maintained on a keto diet, not built their base on a keto diet.
 
Smont

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I said it’s not optimal for building muscle, not it’s impossible to build muscle with while using gear...

Not to mention almost everyone on a keto diet who is huge now got huge and THEN maintained on a keto diet, not built their base on a keto diet.
That's the point I was trying to make
 
ValiantThor08

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I said it’s not optimal for building muscle, not it’s impossible to build muscle with while using gear...

Not to mention almost everyone on a keto diet who is huge now got huge and THEN maintained on a keto diet, not built their base on a keto diet.
Close friend of mine and brother in law got the biggest and strongest he has ever been on primarily carnivore ketogenic diet. Doing his second contest prep now.
 
muscleupcrohn

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Close friend of mine and brother in law got the biggest and strongest he has ever been on primarily carnivore ketogenic diet. Doing his second contest prep now.
I’m not claiming you can’t succeed on a ketogenic diet; I’m saying research suggests it is SUBOPTIMAL. A good keto diet will be better than a bad non-keto diet, and probably still good enough for most people. And perhaps drug use, which many people who compete use, attenuates negative effects, who knows.
 
ValiantThor08

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I’m not claiming you can’t succeed on a ketogenic diet; I’m saying research suggests it is SUBOPTIMAL. A good keto diet will be better than a bad non-keto diet, and probably still good enough for most people. And perhaps drug use, which many people who compete use, attenuates negative effects, who knows.
I get you.
 

sammpedd88

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Close friend of mine and brother in law got the biggest and strongest he has ever been on primarily carnivore ketogenic diet. Doing his second contest prep now.
Imagine that.....someone can actually get big on a diet that some claim isn’t productive in putting on muscle mass.

Let’s face it. Some diets work for some people and some of them don’t. Some can get big on keto and some can’t.

I’m 47 and been in and out of the gym since I was 14. I’ve tried many workouts. I know what works for me. I’ve seen guys in the gym that do half reps of heavy ass weight, every time they work out. I used to say to myself, hahaha he hasn’t done a full rep yet. Well one of those guys is stepping on stage for his second contest. He won his first one.

Moral of the story....sometimes **** works and sometimes it don’t. Some get big with keto and some don’t. Research is research...basically like statistics. There’s lies, damn lies and then there’s statistics. Plain and simple.
 
Smont

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If your eating in a surplus and you can build muscle on any diet. But for 90+ % of ppl a diet with more carbs is going to build more muscle. In jail on 3 crappy meals a day low in protein and loaded with surgery carbs and crappy fats guys build muscle. Any diet can work to some degree
 

sammpedd88

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If your eating in a surplus and you can build muscle on any diet. But for 90+ % of ppl a diet with more carbs is going to build more muscle. In jail on 3 crappy meals a day low in protein and loaded with surgery carbs and crappy fats guys build muscle. Any diet can work to some degree
My point, exactly.
 
ValiantThor08

ValiantThor08

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If your eating in a surplus and you can build muscle on any diet. But for 90+ % of ppl a diet with more carbs is going to build more muscle. In jail on 3 crappy meals a day low in protein and loaded with surgery carbs and crappy fats guys build muscle. Any diet can work to some degree
Blows my mind how those guys can retain and grow in jail.
 

sammpedd88

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Blows my mind how those guys can retain and grow in jail.
Yeah it’s insane. They defy everything you read as far as diet and such. They basically work the same body parts day in and day out. But some come out looking like pro body builders.
 

DS3317

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Yeah it’s insane. They defy everything you read as far as diet and such. They basically work the same body parts day in and day out. But some come out looking like pro body builders.
I think that goes into genetics. Take Ronnie for example he would’ve been a monster eating ramen and doing push ups.
 

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