Ar1macare Pro Ruined?!

Metalingus

Metalingus

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What in the world is this new formula and why have they moved to it?

Dosages reduced, proven ingredients swapped for *insert pixie dust here* extracts.

Very disappointing.
 
Metalingus

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Pretty sure he knows the labels since he formulated them.
Excellent. I've got the right persons ear then. I'm sure he can tell me why I'm completely wrong and the new version is superior...
 
NoAddedHmones

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View attachment 179252
View attachment 179254

Compare the two. The new formula is garbage in comparison. Less comprehensive, dosages reduced, less proven ingredients.
If anything ingredients were replaced with more researched ingredients. The OG was to heavy on prolactin inhibitors, which effected libido in some people.

Luteolin/DHAA is a great combo for estrogen control - doubled the dose of DHAA in the new version. Both ingredients promote healthy lipids and improve metabolic function - unlike arimistane...

Lowered NAC to an effective amount for liver protection whilst limiting its anti-hormetic effects. Removed arimistane and red yeast cause of compliance.

Aged garlic is an outstanding ingredient for wide ranging health benefits on cycle - studied exponentially higher than any other ingredient in the profile.

Added picroliv and a solid dose high silymarin extract which improves liver/kidney protection vs the OG formula.

So again, how is it pixie dusted?
 
ValiantThor08

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Is arimistane a banned substance? And if it is not, is any threat from the FDA really valid?
 
NoAddedHmones

NoAddedHmones

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Is arimistane a banned substance? And if it is not, is any threat from the FDA really valid?
Compliance with rules and regulations is essential for selling through many retailers and longevity of the products themselves. I don’t know the answer to your question.
 
ValiantThor08

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Compliance with rules and regulations is essential for selling through many retailers and longevity of the products themselves. I don’t know the answer to your question.
So it is a grey area, and a potential risk to a company.
 
Jiigzz

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Is arimistane a banned substance? And if it is not, is any threat from the FDA really valid?
The FDA has the power to shut down supplement companies, so yes, their threats are very valid whether always lawful or not in how they do things.
 

shockrock3

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The FDA has the power to shut down supplement companies, so yes, their threats are very valid.
Threats are not, they have been threatening people for almost 3-4 yrs. on DMHA, haven't done a thing...still being produced along with Noopept, etc. in mass quantities for years.
Not here to argue other than FDA "threats" are taken with a grain of salt...and most aren't listening to them.
 
ValiantThor08

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The FDA has the power to shut down supplement companies, so yes, their threats are very valid whether always lawful or not in how they do things.
Isn't that a little tyrannical if certain substances are not banned. Seems over reaching and ridiculous.
 
Jiigzz

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Threats are not, they have been threatening people for almost 3-4 yrs. on DMHA, haven't done a thing...still being produced along with Noopept, etc. in mass quantities for years.
Not here to argue other than FDA "threats" are taken with a grain of salt...and most aren't listening to them.
Cases take time to build man. That doesn't mean they arent working towards anything or that their threats are not to be taken seriously.

Look a what happens when the FDA has a hard-on for you: think USPlabs, Primordial Performance, Hi Tech pharmaceuticals etc. I'm sure USPlabsrep can confirm the FDA scrutinises their every move now.

This is one reason why new stimulants are always appearing - i believe in the US the FDA has to prove an ingredient is unlawful before they can pursue legal action. Other countries (like NZ) we have to prove the ingredient is legal before we can sell it.

Last year MA labs was issued a warning letter for its Vicaine supplement and they disco'd it almost immediately.

When you know an ingredient is borderline or unlawful, it often isn't worth the fight - especially if you're a small company which doesn't have much financial resources.
 
Jiigzz

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muscleupcrohn

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Plus having even arguably non-compliant ingredients could hurt your chances at being sold in/by some of the larger stores/sites.
 
Jiigzz

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So according to the article because of how they labeled the product, they were attacked.
Essentially. But so Bruce Kneller makes it seem that Arimistane is unlawful by virtue of its MOA. That's kinda the problem with legislation is that it takes fighting in courts to set precedents as to what it actually means. The DSHEA is no exception this as it seems intentionally broad and open to interpretation.
 
Old Witch

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I was unaware that red yeast rice extract was a non compliant ingredient. Anybody know why that is?
 

Anabaholic

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I was unaware that red yeast rice extract was a non compliant ingredient. Anybody know why that is?
Oh that story is golden. So red yeast rice naturally contains some compound (I forget exactly what it is) that's very similar to a prescription drug used to lower cholesterol. The FDA uses that to go after any company they want because they can say their red yeast rice is adultered with that drug and therefore not a supplement, which is why most red yeast rice now is standardized to contain minimal or no amount of the effective compound. So they more or less force you to produce an ineffective product or face court fees they know you'll never afford.
 
ValiantThor08

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Oh that story is golden. So red yeast rice naturally contains some compound (I forget exactly what it is) that's very similar to a prescription drug used to lower cholesterol. The FDA uses that to go after any company they want because they can say their red yeast rice is adultered with that drug and therefore not a supplement, which is why most red yeast rice now is standardized to contain minimal or no amount of the effective compound. So they more or less force you to produce an ineffective product or face court fees they know you'll never afford.
Ridiculous
 
Rostam

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Pretty sure he knows the labels since he formulated them.
So maybe he can explain why they included two pine bark extracts for a total of 300mg and in addition to 600mg of grape seed extract (which is also a source of proanthoyacidines). This gives us around above 800mg of proanthoyacidines. I’ve never seen such high dose of it in any other product. The standard suggested dose for grape/pine bark extract is around 200-300mg per day.
 
NoAddedHmones

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So maybe he can explain why they included two pine bark extracts for a total of 300mg and in addition to 600mg of grape seed extract (which is also a source of proanthoyacidines). This gives us around above 800mg of proanthoyacidines. I’ve never seen such high dose of it in any other product. The standard suggested dose for grape/pine bark extract is around 200-300mg per day.
Because one is extracted for a very high percentage DHAA and the other is extracted as said on the label.

Pine bark and grape seed are extracted for different actives.
 
NoAddedHmones

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would you mind telling us which actives? both are listed as extract standardized for 95% proanthocyanidins.
Pine bark contains proanthocyanidins with molecular weight generally less than 1100, while grape seed has larger proanthocyanidins ranging from around 1200 to 5000ish Molecular weight.

Using both covers the full spectrum, each offering benefits for cardiovascular function, antioxidant, anti-inflammatory and neuroprotective properties.
 
Metalingus

Metalingus

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What pixie dust extracts?
Apologies for my post before, labelling the some of the ingredients changes as "pixie dust" was ignorant of me. Must have been having a bad day...

Could you please tell me, in comparison to the old formula, how effectively the new formula keeps prolactin in check? Starting an SD cycle in about 10 days and want to make sure I'm covering all the bases.

Cheers.
 
stopstalking

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Apologies for my post before, labelling the some of the ingredients changes as "pixie dust" was ignorant of me. Must have been having a bad day...

Could you please tell me, in comparison to the old formula, how effectively the new formula keeps prolactin in check? Starting an SD cycle in about 10 days and want to make sure I'm covering all the bases.

Cheers.
I can speak for how it works for prolactin but I usually run inhibit-p along side of my cycles .
 
The Express 42

The Express 42

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Just pick up some SNS Inhibit P to keep prolactin in check. Always works for me. Sometimes I get some mild headaches from it the first couple days but my body adjusts
 

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