AI / Gyno Pros

[kingls1]

This here is a question for all you AI/Gyno masters that have it down packed.

If one is running 500mg/test & 500mg deca weekly and has sore/sensitive nipples and very small lump under nips. Whats the best next course of action?

I understand and am well aware tamoxifen is fighting gyno and that arimidex/aromasin lowers estrogen..

So is it best to take the Nolva until nip issues go away and then run the AI as need to keep estrogen in check? Or is there a better alternative.

 

[SSJ4GOD]

Ralox is best for gyno

 

[Sparta12]

Ralox and exemestane kill gyno for me. I have had it for ages and it got real bad, done this a few times and really clears it up, but I always seem to lapse and get fat or let estrogen take over at it builds again... trying to be better. The only way to truly be rid of it will be surgery.

60mg for 10 days then 30mg
Exemestane 25mg once every 2 weeks or if I feel estrogen is creeping up.

Just need to be careful with sore joints

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

Good topic. Wouldn't this be assuming his estradiol was out of whack?

OP, have you gotten bloodwork even mid cycle while the nip lump has appeared?

You mentioned deca (19-nor) so make sure it's not prolactin driven - meaning you need cabergoline to inhibit P not just ralox, tamox, exemestane to crush E...

 

[kingls1]

Ralox and exemestane kill gyno for me. I have had it for ages and it got real bad, done this a few times and really clears it up, but I always seem to lapse and get fat or let estrogen take over at it builds again... trying to be better. The only way to truly be rid of it will be surgery.

60mg for 10 days then 30mg
Exemestane 25mg once every 2 weeks or if I feel estrogen is creeping up.

Just need to be careful with sore joints

The thought of surgery sucks. I dont THINK , keyword think, mine is that bad as of yet. What are you thoughts on Nolva for clearing up gyno? I am asking only because I do not have Ralox on hand right now (but do have Nolva, exemestane & bromo). Ralox i would not have on hand for a good two weeks or so. I felt it (the gyno) coming on a while ago (probably about 2-3 weeks ago) but I neglected it. My estrogen is in check now though, however thats after the fact.

 

[kingls1]

Good topic. Wouldn't this be assuming his estradiol was out of whack?

OP, have you gotten bloodwork even mid cycle while the nip lump has appeared?

You mentioned deca (19-nor) so make sure it's not prolactin driven - meaning you need cabergoline to inhibit P not just ralox, tamox, exemestane to crush E...

Correct at one point my E2 was for surely out of wack. I felt like absolute dog ****. However aromasin for two weeks at 12.5mg per week got me back in check, along with lowering my test dose (but that was atleast 2-3 weeks ago). I've been fine, or atleast felt fine E2 wise since then. Also if im not mistaken that was around the time my nips started feeling funny but as stated i neglected/overlooked it (like an idiot). As also stated though I dont THINK its super bad, but its slightly there. I just got bloods done yesterday.

 

[mTOR25]

This here is a question for all you AI/Gyno masters that have it down packed.

If one is running 500mg/test & 500mg deca weekly and has sore/sensitive nipples and very small lump under nips. Whats the best next course of action?

I understand and am well aware tamoxifen is fighting gyno and that arimidex/aromasin lowers estrogen..

So is it best to take the Nolva until nip issues go away and then run the AI ? Or is there a better alternative.

Minimum action is a strong SERM best option is Raloxifene.

If you want to really max out the pharmacological intervention if it's really bothering you then look into these treatments that all have strong literature support!

Raloxifene, Letrozole, and DHT transdermal local applied!

Those three all have promising results in many studies. The DHT was very interesting because out of 17 TRT induced gyno cases they had a impressive reversal in several of the men who continued to take TRT!

If I had a serious concern for gyno that had developed then before surgery I would try a maximum intervention of Raloxifene, letrozole, and DHT transdermal. I would drop my cruise doses of testosterone very low and replace with much higher doses of masteron?

You would probably have some nasty low E2 sides sure but from the experiences of people with gyno surgery I'd rather try the pharmacological route first even if the sides are horrible?

 

[kingls1]

Minimum action is a strong SERM best option is Raloxifene.

If you want to really max out the pharmacological intervention if it's really bothering you then look into these treatments that all have strong literature support!

Raloxifene, Letrozole, and DHT transdermal local applied!

Those three all have promising results in many studies. The DHT was very interesting because out of 17 TRT induced gyno cases they had a impressive reversal in several of the men who continued to take TRT!

If I had a serious concern for gyno that had developed then before surgery I would try a maximum intervention of Raloxifene, letrozole, and DHT transdermal. I would drop my cruise doses of testosterone very low and replace with much higher doses of masteron?

You would probably have some nasty low E2 sides sure but from the experiences of people with gyno surgery I'd rather try the pharmacological route first even if the sides are horrible?

Ive got about 1-2 wk ETA on Ralox

I heard Letro is extremely harsh ? - and yeah, I mean if itll fix my issue then haha **** it id deal with the shitty E2 sides

 

[mTOR25]

The thought of surgery sucks. I dont THINK , keyword think, mine is that bad of of yet. What are you thoughts on Nolva for clearing up gyno? I am asking only because I do not have Ralox on hand right now (but do have Nolva, exemestane & bromo). Ralox i would not have on hand for a good two weeks or so. I felt it (the gyno) coming on a while ago (probably about 2-3 weeks ago) but I neglected it. My estrogen is in check now though, however thats after the fact.

Start the Nolvadex immediately until you get the Raloxifene. I would also stop the deca personally and never risk it again except in maybe 200mg doses in cycles with dry compounds if you use it at all!

I personally am sticking to low dose test, mast, eq, primo, dhb and anavar, winstrol, tbol permutations in all my cycles BUT I might use shorter cycles of NPP maybe for the later half of my cycles to help with dry joints?

This is me personally I'm not saying you should do this but I was driven to this point out of fear of gyno lol. I really don't want a surgery?

Oh I also haven't ruled out shorter term use of other compounds even some

I spoke to my meat head friend about Ralox he said itll take him a week or two to get it. He has very good legit PS.

I heard Letro is extremely harsh ? - and yeah, I mean if itll fix my issue then haha **** it id deal with the shitty E2 sides

I would start with nolva today and then switching to ralox once you receive it. I'd try that first but continued use of 500mg test and 500mg deca might be a dumb mistake if gyno is developing?

I personally don't use much deca anymore or tren and I keep my cycles dry as bones these days out of a healthy fear of gyno lol.

 

[kingls1]

Prolactin gyno = caber, prami or dox

Estrogen gyno = nolva or ralox

Lowering E2 = arimidex/aromasin

Where does bromocriptine fit into this ? Im under the impression it will reduce prolactin levels - however is it not one of the bests or usual go toos for prolactin ?

 

[SSJ4GOD]

This is what I’m doing for gyno…
Ralox: 100mg a day for two weeks and then 50mgs a day until gone.
SNS Inhibit P- 2 caps a day for prolactin
Transdermal Epiandro on the chest
Arimahex (6-oxo) but any ai will do.
I apply the transdermals at night and also apply a skin tightening lotion (I’m using the BPI one) to the chest in the morning

 

[SSJ4GOD]

MA research (board sponser here) has great Ralox and @Smont has a discount code. I get orders in a few days. But regardless I would start nolva now until you get ralox but o believe there is a good high dose nolva protocol now for gyno

 

[kingls1]

MA research (board sponser here) has great Ralox and @Smont has a discount code. I get orders in a few days. But regardless I would start nolva now until you get ralox but o believe there is a good high dose nolva protocol now for gyno

Never used any AAS, Peptide or Research Chem that comes in a 'liquid dropper' form. Lol, this might be a dumb question but how the **** do you use it

 

[SSJ4GOD]

Never used any 'liquid dropper' type chemicals. Lol, this might be a dumb question but how the **** do you use it

Instead of 1 pill being whatever mg, it’s measured per ml. Their Ralox is 50mgs/ml so you just do two full droppers a day for 100mgs and then 1 full dropper a day to continue out the 50mg. It’s in like an alcohol suspension so you can put it in your mouth and drink something or squirt it in your drink. It’s pretty easy and for other things you have more control over dosages which is nice

 

[SSJ4GOD]

If you get two bottles of ralox, you basically have 90 days worth of gyno protocol (which should be plenty) and it doesn’t require any special measurement since with the protocol, the dose and the dropper size are the same

 

[Smont]

If you get two bottles of ralox, you basically have 90 days worth of gyno protocol (which should be plenty) and it doesn’t require any special measurement since with the protocol, the dose and the dropper size are the same

I don't like the droppers so I usually go to Wal-Mart or CVS and get a 1ml oral syringe. I actually think Mike is going to switch away from the dropper to a oral syringe because it's more accurate. As far as gyno protocol goes, seems like everyone has there own methods but the last time I used it was my most successful one, 100mg for 2 weeks and 50mg for 4 weeks and I haven't seen any signs sense. To be fair tho, it always comes back eventually

 

[kingls1]

I don't like the droppers so I usually go to Wal-Mart or CVS and get a 1ml oral syringe. I actually think Mike is going to switch away from the dropper to a oral syringe because it's more accurate. As far as gyno protocol goes, seems like everyone has there own methods but the last time I used it was my most successful one, 100mg for 2 weeks and 50mg for 4 weeks and I haven't seen any signs sense. To be fair tho, it always comes back eventually

What was your gyno protocol with ? Ralox ? Nolva ?

 

[Jeremyk1]

What was your gyno protocol with ? Ralox ? Nolva ?

Everyone says raloxifene is better for gyno, but it didn’t seem to touch mine. Tamoxifen knocked it out for me, so you may do well with what you have. If you get MA stuff, the bottles have droppers attached to the lid with measure markers on it. Super easy. Sometimes the markings fade though. You can get oral syringes right from the site though, to make it easy.

I had a lump under one nipple, blew through two bottles of raloxifene and didn’t see any difference. Switched to tamoxifen and in like two weeks it wasn’t noticeable anymore. I love MA stuff, but the raloxifene just didn’t seem to do it for me.

 

[Smont]

Everyone says raloxifene is better for gyno, but it didn’t seem to touch mine. Tamoxifen knocked it out for me, so you may do well with what you have. If you get MA stuff, the bottles have droppers attached to the lid with measure markers on it. Super easy. Sometimes the markings fade though. You can get oral syringes right from the site though, to make it easy.

I had a lump under one nipple, blew through two bottles of raloxifene and didn’t see any difference. Switched to tamoxifen and in like two weeks it wasn’t noticeable anymore. I love MA stuff, but the raloxifene just didn’t seem to do it for me.

Use the oral syringe, it's more accurate then the dropper

 

[Mikereyn513]

Use the oral syringe, it's more accurate then the dropper

On my last purchase mike sent me an oral syringe for free, either way I only think he charges 1$ so just a grab a few

 

[Smont]

On my last purchase mike sent me an oral syringe for free, either way I only think he charges 1$ so just a grab a few

I think he's going to start including one with every order, and if you ask the pharmacy counter for 1 I think they have to give you one for free. I have had them give me funny looks before when I ask for one, not sure why but it made me a little uncomfortable lol

 

[Smont]

What was your gyno protocol with ? Ralox ? Nolva ?

I used 12.5 exemestane for a couple days to make sure estrogen was on the lower side and added 100mg raloxifene for 2 weeks with exem at 12.5 still.

Then raloxifene at 50mg for a month with the exem every other day.

This seemed to be the most successful run I had with it. Visibly my gyno is non existent for the past 6 months or so, haven't had itchy nips or swelling at all.

But, I have to assume it will come back at some point.

 

[mTOR25]

Everyone says raloxifene is better for gyno, but it didn’t seem to touch mine. Tamoxifen knocked it out for me, so you may do well with what you have. If you get MA stuff, the bottles have droppers attached to the lid with measure markers on it. Super easy. Sometimes the markings fade though. You can get oral syringes right from the site though, to make it easy.

I had a lump under one nipple, blew through two bottles of raloxifene and didn’t see any difference. Switched to tamoxifen and in like two weeks it wasn’t noticeable anymore. I love MA stuff, but the raloxifene just didn’t seem to do it for me.

Everyone reacts different to some protocols then others! I have heard that same remark about Tamoxifen not working so it depends alot on the person as with all drugs!

That said the literature is on Raloxifenes side obviously but Tamoxifen has had nearly as good results. Problem is the sides are usually greater from Tamoxifen but then again I'm sure many a person would disagree individually!

 

[mTOR25]

I used 12.5 exemestane for a couple days to make sure estrogen was on the lower side and added 100mg raloxifene for 2 weeks with exem at 12.5 still.

Then raloxifene at 50mg for a month with the exem every other day.

This seemed to be the most successful run I had with it. Visibly my gyno is non existent for the past 6 months or so, haven't had itchy nips or swelling at all.

But, I have to assume it will come back at some point.

I'm going to try DHT transdermal I am creating on a friend's pretty severe case of gyno. He had a bad reaction to tren but kept using it anyways for months despite the gyno getting worse and worse? He was on P5P and Aromasin but obviously that wasn't cutting it for him!

I plan on treating him with 50mg Raloxifene, 2.5mg Letrozole, 400mg P5P, and 1g of 10%DHT transdermal twice a day! The letrozole will be titrated down over the first few weeks and then kept at 0.5mg ED? He will run this while on 50mg of Testosterone and 300mg Drostanolone! Do you think Aromasin would be a better choice? I am choosing letrozole only because of the medical literature?

Obviously his e2 is going to be completely smoked and he understands this but I only recently started researching gyno treatments so I figure I should ask you what you think about this protocol? It seems reasonable to me and I am hoping it will be enough to reverse some of the size of the glands enough for him to avoid surgery?

He was planning on the surgery but I showed him people's logs and he really had no idea how much of a procedure it is and recovery time! The reason he kept using the tren was because he thought it was just two small cuts and remove all gland tissue and a few days your gtg lol! He really regrets his decision obviously

 

[Smont]

I'm going to try DHT transdermal I am creating on a friend's pretty severe case of gyno. He had a bad reaction to tren but kept using it anyways for months despite the gyno getting worse and worse? He was on P5P and Aromasin but obviously that wasn't cutting it for him!

I plan on treating him with 50mg Raloxifene, 2.5mg Letrozole, 400mg P5P, and 1g of 10%DHT transdermal twice a day! The letrozole will be titrated down over the first few weeks and then kept at 0.5mg ED? He will run this while on 50mg of Testosterone and 300mg Drostanolone! Do you think Aromasin would be a better choice? I am choosing letrozole only because of the medical literature?

Obviously his e2 is going to be completely smoked and he understands this but I only recently started researching gyno treatments so I figure I should ask you what you think about this protocol? It seems reasonable to me and I am hoping it will be enough to reverse some of the size of the glands enough for him to avoid surgery?

He was planning on the surgery but I showed him people's logs and he really had no idea how much of a procedure it is and recovery time! The reason he kept using the tren was because he thought it was just two small cuts and remove all gland tissue and a few days your gtg lol! He really regrets his decision obviously

It's tough to say on doses, letro will probably crash estrogen into the dirt. You won't feel good but that's probably the best environment to reverse gyno. Trasdermal dht seems to be great at gyno reversal from what I've heard but I have no personal experience with it. I've never came across raws foe straight dht

 

[mTOR25]

It's tough to say on doses, letro will probably crash estrogen into the dirt. You won't feel good but that's probably the best environment to reverse gyno. Trasdermal dht seems to be great at gyno reversal from what I've heard but I have no personal experience with it. I've never came across raws foe straight dht

I had to use one of the less reputable raw sources unfortunately but they had it called Stanolone for pretty damn cheap actually. It's a Chinese source that's very popular and purple lol but I've seen a few questionable reports on a few items but I feel like stanolone isn't something that would be an issue? From what I've read it's there primo raws that have been questioned?

 

[Smont]

I had to use one of the less reputable raw sources unfortunately but they had it called Stanolone for pretty damn cheap actually. It's a Chinese source that's very popular and purple lol but I've seen a few questionable reports on a few items but I feel like stanolone isn't something that would be an issue? From what I've read it's there primo raws that have been questioned?

I've heard mixed reviews about them. They use to be good but it seems like they went down hill over the years. Which blows my mind, in that industry, the better your product the more reputable you become, the more reputable you are the more ppl find you and the more money you make.

As soon as you start putting out bunk **** your sales go downhill until you go out of business or change your name and start over

 

[Smont]

In today's hi tek internet world, as soon as you screw someone over the whole world knows about it

 

[mTOR25]

I've heard mixed reviews about them. They use to be good but it seems like they went down hill over the years. Which blows my mind, in that industry, the better your product the more reputable you become, the more reputable you are the more ppl find you and the more money you make.

As soon as you start putting out bunk **** your sales go downhill until you go out of business or change your name and start over

Ya I use other sources because of the issues some people have had with the products? From what I understand it was primo and var that were completely bunk? Oh and arimidex and dhb as well had issues when tested on jano I guess but there were real batches too? It's hard to trust reviews one way or the other to be honest but there are a few domestic good ones that are highly trusted!

 

[kingls1]

Wanted to follow up on this ;;;

If the cycle was, Test & Deca / with an Adrol kick start ; is ralox the best ? Hearing Letro might be better if the gyno is a result of progesterone

 

[Renew1]

Wanted to follow up on this ;;;

If the cycle was, Test & Deca / with an Adrol kick start ; is ralox the best ? Hearing Letro might be better if the gyno is a result of progesterone

You may already know this, but that's a Rough cycle for someone with preexisting gyno.

 

[kingls1]

You may already know this, but that's a Rough cycle for someone with preexisting gyno.

Gyno was not preexisting, if im understanding what i think youre saying correctly.

Happened while on cycle. Didnt need an AI at first, it creeped up. Took Ai, symptoms went down. Stopped taking it, and then BoomM. Honestly, I think the Adrol fucked me hard. Everything was low dosed except the Adrol I hit that hard. Have also previously cycled everything independent prior with no gyno issues whatsoever.

 

[Renew1]

Gyno was not preexisting, if im understanding what i think youre saying correctly.

Happened while on cycle. Didnt need an AI at first, it creeped up. Took Ai, symptoms went down. Stopped taking it, and then BoomM. Honestly, I think the Adrol fucked me hard. Everything was low dosed except the Adrol I hit that hard. Have also previously cycled everything independent prior with no gyno issues whatsoever.

Ahhh.... I see. I thought you had it prior.

Hopefully you know this now ...
If gyno starts on a cycle .... If you decide to continue the cycle.... You REALLY have to stay on top of it (ahead of it). Because in reality, you are already behind, and still supplying more fuel for it.

 

[kingls1]

Ahhh.... I see. I thought you had it prior.

Hopefully you know this now ...
If gyno starts on a cycle .... If you decide to continue the cycle.... You REALLY have to stay on top of it (ahead of it). Because in reality, you are already behind, and still supplying more fuel for it.

Yezzirrrr.. I fucked up.. It wasnt bad , very very minor.. And then one day that **** literally hit me .. hard ..

 

[kingls1]

This may be a dumb question - however I am curious ...

Instead of using an AI to keep estrogen in check, why don't people just use a SERM to block the receptors in the breast tissue during cycle in the first place ? I would assume, there are a multitude of reasons, however I am curious as to why its not done.

 

[Renew1]

This may be a dumb question - however I am curious ...

Instead of using an AI to keep estrogen in check, why don't people just use a SERM to block the receptors in the breast tissue during cycle in the first place ? I would assume, there are a multitude of reasons, however I am curious as to why its not done.

A Big reason is because gyno is only one issue with high Estrogen.

SERMs don't lower Estrogen, so any other side effects from high Estrogen are still in play

 

[Jeremyk1]

This may be a dumb question - however I am curious ...

Instead of using an AI to keep estrogen in check, why don't people just use a SERM to block the receptors in the breast tissue during cycle in the first place ? I would assume, there are a multitude of reasons, however I am curious as to why its not done.

I think some people do. My first thought for why you don’t see it more is that SERMs can lower IGF1. Not sure. I always have tamoxifen on hand when I run cycles.

 

[Stacks1]

I'm going to try DHT transdermal I am creating on a friend's pretty severe case of gyno. He had a bad reaction to tren but kept using it anyways for months despite the gyno getting worse and worse? He was on P5P and Aromasin but obviously that wasn't cutting it for him!

I plan on treating him with 50mg Raloxifene, 2.5mg Letrozole, 400mg P5P, and 1g of 10%DHT transdermal twice a day! The letrozole will be titrated down over the first few weeks and then kept at 0.5mg ED? He will run this while on 50mg of Testosterone and 300mg Drostanolone! Do you think Aromasin would be a better choice? I am choosing letrozole only because of the medical literature?

Obviously his e2 is going to be completely smoked and he understands this but I only recently started researching gyno treatments so I figure I should ask you what you think about this protocol? It seems reasonable to me and I am hoping it will be enough to reverse some of the size of the glands enough for him to avoid surgery?

He was planning on the surgery but I showed him people's logs and he really had no idea how much of a procedure it is and recovery time! The reason he kept using the tren was because he thought it was just two small cuts and remove all gland tissue and a few days your gtg lol! He really regrets his decision obviously

2.5mg letro ED?? Interested to know how this goes but I've ran letro at 1mg ED and after only a few days I felt like death. I can't even wrap my head around 2.5mgs ED but I've seen people do it before.