Upcoming Clen Cycle
- 12-06-2008, 09:24 PM
Upcoming Clen Cycle
I've run two clen cycles in the past and I'm about to start another one on the 15th. I wanted to go ahead and get this posted to get some feedback on my plan. I'll probably maintain a log here as well for those interested.
I'm going to run it for 3 weeks with the possibility of a 4th week depending on how stable the upregulation of beta-2s go. I'll be taking my temperature twice a day (am & pm) as well as checking my blood pressure.
Each dose will be split 2-3 times throughout the day. My tolerance has already been assessed from past runs.
Week 1 (Clen): 40/60/80/100/100/100/100
Week 2-4* (Clen): 100mcg
Week 3 (Benadryll): 75mg ED
Week 4: Assuming my temperature is still elevated: 100mcg
Week 1-4: 5g Taurine ED
I'll be downing around 2 gallons of water a day. I'll be eating 300 calories below maintenance but may scale up to maintenance depending on my energy levels. I'll be doing daily cardio with BCAAs and protein before and after to reduce catabolism as much as possible. Regardless of clen's pseudo-anabolism, lots of cardio and a hypocaloric diet will cause catabolism.
Pictures and stats will be posted closer to start. Constructive feedback is welcome.
- 12-06-2008, 09:32 PM
Subbed. I am hoping to start my first clen cycle in the near future so I will be following this pretty closely and maybe PMing you some questions. Good luck with whatever your goals are!
- 12-06-2008, 09:51 PM
12-06-2008, 10:18 PM
12-06-2008, 10:21 PM
Why don't you do 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off (EC stack in this break), and then back 2 weeks on clen.
You prolly get better results doing it this way.
12-07-2008, 01:39 AM
Appreciate the feedback, everyone.
I think the 2 on 2 off is a bit overrated. My temperature only degraded by 3/10ths during the third week of my last run which is till plenty high enough to increase BMR. If for some reason, I downregulate too harshly and I'm not getting an acceptable read on my temperature, I'll go ahead and stop for a week while dosing benadryll.
As well, running ECA during time off would be counter-productive. You presumably take time off to allow receptor turnover, but ephedrine acts on the same beta 2s as clen. Taking ephedrine would further saturate the beta 2 receptors (more widely so than clen by itself).
Goals: I just finished a short bulk to test my caloric threshold an also just got done dealing with a few unrelated medical issues. I put a bit of a spare tire on that I'm ready to get rid of. I'm in law school and taking finals right now, so I'll get started once they're over.
12-07-2008, 02:25 AM
12-07-2008, 01:43 PM
12-07-2008, 02:06 PM
Generally, if you've never done clen before, you want to do a taper on your first week starting as low as possible and then increasing until you begin to feel sides (shakes, nausea, restlessness, etc). Something like this initially: 20/40/60/etc.
Once you get to the dose you're comfortable with, just stick with it every day through the cycle. Then, the next time you do a clen cycle, you can just start at that dose instead of tapering.
There is a rule of thumb that some people use which says you should take half your body weight (in lbs). If you weigh 200, you should take 100mcg ED. However, its just that, a rule of thumb. Each person will be different.
12-07-2008, 02:24 PM
12-07-2008, 02:26 PM
12-07-2008, 03:53 PM
No need to taper off. There won't be any sufficient thyroid interference.
With that said, thanks Hank. I forgot to answer the second part!
Clen rapidly depletes taurine from your body which can result in cramping. Drink lots of water and take taurine to eliminate that. As well, you could throw in some Tyrosine to ensure your Thyroid remains at 100%. Clen slows the conversion of T4 to T3 but there really isn't any sort of significant shutdown going on. Further, the thyroid is extremely resilient contra to, say, the HPTA.
12-07-2008, 08:58 PM
That's not 100% true.
Clen has a direct influence on the beta 2 recptores in muscle and fat tissue where in contrast, Ephedrine is a poor ligand for the beta 2 receptor. It is tottally indirect. I'm not going to go into how ECA work, but anyway.
Some people take ECA stack for months and still feel its effect. You can't do that with clen because it downregulate the beta recptores much much much FASTER than ECA stack.
Goodluck on this cycle bro !
12-07-2008, 09:38 PM
12-07-2008, 11:47 PM
You're right that Ephedrine is slower to desensitize; however, if your receptors are already downgraded to the point of null-effect, then taking ephedrine will still perpetuate that standing desensitization.
12-08-2008, 12:13 AM
12-08-2008, 12:21 AM
12-08-2008, 12:24 AM
12-08-2008, 12:25 AM
12-08-2008, 12:29 AM
12-08-2008, 12:46 AM
The only three things I thought of were:
1) Timing of benadryl. Instead of using a static start date, just do so once temperature has declined back to normal.
2) No need to really exercise during the first two weeks as the effect will already be maximized.
3) Length of cycle could be stretched out towards 8 weeks to take advantage of clen's pseudo-anabolic properties.
In my research, all of these are subject to an individual's preference. So give me a heads up as to what I'm missing for my sake and the people who are reading this.
Appreciate your input, bud.
12-08-2008, 02:52 AM
A good clen cycle IMO is 10 weeks, with ketotifen(preferred) or benadryl.
AM/PM readings should be taken for a week prior to the cycle and an average number in those 14 readings used. Do the same measuring for the first week on Clen use the average number from the readings.
Once it goes down to normal W/O Clen use the Ketotifen until it comes back up to the average reading of week 1 on Clen.
Add Taurine 3-5 grams, Potassium(lite salt/salt substitute), drink some diet tonic water, take ZMA and some Iodine.
Clen/Albuterol seem to not work best with Keto diets, I'm assuming this might enhance the T3 slowing down from the Clen+caloric deficit.
Also in the week you run the bendryl with the Clen, say you decide your temp has gone too low, so you decide this night, you're taking the bendryl.
You stop taking it when the temperature is again elevated to "normal" (usually a week or so) from day 1-4 on benadryl it doesn't affect the cycle/fat loss if the dose is reduced by 20-120 mcg (saving money to extend cycle and giving the heart a little rest from a drug that was never approved in humans because of heart cell death...but works so well!) 40-60 mcg reduction for your tolerance for the first 4 days sounds reasonable.
Basically, that will maximize your effects, making sure you get the very best out of your cycle, Clen/Albuterol are weak drugs compared to some of the others out there so I always try to make sure I get the best out of them whenever I decide to run them
No point in wasting $200-$400 for results that coulda been obtained by just diet/training/cardio.
12-08-2008, 03:39 AM
Before i start, no one studied clen and its effect on human. I'm not a horse nor a rat.
I'm no animal expert BUT animals have more beta-2 receptors and they cause certain event chains that humans’ beta-2 receptors may not, due to their relatively high concentrations.
Conclusion of the article is:
If you are not planning to use benadryll or keto then 2 weeks on 2 weeks off is what will work. Hence, he said take benadryll every 3rd week cause he's sure that clen loses its effect after week 2. I have no clue why he said 2 weeks off 2 weeks on is useless. He was contradicting himself IMO.
Good article though. I love to read new stuff.
12-08-2008, 01:37 PM
Thanks for the feedback and time taken guys!
I don't necessarily see where any of that contradicts anything in my cycle, but I'll review it a few more time prior to starting.
As well, though that guy appreciates longer cycles (most likely due to competition prep), I'm simply running a short cutter utilizing clen's most potent timestamp.
Also, liquid clen is pretty cheap. I'm not sure where you got $200-400 estimate from; however, I'm definitely going to look into ZMAs synergy while on clen.
12-08-2008, 03:34 PM
12-08-2008, 04:18 PM
No problem, Problem (Rep for cheese!). Haha.
I can't wait to get to get this weight midget off my back.
12-10-2008, 01:02 AM
never taken it before but im going on a cruise in 3 weeks and have it available. how much would this help me cut? im 6'4" 248 lbs and would like to get down to about 235 for the cruise. what are common side effects. most importantly what do these pills look like and how many mcg's are in the pills?
a friend has some but doesnt know much about them and is wanting to get rid of them. how much do they go for? any help is apprecicated.
ps. what is this talk about taking "benadryl" about? what are the basics i need to know about this. im kind of in a time crunch. anything else i should really know? or be ware of?
12-10-2008, 02:12 AM
12-10-2008, 02:20 PM
Side-effects are classic stimulant sides: nausea, shaking, sweats, restlessness but most importantly elevated blood pressure.
I don't use pills, only liquid. Dosing is same regardless. Taper up in your first week to assess tolerance and you can max out as high as 200mcg/ed depending on your tolerance. Obviously, that high isn't safe. Stay around ~100 for optimum safety to benefit ratio.
Clen begins to desensitize your beta-2 receptors after 2 weeks, so benadryl or keto can be used to upregulate those receptors resulting in prolonged benefits.
In my opinion, you aren't ready to just jump on clen, but I'm guessing you'll do so regardless so I'd rather you be prepared. Just follow the cycle I posted but stop at two weeks (so no benadryl will be needed).
12-10-2008, 03:16 PM
clens fat loss properties do diminish after 2 weeks but the anabolic effects keep coming (in my experience with still getting stronger) but i use clen every day as in the dave palumbo protocol.
12-10-2008, 03:22 PM
I think the fat-burning properties of clen are sustained as long as two months. Not as drastic as they are initially, but there is still an elevation in mitochondrial activity there enough to increase BMR. At a point, the fat loss:cost ratio obviously is too lopsided (which I think is around 5 weeks).
However, if you're trying to get its anabolic properties, we're talking 6-8 weeks at least.
12-10-2008, 04:29 PM
12-13-2008, 01:13 AM
I'm on cloud nine right now. I've been on TRT for awhile now. My HPTA has been shutdown for a few years my last blood test came back today and showed a 100pt increase in my testosterone production. I thought my MPH was shut down permanently and I'd be on TRT for the extent of my life.
I'm thoroughly optimistic that things are finally beginning to come back together for me. I can finally get this disgusting fat off of me without fighting tooth and nail against my estrogenic onslaught. I'm giving myself 60 days to get back to a weight I'll feel confident at (~170).
I'll be keeping my Omega 3-6-9 uptake pretty high during this cut to ensure my hormones stay healthy and continue to rise so this may counteract some of my fat loss, but I'm still confident I'll be able to drop at least 6lbs of fat in the first two weeks.
12-14-2008, 04:47 PM
Here are the averages from twice a day measurements (AM & PM) over the last seven days.
Blood Pressure: 112/58
12-14-2008, 08:20 PM
12-14-2008, 10:27 PM
12-15-2008, 06:45 PM
It has begun.
Weight (AM): 180.2
Temperature: Within average range.
Blood Pressure: 104/54 *Note at bottom of post.
I took 40mcg this morning at about 11AM. By noon shakes set in. Nothing severe, just shaky hands and a general feeling of unease at first. I've been through it before, so I adjusted quickly. Shakes are still with me at the time of this post. No other issues.
I did manual labor outside from 12-5. Raked the front/back yard which is pretty large. Hauled the bags down the road. Repaired a few rotten boards out on the dock. Worked up a pretty good sweat. I'll tell you though, I felt in the zone. Almost the feeling of being on ADD meds. I had tons of energy and just stayed the course til it was done.
Once that was done, I had a snack, took my second dose of 1.5g taurine, and jumped on he treadmill. Did 20 minutes at 7mph. No difference in performance here. If anything, I felt like my legs tightened up quicker than usual.
As for food, so far, I've had 4 small meals about 350 calories each. I'm about to eat some vegetable soup and will ultimately tip about 1800cals for the night. All clean except for a few reduced fat cheez-its (my weakness).
*Regarding my blood pressure, my systolic is always in a healthy range though my diastolic is always slightly low. Every doctor I've ever seen has said my blood pressure is fine. Unless I see a much lower diastolic reading in the future, I won't let this be of any concern.
12-16-2008, 02:25 AM
good luck WeighShift! I'm excited about getting on my cycle of clen for the first time beginning of January. Ill probably do some circuit training in the mornings before my classes after i take my doses. Is there any good diet while on clen? or basically minimizing caloric intake and avoiding processed foods.
12-16-2008, 10:37 AM
12-16-2008, 07:44 PM
Weight: 178.4 (sucking the water out of me)
Temp: Within Average
I went ahead and upped the dose to 80mcg, skipping the 60mcg increment since I felt so good yesterday. Per usual, the shakes set in but you don't really notice them unless you focus on it. At one point, I was handing a bill to a cashier and she noticed it and asked if I had the flu, lol.
My temperature has still been normal, even low at times today. Oddly enough though, I was dumping out sweat while working. My hair looked like I took a shower. That isn't normal for me. So I'm not sure why my temperature isn't showing the added thermogenesis.
As for the workload, I was outside most of the day doing a little bit of everything. I was on the roof cleaning gutters, then I was on a ladder cutting tree limbs, then I was hauling 70lb bags of pecans to a shed and finished it off by spraying weeds around a 300 yard perimeter. Once I got home I ran for 20 minutes at 7mph.
I had no problem sleeping last night. Fell asleep and stayed asleep.
Using clen is like using an ECA stack they doesn't wear off in a couple of hours. It really is great. I feel energized and focused all day with no crash and no sleep issues. I did notice my ass on the verge of cramping a few times as well as my shoulders, oddly enough - presumably because they were getting worked hard today. I went ahead and upped my taurine to 5g from 3g. Drinking around 2 gallons daily.
So far, so good.
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