EvoMuse Presents: Virile Mane Serum 25

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Some light editing left, but i want to get this posted since we are already selling while final labels are being done.

VIRILE MANE SERUM 25 WRITEUP



In men, balding can negatively affect confidence, self-image, mental health, perception of overall health and age, as well as mate selection/appeal. In women, hair loss can be absolutely devastating on a scale that is hard to appreciate.



For hundreds of years now, scientists and quacks have promised that the solution is either here or just around the corner, usually choosing to focus on “that one magic bullet that will offer a cure”. As I’ve repeated so many times, there is no such thing. The body is a complex machine, and the hair follicles some of the most complex components of this complex machine. As small, almost micro, organs, the follicles are extrememely sensitive to even minute changes in the body. Microvasculature, glycogen storage and metabolism, Reactive Oxygen (and nitrogen) Species (Free Radicals), and lipid/hormone disruptions can cause these micro-organs to malfuction, leading to hair loss and failure to regrow new hairs. If you’re here now, then this is probably a dilemma you’re facing. Well, let’s get on it then…



This subject is very, very complex so I’ve done the best I can to simplify.



A study performed by Sadgrove, et al, in Cosmetics 2023 elucidate 8 key areas that control hair growth and follicle health.

https://www.mdpi.com/2079-9284/10/4/106



They are identified as (paraphrased and expanded):



1. Androgens – Androgen receptor overactivation, with subsequent interference with phase control



2. Prostaglandins – With a complex interplay depending on the type of prostaglandins formed, prostaglandins are generally proinflammatory but some types trigger a potent repair function that can rescue hair growth



3. Overactive Aerobic Metabolism of Glucose – dysregulation of glucose metabolism(metabolic syndrome, etc) can lead to malfunctions of follicular glycogen storage, which starves the follicle, as well as inflammation and vascular disorders leading to exacerbation of growth phase dysfunction and hair loss.



4. Bacterial or Fungal Over-colonization – which we find is slightly less important for garden-variets Androgenic Alopecia (male pattern baldness), but have addressed indirectly



5. Inflammation - which plays a huge and complex role, not only in follicular function, but whole body health



6. Fibrosis- affecting whole body tissues and one of the main culprits in so many health problems, including cardiovascular disease



7. Metabolism or Circulation Problems – meaning without adequate blood and nutrient supply, and the transport and elimination of waste products, the highly fragile follicles are crippled



8. Malnutrition - if you have delved this deeply to get you to this point, we would hope you understand the critical importance of proper macro and micro nutrition including balanced blood sugar levels, and intake of vitamins, minerals, and phytonutrients.



This is a good solid list, and a wonderful starting point – but things are even more complex. Energy states (AMPk and mTORc1 signaling), BMP initiation and inhibition of follicle growth phases including fibroblast growth factors, Adenosine triggers, Estrogenic and IGF-1 signals, and other enzymes, and a few others will be covered here.







Ingredients





Genistein-Nicotinamide Crystals




Estrogen Receptor Beta, a relatively recent discovery on the scene, functions as a balance to Estrogen Receptor Alpha receptor (which was once thought to be the only one.) Very slight ERa activation can help to trigger hair growth, but it’s a very touchy balance before it forces the follicle into catagen phase . Activation of the ERbeta receptor mediates estrogenic signaling, and has a potent effect on transition to Anagen phase.



https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15591132/



Genistein, an isoflavone contained in soy, has a high selectivity and potent activation of Estrogen Receptor Beta.






Erb and catagen blocking

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15591132/





Nicotinamide- You will find that I have used Nicotinamide (an active form of vitamin B3) several times in my crystalline complexes. In addition to being an excellent and simple coformer, Nicotinamide has hair growth promoting effects on its own, notably reducing an enzyme called DKK-1, which triggers follicles to regress back to telogen/catagen phase. By reducing the activity of this enzyme, our Anagen phase can be amplified and prolonged. Nicotinamide also functions to scavenge free radicals.






Puerarin-Ascorbic Acid Crystals



Puerarin is a high-quality isoflavone found in an invasive vine known as Kudzu. It functions as another Estrogen Receptor beta agonist, anti-oxidant, 5a-reductase inhibitor, and GSK-3b inhibitor/



https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22278629/

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8061915/

Puerarin also maintains natural pigmentation in the new hairs, so the hairs that do grow in should match mature natural color.



https://www.mdpi.com/2079-9284/9/6/118



Puerarin also seems to be an effective inhibitor of the DPP4 enzyme, most known for breaking down GLP1, but also has significant effects in the hair follicle. Inhibition of this enzyme cause hasten entry into Anagen phase.



https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022202X23020730





Myricetin-Nicotinamide Crystals



While Myricetin is a wonderful compound, and I expect more research to occur regarding its role in hair growth, we are including it for more of a singular purpose.



GSK-3b, or Glycogen Synthase Kinase 3b, is yet another ubiquitous enzyme that very tightly controls growth processes. It limits reponses to GLP-1 and Adiponectin, blunts the body’s response to IGF-1, inhibits the body’s (and hair follicle’s) ability to properly store glycogen, contributes to mitochondrial dysfunction, inhibits muscle growth and adaptation to training and, as a major factor here, completely destabilizes out beloved WNT/b-catenin.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19238412/



Myricetin is an extremely potent GSK3b inhibitor, which will both boost the follicular sensitivity to IGF-1, correct mitochondrial function, aid in the proper glycogen balance to help feed the follicles, and stabilize WNT/b-catenin to prolonged Anagen.






Myricetin also restores functioning and response of Endothelial Nitric Oxide Synthase and NO for vascular dilation and increase of blood flow.



 
Baicalin-Ascorbic Acid Crystals



AMPk (Adenosine MonoPhosphate Kinase) is an enzyme which, along with and related to cAMP, helps control energy production and metabolism. Activation of AMPk in hair follicles induces rapid growth and proliferation of keratinocytes. AMPk activation also triggers our macrophages to engage in Autophagy and Mitophagy (a clearing out of nonfunctional cells that inhibit mitochondrial function), triggering activation and recruitment of stem cells and entry into Anagen phase.



https://cellandbioscience.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13578-023-01177-2

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11473489/



Dermal Papillae are the hair follcile “storehouses” of the stem-like cells that are recruited to restore and create new follicles and other organelles within the follicle.



Dermal papillae (DP) are little bumps sitting on top of the dermis, surrounding individual hair follicles like a ring. These cells are crucial components in nourishing hair and allowing for growth. They also contain androgen receptors, that when stimulated by the presence of dihidrotestosterone (DHT), will translocate to the cell membrane and allow for binding.

Excessive DHT binding at the papillae cells can be catastrophic for hair growth. Baicalin interferes with this process, stopping the translocation of the androgen receptor so DHT has no place to bind. In addition, baicalin has also been shown to upregulate DP cell proliferation which encourages new hair growth.




Baicalin has also been shown to promote angiogenesis (growth of new blood vessels) through weakly activating a specific estrogen related receptor (ERRa), which causes production of vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF)

Finally, It has been observed that all three PPAR subtypes are expressed in hair follicle cells, and that specific activation and inhibition of specific PPAR subtypes increases hair follicle survival. One key factor is clear, however, which is that overactivity/overexpression of PPAR-gamma subtype causes potent inhibition of hair growth. Baicalin has been shown to downregulate PPARy in multiple studies, which could aid in slowing hair loss and removing the phase shift blockade.



https://www.mdpi.com/2079-9284/10/4/106



WNT/b-catenin



By far the most important factor in hair follicle activation via Anagen phase is WNT/b-catenin stabilization and cellular accumulation. A critical glycoprotein in growth-related processes, WNT/b-catenin exhibits rapid and dynamic degradation and re-stabilization. Highly sensitive to control pathways, WNT/b-catenin has to be stabilized to exert its positive effects on growth – especially hair growth. Bacailin is a highly potent compound which stabilizes WNT/b-catenin.






Arachidonic Acid – Beta-Aescin



Prostaglandins are extremely potent, extremely rapid acting molecules that are formed in response to various types of injuries and assaults on the immune system. They communicate to adjacent cells, and propagate that signal throughout the general area. For our purpose here, we are looking particularly at the 2 series prostaglandins, especially PGF2a.



Arachidonic Acid is an omega 6 fatty acid that is stored in the cell membrane. When an injury occurs that causes a slight rupture to the membrane, arachidonic acid is released. It quickly reacts with Cyclooxygenase2 enzyme (COX-2) to trigger pain and inflammation, which spread quickly to adjacent cells, but also cause a huge release and sensitivity to IGF-1 and other healing molecules. In the tissue surrounding the hair follicles, and the hair follicles themselves, the result is a turbo boost of hair growth. Given that one of the functions of hair is a cushioning of the scalp, this makes sense. PGF2a also causes a rapid entry into Anagen phase, which also fits with this model.






By loading the scalp cells with Arachidonic Acid, we get an increased PGF2a response to “injury”. In this case, the “injury” is trigger by a unique compound in Horse Chestnut called Aescin. Aescin has a quality of sort of “burrowing” its way through any cells it encounters, a process known as cell permeabilization. This causes the above reaction, and a rapid and dramatic increase in PGF2a formation. Not to worry, the membranes are quickly healed with no ill effects.






https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10043424/



 
Betulinic Acid-Ascorbic Acid Crystals



Protein Tyrosine Phosphatase 1-B enzyme is ubiquitous and closely related to Insulin (and Leptin) resistance, leading directly to vascular malfunction, cardiovascular diseases, and metabolic syndrome. Inhibition of PTP-1b not only rapidly reverses insulin resistance, but activated VEGF and restores vascular dilation response to Nitric Oxide.






As well, inhibition of PTP-1b protects against excess lipoproteins in the vasular tissue, leading to restrictions of blood flow and blockages.






Betulinic Acid is a potent PTP-1b enzyme inhibitor, with less than ideal solubility. By complexing with Ascorbic Acid we not only improve absorption, but add the free radical scavenging effects of Vitamin C.



Capsaicin-Cyclodextrin-TPGS Complex



TRPV1 is one one the two Transient Receptors we are hitting in this formula. TRPV1 is a thermoreceptor that reacts to high temperature, such as many types of burns (including sunburns). As hypothesized, the baking Summer heat on the scalp signals the body that it is, indeed, Summertime which means Fall and Winter are soon to follow and it’s time to get in gear growing that hair. TRPV1 activation signals hypersensitivity to IGF-1, a potent anabolic factor that triggers growth and tissue regeneration. TRPV1 is also the receptor activated by capsaicin, the “heat” compound in hot peppers. Now obviously when you eat a hot pepper, your tongue isn’t literally “burning”, but by activating the receptor the body merely thinks it is, and causes those beautiful IGF-1 effects. Capsaicin is tricky to work with, which is why I created a created a cyclodextrin-TPGS encased form which enables capsaicin, normally insoluble in water, to dissolve into our formula easily.



TRPV1 activation also triggers the activity of little bio-janitors called Macrophages. One of their jobs is to clean up the biological clutter, while also activating growth response pathways to make sure the body remains in an ideal functional state. In the hair of scalp tissue, macrophages activate our beloved WNT pathway, activating stem cells, increasing VEGF to increase blood supply, and specifically a Keratinocyte Growth Factor resulting in marked hair growth.






Oddly enough, when TRPV1 research first began, isolated hair follicle activity was suppressed with TRPV1 activation, but refining of study parameters showed the mistakes.



Quercetin-Nicotinamide Crytals



Quercetin is a ubiquitous compound in nature. It assists the entry of zinc into cells, and shows potent anti-viral properties. Applied topically, quercetin stimulates extremely rapid and potent hair growth.

One of the pathways Quercetin uses is induction of Hypoxia Inducible Factor-1, which signals to the body inadequate oxygen supplies, which then trigger the body to branch out new capillaries in order to deliver more oxygen, and nutrients, to the area. Enhancement of the vascular network is itself beneficial for hair growth.





https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10246722/



As well, quercetin inhibits the metabolism of caffeine, prolonging the potent effects of caffeine on hair growth (see below.)








Forskolin-Caffeine Crystals



Forskolin was a difficult addition to the formula, as there are conflicting studies that have yet to be clarified. Forskolin increases cAMP levels in cells by activating Adenylyl Cyclase. The decision was influenced by the details of the studies showing differential effects, with subjects already suffering from Androgenetic Alopecia undergoing significant growth, whereas the majority of negative effects were demonstrated on isolated skin patches containing follicles, but separated from the rest of the body pathways and systems.











Caffeine – The positive effects of caffeine on hair growth are well known. Topical application of caffeine to the scalp, increasing sensitivity to IGF-1 while also increasing expression, while at the same time reducing the apoptic effects of TGF-b2 (which triggers catagen phase). Caffeine induces anagen while at the same time, blocking entry into Catagen.



https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24836650/



There is also significant evidence that Caffeine blocks the negative effect of androgens on the hair follicle.






These unique crystals are formed to increase the solubility of forskolin, while combining the positive effects of both compounds.



Andrographolide

Like TRPV1, described above, TRPV4 is a transient (activated only under certain external conditions) thermosensitive receptor. TRPV4 activation occurs between 36 and 42 degrees celsius ( around 100 degrees farenheit) which, when combined with TRPV1 helps to signal Summer heat, and the upcoming Fall/Winter, when thicker hair will be needed for heat retention. Andrographolide is a relatively potent TRPV4 agonist.



https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10816018/



TRPV4 is also a mechanosensitive receptor, caused by some friction and stretch injuries, which means it also triggers and sensitizes the effected tissues to healing factors like IGF-1. One of major benefits here is that, in follicle-rich skin like the scalp, the IGF-1 and TRPV4 signaling causes a rapid and potent induction of Anagen phase.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32542737/



Stretch activation of TRPV4 also triggers the macrophage activity discussed above to bring in the reservoir stem cells.






Andrographolide, in particular, has a potent anti-inflammatory property, and as side benefit demonstrates multiple anti-aging properties. Expect some compliments on your youthful scalp.



https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6332002/
 
Stem Bromelain



PDE-3b belongs to the Phosphodiesterase family of enzymes, functioning to disable cAMP. It is triggered by elevated insulin levels in order to prevent lipolysis and enable nutrient storage (unfortunately usually fat gain). Chronic insulin elevation leads to metabolic syndrome, including type 2 diabetes, and whole body malfunctions. Inhibition of PDE3b causes a major cascade of biological signals that result in rapid, and potent, induction of Anagen phase as well as a massive increase in cellular proliferation of keratinocytes and hair shaft elongation.






cAMP(or cyclical Adenosine Monophosphate) is a molecule that trasmits a state of “low energy” to important energy producing cells. In the case of hair follicle, the resulting generation of energy suppresses GSK3b and triggers follicular activity.








Pumpkin Seed Oil



Pumpkin Seed Oil has been shown to inhibit our damaging 5a-reductase enzyme, which converts testosterone into the far more potent DHT. As an added benefit, the oil is used as a component of the carrier oil for the fomula.












70% Phosphatidic Acid

Phosphatidic Acid, a phospholipid is an essential component of a healthy cellular membrane. PA has been shown to activate a pathway known as MAPK/ERK to counteract TGF-b1 growth inhibition and atrophy. Several studies have indicated potent hair growth properties via potent induction of Anagen phase. As another benefit, PA is the key structural component in the specialized liposomes used to form Virile Mane’s proprietary carrier.






Emu Oil



There have been contradictory reports on the use of Emu oil when it comes to hair. However, a recent study demonstrated long term effects on wound healing, inflammation, and quality or restored hair follicle, with the resulting follicles being multi-layered and of complex structure, leading to thicker and denser hair formation. As well, density of follicles per square inch, was higher in the Emu Oil treated group.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4812284/



As yet another side benefit, the saturated fat content of Emu Oil helps (along with the phytosterols) reinforce the structure of the liposomes, and helps restrict delivery of the ingredients to the layers of the skin, rather than being picked up systemically via the dermal vasculature.



Phytosterols



Phytosterols have been shown to contribute to the inhibition of 5a-reductase, as well as purported to effectively induce Anagen growth phase. As well, the phytosterols form a stiffening support to the liposomal carrier, and prevent instability from rupturing them during delivery through/to the skin.






Virile Mane is an easy-to-use, effective topical serum treatment to stimulate and prolong healthy hair growth by addressing most of the dysfunctional pathways that lead to hair loss. Absorption is extremely rapid and non-staining.



The world is complicated and judgmental enough without having to be constantly self-conscious about your hair. For better or worse, hair thickness is considered a sign of health and virility. Virile Mane is here to change your world for the better.
 
Here is the order link. Highly discounted while awaiting labels and outer boxes.

 
Here is the order link. Highly discounted while awaiting labels and outer boxes.

I'm not sure why it has that content about the original VM. It is not in the store entry.
 
Just ordered 2 bottles. I react awful to finasteride & minoxidil so hoping this might help.

Will log it :)
 
Just ordered 4 bottles to give it a go.
Won’t know much for a few months other than how it affects daily hair fall which I casually track via a shower drain plug that catches every single hair.

@dsade
1.Can we get updated directions? The old ones say 1/4-1/2 dropper onto “areas desired” twice per day. What constitutes an “area”? 1x1in? 2x2? The entire crown?

For reference, I generally apply my 2ml of my current topical (“Lipogaine” with finasteride raws mixed in) to my entire scalp, with emphasis on the crown and temples, once per evening.

2. Can this be used in conjunction with minoxidil and/or topical finasteride?

Apologies if these were covered in the write up and I missed them. I will come back for a deeper read later.

Thank you.
 
1 drop will cover about 1 square inch

If you
Just ordered 4 bottles to give it a go.
Won’t know much for a few months other than how it affects daily hair fall which I casually track via a shower drain plug that catches every single hair.

@dsade
1.Can we get updated directions? The old ones say 1/4-1/2 dropper onto “areas desired” twice per day. What constitutes an “area”? 1x1in? 2x2? The entire crown?

For reference, I generally apply my 2ml of my current topical (“Lipogaine” with finasteride raws mixed in) to my entire scalp, with emphasis on the crown and temples, once per evening.

2. Can this be used in conjunction with minoxidil and/or topical finasteride?

Apologies if these were covered in the write up and I missed them. I will come back for a deeper read later.

Thank you.
1 Drop covers about 1 square inch

If you use another topical, just apply it at a different time
 
1 drop will cover about 1 square inch

If you

1 Drop covers about 1 square inch

If you use another topical, just apply it at a different time
Hey Dsade.

Do you think this is strong enough as a solo product?

I've lost around 50% of my hair so at the desperate stage lol
 
Hey Dsade.

Do you think this is strong enough as a solo product?

I've lost around 50% of my hair so at the desperate stage lol
Yes
 
Hey Dsade. You still running a little behind with the defuse shipping?
Tracking says tomorrow. I'm upgrading everyone to Priority so you will still get them in time..
 
If I missed I’m sorry in advance but I didn’t see it. What effects would this have on patchy facial hair?
 
If I missed I’m sorry in advance but I didn’t see it. What effects would this have on patchy facial hair?
I'm currently using it. Far too early to tell anything yet though.

I've heard people have had success with minoxidil on their beards?
 
F

Fair.. keep us updated! I really hope it works.
So do I lol

I have a full head of hair but it's just very thin (Easily lost 50% of mass) can see my full scalp now. Damn androgens! Lol

Do you think I should micro needle my scalp also?
 
So do I lol

I have a full head of hair but it's just very thin (Easily lost 50% of mass) can see my full scalp now. Damn androgens! Lol

Do you think I should micro needle my scalp also?
The good news is, at least in my experience researching this stuff, diffuse thinners tend to achieve faster and fuller results than those of us with traditional MPB.

You should absolutely micro needle.
 
I have been using this latest iteration for about a month now.

Unfortunately, I have not been able to use it exactly as instructed. Due to some of the ingredients, the product has a color and smell not dissimilar to TopMuscle, which is unfortunate for an area you don’t want to wash within an hour or two of use.

To make it easier on me and my girl who hates the smell, I have been diluting 14 drops into 1.5ml of my minoxidil/finasteride solution along with 4-5 drops of a rosemary mint oil to mask the scent.

This may not be what dsade intended, and I have no idea how much, if at all, this method of application is hurting the efficacy of the product, but the good news is: 1 month in and daily hair-fall is significantly reduced.

I use a silicone shower drain that catches everything. I typically see ~15-30 hairs after a shower. In the past couple weeks that has been cut in half. Optimistic results so far
 
Approaching 2 months of use and hair-fall has subsided even further. It has been a substantial reduction to the tune of maybe ~75%. It is possible I’m simply going through a low-shedding phase, but I’ve never experienced one that lasted this long or had such little hair-fall.

Additionally, my barber remarked on new growth that he believed he saw on my scalp. I didn’t prompt him or ask him, he just noticed enough that he felt the need to say something.

We are still very much in the early stages. Won’t really have any concrete evidence until around 3 months in, but this is very promising so far.
 
Approaching 2 months of use and hair-fall has subsided even further. It has been a substantial reduction to the tune of maybe ~75%. It is possible I’m simply going through a low-shedding phase, but I’ve never experienced one that lasted this long or had such little hair-fall.

Additionally, my barber remarked on new growth that he believed he saw on my scalp. I didn’t prompt him or ask him, he just noticed enough that he felt the need to say something.

We are still very much in the early stages. Won’t really have any concrete evidence until around 3 months in, but this is very promising so far.
Sounds good, as hair grows in cycles you should know by month 3-4 if this works for you or not... seems promising.
 
Approaching 2 months of use and hair-fall has subsided even further. It has been a substantial reduction to the tune of maybe ~75%. It is possible I’m simply going through a low-shedding phase, but I’ve never experienced one that lasted this long or had such little hair-fall.

Additionally, my barber remarked on new growth that he believed he saw on my scalp. I didn’t prompt him or ask him, he just noticed enough that he felt the need to say something.

We are still very much in the early stages. Won’t really have any concrete evidence until around 3 months in, but this is very promising so far.

This sounds promising!

I'm about 3-4 weeks into using it also. I picked up a few extra bottles in hope that it works. An amazing formula on paper tbh.

When did you start to really notice any sort of changes? So far I'm not noticing anything. I know about hair cycles etc and it's a slow process.

This is my last attack on my hair. I'm too scared to use finasteride etc. I do have it their but I just don't fancy taking the risks. It actually scares me how many people value their hair more over their mental/physical health. On reddit I was reading posts of guys who's sex drives had dropped to near zero and they were battling anxiety/depression but because their hair had started to grow again they didn't want to stop. What the actual f*ck!. I would rather feel good than salvage my hair. Everyone is different though and have different outlooks on things. I know the side effect profile is a low percent but it's definitely still present.

I will update on any changes. Fingers crossed.
 
Sounds good, as hair grows in cycles you should know by month 3-4 if this works for you or not... seems promising.
Indeed, hence my apprehension to get too excited. If any regrowth begins to occur I probably won’t notice it much until 6 months even, but I’m in it for the long haul.
 
This sounds promising!

I'm about 3-4 weeks into using it also. I picked up a few extra bottles in hope that it works. An amazing formula on paper tbh.

When did you start to really notice any sort of changes? So far I'm not noticing anything. I know about hair cycles etc and it's a slow process.

This is my last attack on my hair. I'm too scared to use finasteride etc. I do have it their but I just don't fancy taking the risks. It actually scares me how many people value their hair more over their mental/physical health. On reddit I was reading posts of guys who's sex drives had dropped to near zero and they were battling anxiety/depression but because their hair had started to grow again they didn't want to stop. What the actual f*ck!. I would rather feel good than salvage my hair. Everyone is different though and have different outlooks on things. I know the side effect profile is a low percent but it's definitely still present.

I will update on any changes. Fingers crossed.
Typing on my phone so this may be riddled with grammatical errors.

The only 2 changes I’ve noticed thus far are significantly reduced hair-fall, and my barber remarking on my mid/crown area seemingly being thicker.

The reduced hair-fall began about a month in. As mentioned, I track this consistently by my silicone shower drain (“tubshroom”), that catches virtually every hair.

You are wise to be hesitant about finasteride. I have tried in on two separate occasions, once about 10 years ago, and once about 5 years ago. I seem to be very sensitive to the sides, and gave up on entirely until last year when I decided to go on TRT and fin at the same time as an experiment . I have never done cycles, and my test levels have always been fine, but with the advent of topical fin, which anecdotally appears to cause some people less sides, I thought: “what if I tried low dose TRT and low dose topical fin at the same time”?

I played with doses of both and have settled on 84mg test prop per week, (12mg administered daily), and .5mg fin per day administered topically. I make my own solution with finasteride raws dissolved in a minoxidil solution. I have been on this combo for about a year and have noticed no significant issues with libido, and it stabilized my hair loss. I was going to play with upping the fin dose to see if I could get some regrowth, but when dsade dropped this new virile mane, I figured I’d try adding that to my regimen first.
 
Typing on my phone so this may be riddled with grammatical errors.

The only 2 changes I’ve noticed thus far are significantly reduced hair-fall, and my barber remarking on my mid/crown area seemingly being thicker.

The reduced hair-fall began about a month in. As mentioned, I track this consistently by my silicone shower drain (“tubshroom”), that catches virtually every hair.

You are wise to be hesitant about finasteride. I have tried in on two separate occasions, once about 10 years ago, and once about 5 years ago. I seem to be very sensitive to the sides, and gave up on entirely until last year when I decided to go on TRT and fin at the same time as an experiment . I have never done cycles, and my test levels have always been fine, but with the advent of topical fin, which anecdotally appears to cause some people less sides, I thought: “what if I tried low dose TRT and low dose topical fin at the same time”?

I played with doses of both and have settled on 84mg test prop per week, (12mg administered daily), and .5mg fin per day administered topically. I make my own solution with finasteride raws dissolved in a minoxidil solution. I have been on this combo for about a year and have noticed no significant issues with libido, and it stabilized my hair loss. I was going to play with upping the fin dose to see if I could get some regrowth, but when dsade dropped this new virile mane, I figured I’d try adding that to my regimen first.

Did you make your own finasteride blend using the pills? I've seen guys turning the pills into powder then adding it to a minoxidil pre mix.

Minoxidil made me feel awful. Like serious fatigue that I've never experienced in my life. Was scary tbh. I battled through it for 3 months. I never knew the minoxidil was actually the culprit until I went on holiday and forgot my minoxidil. All that fatigue lifted and my mood improved drastically. I was kinda angry as for 3 months I felt seriously ill and it was minoxidil all along. Just the standard off the shelf stuff too.

I've looked at topical finasteride. I might give it a go. The horror story's are scary tbh. I watched a video of a guy with serious PFS and it was so sad to watch. Completely ruined his life with no chance of return.
 
Did you make your own finasteride blend using the pills? I've seen guys turning the pills into powder then adding it to a minoxidil pre mix.

Minoxidil made me feel awful. Like serious fatigue that I've never experienced in my life. Was scary tbh. I battled through it for 3 months. I never knew the minoxidil was actually the culprit until I went on holiday and forgot my minoxidil. All that fatigue lifted and my mood improved drastically. I was kinda angry as for 3 months I felt seriously ill and it was minoxidil all along. Just the standard off the shelf stuff too.

I've looked at topical finasteride. I might give it a go. The horror story's are scary tbh. I watched a video of a guy with serious PFS and it was so sad to watch. Completely ruined his life with no chance of return.
I am not using pills. I'm not 100% certain what excipients/fillers are present in pills (which can vary from manufacturer to manufacturer anyway) and would prefer not to rub them into my scalp. I found a supplier of raw api and purchased 50 grams. I had it 3rd party tested as well. I would recommend them, but unfortunately they're no longer in business. I'm confident one can find it from any number of other suppliers, though. Alternatively, you can probably have a custom topical made with whatever dose you want. Most pre-made topicals have very high doses. Presumably they've determined that topical application is far less efficient than oral.

It's strange how pharmacokinetics/dynamics vary from one person to another. I'm sorry to hear about your experience with minox. You could also look into stemoxydine.

Are you on test/trt? If so, trying a low-dose topical fin may be worthwhile. I am crazy sensitive to 5-ar inhibition and will never be able to use it orally, but low-dose topical combined with my moderate TRT dose (84mg/week) has yielded very little libido drop-off.
 
Mini-update: For almost a week now there have been maybe 2-3 hairs in my shower drain. My daily hair-fall has never been this low. Hair is also looking slightly thicker overall. Still inconclusive, but positive.
 
Mini-update: For almost a week now there have been maybe 2-3 hairs in my shower drain. My daily hair-fall has never been this low. Hair is also looking slightly thicker overall. Still inconclusive, but positive.

How much do you think the virile mane has contributed?

I'm on about 5ish weeks in roughly. I'm using virile mane only. I completely forgot about microneedling though. I was sitting the other day and it just came into my head. Microneedling. I bought a Derma pen last year and barely used it. I loaded it up 2 days ago and ran a 1.5mm across my full head. I waited a day and then started the virile mane again. I'm gonna derma pen once a week at 1.5mm. Feels awful but 15 mins once a week is doable.

I would definitely say my hair has stopped falling out as bad. I still have my full hair line it's just VERY thin. Can see my full scalp. People don't realise how impactful hair loss is. It affects me mentally for certain. I've found myself wearing a hat almost everyday 👎 Though. This is my last attempt at recovering it. I may try the topical finasteride. Their is a company in the UK that does topicals and they do very low dose ones also so it's ideal. Infact I will buy a bottle just now. Do you put it only on the thinning areas?

Do you think you can recover your hair?

Yeh I'm on TRT. The test has 100% sped up the hair loss. It's just part of the package when using anabolics. I was running primo for a few months but it was accelerating the hair loss far too quick. I had to stop it. Also the primo is notorious for crashing your e2.

I'm currently using 120mg test a week. 40mg 3x per week. I added in HCG about 2 months ago aswell. 150iu on injection days. Just to bring the boys back online. I've been playing around with DHEA/Pregnenolone recently also. I don't react well to oral dhea so I've been experimenting with topical and so far so good.

I will sometimes throw in the odd prohormone. I recently used nanodrol for about 2 weeks. I just do short bursts with prohormones. Even with 2 weeks I can add 5 lbs in weight. My strength goes up also. Their mostly all dht backbone based so gotta limit the exposure. You also feel very fatigued on them. Their very strong. My body is numb to testosterone now. I keep my dose steady just to feel good. If I increase the dose I just start fighting with e2.

You ever feel like a lab experiment? 😂 It's good fun playing around but I've also had horrible periods. Bad side effects etc.

Anyway dude. Best of luck. Fingers crossed you get all your growth back 💪
 
I am going to experiment with this, I had surgery that results in a scar across my skull, I had a lot of needling on it to the point I dont have any raised scar tissue or anything. I had a partial hair transplant to cover up the hairless area, it held for a little bit but then all fell out. It was a combination of infection and possible not getting the right amount of blood supply etc... but I am going to try this on those locations and see if it can grow any hairs or atleast thicken the surrounding area. I am not sure if there are any hair bulbs left there, but it worth a go. Got two bottles and will give it a crack.
 
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