Lagging arms/shoulders

jwstoick

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I did push/leg/pull for about 8 months and my chest and back grew tremendously but arms and shoulders started to fall behind. For the past month I switched to chest/back, legs, arms/shoulders which has been working good except for I started cutting and now the chest/back day is just too much for me. I put together a routine that still is push leg pull oriented but also focuses a little more on arms and shoulders. Also I have a quad dominant and hamstring dominant leg day. Let me know what you think.


Push
Bench 4x4-6
Incline dumbbell 4x8-12
Cables flies 3x12-15/Side lateral raise 4x8-12
DB Tricep extension 3x8-12
Tricep push down 3x8-12

Pull
Wide grip pull-ups 30reps
Pendlay row 4x4-8
Lat pull downs 3x8-12
Hammer row 3x 12-15
DB Curl 3x8-12
Hammer Curl 3x8-12/rear delts 3x12-15

Legs
Squat 4x4-8
Hack squat 5x10-15
Walking lunges 4x10-15/leg curl 4x10-15
Calves/abs

Shoulders/chest
OHP 4x4-8
Decline DB Press 4x8-12/Side lat raise 4x8-12
Arnold press 3x8-12/rear delt 4x15-20
Flat cable press 2x12-15/cable side lat 2x12-15

Back/arms
Tbar row 3x8-12
Barbell curl 3x6-10/DB ext 3x6-10
Close grip late pulldown 3x12-15
Single preacher curl 3x8-12/push downs 3x8-12
Cable hammer 3x12-15/reverse Tricep 3x12-15

Legs
Romanian deadlifts 3x5-8
Leg press 4x12-15/leg curl 4x8-12
Goblet squat 4x12-15/glute game raise 2x12-15
Calves/abs
 
JXiiXViii

JXiiXViii

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I've been doing Christian Thibaudeau's growth factor shoulder training and I like it a lot: http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_thibaudeau/update_to_growth_factor_shoulder_training_width_complexes

I'm in the same boat as you with having poorly developed delts. I can overhead press a fair amount of weight, but my delts have always lacked that full, rounded look.

What I like about the growth factor training is it uses mostly isolation work and you get a nasty pump in your delts from it. Since you're using lighter weight and it's not too taxing on the body as a whole like presses are, you can do it a few times per week.

I'm on a cut as well, so I only choose 1 of the supersets instead of going through every single one like what's recommended in the post. I'll do it twice per week on my non-overhead pressing days, so that way I'm hitting delts 3 times per week total.

Despite being in a deficit, I've noticed some improvement. I'm really looking forward to trying it out when I get back to bulking.
 

jwstoick

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That looks amazing and tremendously painful all at once!! I'm definitely going to have to give that a shot thank you man!!!

How are you working the rest of your body?
 
JXiiXViii

JXiiXViii

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That looks amazing and tremendously painful all at once!! I'm definitely going to have to give that a shot thank you man!!!

How are you working the rest of your body?
Yeah it is painful, but in a good way of course. I've never really felt a pump in my delts until doing this.

As for the rest of my training, since I'm on a cut, I'm just trying to retain as much strength as I can.

So for the big lifts like bench, squat, and cleans (I can't deadlift due to my back at the moment), I focus on sets of 5 or less.

For everything else I train in the 6-15 rep range depending on if it's an isolation movement or compound.

Here's what a standard week will look like:

Monday:

Heavy BB bench - 5 reps or less
Incline DB press - sets of 8-12
DB rows - I go heavier on these too, so I do sets of 5-8
1 Growth factor shoulder workout from the link above (3 sets total)

Tuesday - Fasted conditioning work first thing in the morning

Wednesday:

Heavy squats - 5 reps or less (recently been leg pressing though because of my back)
Leg extensions/leg curls - 12-15 reps
Calves - 12-15 reps
Overhead DB press - 6-10 reps
Another back exercise like seated rows or pull ups

Thursday - Fasted conditioning work in the morning

Friday:

Arms and another growth factor shoulder workout

Saturday:

Cleans - 5 reps or less
Shrugs - 10-12 reps
Face pulls - 12-15 reps
Forearms

I was doing heavy farmers walks on Saturdays too before I screwed my back up.

Hopefully another couple weeks and it will be healed.

That program is just something I threw together for now.

Once I'm back on a bulk, I plan on getting back on 5/3/1 which is by far my favorite program for getting stronger.

I'm gonna put my own twist on it though and add some high rep hypertrophy work.
 
hubbabubba

hubbabubba

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My arms always fell behind until I trained them heavy at least twice a week. I trained them alone one day and then did about twelve sets of his after back and 12 sets of tris after shoulders. On my arms only days I lifted heavy: straight bar curls for bis and close grip benches for tris.

Shoulders I would do some clean and presses and heavy laterals. Tri sets of raises: 7-front, 7-side, 7-rear=one set to finish. My traps always took over on raises until I figured out how to relax them to put the focus on the delt.
 
KidIcarus

KidIcarus

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I used to do a similar split. I've found that taking one muscle group per day and just spending an hour destroying it and letting it recover for a week has given me impressive gains. It's actually not the work out that gets you stronger or bigger, it's the recovery. So, my split is: Monday-Chest, Tuesday-Biceps/triceps, Wednesday-Legs, Thursday-Shoulders, Friday-Back. Dedicating a day each to arms and shoulders might help you. I've seen huge gains in my shoulders and arms since doing that. Also, on arms day, supersetting a biceps exercise with a triceps will save you time and get you bigger and stronger.

Example:
Monday: Chest
DB Incline Press 4X6-8
Bench Press 3X8, last set double drop
Hammer Strength Decline Press 3X8-12, last set double drop
Superset:
1. DB Flyes 3X8
2. DB Bench 3 sets to failure
Superset:
1. Pec-Dec 3X8-12
2. Dips (Chest version)
Cable Cross Overs: 5X20

Tuesday: Arms
Superset:
1. EZ Bar Curls 3X6-8
2. Close Grip Bench Press 3X6-8
Superset:
1. DB Cross Body Hammer Curls 3X8-12
2. Hammer Strength Triceps Extensions 3X8-12
Superset:
1. Incline Skull crushers--8 straight into presses to failure, 3 sets
2. DB Biceps Curls on incline bench 3X8-12 with 4 forced reps
Superset:
1. Reverse Grip Press-Downs 3X8-12
2. Lying Cable Curls 3X8-12
Superset:
1. Overhead Cable Curls 5X20
2. Overhead Cable Triceps extensions 5X20
Reverse Grip Curls 3X8-12

Wednesday: Legs
Squats 4X8-12
Romanian Deadlifts 3X8-12
Trap Bar Deadlifts 3X8-12
Lying Leg Curls 3X8-12
Superset:
1. Seated Calf Raises 3X8-12
2. Standing Calf Raises 3X8-12
Leg Press 5X20

Thursday: Shoulders
Shoulder Press: 3X6-8
Behind the Neck Press: 3X8-12
Hammer Strength Shoulder Press 3X8-12 last set double drop
Giant Set:
1. Wide Grip Upright Rows 3X8-12
2. Reverse Flyes 3X8-12
3. Underhand DB Front Delt Raises 3X8-12
4. Car Drivers 3X8-12
Face Pulls: 5X20

Friday: Back
Weighted Pull-Ups 3X8-12
Deadlifts 3X8-12
Superset:
1. Barbell Rows: 3X8-12
2. Cable Pull-Overs: 3 sets to failure
Hammer Strength High Rows: 3X8-12 last set double drop
Wide Grip Cable Rows: 3X8-12 last set double drop
Shotgun Rows: 5X20

I actually do abs every day too. I have a bunch of different abs work-outs I do for pure torture (and of course to keep the 6 pack...) I spend about 5-10 minutes on abs. For example, today I did tri-set: Reverse Decline Crunches 3X12, Barbell roll-outs 3X12, and Landmine 180's 3X12. My personal favorite is 3 sets of 12 of Hanging Leg Raises--Feet to the bar, followed by 3 sets of 10 of Hanging Oblique Knee Raises, followed by 3 sets of 20 cable crunches.
 

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