Need help with my routine

[Tinyme]

Sup everyone I started back working out and it's been about 16 weeks. So now I'm trying to do things right. Probably need help with nutrition too. I got the supplements down but haven't bought them yet. Trying to get my nutrition and training down.

I'm 31 5'6 170lbs...I've gained about 7lbs. if I flex my abs I can see the top two.. Got a lot of fat. I don't want to cut I just want to bulk up and gain size. Maybe I'll cut for next summer.

Day 1
Chest /tris
Db incline bench press 4x8-12
Smith machine incline 4x8-12
Dips 3x12
Flies 3x12
Skulls 4x8-12
V bar push down 4x12

Day 2
Back/bis
Wide grip lat pulldowns 4x8-12
Close grip seated rows 4x8-12
Bent over db rows 3x12
Close grip pull downs 3x10
Seated dumbbell curls 4x10
Hammer curls 4x10

Rest

Day 3 shoulders/traps
Military press 4x10
Dumbbell press 3x12
Dumbbell laterals 4x12-15
Rope face pulls 3x15
Barbell shrugs 4x10

I only workout 3 days a week. And to be honest I don't train legs. I know I need to and I will start.

Any good leg routine I should follow? Should I change anything in my routine?

The pic on the right was taken may 25
Left was yesterday.

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Main thing for good legs, squats, lots of squats haha Squat heavy, squat deep, squat often! need to work the calfs hard too as well man! Simple routine

Squats (mix up variations)
Leg press
Leg extension
Laying leg curl
RDL
Seated calf raise
Standing calf raise

Rep range depends of your goals, intensity level ect.

 

[Tinyme]

Goals are to get swole lol big and bulky. Thanks man Imma try that leg workout today. How are my other days? Especially back? My back seems like it's lagging

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Well go heavy and go hard haha man they look good, I like to keep it simple and it works well for me, the only thing I'd add/change is start off with 3/4 sets of pull ups and some variation of a row, bent over row, nice and heavy, one of the best exercises for that V taper

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Oh and some sort of flat bench for chest, flat should be a staple IMO as it hits the whole chest

 

[Tinyme]

Pull-ups is underhand grip and close grip right

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Medium grip, shoulder width, I mean if you can do 3/4 sets of chin ups they're even better but to start with, pull ups or assisted chin ups

 

[Tinyme]

Alright thanks bro.

 

[R1balla]

For triceps, I LOVE reverse grip bench. And since you do your triceps on chest day, you get that added benefit. Keep elbows tucked. It's a great workout

 

[Cole Dreyer]

Goals are to get swole lol big and bulky. Thanks man Imma try that leg workout today. How are my other days? Especially back? My back seems like it's lagging

If this is your goal and if you are truly serious about then I would recommend a program that is structured around basic compound movements that is programmed for progressive overload over time.


If you only train 3 times a week then u would recommend a split that allows you to hit the full body at least within two days so that you have decent frequency as that can be very beneficial for growth.

 

[Tinyme]

Any tips on what program?

 

[Cole Dreyer]

Any tips on what program?

There some full body over two day templates out there but something easy you could do would be:

Day 1 Upper Body Mechanical Strength
Flat or incline smith machine bench press: 3 working sets of 6-8
Seated Barbbell or dumbbell shoulder press: 3 working sets of 6-8
Deadlift variation: 3 sets of 4-6
Pull Ups or Wide grip pull downs: 3 x 6-8
Standing Barbbell curls: 3 x 8
Close grip bench press: 3 x 8


Day 2 Lower body mechanical strength
Squat variation: 3 x 6-8
Sumo dead lift: 3 x 4-6
Leg press: 3 x 8-10
Leg extension: 3 x 8-10
Lying or seated leg curl: 3 x 8-10
Favorite ab crunch exercise: 3 x 15
Leg raise: 3 x 15


Day 3 Full body metabolic/pump set
Incline dumbbell bench: 2 x 12-15 reps
Db lateral raise: 2 x 15
Lat pull down: 2 x 15
Seated cable row: 2 x 15
Alternating dumbbell curl: 2 x 15
Rope press down: 2 x 15
Squat: 2 x 15
Leg press: 2 x 15
Ab crunch: 2 x 15
Leg raise: 2 x 15


The idea behind days 1 & 2 is create tremendous mechanical overload. Your goal should be pushing the HEAVIEST weight you can on every exercise working set with perfect form. This will create enormous mechanical and metabolic stress in the body and should drive EPOCH through the roof. Your body will have no choice but to grow if you are truly training balls out hard and then eating wisely to recover.

The idea behind day 3 is to train the body in the traditional hypertrophy rep ranges to cause cell swell stressors and further metabolic stress without overly taxing the CNS to still illicit a growth response. This day should not be easy but equally intense as days 1 and 2 but only with lighter loads.

 

[Tinyme]

that's a lot in a session

I can workout 4-5 days but I don't do legs which I'm about to start

 

[Cole Dreyer]

that's a lot in a session

I can workout 4-5 days but I don't do legs which I'm about to start

I'm sorry I thought for some reason you could only do 3.


Then I would take day 1 and split that into two days: one day do all of the chest, delts and tricep movements. On the other do the back and bicep movements. Then have the lower body day still and then the final day still.

 

[Tinyme]

I'm sorry I thought for some reason you could only do 3.


Then I would take day 1 and split that into two days: one day do all of the chest, delts and tricep movements. On the other do the back and bicep movements. Then have the lower body day still and then the final day still.

Ok I'll give it a try. I did see a program that caught my eyes the 5/3/1?

I probably do need to concentrate more on compound movements...Because my bench is really weak...I can only do like 135-155 for my working sets but with Dumbbells I can do 70-85...why is that? Bench seems like there's a lot of technique to it...I used to workout with 225 but that was them high school days...

 

[Cole Dreyer]

Ok I'll give it a try. I did see a program that caught my eyes the 5/3/1?

I probably do need to concentrate more on compound movements...Because my bench is really weak...I can only do like 135-155 for my working sets but with Dumbbells I can do 70-85...why is that? Bench seems like there's a lot of technique to it...I used to workout with 225 but that was them high school days...

5/3/1 is a GREAT program - I have used it and its philosophies multiple times in my training history. It would be a great starting point because it focuses and is centered around the compound movements. Plus because it is based on percentages it keeps you honest in pursuing adding weight to the bar and beating the previous workouts which is key to progressive overload.

As for as why your barbell vs dumbbell bench pressing numbers are what they are - there can be several reasons - your mechanical set up differences in each movement, the general form of the movement such as bar and dumbbell patterning, if you are properly recruiting the appropriate muscles (chest, triceps and some delts), etc.

If you could post a video of you doing both movements we can take a look and see what your currently doing and how we could help you improve it?

 

[R1balla]

Ok I'll give it a try. I did see a program that caught my eyes the 5/3/1?

I probably do need to concentrate more on compound movements...Because my bench is really weak...I can only do like 135-155 for my working sets but with Dumbbells I can do 70-85...why is that? Bench seems like there's a lot of technique to it...I used to workout with 225 but that was them high school days...

For chest growth and strength, focus on incline. Stop doing flat bench for about 6 weeks.

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Ok I'll give it a try. I did see a program that caught my eyes the 5/3/1?

I probably do need to concentrate more on compound movements...Because my bench is really weak...I can only do like 135-155 for my working sets but with Dumbbells I can do 70-85...why is that? Bench seems like there's a lot of technique to it...I used to workout with 225 but that was them high school days...

I'd disagree on the 5/3/1 programme, unless you're a experienced lifter, calculated your maxs, know your limits and have good form for each rep, you won't get anywhere, it is based on concentration on perfection IMO

Loads of reasons you flat could be offset a bit by Dumbbells, main reason probably is because you tend to push a bit more with your shoulders using Dumbbells unless you concentrate on squeezing your shoulder blades together to activate the chest, easier to do on a flat bench, harder to get the hang of with Dumbbells

 

[Tinyme]

I'd disagree on the 5/3/1 programme, unless you're a experienced lifter, calculated your maxs, know your limits and have good form for each rep, you won't get anywhere, it is based on concentration on perfection IMO

Loads of reasons you flat could be offset a bit by Dumbbells, main reason probably is because you tend to push a bit more with your shoulders using Dumbbells unless you concentrate on squeezing your shoulder blades together to activate the chest, easier to do on a flat bench, harder to get the hang of with Dumbbells

Should I just stick to the regular split?

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Honestly it's completely up to you, if you want fast results, a mixture of strength (low reps/high weight) and hypertrophy (high rep/lower weight) a solid diet and a routine you can stick too! Like the guy said above its all about PROGRESSIVE overload, so take notes when you train ect. Know where you're at! to be honest if you weren't going to do a ppl style routine, I'd go with full body 4 times a week. Like I said its up to you, I know people that have started with a full body split and done great but it's not for everyone

 

[Tinyme]

Honestly it's completely up to you, if you want fast results, a mixture of strength (low reps/high weight) and hypertrophy (high rep/lower weight) a solid diet and a routine you can stick too! Like the guy said above its all about PROGRESSIVE overload, so take notes when you train ect. Know where you're at! to be honest if you weren't going to do a ppl style routine, I'd go with full body 4 times a week. Like I said its up to you, I know people that have started with a full body split and done great but it's not for everyone

Yeah I really need a solid diet. That's the thing that is Holding me back. I was thinking about hiring a personal trainer online but idk if I should spend money on that...just stop being lazy and do my own diet I guess lol

 

[Anabolikz]

In terms of programming my advice to you would to be hit each muscle group 2-3 times a week. You can split this up in whatever way it makes it easier for you to adhere to. Upper/Lower, full body, push pull legs will all work or a combination of these can work. This might make you take your volume down slightly each workout but your total weekly volume will likely be increased. Working on your lifts more often will enable your technique to get better faster and thus increasing the rate of progressive overload which as discussed above is one of the keys to growth.

About leg training... Matt Ogus said this not long ago... 3 exercises you need for optimal leg development.. 1 some form of a squat 2 some form of a deadlift and 3 some form of a leg curl..

Learn how to squat and deadlift properly. Most don't have the mobility in their hips and don't reap the benefits of squatting. Stretch and do mobility drills and work on squatting below parallel to reap ridiculous leg gains from squatting. Same thing with deadlifts. Obviously apply progressive overload and work them 2-3 times per week.

 

[Juicedeez utz]

^^this also^^ but when it comes to diet man, a trainer won't do $h1t, it's all down to you on that one brother!

 

[Tinyme]

In terms of programming my advice to you would to be hit each muscle group 2-3 times a week. You can split this up in whatever way it makes it easier for you to adhere to. Upper/Lower, full body, push pull legs will all work or a combination of these can work. This might make you take your volume down slightly each workout but your total weekly volume will likely be increased. Working on your lifts more often will enable your technique to get better faster and thus increasing the rate of progressive overload which as discussed above is one of the keys to growth.

About leg training... Matt Ogus said this not long ago... 3 exercises you need for optimal leg development.. 1 some form of a squat 2 some form of a deadlift and 3 some form of a leg curl..

Learn how to squat and deadlift properly. Most don't have the mobility in their hips and don't reap the benefits of squatting. Stretch and do mobility drills and work on squatting below parallel to reap ridiculous leg gains from squatting. Same thing with deadlifts. Obviously apply progressive overload and work them 2-3 times per week.

Any good workout program I should follow that trains each muscle twice a week?

 

[Tinyme]

^^this also^^ but when it comes to diet man, a trainer won't do $h1t, it's all down to you on that one brother!

That is true man! I guess Imma have to stop being lazy.

The other day I did bent over barbell rows and hurt my hip now I'm injured...

 

[R1balla]

Any good workout program I should follow that trains each muscle twice a week?

I am on this right now with a few tweaks. I do more calves and less accessory leg workouts than what is posted in the pic below. I also do super sets and drop sets a lot.

 

[Tinyme]

I am on this right now with a few tweaks. I do more calves and less accessory leg workouts than what is posted in the pic below. I also do super sets and drop sets a lot.

So just 3 day a week? Mon Wed fri?

 

[R1balla]

So just 3 day a week? Mon Wed fri?

That's what I'm on right now, yes. This isn't my main routine but I change it up often. Every 4-6 weeks.

 

[PaulBlack]

2 cents...

So just 3 day a week? Mon Wed fri?

But if you notice he is getting in more in the 3x per week than your original layout, since the frequency is higher.
If one is more or less starting out or in the beginner or even intermed stages, more frequency thru the week can be used (ie: shoulder work 2-3x per week,) because recovery is quicker or more efficient when the loads being used by less experienced lifters, are not so heavy to tax the system, like an advanced lifter using near his max loads and always closer to his recovery potential.
IMO, it is better to do less for one area, say 5-6 total sets for chest, (with more time to cover other areas) but do that more often thru the week, than doing 10-15 sets in one workout, then waiting a full 7 days until you train that group again.
Do you see what I am saying?
And not training legs is again, IMO shortchanging yourself, since the potential for all over systemic hormonal activation and training the largest muscular structures ie: hams, glutes, quads, erectors, loading the spine, etc. etc. along with better lung and cardio capacity, will in the long run and from a fitness standpoint, give you the most bang for you gym dollars.
To add, I did not train legs for my first 5 or so years. I was sorry I didn't after I found out how well it brought up overall body strength , stamina for my manual labor job and all round fitness.

 

[Anabolikz]

Any good workout program I should follow that trains each muscle twice a week?

Yeah man, PHAT was one of my favorites but also push/pull/legs. There are also some really good upper/lower splits out there. Also PHUL is really good. Just depends on how you like to split things up and how many days per week you want to go to the gym. PHAT is 5 days a week PHUL is 4 you could do full body 3 days a week if you can only train 3 days per week. And if you want to be in there 6 days a week push/pull/legs is a great choice. Look up those splits and there are literally hundreds of good programs made with those as a "template" or you can make your own.

The important thing to remember is all the programs you look up can be customized for your goals and your schedule. If it's too much volume you can cut out some sets or exercises and if you need more you can add more.

 

[R1balla]

I really like to add a full body workout on Saturdays since weekends I have more time. Take off Friday's and Sunday's for rest.

 

[Tinyme]

It's going to be different for me to hit the whole upper body in one session. I guess I'll try the Phat 5 day.

How come I always see the big guys in the gym doing splits like my old one? They either doing all chest all back etc...

 

[Tinyme]

Upper Body Power Day

Pulling Power Movement: Bent over or Pendlay rows
3 sets of 3-5 reps
Assistance Pulling movement: Weighted Pull ups
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Auxiliary Pulling movement: Rack chins
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Pressing Power Movement: Flat dumbbell presses
3 sets of 3-5 reps
Assistance pressing movement: Weighted dips
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Assistance pressing movement: Seated dumbbell shoulder presses
3 sets of 6-10 reps
Auxiliary curling movement: Cambered bar curls
3 sets of 6-10 reps
Auxiliary extension movement: Skull crushers
3 sets of 6-10 reps
Day 2: Lower Body Power Day

Pressing Power Movement: Squats
3 sets of 3-5 reps
Assistance pressing movement: Hack Squats
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Assistance extension movement: Leg extensions
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Assistance pulling movement: Stiff legged deadlifts
3 sets of 5-8 reps
Assistance pulling/curling movement: Glute ham raises or lying leg curls
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Auxiliary calf movement: Standing calf raise
3 sets of 6-10 reps
Auxiliary calf movement: Seated calf raise
2 sets of 6-10 reps
Day 3: Rest

Day 4: Back and Shoulders Hypertrophy Day

Pulling Power Exercise speed work: Bent over or Pendlay rows
6 sets of 3 reps with 65-70% of normal 3-5 rep max
Hypertrophy pulling movement: Rack chins
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy pulling movement: Seated cable row
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy pulling movement: Dumbbell rows or shrugs bracing upper body against an incline bench
2 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy pulling movement: Close grip pulldowns
2 sets of 15-20 reps
Hypertrophy shoulder movement: Seated dumbbell presses
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy shoulder movement: Upright rows
2 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy shoulder movement: Side lateral raises with dumbbells or cables
3 sets of 12-20 reps
Day 5: Lower Body Hypertrophy Day

Lower Body Power Exercise speed work: Squats
6 sets of 3 reps with 65-70% of normal 3-5 rep max
Hypertrophy pressing movement: Hack squats
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy pressing movement: Leg presses
2 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy extension movement: Leg extensions
3 sets of 15-20 reps
Hypertrophy pulling movement: Romanian deadlifts
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy curling movement: Lying leg curls
2 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy curling movement: Seated leg curls
2 sets of 15-20 reps
Hypertrophy calf movement: Donkey calf raises
4 sets of 10-15 reps
Hypertrophy calf movement: Seated calf raises
3 sets of 15-20 reps
Day 6: Chest and Arms Hypertrophy Day

Pressing Power Exercise speed work: Flat dumbbell presses
6 sets of 3 reps with 65-70% of normal 3-5 rep max
Hypertrophy pressing movement: Incline dumbbell presses
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy pressing movement: Hammer strength chest press
3 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy fly movement: Incline cable flyes
2 sets of 15-20 reps
Hypertrophy curling exercise: Cambered bar preacher curls
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy curling exercise: Dumbbell concentration curls
2 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy curling exercise: Spider curls bracing upper body against an incline bench
2 sets of 15-20 reps
Hypertrophy extension exercise: Seated tricep extension with cambered bar
3 sets of 8-12 reps
Hypertrophy extension exercise: Cable pressdowns with rope attachment
2 sets of 12-15 reps
Hypertrophy extension exercise: Cable kickbacks
2 sets of 15-20 reps
Day 7: Rest

Keep in mind this workout would be for someone who is relatively adapted to higher frequency and volume, so you may want to cut out an assistance/auxiliary exercise on each day to start until your body adapts.

 

[R1balla]

It's going to be different for me to hit the whole upper body in one session. I guess I'll try the Phat 5 day.

How come I always see the big guys in the gym doing splits like my old one? They either doing all chest all back etc...

Cause that's the most common when on cycle. Blast one muscle group once or twice a week.

 

[Anabolikz]

It's going to be different for me to hit the whole upper body in one session. I guess I'll try the Phat 5 day.

How come I always see the big guys in the gym doing splits like my old one? They either doing all chest all back etc...

"The big guys you see in the gym" are very likely using drugs and drugs make a way bigger difference than programming... This is coming from someone who loves to read research on training and how to optimize it for the best muscle growth. So I will be the first person to admit that drugs make a bigger difference.. Sucks, but that's the way it is. Guys who take drugs follow the pros that have led the way before them and for a while now the 5 day split has been used extensively by these guys.


You can get results using virtually any split you want including the typical 5 day split you are talking about. In fact, if you feel you can adhere to this split and are more motivated to train on this split it could be better for you.

But if you want what is considered "optimal" there is research that compares splits that hit each muscle group once per week vs multiple times per week and hypertrophy results have been proven to be greater for the higher frequency splits.

If you want real world examples a lot of worlds best natural bodybuilders typically hit more than one muscle a session and hit their muscle group 2-3 times per week.

 

[PaulBlack]

Yeah and also, there are just some guys who can just look at weights (drugs or not) and grow, no matter what they do. Most of us more average guys are not that lucky. If they do not have to train very hard or very often to grow, many won't.
The best thing I learned about good gaining, is what many older gurus preach...
Stick first and foremost to the big 5-7 compound lifts
Train the body's main structures/groups 2x or so per week
Eat good healthy food
Rest when it is time to rest
Rinse and repeat

 

[Tinyme]

Wouldn't a twice a week routine be better for a guy on drugs? Since they recover faster? And vise versa for a natural guy where once a week be better because you recover slower?

 

[Rodja]

Wouldn't a twice a week routine be better for a guy on drugs? Since they recover faster? And vise versa for a natural guy where once a week be better because you recover slower?

It's no so much the frequency, but the overall volume and intensity threshold that increase with PEDs. I highly recommend twice a week on the big 3 with or without drugs.

 

[Tinyme]

It's no so much the frequency, but the overall volume and intensity threshold that increase with PEDs. I highly recommend twice a week on the big 3 with or without drugs.

Big 3?

 

[Juicedeez utz]

Big 3?

Bench, deadlift, squat!
Although there are other compounds, over head press, any variation of row ect.

 

[R1balla]

Yeah, twice a week is perfect. Just lower the volume a little bit if you are all natty.

 

[PaulBlack]

Just to get a bit technical, studies show "most people" (especially if one is less advanced, because again, the loads/weights and training intensity by beginner and intermeds is usually a good bit lower, so recovery is easier and not being pushed to max either by 90%+ maxes and heavy strains on the CNS.
Usually most muscle groups, can recover in about 48-72 hours of training and be ready to train again. Small groups like forearms and stuff can be trained pretty frequent, while say larger ones, glutes, hams perhaps 72+.

 

[Tinyme]

I was going to say that but I was wondering about the other lifts too lol

 

[Rodja]

I was going to say that but I was wondering about the other lifts too lol

It's a hierarchy. Place prominence and paramount on the big lifts and fill in the accessories. The only person that can determine which accessories are appropriate for you is you and they will change throughout the process.

 

[R1balla]

It's a hierarchy. Place prominence and paramount on the big lifts and fill in the accessories. The only person that can determine which accessories are appropriate for you is you and they will change throughout the process.

Good point Rodja. Nice to see you again! Been a while!