Bonds' use revealed

[swole210]

right, which is what i mean by saying "directly"... the juice didnt magically improve his skills, they allowed him to improve them more than he could've without through his own work... im not disagreeing that they allow you to train longer and harder

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Bottom line is that he was a great player to begin with, before steroids! If you suck, you suck!! Steroids will make you a bigger sucker if you do not have the god given talent, ability or heart/love of the sport!!! Like stated before, it will make a good player really good, and a really good player awesome! The playing field is probably more level than everybody thinks. There are or were a lot of players juicing, and not everyone was having record breaking years.
Hey Uncle Sam.........JUST ****ING LEGALIZE IT ALLREADY AND SHUT UP, SIT YOUR FAT OUT OF SHAPE ASS ON THE COUCH, DRINK YOUR BEER EAT YOUR CHIPS, AND WATCH AN AWESOME BASEBALL GAME FULL OF ACTION!!

 

[jomi822]

Still... it can't make your eye/hand coordination any better...

i had a biology teacher tell me that steroids did indeed increase your reflexes. who knows if its true coming from that source but he was a very intelligent man to say the least

i know that when im "on" i do everything involving athletics much faster and with much more confidence, including hand to eye related movements. perhaps it could be the placebo effect but if the steroids gave that to bonds then that is still an advantage i suppose.

also if the playing field were "level" i think sports would be very boring. for one i think we should have "natural" leagues and "do what you want" leagues. im guessing people would watch the athletes pushed to the limit of their genetic potential rather than the natural players, in any sport

 

[kasket]

I seriously don't think that any anabolics caused Barry to win a batting title.
Sure, they might add 5 feet to a hit, turning some into HR's. But, they won't cause you to turn your hips faster to get around on the inside fastball. Or to transfer your weight properly.

Dude is a hitter - anabolics or not.

Not true

Take 2 people, clones (theoretically)


the one with the stronger hips, legs, back, arms, and body in general, IS going to get the hips around faster, transfer the weight quicker, have MORE weight, and overall do better.


But thats not to say Barry wasnt already a great baseball player.

 

[UnicronSpawn]

I know that when Im on it definately helps with sprinting speed. Last weekend I did some sprints for the first time in forever and.... I dont know exactly how far I was running or in how many seconds, but It sure FELT like I was flying pretty fast. I dont think people I was hanging around with expected a 6ft 4 250lb guy who ussually does most things slowly could move that fast. (especially right after a huge meal at texas longhorns steak house! God I love that place.) Im lucky I didnt puke.
Im suprised it never became en vouge to be a super AAS slugger who also steals alot of bases. In 88 people seemed to be excited about it when Canseco had his 40-40 moment. But seems like we could have seen guys doing like 60-60 by the late 90's early 2000's if the ultra sluggers had made it a point to exploit the speed advantage that AAS use offers.

 

[Qwerty]

Let's be brutally honest though. Bonds was past his athletic prime. He was in his late thirties. Then all of a sudden he comes to training camp with all this extra weight, and his teammates are calling him the hulk. He SHATTERED his personal homerun record in the process of setting the MLB record, a number he had never even come close to before. All while almost every other player would have been at a consistant or downhill stage of their career. Some improvement is obviously possible because of the mechanical nature of baseball and hitting, but you just don't see the explosion we saw. The evidence is simply overwhelming.

And noone is trying to take away the fact that Bonds is a great player. He went from being a great player to one of the most prolific homerun hitters in history. Those aren't one and the same. And to be honest, he would not have put up the homerun numbers he did without the roids. EVERYTHING leading up to that point in his career tells us that. You can't use the arguement "Steroids don't make you a great player, he was great anyway." Because the fact of the matter is he went from great to the pinnacle of baseball as far as stats are concerned, all with his bulked up frame that he put on past the age of 37.

For those of you who don't believe me, the stats are pretty telling:
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By analyzing his performance before and after alleged steroid abuse, and comparing him to the top hitters of all time and their performance relative to the stages in their career, here are the stats one might expect to see if he had continued to progress like the best players of all time (a generous assumption even). Non-roided barry could have expected around 631 homeruns right now, 77 less than he actually has. It would be pretty hard to predict what he would have had in a single season, but the implication is pretty obvious.

 

[anabolicrhino]

Bonds was a great all around player. He hurt his elbow when he was about 30. It was touch and go for his career, he almost had to retire. He got into weight training and supplementing during his recovery. This was 1995 baseball was coming off the strike season and the game became all about homeruns and strikeouts. The subtle strategies that seperate baseball from other sports were put on hold . Players were getting huge, anybody remember Lenny Dykstra? He went from a skinny scratch hitter for the Mets to a homerun stud for the Phillies. Why shouldn't Bonds take steroids? They were neither illegal or even tested for in his sport. He never tested positive. Bonds is very smart, he had plausable deniability when he was questioned. He probably did not know exactly what he was taking, only that "what ever?" it was it was working!

I think greatness is measured relative to the other players of your era. I believe that the year Babe Ruth hit 60 hrs the next closest guy had 24. Ruth hit more hrs that year than half of the TEAMS in the league! Bond has had some great numbers even relative to the other juiced guys, but not quite the dominance of Ruth.

 

[UnicronSpawn]

Yeah, and whose to say how a hitter from one era would fare against the pitching standards of another era. In the past, there were always guys who were ahead of their time, and dominated at WAY beyond the excepted status quo of their time. If Babe Ruth played against today's pitchers, he'd probably have to quit getting hammered all the time, and start training his butt off with a much better diet then he got away with then in order to put up great numbers against modern day pitching standards. I think Canseco was an innovator for realizing the potential AAS and GH had in pro baseball, in a time when nobody thought they would be suited for baseball players. The homerun explosion saved baseball in a way, cuz before the strike year attendance was abysmal. This whole war on steroids bussiness is just setting back the evolution of sports and human physical culture in general. Its costing taxpayers money, misleading the uneducated, and landing otherwise productive law-abidng citizens in lockup. The guy's getting an advantage in their sports arent even the one's getting locked up, it's bodybuilders, and physique enthusiasts who have regular jobs, like contractors, sales rep's, shop keep's, college students, register jockey's, and bouncer's. It's insane. Alot of those people did enough research that they know how to use them in a way that's not even a formidable threat to themselves, let alone others.
But the media, politicans and other's with dubious knowledge of AAS want to trick people into thinking "they'll shrink your penis, theyl make you kill people, theyl make you kill yourself, theyl give you liver failure, heart-attack's, stroke's, brain cancer, athletes foot, broken bones, smelly butt sweat, theyl make you stub your toe, theyl make you go blind, theyl give you freakin gingivitus!" For crying out loud. Then they conveniently fail to produce any more evidence than just an anecdote from some other knuckle head that doesnt know an androgen receptor from a garbage receptical EITHER. Its crazy I tell you. Crazy.:nutkick: :wtf:

 

[the Cardinal]

I know for some of you, this is simply me preaching to the choir, but anyway...

Steroid use? Most fans, including yall’s truly, don’t care! Want proof? Watch the increase in average attendance at any visiting ballpark Bonds visits this year!

“Cheating” implies: 1) taking advantage of an opportunity that is unavailable to others, and 2) that somehow the advantage is real. Well, others had the same opportunity to use steroids, but some simply chose not to do so (while plenty more did so, but because they haven’t exhibited Bonds-like talent, no one could tell the datgum difference!!!). Despite all the hoopla, the use of anabolic agents is no different than the use of supplements, weight loss pills, B-12 injections, vegetarian diets, Viagra, or other prescription medication – it’s all about personal choice to use whatever helps you to be better at…whatever. Steroids don’t make anyone’s hand-to-eye coordination better, nor does the added strength matter when you are already capable of 425 ft. homerun shots. But some anabolic steroids can help a worn-out, aging body handle physical stress much better than it would otherwise.

For anyone who wants to scream Bonds used illegal steroids based on his alleged testimony, you’re wrong. At the time he allegedly admitted to using the “creme and clear,” the so-called experts believed this steroid to be THC, which is a designer steroid. THC wasn’t declared illegal until after Bond’s alleged testimony, when Congress voted to specifically ban it (same technicality – “they weren’t illegal at the time” - as Guv’nor Ahnold used when asked about his past steroid use!!!). As for the human growth hormone, check out what’s happening at any anti-aging clinic around the country (yes, grandpa and grandma may be HGH users, woe is me!!!) And the next time any one of you finds yourself driving faster than the posted speed limit, check yourself before you start ranting about someone else doing something illegal!

Bottom line is the man is a professional athlete who makes his living playing a grueling sport. I do not begrudge him or anyone else for using exercise, nutrition, supplementation, and chemical enhancement that allows them to do a better job at what they are being paid to do, and for what we, as the ticket purchasers, pay to see!

MLB, as well as those "outraged" (yeah, right) talkin' heads, are free to recognize or not recognize Bond's on-the-field achievements as they see fit, but any independent thinking fan who is the least bit objective will recognize him for what he is as baseball player: arguably the greatest of all time. Shoot, the man ain't been accused of killing, robbing, raping, or pillaging, yet the media (as well as some of the brain-washed public) are tending to treat the "revelations" in this new book as the greatest piece of investigative journalism since <gasp>...the Paula Abdul/American Idol so-called scandal!!!:blink: God bless America...

 

[not_big_enuf]

No, there's also another reason Bonds get so much attention from the media and it's the same reason people want to see him fail. HE'S AN *******!

I used to be one of the biggest Bonds fans around... my dog, whom I love dearly is named Bonds. HERE BOY!

Regardless, he's a **** to just about everybody he meets. Sometimes he'll come off as a sincere guy, but most of the time he's an arrogant asshat. He's publicly berated his wife, his kids, etc in front of countless people. Almost every teammate he's had has had run ins with him (and it's not because they're not playing hard). Even guys that have tried to get close and became friends with him came away bitter. Sheffield became close to Barry and finally just "f it, this guy aint worth this hassle" and left. I know too many people close to baseball that have told me time and time again of stories that are utterly jaw-dropping. There's tons out there too... look around.

Now, yes, that is a completely different topic altogether, but people like to see good guys succeed and jerks fail. I'm sorry, but I understand. I've went out of my way to make sure someone I disliked failed when, if it was a friend, I wouldn't have done the same thing.

Yeah, stars in different sports get special treatment, etc. Many times it's because those people are good guys and are generally like. They have a good persona, do great with fans, and are easily accessible. Those that aren't... well, we don't want them to have the same level of success.

 

[the Cardinal]

No, there's also another reason Bonds get so much attention from the media and it's the same reason people want to see him fail. HE'S AN *******!

I used to be one of the biggest Bonds fans around... my dog, whom I love dearly is named Bonds. HERE BOY!

Regardless, he's a **** to just about everybody he meets. Sometimes he'll come off as a sincere guy, but most of the time he's an arrogant asshat. He's publicly berated his wife, his kids, etc in front of countless people. Almost every teammate he's had has had run ins with him (and it's not because they're not playing hard). Even guys that have tried to get close and became friends with him came away bitter. Sheffield became close to Barry and finally just "f it, this guy aint worth this hassle" and left. I know too many people close to baseball that have told me time and time again of stories that are utterly jaw-dropping. There's tons out there too... look around.

Now, yes, that is a completely different topic altogether, but people like to see good guys succeed and jerks fail. I'm sorry, but I understand. I've went out of my way to make sure someone I disliked failed when, if it was a friend, I wouldn't have done the same thing.

Yeah, stars in different sports get special treatment, etc. Many times it's because those people are good guys and are generally like. They have a good persona, do great with fans, and are easily accessible. Those that aren't... well, we don't want them to have the same level of success.

I don't disagree with you - your account of him being a jerk is consistent with the general consensus. BUT...a lot of celebrities, athletes, politicians, journalists, AND REGULAR, ORDINARY FOLKS are born jerks, and a lot more are jerks at least some of the time. They/we lie, cheat, pout, badmouth, etc... from time to time, but notice a lot of us judge "the other guy's" behavior much harsher than our own. In fact, the more hypocritical amongst us can always rationalize why whatever-the-hell he or she did ain't nearly as bad as what some high-paid prima donna has done.:study: Oh well, we're all simply human...

 

[natedogg]

Maybe we should throw out all records. Over the years we have seen improvements in the way players train and supplement their diets, the type of bats and balls used, lowering of the mound, configuration of ballparks, motivational factors (i.e. money and lots of it), pitchers who are too scared to throw inside, and the list can go on forever. IMO, the records attained in the steroid era should NOT be thrown out. The players took advantage of something baseball just happened to overlook for so many years until recently. I guarantee this wouldn't be as bad for Bonds if he wasn't such a d!ck to the media. Truthfully, I'll still be rooting for him and the Giants this year. Take that for what it's worth.

 

[UnicronSpawn]

Then again a lot of people looked at McGwire like he was freakin Paul Bunyan, and alot of the same people who are judging Bonds are also saying that McGwire's stats should all be eradicated, and have him barred from the hall of fame too.

 

[natedogg]

and alot of the same people who are judging Bonds are also saying that McGwire's stats should all be eradicated, and have him barred from the hall of fame too.

I'm not one of them. Then again, I always liked McGwire too. Although sending McGwire to the hall of fame, steroids or not, is still up for debate in my book. I'll quote Skip Bayless here, "It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of the Very Good."

 

[Achilles13]

Then again a lot of people looked at McGwire like he was freakin Paul Bunyan, and alot of the same people who are judging Bonds are also saying that McGwire's stats should all be eradicated, and have him barred from the hall of fame too.

It's only fair correct?:hammer:

 

[UnicronSpawn]

I suppose so, but my point was just that it's not just because people think Bonds is an A**h*le that people want him hung drawn and quartered. To some people, having a tactical advantage that someone else chooses not to, or is'nt supposed to have is as bad as molesting children. And IMO, that's overblowing the situation. Ty Cobb used to play dirty all the time and he's still in the hall of fame, and he didnt have an * next to any of his batting records. Dozens of guys have pitched spitballs or used corked bats, and their statistics were left alone. Ricky Henderson is rumored to have been a meth head when he set some of his stolen base records. Maris hadnt reached 60hr's by the time 154 games had passed. (I know they said his record would have a * next to it, but I've heard that that never actually happened and his 61hr's in 1961 were written as is in the official record books, w no *) At worst, if someone is caught juicing, they should be suspended for a while. That would make sure their not going to put up earth shattering #'s anyway, cuz they'd only be playing 2 thirds of a season. (if they actually get caught that is.)
But if you start messing with statistics, wich are merely a recording of what ACTUALLY happened, youd be neglecting the stats of anyone who did it but didnt get caught. In this case youd be basing it on guilt by overwhelming suspicion. Stats record WHAT happened, not what COULD have or SHOULD have or WOULD have happened. If you start thinking that way then you could just start saying, oh well so in so would have pitched a great game if he didnt catch that stomach virus before the game. Or so in so would have hit more homeruns if he hadnt been sidelined for that hamstring pull. Or so in so would have been to tired to go 4 for 4 in that game if they hadnt let him drink 4 cups of esspreso before and during the game.
Eradicating the stats just doesnt seem reasonable to me weather the player was a jerk, an real american hero, or in between. And if we're going to use an * based on suspicion, we might as well put an * by the last 16 seasons of everybody, cuz we'll never know who used what in that time.

 

[swole210]

I suppose so, but my point was just that it's not just because people think Bonds is an A**h*le that people want him hung drawn and quartered. To some people, having a tactical advantage that someone else chooses not to, or is'nt supposed to have is as bad as molesting children. And IMO, that's overblowing the situation. Ty Cobb used to play dirty all the time and he's still in the hall of fame, and he didnt have an * next to any of his batting records. Dozens of guys have pitched spitballs or used corked bats, and their statistics were left alone. Ricky Henderson is rumored to have been a meth head when he set some of his stolen base records. Maris hadnt reached 60hr's by the time 154 games had passed. (I know they said his record would have a * next to it, but I've heard that that never actually happened and his 61hr's in 1961 were written as is in the official record books, w no *) At worst, if someone is caught juicing, they should be suspended for a while. That would make sure their not going to put up earth shattering #'s anyway, cuz they'd only be playing 2 thirds of a season. (if they actually get caught that is.)
But if you start messing with statistics, wich are merely a recording of what ACTUALLY happened, youd be neglecting the stats of anyone who did it but didnt get caught. In this case youd be basing it on guilt by overwhelming suspicion. Stats record WHAT happened, not what COULD have or SHOULD have or WOULD have happened. If you start thinking that way then you could just start saying, oh well so in so would have pitched a great game if he didnt catch that stomach virus before the game. Or so in so would have hit more homeruns if he hadnt been sidelined for that hamstring pull. Or so in so would have been to tired to go 4 for 4 in that game if they hadnt let him drink 4 cups of esspreso before and during the game.
Eradicating the stats just doesnt seem reasonable to me weather the player was a jerk, an real american hero, or in between. And if we're going to use an * based on suspicion, we might as well put an * by the last 16 seasons of everybody, cuz we'll never know who used what in that time.

:goodpost: :goodpost: !

 

[natedogg]

Pretty much what I said or intended to say in my previous post. Just not in so many words. With the new rules in effect, Baseball should pretty much deter any steroid use. But with the old rules, I probably would have juiced too. When you're playing for your livelyhood, you do what you have to to gain that little extra edge and steroids do just that. If you want to blame anyone, blame Baseball. Blame Selig for turning the other way. Not the players who took advantage of the situation.

 

[ktw]

I know I am late but I still find it ironic that some of you believe that roids did not help Bonds. I would like you to refer to the other cases of steroid use in sports that have been exposed in the past. The East German athletes that followed a strict OT and GH program managed to break records in nearly every single sport, Ben Johnson and Carl Lewis managed to run blazingly fast times while using winstrol, and it is said that an estimated 80% of the athletes at the 1972 Munich olympics were on steroids. I would like to think that the pinnacle of sports excellence, the olympics, would have a good idea if steroid use effected their athletes and competition. Bottom line: It helps. How could it not? If one uses the right compounds, they can train to become more explosive, stronger, faster, and more agile. They can train at never before seen levels and recover extremely fast. In every way it provides advantages to their training regimen and performance. Now this is based on the fact that they are using the correct compound in the correct manner and have a training program that is designed to increase certain aspects of their sport. Bonds was on such a program, designed by a baseball player with extensive knowledge of performance enhancing substances. He is in the same boat as those of previously caught athletes, except this time he has little way to cover up the fact that he knew he was using. Whether he took the specified compounds in the book is debatable, but clearly any use would definately help his performance. If he had put on 40 lbs of unfunctional muscle, you would have seen his performance go down, not skyrocket to never before seen levels. He would be larger and have more weight to carry, and would rotate slower and run slower between bases. The fact of the matter is, the weight he put on aided his performance, next we have to debate how he got that weight and if it was ethical

 

[NUPE69]

Do you guys really think "Bonds" is the only one using Steroids??? The number of athletes using steroids is growing in EVERY sport. If the investigation is done RIGHT, we might see over half of the baseball league sitting on the bench. Every athlete is looking for an edge, every athlete looking to keep his or her job and every athlete wants to be number one.

Let’s do a flashback, was it Mark McQuire that had the 1ad bottle in his OPEN locker… {During an interview with a reporter?}

Let’s have every ballplayer do a SURPRISE urine test and I bet the world will be surprise with the numbers…if they let the public know.

 

[GREENFEATHER]

Personally I could care less what anyone puts into their body. I could say that test E gave me my 700 lb deadlift, but I know all of the work I put in in the gym did it, not 24 pins of juice!!
ROB who is in the hunt for 800 now!!

 

[UnicronSpawn]

I dont think anyone is trying to say that an intelligently applied AAS regimen wouldnt enhance the athletic performance that a appropriately structured training (including sports specific practice) and diet program can yield. But alot of (AAS nieve) sports fans think that the high profile guys who break records are the only ones using, or that any mediocre pro will reach the pinnacle of their sport if you added AAS to their protocol. Even more rediculous, are the sports fan's that think AAS is a method to be lazy. As if a mediocre athlete could just "coast" and become one of the top guys by simply juicing. The high profile record breaking AAS users are the exception because they are the elite athletes that allready had near top notch talent and when they implemented an AAS regimen with their allready incredibly ambitious and competetive work ethic, they pushed themselves over the top. But theese are the ONLY types of AAS users the lamen will ever be exposed to (at least knowingly), so it's easy for them to get an inaccurate view of exactly what AAS does and doesnt do for someone. That overblown perception the average sports fan has (of Joe Nobody, slacking off and taking a drug and suddenly being the best in the world) is one of the reasons the fan may very well resent the existance of AAS and of people who choose to use them. There are far more AAS users that use for the intent of cosmetic enhancement (people who arent cheating at ANY sport, or anyTHING) then there are competetive athletes cheating the other players in their sport. But the wrath skips right over the cheaters and lands squarely in the lap of the cosmetic users, who arent hurting anyone. (In many cases not even themselves if they no what their doing.) And blood work results of responsible AAS users consistantly supports that.

 

[Qwerty]

I'm not one of them. Then again, I always liked McGwire too. Although sending McGwire to the hall of fame, steroids or not, is still up for debate in my book. I'll quote Skip Bayless here, "It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of the Very Good."

lol. Is that a joke? He has the highest homerun to at-bat ratio in MLB history. He has an on-base percentage of nearly. 400, and a slugging percentage of nearly .600. He hit almost 600 homeruns over his career(5th most at the time he retired), when history shows 500 has basically been a lock for the hall of fame. And don't tell me he wasn't a rounded player. He was a gold-glove winner. He was far from a slouch as a defensive player. Not to mention him and Sosa singlehandedly brought baseball off lifesupport when he broke the homerun record that stood for 40 years.

Hall of the very good? If we are setting the requirements for the hall of fame THAT high, there are a LOT of people that shouldn't be in the hall right now, because he is more deserving of being there than a good portion of players already in the hall. And that's certainly not to disrespect anyone in the hall of fame. But McGwire was a dominant player.

 

[PumpingIron]

lol. Is that a joke? He has the highest homerun to at-bat ratio in MLB history. He has an on-base percentage of nearly. 400, and a slugging percentage of nearly .600. He hit almost 600 homeruns over his career(5th most at the time he retired), when history shows 500 has basically been a lock for the hall of fame. And don't tell me he wasn't a rounded player. He was a gold-glove winner. He was far from a slouch as a defensive player. Not to mention him and Sosa singlehandedly brought baseball off lifesupport when he broke the homerun record that stood for 40 years.

Hall of the very good? If we are setting the requirements for the hall of fame THAT high, there are a LOT of people that shouldn't be in the hall right now, because he is more deserving of being there than a good portion of players already in the hall. And that's certainly not to disrespect anyone in the hall of fame. But McGwire was a dominant player.

I definately agree, if not the fact that he broke the HR record should put him in automatically, his statistics speak for themselves and show his to be deserving of the hall 5 years from retirement...

 

[hardknock]

I know I am late but I still find it ironic that some of you believe that roids did not help Bonds. I would like you to refer to the other cases of steroid use in sports that have been exposed in the past. The East German athletes that followed a strict OT and GH program managed to break records in nearly every single sport, Ben Johnson and Carl Lewis managed to run blazingly fast times while using winstrol, and it is said that an estimated 80% of the athletes at the 1972 Munich olympics were on steroids. I would like to think that the pinnacle of sports excellence, the olympics, would have a good idea if steroid use effected their athletes and competition. Bottom line: It helps. How could it not? If one uses the right compounds, they can train to become more explosive, stronger, faster, and more agile. They can train at never before seen levels and recover extremely fast. In every way it provides advantages to their training regimen and performance. Now this is based on the fact that they are using the correct compound in the correct manner and have a training program that is designed to increase certain aspects of their sport. Bonds was on such a program, designed by a baseball player with extensive knowledge of performance enhancing substances. He is in the same boat as those of previously caught athletes, except this time he has little way to cover up the fact that he knew he was using. Whether he took the specified compounds in the book is debatable, but clearly any use would definately help his performance. If he had put on 40 lbs of unfunctional muscle, you would have seen his performance go down, not skyrocket to never before seen levels. He would be larger and have more weight to carry, and would rotate slower and run slower between bases. The fact of the matter is, the weight he put on aided his performance, next we have to debate how he got that weight and if it was ethical

I know what your saying, and that is all true, but NO AMOUNT of AAS/GH/designer, or the likes is going to develop great hand/eye coordination to "HIT" for bases...hitting a homer, at that rate is one of the hardest things in sports to accomplish. While so many, as people say, were using, how come only a couple had outstanding offensive seasons? And sprinting which requires one thing....speed, is a bit different to gain the same success hitting a ball 500ft

And the "game of shadows" is a joke book. It has some decent accounts of what went on, but when i seen so many innaccurate definitions of certain drugs; it was hilarious.The only thing n that book that is remotely worth remembering are the actual court documents.

Then i went on to read the sources section...laughable that any1 with a quivering of sense would believe half the people from which these sources came. I do honestly believe in 60% of the book, but 30% of the areas from which the sources came had vindictive reasoning for giving the accounts in which they did.

In the book, they recall some situation to where they may try to retest old urine samples....how? Why would u try to go back and retest for a claim which wasnt even a law to break a few years ago? There still isnt any factual evidence about Bond's or McGwire, unlike Giambi and Tim montgomery...

If you cut the bullsh*( from the book, and recount what is important, about the cases and "evidence", it' be about 5-6 chapters instead of 23+