Topic of the week: Is Overtraining BS?

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    As far as I understand OR and experience it, I wouldnt characterise it as 'burnout'. If I were to characterise it symptomatically it would be where I get weaker at specifically targeted lifts, there is a strength drop-off. This is due to purposefully training at an 'excessive' weekly volume/freq for that particular lift. My sleep is unaffected, as are my other lifts.

    I think there is a grey area with these conditions, because a whole body overreach could, with a bit of extra effort/time and no deload, become overtraining.
    I would highly doubt you reach the threshold of over-training within a weekly block of training. What a lot of people tend to do is read the symptoms, then apply it to them and self diagnose a condition in which they do not have, then proceed to "treat" a condition which they do not have.

    This little graph shows the recovery time you can expect for true over training:

    Attachment 120347

    An important consideration is that under recovery can exhibit the same symptoms as over training but chronic under recovery may not necessarily lead to over training. Common over training we might see is back in the early 2000's when the relationship between prolonged intense loads and under recovery plus the stress of competition was not understood, and elite athletes were competing in some cases every 3-5 days at maximal intensities (think sprinting in soccer, ice hockey etc.) with only a few days recovery that also required the athlete travel between time zones and sleep little on buses.

    In competition, the loads are not self regulated - you are expected to perform to a high degree regardless of fatigue and so athletes would commonly peak every 3-4 days for an entire season. This would be akin to a PLer or Olympic lifter trying to compete in a new competition every few days (competition loads are typically greater than training loads).
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  2. Quote Originally Posted by plifter42 View Post
    Haha, this is true. But after years of training I know what works for me and I have my training dialed in to a point where I've been making steady gains every year.

    I might have experienced "overtraining" before... Squatting 225 raw, ass to grass for 22 reps and puking all over the squat rack on the last set... Varsity wrestling practice until sundown in a small room with the goal of dehydrating ourselves... Two-a-days during football going through practices with multiple concussions...

    I've experimented with overtraining... Wasn't for me.
    Haha i'm not too sure what you mean here? I don't think you have the correct definition of overtraining. Being sick during a set isnt overtraining. It's heavy for sure, but the term isnt literal to the definition.

    Its not how much you do necessarily, its a combination of increased volume loads, intensities (not perceived intensity but the training definition which is relative to maximal), competition stress, external stress, lack of recovery days between movements or exercise patterns etc. etc.
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  3. I don't know the definition of overtraining. I said that I "Might" have experienced overtraining. I don't know what the definition of overtraining is or maybe I just haven't experienced it. Either way, I've suffered multiple injuries and muscle tears from lifting weights, I know that.
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/269154-msten-pmag-log.html

  4. Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    I would highly doubt you reach the threshold of over-training within a weekly block of training.
    No, of course not, but then Ive never overtrained either. Hell, Ive never reached the threshold for overreaching within a weekly block, typically takes me up to 3 weeks to do that.

  5. I've done 5 a days for 2 weeks straight. Started to flatline but maybe it was because I was young that I was fine?

    So what effect does steroids have on overtraining?
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  6. Topic of the week: Is Overtraining BS?


    Overtraining is real for us older lifters (55 next month). The body simply cannot regenerate tissue as fast. This is the reason I've moved to One Lift A Day routines.
    May I suggest using this app to track your bloodwork tests:
    myBloodTracker for IPhone and IPad
    https://appsto.re/us/vvMndb.i
  7. AnabolicMinds Site Rep
    MidwestBeast's Avatar

    Real? Yes.

    Something most people will encounter? Nope.



    If you wanna see people battling through it, just look at the way @kbayne and @EMPIREMIND are training
    Psalm 34:10 - "The lions may grow weak and hungry, but those who seek the Lord lack no good thing."
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  8. You can't point to someone's training and say that it is an example of over training or working through it because everyone has different capabilities. I know where you were going just as an example, but for the sake of those that think it happens more than it does, just FYI.
  9. AnabolicMinds Site Rep
    MidwestBeast's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    You can't point to someone's training and say that it is an example of over training or working through it because everyone has different capabilities. I know where you were going just as an example, but for the sake of those that think it happens more than it does, just FYI.
    Perhaps my choice of wording with "battling through it" was poor.

    The point I was trying to make is what you hit on as well -- it's an individual thing, but generally speaking, the average person isn't going to run into that wall. The body is capable of being pushed to pretty extreme limits (and that last part is why I highlighted those guys' training styles).
    Psalm 34:10 - "The lions may grow weak and hungry, but those who seek the Lord lack no good thing."
    EvoMuse Representative | [email protected] | Inspire to Evolve

  10. Gotcha, and I completely agree.

  11. I think its beneficial to overtrain at some point. I have absolutely overtrained my cns, and it has shown me my breaking point. To get to that point i had to do an excessive amount of compounds and hiit and it still took about four to five weeks to reach that point. It has enabled me to understand my limits and push past them accordingly. I am much more aware of my body, and in this sport knowing YOUR body is everything. I am currently over reaching, but have increased my cals and rest time accordingly. I will not overtrain.

    I honestly believe people dont realize how strong they truely are. I always remember this qoute; "if it doesnt challenge you, it wont change you"

  12. I've experienced overtraining, but it was while I was fighting and that's a whole different animal. Overreaching is something that everyone should be doing in their training, but most don't know what it is or how to implement it.

    Another thing is that overtraining and excessive use injuries are often confused as well. Inflammation or a strain of a muscle from excessive training does not indicate overtraining. It's merely using something too often beyond its normal capacity with inadequate rest and not a systemic issue like overtraining.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys


  13. I thought it was bs and trained 7 days a week for a year. Loved the results but eventually I hit a plateau I decided to take rest days. Started growing again and breaking PRs. So I think it's good to not believe in it initially and listen to your body

  14. Overtraining is definitely real, but not many people succumb to it now adays, especially in a period where autoregulation is in most new programs such as reactive training system. And if you ever feel your CNS getting fried just pop a few nerve restore and lift

  15. Overtraining is possible if someone's not working within their means. IE - training too much without enough rest, food, flexibility work. But if all those are adequate I find it difficult to overtrain.

  16. Of course over-training exists. Anyone who claims to doubt that is fooling themselves. I mean - nobody on here does 200 sets/workout and works out all day, for days on end. They'd kill themselves. I don't care how much you eat. haha.

    The most popular routines - whatever you choose - all account for modulation of intensity, volume and frequency. Everyone has a threshold, some have a higher threshold than others, and most people who claim over-training is an excuse are actually working less hard than the people who have been through it. If you go high intesity, all the time, every day, for weeks, you will fall. I think intensity, as Jiggz said, is the biggest contributing factor to overtraining. On the same hand, no one gets huge running marathons - but that is training for a different reason.

  17. Of course overtraining is real. The "no such thing as overtraining" really came from people/gurus trying to motivate the lazy to push themselves and stop being little pv$$ies. You tell a certain type of person (the highly driven kind) overtraining doesn't exist and watch what happens to them.

  18. Quote Originally Posted by plifter42 View Post
    Haha, this is true. But after years of training I know what works for me and I have my training dialed in to a point where I've been making steady gains every year.

    I might have experienced "overtraining" before... Squatting 225 raw, ass to grass for 22 reps and puking all over the squat rack on the last set... Varsity wrestling practice until sundown in a small room with the goal of dehydrating ourselves... Two-a-days during football going through practices with multiple concussions...

    I've experimented with overtraining... Wasn't for me.
    I as well wrestled and played varsity football and the training for both sports is very different. It was a lot easier to be worn out and just tired from wrestling, from limiting calorie intake and drill practice while also trying to drop water weight and all while trying to stay focused. But I wouldn't call it overtraining. My weight training coach for football was much better at helping to reach goals. Even though he would basically have us eating as much as possible and then train before we went and practiced. With two a days it wasn't really overtraining it was more of just being exhausted from practice then lifting and practicing again. I really think people just use "overtraining" as an excuse. Not saying it doesn't exist. But I think people who overtrain go months at a time doing two hour bicep workouts a couple of times a week and don't know why they aren't getting bigger.
    G.I.F.D

    *Everything stated above is for entertainment purposes only*

  19. Depends in the actual definition of over training. If you improperly stimulate muscle growth to the point you are running circles in the gym, that is over training to me. Adrenal fatigue can be over training. Improper nutrition can lead to over training. It just depends in my opinion. Ole Ronnie Coleman hit his muscles twice a week and was on of the best, bet he did methodically, along with proper nutrition.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Magg0078 View Post
    Ole Ronnie Coleman hit his muscles twice a week and was on of the best, bet he did methodically, along with proper "nutrition".
    I corrected it - you forgot the " around nutrition. No big.

    Beyond that, your post was great!

  21. Thanks, sorry about the grammatical errors. iPhone has a mind of its own sometimes.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by Magg0078 View Post
    Thanks, sorry about the grammatical errors. iPhone has a mind of its own sometimes.
    LMAO - no worries man, I was just busting your chops and pointing out that comparing the typical person with Ronnie Coleman ....Coleman had a lot more than nutrition on his side....lots of drugs too I would suggest. I was just giving you a hard time. I am far from the grammar police. Say it however you have to...haha

  23. Name:  woot_siren.gif
Views: 327
Size:  17.6 KB You forgot a period.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    Name:  woot_siren.gif
Views: 327
Size:  17.6 KB You forgot a period.
    Damn I need to spread reputation around lol
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  25. I see admin has a knack for asking good questions.

    I think overtraining is mostly myth in bodybuilding until you get to competition-level seriousness. I don't necessarily think bodybuilding is the best example of athletes overtraining, but rather combat sports like MMA and boxing.

    Floyd Mayweather is famous for what would widely be regarded as an overtraining regimen.

    Junior Dos Santos in MMA started monitoring various blood markers after heavy training sessions after he nearly developed rhabdomyolysis which is the worst-case scenario as a medical outcome.
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