Any good programs out there that combine Strength / Size / Endurance?

[Gutterpump]

I typically create my own programs, but I'm interested in researching existing ones that align with my current goals.

Currently I'm trying to really improve my athleticism (endurance, mobility, strength) while also packing on more size while fixing muscle imbalances.

Longterm goals are to cruise at 12%BF, but currently looking to recomp to get there via carb cycling / targeted carb intake & intense training (as well as many things to increase recovery). I'm probably around 18% right now.

 

[Rodja]

Depends on how you define endurance first.

 

[Gutterpump]

Endurance in every aspect possible. Cardio capacity and muscle endurance.

 

[Razor198042]

A really good one is HITT (High Intensity Tactical Training) in current use by the USMC,just Google it,they even have a fitness app made by Dartfish as well as a Facebook page,hope it helps

 

[Gutterpump]

For example, my ideal long term goal would be to have the body to compete on stage, be able to enter into a powerlifting meet (and place), and do decently well in an Ironman competition. Not a very low bar I've set for myself, but I think it's doable.

 

[Gutterpump]

A really good one is HITT (High Intensity Tactical Training) in current use by the USMC,just Google it,they even have a fitness app made by Dartfish as well as a Facebook page,hope it helps

Been looking into military routines / training programs lately actually. A very good place to look for this type of training!

 

[Gutterpump]

Here's what I had put together recently, and have been using for the past month. It's pretty tough though, and I think I need more variance and possibly more leg & core work. It's also needing some periodization as the intensity gets brutal, as does recovery. Another thing I need to consider is agility (for injury prevention and being fast on my feet).

1] Warmup - mobility drill

2] Clean and Press - total of 40 reps for time

- then I move onto strength / mass building

3] Barbell Bench Press (3-4 sets of 5, 1 set of 3, 1 set of 1 / strength bias)

4] Fly machine (4 sets x 10-12 reps - volume)

5] Reverse fly machine (4 sets x 8-10 reps - volume)

6] Seated Pulldowns (4 sets x 8-10 reps - volume)

7] Curlbar curls (3 sets of 15 - volume)

then I do my cardio/strength finisher

8] Prowler @320# - 6 - 8 lengths of my gym (30-60s rest between lengths)

- note: weight on prowler is fairly high, so it's a good leg workout as well as being a cardio crusher

I have been doing this routine EOD, with 2 days off after 3 training sessions. Recovery is enhanced atm, so it's been doable, but I don't think it's sustainable.

 

[Rodja]

For example, my ideal long term goal would be to have the body to compete on stage, be able to enter into a powerlifting meet (and place), and do decently well in an Ironman competition. Not a very low bar I've set for myself, but I think it's doable.

Specificity. The first two can happen, but not concurrently with the third. Endurance activities of that level are inherently catabolic not to mention how much they nuke test levels.

 

[Gutterpump]

Specificity. The first two can happen, but not concurrently with the third. Endurance activities of that level are inherently catabolic not to mention how much they nuke test levels.

True, I cruise on test year round though (TRT) + GH. But to clear things up a bit, I don't actually want to compete in Ironman, but have similar endurance as an Ironman athlete. I'm more of an obstacle course racer (12+ miles).

 

[Gutterpump]

Rodja - what are you initial impressions of the routine I posted above, for increasing athleticism / endurance while still keeping in some strength/volume work. It's not perfect, but a good start (I think?).

 

[Rodja]

Well, clean and press should never be done for time. EVER. There's no progression laid out so I can't comment on that, but the assistance lifts are definitely not going to address getting stronger. 3 isolation and all work the internal rotators.

Honestly, WS4SB is probably the best place for you to start and then adjust to your specific needs.

 

[Gutterpump]

Well, clean and press should never be done for time. EVER. There's no progression laid out so I can't comment on that, but the assistance lifts are definitely not going to address getting stronger. 3 isolation and all work the internal rotators.

Honestly, WS4SB is probably the best place for you to start and then adjust to your specific needs.

Thanks. WS4SB + GPP/conditioning work sounds like what I'm looking for in the short term. I was really hoping to incorporate the prowler and GHR into my routine though. Not sure if the prowler on off days is too much, but I can try it out.

 

[Rodja]

Thanks. WS4SB + GPP/conditioning work sounds like what I'm looking for in the short term. I was really hoping to incorporate the prowler and GHR into my routine though. Not sure if the prowler on off days is too much, but I can try it out.

You know that GPP is in WS4SB, right? Why wouldn't you be able to use a GHR?

 

[Gutterpump]

You know that GPP is in WS4SB, right? Why wouldn't you be able to use a GHR?

The site I was reading didn't offer it as an option in their template, but another site just did, so yes, I'm happy now. I love heavy prowler pushes though, high bar, so it's a combo of strength/conditioning for me. I'm not sure if this would be too much as part of this routine, or if it would be allowed as GPP. Most people I know who use the prowler use much less weight than I. I just love tackling it with high weight and going all out with max effort.

Also, for clean and press, I usually do 4 sets of 10, with minimal time between sets, and low weight. It's warms me up and gets my HR up / sweat running before I start my workout. I mean, it's a tough workout in itself, but I love it as a starter.

 

[Gutterpump]

I forgot to mention that I do rehab work 2-3 days per week (shoulder PNF - D1/D2, band pull-aparts, etc - mainly focusing on external rotators). Should I do these on each workout day? Or in-between days / cardio days?

 

[jaces]

Specificity. The first two can happen, but not concurrently with the third. Endurance activities of that level are inherently catabolic not to mention how much they nuke test levels.

i agree with rodja here

 

[jaces]

Rodja - what are you initial impressions of the routine I posted above, for increasing athleticism / endurance while still keeping in some strength/volume work. It's not perfect, but a good start (I think?).

it depends on what tipe of athlete you want to be

 

[kisaj]

All my training has always been specific to athletic support and improvement and will be tweaked depending on the event, competition, or sport I was playing. I'd agree with Rodja that all of your goals are difficult, but particularly wanting to compete in a PL meet (and place) and compete in an Ironman. I've done a strongman and entered a couple of local PL meets in the past and the training is quite different than any endurance training. If you haven't trained for a triathlon before, you'll see how far it is on the opposite end of the spectrum.

 

[Gutterpump]

All my training has always been specific to athletic support and improvement and will be tweaked depending on the event, competition, or sport I was playing. I'd agree with Rodja that all of your goals are difficult, but particularly wanting to compete in a PL meet (and place) and compete in an Ironman. I've done a strongman and entered a couple of local PL meets in the past and the training is quite different than any endurance training. If you haven't trained for a triathlon before, you'll see how far it is on the opposite end of the spectrum.

Oh my bad sorry, I was mentioning in another post that I'd like to have the endurance similar to an Ironman athlete, but I'm never planning to compete. I'm more of an obstacle course racing guy (12-20+ miles) where a lot of strength and endurance is needed. I'm going to create a WS4SB template because it addresses strength and volume work, as well as leaves room open for GPP/conditioning work. I'm not sure where to stick my rehab work in though. I usually don't do it on workout days, but not sure with this program.

Another option is to do crossfit (as it addresses so many areas - except for bodybuilding), butttt I don't want to get skinny... I also know a lot of big dudes who have crazy endurance, so I think it's possible to combine all 3 (strength/bodybuilding/condition work).

 

[bolt10]

Sounds like you want alex Viadas hybrid training book. That's the closest to what your saying.

Keep in mind that the more qualities you want to develop the more balanced the plan so it may almost seen like too little of each to start, just as a heads up.

 

[kisaj]

Oh my bad sorry, I was mentioning in another post that I'd like to have the endurance similar to an Ironman athlete, but I'm never planning to compete. I'm more of an obstacle course racing guy (12-20+ miles) where a lot of strength and endurance is needed. I'm going to create a WS4SB template because it addresses strength and volume work, as well as leaves room open for GPP/conditioning work. I'm not sure where to stick my rehab work in though. I usually don't do it on workout days, but not sure with this program.

Another option is to do crossfit (as it addresses so many areas - except for bodybuilding), butttt I don't want to get skinny... I also know a lot of big dudes who have crazy endurance, so I think it's possible to combine all 3 (strength/bodybuilding/condition work).

Oh, that is totally different then. Yes, it is very possible to do what you are after.

 

[Gutterpump]

Oh, that is totally different then. Yes, it is very possible to do what you are after.

Thanks, yeah I think a good hybrid program, even a football type program would work well. I think I'll start a new Westside log (WS4SB). Definitely feels strange telling people the name of the program since I'm already a fairly big dude (6'2 240). But it will do what I'm looking for haha

 

[jaces]

google some rugby training programs as well

 

[Gutterpump]

google some rugby training programs as well

Thanks. Yeah I think football, rugby, and military (USMC training program) is where I should draw influence from for agility drills / conditioning.

 

[Gutterpump]

This is exactly what I was looking for, WS4SB III. A solid powerbuilding program with GPP/Conditioning:

https://www.defrancostraining.com/westside-for-skinny-bastards-part3/

Thanks Rodja

 

[jaces]

Thanks. Yeah I think football, rugby, and military (USMC training program) is where I should draw influence from for agility drills / conditioning.

football is a bit more specific toe the postion you play .. were rugby is 80min of tackling the **** out of one and other.. so rugby players are more ''fit'' than most nfl players and every rugby player has to be strong in all aspects were an nfl player trains more specificly.. but for what you want google or research programs for flankers,8th man or inside centre

 

[Gutterpump]

Started up a new WS4SB III log here: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/271447-gutterpumps-westside-log.html

Going to start working in serious GPP/Conditioning over time, to see where it will fit in best. Maybe after a week or two.

 

[Capt Awesome]

Sounds like you want alex Viadas hybrid training book. That's the closest to what your saying.

Keep in mind that the more qualities you want to develop the more balanced the plan so it may almost seen like too little of each to start, just as a heads up.

I second Alex Viada's book. There is a powerlifting and triathlon template in the book. He actually has a obstacle course race template that you get by email after you purchase the book and eventually some military ones as well. It's not a complete program, but he gives a couple sample weeks and tells you how to progress and to build a full program. It's a great book, albeit a little pricey. They do plan on supporting the book for quite a while and providing various templates as they get them built.

 

[Gutterpump]

I second Alex Viada's book. There is a powerlifting and triathlon template in the book. He actually has a obstacle course race template that you get by email after you purchase the book and eventually some military ones as well. It's not a complete program, but he gives a couple sample weeks and tells you how to progress and to build a full program. It's a great book, albeit a little pricey. They do plan on supporting the book for quite a while and providing various templates as they get them built.

Thanks man, definitely going to get it for some good reading.

I just started WS4SB this week and think I'll likely run the program for 4 months before moving completely over to Westside training, or some sort of hybrid program. I'm really liking WS4SB now, and keep in mind this is the first real program I've run since my surgery and injuries. I used to do 5/3/1 with periodization bible assistance alongside bb complexes and prowler work for condition, was pretty good stuff. WS4SB with combine type agility/speed/conditioning work is really going to work out great for me though I think. I can tell already.