Bad shoulders

[Mkgain1]

Everyone who's trained seriously before has had shoulder issues to some degree, recently I started having a shoulder issue I've never had before where its like a deep pressure in my shoulder joint (painful as well) but only while doing lateral raises. Anyone else ever have this? Any idea on how to ease the pain so I can train or at least alternative exercises to hit the mid delt that may not cause the pain?

 

[kjetil1234]

How is your internal rotation? You should be able to lift your arm off your back at least 4 inches. Compare to unaffected arm.

 

[YouBet33]

The greatest things I've learned from multiple shoulder surgeries is 1) rest 2) if pain is still there after a week of rest, see a orthopedic doc...I don't mess with my shoulders anymore, already in daily pain haha

 

[Mkgain1]

How is your internal rotation? You should be able to lift your arm off your back at least 4 inches. Compare to unaffected arm.

They're both affected the same but rotation is normal for me and painless, they click a bit with external rotation but only actually painful with the lateral raise movements

 

[Mkgain1]

The greatest things I've learned from multiple shoulder surgeries is 1) rest 2) if pain is still there after a week of rest, see a orthopedic doc...I don't mess with my shoulders anymore, already in daily pain haha

I know this is the most realistic thing to do but the last thing I wanted to hear since shoulders have been my weak spot so I'm really trying to make them grow for the 2016 season.. Gah oh well, longevity is more important

 

[kjetil1234]

I am asking for range of motion, not symptoms

 

[Mkgain1]

I am asking for range of motion, not symptoms

I stated above that internal rotation was normal, external rotation is okay they just click a bit. My mobility and range of motion is normal all around just bad pain on the lateral movements

 

[YouBet33]

I stated above that internal rotation was normal, external rotation is okay they just click a bit. My mobility and range of motion is normal all around just bad pain on the lateral movements

It clicks?!

 

[Mkgain1]

Yessir not a painful click but I can certainly feel it lol its pretty loud too

 

[YouBet33]

No Beuno, my shoulders both clicked without pain, could possibly be a labrum tear

 

[B5150]

Everyone who's trained seriously before has had shoulder issues to some degree, recently I started having a shoulder issue I've never had before where its like a deep pressure in my shoulder joint (painful as well) but only while doing lateral raises. Anyone else ever have this? Any idea on how to ease the pain so I can train or at least alternative exercises to hit the mid delt that may not cause the pain?

Take a couple to several weeks off. Injuries require healing. Let it heal.

Had an issue where I was laying on my left arm/side spooning with the wife in bed. I forced my arm out from under my body weight and heard and felt the POP! It bothered me from that moment on. Every work out thereafter was painful. Even indirect work. I certainly injured it.

Had a period of time where other priorities in my life took precedence and my gym time was shut down to none for 6 weeks or more.

I'm back in the gym again and I happen to notice that to my surprise and pleasure the pain and click no longer exist.

Save yourself the time of reading the over elaborate post you'll get from guys who know better and the money from supplements or worse, MRI's, and rest and heal. TIFWIW!

 

[cheeky1]

If both shoulders are providing the same symptomology and level of pain then you are likely performing an exercise incorrectly &/or overexerting them in equal fashion. This may be gym, work, sport, anything - and could well be that the motion causing the issue isn't noticeable until you get to the gym & load up laterally. Have a think about it...

Very difficult to pinpoint with shoulders unless performing a physical check. Get checked for alignment & take note of any pressure on your neck when pressing overhead as this can transfer down to the shoulders.
The lateral raise is a problem exercise for sufferers of Bursitis - inflammation of the bursa (fluid sacs) that enable smooth function of the Supraspinatus. This will quickly turn into constant pain if it's the case - and it's a b*tch to sleep on. Highly unusual to have it in both shoulders at the same time though.

I would find a competent physio or osteopath & get checked for upper body alignment. They will assess you for function & flexibility & see where in the range of motility the pain occurs, giving a better indicator of wherein the problem lies.

 

[cheeky1]

I know this is the most realistic thing to do but the last thing I wanted to hear since shoulders have been my weak spot so I'm really trying to make them grow for the 2016 season.. Gah oh well, longevity is more important

Yep, me too. I found suspension cables & kettlebells to be of great value in strengthening so I had greater stability when going back to weights.

Dodgy shoulders suck big time. Making some adjustments to training once the issue is identified (or resolved) is a wise idea to prevent reocurrence.
I have a shortened collar bone on one side & if i'm not careful it tries to float free & I have to massage it back into place. I've found that deep bb incline & flat bench is problematic due to my (now) unevenness, but slow & steady incline db flyes have tightened up the supporting muscles through upper pec. Working more upper back has strengthened under my shoulder blades, providing more stability.

 

[kjetil1234]

Dude are YOU going to define what's normal or am I? Why waste my time? If you want help just answer the questions
I need the degrees of internal and external rotations. Degrees.

 

[Mkgain1]

Dude are YOU going to define what's normal or am I? Why waste my time? If you want help just answer the questions
I need the degrees of internal and external rotations. Degrees.

I don't have the dial to give precise degrees but internal rotation with arm at 90 degrees, right arm can go right about 4 inches, left arm closer to 3 inches before discomfort sets in.

External rotation with hands clasped behind my back I can go about 5 inches. But single arm with the arm bent behind my back, right arms moves about 2 1/2 inches, left arm is the same

 

[kjetil1234]

Approx degrees according to this diagram. External rotation is easily measured - usually I find people with 90° of external rotation in the most trouble, in comparison with those who lack external rotation.

Arms should be able to lift approx 4" off the back (this is internal rotation) - from your description, I take this as OK.

 

[Mkgain1]

View attachment 126223

Approx degrees according to this diagram. External rotation is easily measured - usually I find people with 90° of external rotation in the most trouble, in comparison with those who lack external rotation.

Arms should be able to lift approx 4" off the back (this is internal rotation) - from your description, I take this as OK.

Judging from that diagram I'd say external is between 32-35 degrees until it gets fairly uncomfortable almost painful

 

[YouBet33]

It's it in the front or back of your shoulder

 

[Mkgain1]

It's it in the front or back of your shoulder

If you're referencing the uncomfortableness/pain its dead center like right under the middle head

 

[YouBet33]

Interesting, well with my labrum tears I could usually pinpoint where the pain is (front/back)

 

[Mkgain1]

That's why I'm a bit lost here I've dealt with my fair share of shoulder issues over the years but not like this, and none of my gym buddies either. Even now sitting here just from testing the external rotation over 20min ago, right under the middle head is like a soreness in the joint..starting to feel like an anomaly

 

[YouBet33]

Might need to get a shot in the joint, I've had that before

 

[kjetil1234]

Release supraspinatus, train teres minor and infraspinatus.
If that doesn't help (remember that cuff training is highly specific and easily done wrong), this is more or less a scapular stability issue.

 

[Mkgain1]

Release supraspinatus, train teres minor and infraspinatus.
If that doesn't help (remember that cuff training is highly specific and easily done wrong), this is more or less a scapular stability issue.

I'll research exercises for that and I agree with a stability issue because dumbell lateral raises hurt very bad, but if I do lateral raises on a machine there's no pain

 

[kjetil1234]

I'll research exercises for that and I agree with a stability issue because dumbell lateral raises hurt very bad, but if I do lateral raises on a machine there's no pain

Could be an issue with the deltoid is not firing properly. Hard to say without seeing you in person, but I'd start with this if I were you. Make sure you're not shrugging when doing lateral raises, and don't abduct past 90°

 

[Mkgain1]

I make sure to keep traps out of the movement and focus strictly on the mid delt.. Something you think I chiropractor could diagnos/correct?

 

[kjetil1234]

Doubt it.

Don't keep it out, it should just hold the scapula stable. However some people shrug the scap instead of stabilizing it, and then the trap becomes the primary mover, right. You want to hold the scap in a mild upward rotation by the mid trap and serratus anterior, then make middle deltoid do the work by itself. Hope this makes sense.

 

[cheeky1]

^^ lower weight, focus on holding form & keeping scapula stable, as kjetil suggests^^
See what results that brings. Try it standing & get someone to check your scaps to see if one or both is winging out, that will generally indicate a weakness & give you a target area to strengthen. For me, my R shoulder drops causing R scapula to wing, courtesy of a previously broken clavicle. I have to be very mindful of securing my stabilisers when this happens, as it puts pressure on my neck. PIA!

Very difficult to release those aforementioned muscles yourself, particularly if you don't know where to look. Ask around, see if someone knows a good local football or baseball physio, remedial masseuse or even conditioning trainer. There are plenty of muppets out there (here in Oz anyway), I understand kjetil's reticence in that respect.

 

[Mkgain1]

Yeah that all makes sense guys thanks for the insight i appreciate it.. oddly enough lighter weight actually hurts more than heavier!?! I'm just letting them rest the next week or two then I'm gonna have this guy take a look at me and check my scaps.. Hopefully get this all to subside I'm trying to grow some nasty delts this off season..

 

[NattyForLife]

For the love of someone....google the Obrien test and perform it! Let me know results! Also google empty can test & full can test and perform it! Let me know results!

 

[Whacked]

In.....

 

[Epolis13]

OP, I'd go see a doc or a PT or something.

 

[lamarclark09]

Yes, after training I feel shoulder pain sometimes, then I do some exercises which are helpful for my shoulder, neck release, and chest expansion. Then I feel better.