UFC 105 Lesner vs. Carwin

Mulletsoldier said:
The reverse is true, as well: Carwin can KO any HW, and his 3XL gloves are no Louis Vitton purses themselves. Despite the fact both Lesnar and Carwin's footwork is messy, I like Carwin just "that" much more on the feet; however, that may not be enough to counter Lesnar's technical wrestling advantage.
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carwin wears bigger gloves then lesnar
 
Swaggerstick said:
In my opinion Brock Lesnar is no more than a stunt by Dana to help with publicity for what will ultimatly become the new super-heavy weight division. With men like Marcus Jones coming in to solidify the divison. Brock has the name recognition so in turn bringing a bit of a spotlight to the heavy weights. And underscoring the need for a new weight class. Case in point Brock and everyone else he has fought. he cuts to make 265 LBS. night of the fight he is 275-280LBS. Outweighing by a good 70-80LBS Frank, anmost 100LBS Randy. A man like Marcus Jones Walks around at 270-280 and he knows how to finish. If one looks at TUF most of the men on it fit into a super-heavy weight class. Just a thought
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Umm u might want to change those numbers unless Frank moved down to LHW and Randy moved down to MW :think:
 
Mir fights at about 250. Also, to be Marcus Jones anywhere near Brock in and of itself is a joke.
 
Swaggerstick said:
In my opinion Brock Lesnar is no more than a stunt by Dana to help with publicity for what will ultimatly become the new super-heavy weight division. With men like Marcus Jones coming in to solidify the divison. Brock has the name recognition so in turn bringing a bit of a spotlight to the heavy weights. And underscoring the need for a new weight class. Case in point Brock and everyone else he has fought. he cuts to make 265 LBS. night of the fight he is 275-280LBS. Outweighing by a good 70-80LBS Frank, anmost 100LBS Randy. A man like Marcus Jones Walks around at 270-280 and he knows how to finish. If one looks at TUF most of the men on it fit into a super-heavy weight class. Just a thought
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A super HW division is unlikely, as Brock, Carwin and the like are exceptions, and not the norm.
 
VolcomX311 said:
A two man division is a win-win. You're either the champ or the number one contender.... all the time.


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They fought in 105. They fought in 109. They even fought in 114. But now you get to see Carwin/Lesnar fight AGAIN. UFC 120 Carwin/Lesnar 4!
 
:saw:Both Randy and Frank whent up in weight for there fights with Brock, specifically Frank who Joe Rogan commented on how the extra weight slowed him down. As for Marcus Jones after the show(TUF) is done you will probable have to re-evaluate what you may think of him. He is a friggen stud. He doesnt hurt people by falling on them like Brock,he knocks them out,something Brock cant seem to do. And his ground game has gotten nasty sine the taping of the show.

Gracie Barra in the House.



Just one Knuckleheads opinion
 
Swaggerstick said:
:saw:Both Randy and Frank whent up in weight for there fights with Brock, specifically Frank who Joe Rogan commented on how the extra weight slowed him down. As for Marcus Jones after the show(TUF) is done you will probable have to re-evaluate what you may think of him. He is a friggen stud. He doesnt hurt people by falling on them like Brock,he knocks them out,something Brock cant seem to do. And his ground game has gotten nasty sine the taping of the show.

Gracie Barra in the House.



Just one Knuckleheads opinion
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I don't doubt that he's a genetic freak, but there is a huge difference between being a great fighter and a great athlete. Kevin Randleman for example...
 
Quite true,quite true.....I think by the end of the show we will all know for sure.

My weigh in numbers may be off but not by much


If Carwin doesnt let Brock lay on him for the whole fight (like Heath Herring)he has a real good chase of winning
 
Swaggerstick said:
Quite true,quite true.....I think by the end of the show we will all know for sure.

My weigh in numbers may be off but not by much


If Carwin doesnt let Brock lay on him for the whole fight (like Heath Herring)he has a real good chase of winning
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Outside of Nelson, very few of these guys have the potential to be elite fighters (Schoonover might get there, but it will be a lower class)

Heath has horrible TD defense and Lesnar was mainly toying with him. There's a lot to be said for in-cage time.
 
to have a super HW they would need a bunch of heavy guys who would totally suck. UFC wants cream of the crop.

for it to even be fun you would have to be in japan with no steroid testing. if not it would be gassing out fat guys.
 
AE14 said:
Lesnar will pound him IMO, Carwin got floored by Gonzaga, and Lesnar's lunchboxes will tko him
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Second that..

//CC
 
bigwhiteguy29 said:
to have a super HW they would need a bunch of heavy guys who would totally suck. UFC wants cream of the crop.

for it to even be fun you would have to be in japan with no steroid testing. if not it would be gassing out fat guys.
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Really? It seems to me all of UFCs "Cream of the crop" came from Pride.

Couple of thoughts:Just some observations to discuss

A) Most of the guys on the current TUF qulify as Super-Heavy

B) The largest disparity in weight by far is in the Heavy weight class the disparity is so great it
now has become a sanctioning issue

C) Nelsons performance (in my oppinion) was discaceful. They taped him talking about how to win by repetedy lightly touching an opponents head in order to stop the fight. Probably why Kimbo didnt look too worse for wear after.
 
Swaggerstick said:
Really? It seems to me all of UFCs "Cream of the crop" came from Pride.

Couple of thoughts:Just some observations to discuss

A) Most of the guys on the current TUF qulify as Super-Heavy

B) The largest disparity in weight by far is in the Heavy weight class the disparity is so great it now has become a sanctioning issue
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Only Rod Nog has lived up to expectations in the UFC and it doesn't matter if they qualify at SHW. If they make 265, then they're golden. As it was said earlier, the only 2 that would actually do anything if said division actually existed would be Carwin and Lesnar. Maybe half of the cast would even weigh 265 lbs, but it usually benefits someone to compete at a lower weight class.
 
Swaggerstick said:
Really? It seems to me all of UFCs "Cream of the crop" came from Pride.

Couple of thoughts:Just some observations to discuss

A) Most of the guys on the current TUF qulify as Super-Heavy

B) The largest disparity in weight by far is in the Heavy weight class the disparity is so great it now has become a sanctioning issue
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Well most of the guys on TUF suck so they would end up being punching bags lol. In relative terms to the guys they would be stepping into the octogon with.

The weight disparity among fighters is about 30 pounds at most usually. U don't see that many fighters weighing in under 230 except for most notable Randy Couture. Those who complain Brock is too big come fight time well he is playing with in the rules and using skills he aquired during part of his MMA training while wrestling.
 
Ok.... Here are the facts:
Disparity:
Light Weight 145-155 10LBS
Welter Weight155-170 15LBS
Middle Weight 170-185 15LBS
Light Heavy 185-205 20LBS
Heavy 205-265 60LBS

Current UFC champions from PRIDE Loyota Machida,Anderson Silva, BJ Penn
This means if the guy who cut cant get below 205 they are looking at a min. 60LBS heavier competator. A difference not shared in any other combat sport or UFC weight class. The Nevada Athletic Commision has let it go but now, now they have to make a Super heavy Class


Not to mention Nog,Rampage,Hendo,Wand and others
 
Swaggerstick said:
Ok.... Here are the facts:
Disparity:
Light Weight 145-155 10LBS
Welter Weight155-170 15LBS
Middle Weight 170-185 15LBS
Light Heavy 185-205 20LBS
Heavy 205-265 60LBS

Current UFC champions from PRIDE Loyota Machida,Anderson Silva, BJ Penn
This means if the guy who cut cant get below 205 they are looking at a min. 60LBS heavier competator. A difference not shared in any other combat sport or UFC weight class. The Nevada Athletic Commision has let it go but now, now they have to make a Super heavy Class


Not to mention Nog,Rampage,Hendo,Wand and others
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BJ and Machida never fought for PRIDE; their fight was in K-1. Get your facts straight.
 
so what about 60 pounds? its their problem for not cutting to 205 or not bulking up. cro cop did fine at 225. same with randy. another weight class would just make it less pure. and many fighters were in the UFC and went to pride then some back to UFC.

also i like mark colmen for what he did. it just sucks that he owned then got owned a bunch. did anyone use more steroids than him baroni and randlmen haha
 
Rodja said:
Hate him all you want, he changed the game.
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you should watch his fight with Nobuhiko Takada in Pride. Coleman owns him in the 1st round, takedowns GNP everything. Second round comes and coleman doesnt pass the guy's guard, just stands there punching Takada's thighs. then after a minute of that gives his leg up and taps right away from a heel hook. its hilariously fixed, it was on one of the mma websites for awhile. makes you wonder how many fights today could be fixed?
 
AntonG42O said:
you should watch his fight with Nobuhiko Takada in Pride. Coleman owns him in the 1st round, takedowns GNP everything. Second round comes and coleman doesnt pass the guy's guard, just stands there punching Takada's thighs. then after a minute of that gives his leg up and taps right away from a heel hook. its hilariously fixed, it was on one of the mma websites for awhile. makes you wonder how many fights today could be fixed?
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I have that on DVD. Many of Takada's fights were fixed and so were some of PRIDE's early fights between their Japanese pro wrestlers.
 
Rodja said:
I have that on DVD. Many of Takada's fights were fixed and so were some of PRIDE's early fights between their Japanese pro wrestlers.
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they probably offered coleman a bunch of money. the japanese have a crazy way of conducting mma business, im sure you've seen "smashing machine" with mark kerr and coleman.
 
Swaggerstick said:
Who do you think owned K-1 and yes they Machida did fight in PRIDE not too long ago in fact.
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Wow. K-1 is and has been owned by a completely different group than PRIDE (FEG; PRIDE was owned by DSE). Zuffa now owns DSE/PRIDE, but has ZERO stake in K-1. They put on a few hybrid shows together, but they're not the same group.
 
tell me about it please. my pride knowledge is very weak. also they would really fix fights liek that? so gayyyyyyyyyy
 
AntonG42O said:
they probably offered coleman a bunch of money. the japanese have a crazy way of conducting mma business, im sure you've seen "smashing machine" with mark kerr and coleman.
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I own it. The GP wasn't fixed and the Coleman/Takada fight happened during a swoon for Coleman and, as you alluded, he badly needed the money.
 
bigwhiteguy29 said:
tell me about it please. my pride knowledge is very weak. also they would really fix fights liek that? so gayyyyyyyyyy
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They did during their early years (this was not all of them; just selected worked fights) for publicity and ticket sales.
 
Rodja said:
I own it. The GP wasn't fixed and the Coleman/Takada fight happened during a swoon for Coleman and, as you alluded, he badly needed the money.
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oh yea agreed, the GP was definitely real, you couldnt pay Igor enough money to throw a fight, that motherf*cker only likes to throw heavy ass leather!!

those knees to the head on the ground in Pride were so vicious, I bet Coleman could win more fights in the UFC if that was legal again.
 
everyone on this site should watch "the smashing machine" to understand this sport better. its available on youtube if anyone is interested.
 
Swaggerstick said:
PRIDE is now DREAM,DREAM and K-1 are owened by the same people ZUFFA bought PRIDE after a large fraud and raquettering case was made against the Yakuza who owned Pride and most of K-1. The case did not effect the sepratly run entity of K-1 therefor no shut down. Everything from flat out not paying fighters under contract to making fighters sighn contracts under duress

This is probably hijacking the thread sorry
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Dream is a sister promotion of K-1 and FEG (Fighting Entertainment Group). Some of the old DSE staff is now employed by Dream/FEG, but they are NOT the same people. Zuffa owns no part of K-1/Dream and never has. Pride was sold to Zuffa by DSE (Dream Stage Entertainment) and not by FEG.

This is one of the reasons it was such a huge deal when Saku went to K-1. It's like joining a rival team.
 
Rodja said:
Dream is a sister promotion of K-1 and FEG (Fighting Entertainment Group). Some of the old DSE staff is now employed by Dream/FEG, but they are NOT the same people. Zuffa owns no part of K-1/Dream and never has. Pride was sold to Zuffa by DSE (Dream Stage Entertainment) and not by FEG.

This is one of the reasons it was such a huge deal when Saku went to K-1. It's like joining a rival team.
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Never stated Zuffa had anything to do with K-1. DREAM is a siter promotion to K-1 just like PRIDE was. Matter of fact it is PRIDE under a diffrent name and a few front office changes made after the indictments. But both are still owned by the same people,the money comes from, but more importantly to,the same place. Read one of the contracts then one of the .

Not attempting to get ito a pissing contest.

The guys who crated K-1 kickboxing are the ones who later created the seperate entity of PRIDE, Thats why K-1s "SISTER PROMOTION" is now DREAM.
 
Swaggerstick said:
Never stated Zuffa had anything to do with K-1. DREAM is a siter promotion to K-1 just like PRIDE was. Matter of fact it is PRIDE under a diffrent name and a few front office changes made after the indictments. But both are still owned by the same people,the money comes from, but more importantly to,the same place. Read one of the old contracts then one of the new ones.

Not attempting to get ito a pissing contest.
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Dude, K-1 and Pride were never owned by the same people. You're horribly mistaken. The whole reason that K-1 Hero's was started was to counter the Bushido series by Pride. However, once Pride was killed, the Hero's series was dissolved to start Dream (in conjunction with former executives of DSE).

Since you're so set on your opinion of Pride and K-1 being owned by the same parent company, please find something to prove it...
 
Swaggerstick said:
These are well established facts that everyone who whent over there during that time including Chuck Liddell know this isnt something you can wikipedia. Hence the nature of an illegal enterprise.
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I'm not debating the Yakuza involvement; I'm saying that Pride and K-1/Dream are/were owned and operated by separate parent companies.
 
Rodja said:
I'm not debating the Yakuza involvement; I'm saying that Pride and K-1/Dream are/were owned and operated by separate parent companies.
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Case in point would be Mr. Ichii try looking him up.Fact is Yakuza ran both.

He founded K-! and PRIDE and thats not his real name. A man not to be messed withand the PRIDE K-1 front man for the P Gumi family. They took advantage of a lot of fighters
 
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