A Wide Back? What to do

[EatMoar]

Hi guys so in about a week or two im going to be switching up my workout for all my body parts and the one I want to focus on hardcore is my back. I want to get a nice wide and defined back. IVe heard the general rule of thumb is to go wide grip for wide back and close grip for back mass but it seems iffy.

Anyway heres what im currently doing:
Pendally Rows (grip is medum legnth , shoulder width about )
Wide grip pull up
close grip lat pull down
close grip low row

Heres what im thinking about doing .... (advice needed here please )

Pendally rows (love these cant get rid of em! )
Wide grip pull up
Wide grip lat pull down (isnt the pull up and the push down esentially the same thing?)
Medium/wide grip low row
...adding another exercise in possibly would be : close grip lat pull down (this may be to much though)

Let me know whats good/whats bad/ whats ehh . Thanks guys!

[carpee]

if you're sticking with bb'ing type volume, I would drop the wide grip pull-up and wide grip pulldown combo. keep the pulldowns wide grip but go with a moderate grip pull-up and use chains or a weighted belt.

weighted chins too. heavy compound > super wide grip

don't neglect deadlifts or barbell rows either.

[EatMoar]

if you're sticking with bb'ing type volume, I would drop the wide grip pull-up and wide grip pulldown combo. keep the pulldowns wide grip but go with a moderate grip pull-up and use chains or a weighted belt.

weighted chins too. heavy compound > super wide grip

don't neglect deadlifts or barbell rows either.

Pendally rows are just a variation of barbell rows, they work better for me. I used to BB row but wasnt getting as good of results from it. Ah of course lol yeah I deadlift on my back days, every other week though because i find when I deadlift my lower back needs a longer time to heal.

Why drop wide grip pull ups? Arent they important ?

[Rodja]

Drop Pendlay's for DB rows. Pendlay's aren't designed for hypertrophy since the TUT is not there. As far as the pullups go, switch each week from wide grip to neutral grip for variation and also add in snatch grip deadlifts.

[Young Gotti]

Wide grip lat pulldown:
University of Miami (Coral Gables) researchers had 10 experienced lifters perform wide-grip pulldowns to the front, pulldowns with reverse and neutral grips, and wide-grip pulldowns behind the neck while measuring muscle activity with electromyography. Wide-grip pulldowns to the front were found to involve the most lat muscle fibers, with the reverse-grip version coming in a close second.

[Sean1332]

see if your gym has a wide neutral grip pull down bar, mine has one and it's pretty nice..along with neutral grip pull-ups

[Rodja]

Pullups>>>>>pulldowns

[kdeome]

^ agreed.

[bdcc]

Pullups>>>>>pulldowns

Agreed. Pull ups to pull downs are like squats to leg extensions.

[EatMoar]

Alright then DBs for Pendally rows. I do feel a lot more TUT with DB one arm rows than pendally. Why not just do pull ups and pull downs?!

[hvactech]

Agreed. Pull ups to pull downs are like squats to leg extensions.

I thought leg extensions were the leg mass builder.

[Rodja]

Alright then DBs for Pendally rows. I do feel a lot more TUT with DB one arm rows than pendally. Why not just do pull ups and pull downs?!

Pulldowns are for people that are intimidated to do or suck at pulldowns. Also, they do stress the internal rotators, which are usually overworked into relation to external rotators. It's much better to fill in the volume with additional rows to help create balance within the internal and external rotators.

I thought leg extensions were the leg mass builder.

Leg extensions are not a mass builder. Have you seen how "legs" on people that don't squat but still do leg ex?

[EatMoar]

Alright thanks for the help guys this is what I'm gonna run with :

Db rows
Wide grip pull up
Close grip lat pull down
Medium grip low row (with a bar)
And obviously dead lifts.

I noticed that snatch deads are like regular dead lifts minus the wider grip and leg placement. I'd rather do a dead lift with a wide grip, wider legs and not so close to the knees.

[Rodja]

Alright thanks for the help guys this is what I'm gonna run with b rowsWide grip pull upClose grip lat pull downMedium grip low row (with a bar) And obviously dead lifts.I noticed that snatch deads are like regular dead lifts minus the wider grip and leg placement. I'd rather do a dead lift with a wide grip, wider legs and not so close to the knees.

I specifically said snatch-grip because they place the emphasis on the upper back. You can't hold nearly as much with the snatch-grip compared a sumo or conventional deadlift. The leg placement is virtually identical to a conventional deadlift except you have to bend more at the knee since you have to bend down further due to the wider grip.

[hvactech]

Pulldowns are for people that are intimidated to do or suck at pulldowns. Also, they do stress the internal rotators, which are usually overworked into relation to external rotators. It's much better to fill in the volume with additional rows to help create balance within the internal and external rotators.

Leg extensions are not a mass builder. Have you seen how "legs" on people that don't squat but still do leg ex?

Yeah it was a joke.

[EatMoar]

I specifically said snatch-grip because they place the emphasis on the upper back. You can't hold nearly as much with the snatch-grip compared a sumo or conventional deadlift. The leg placement is virtually identical to a conventional deadlift except you have to bend more at the knee since you have to bend down further due to the wider grip.

ive been trying to find a good video with instruction on how to do the snatch grip deadlift, any tips or can you link a good video? Im a perfectionist when it comes to form, i dont want to learn the wrong form . And lol @ the leg extension comment haha.

[Rodja]

ive been trying to find a good video with instruction on how to do the snatch grip deadlift, any tips or can you link a good video? Im a perfectionist when it comes to form, i dont want to learn the wrong form . And lol @ the leg extension comment haha.

It's the same setup as a conventional deadlift, but with a lower stance to accomodate for the wider grip. The bar will also be slightly further away from your shins at the bottom as well.

[Spaniard]

I agree with the thought in here, pull ups for the win no doubt. My back days consist of dead lifts, weighted pull ups, kroc rows and heavy db rows...

Another thing that would probably suit you better still than a pull down but less effective than a pull up IMO are rack chins. I've done them here and there. The recruitment seems to be to be more focused than a pull down.

Either way, pull ups ftw no doubt in my mind.

- Valdez

[Frank Reynolds]

I actually like rack chins more than pull-ups when doing them regularly. Much easier on my shoulders, easier to progress on, feel them more where I should. I attribute a lot of back width to them.

I do see a lot of people turn rack chins into more of an inverted row which I feel is a different movement entirely.

They translate well into pull ups as well imo.

[EatMoar]

It's the same setup as a conventional deadlift, but with a lower stance to accomodate for the wider grip. The bar will also be slightly further away from your shins at the bottom as well.

what do you mean by lower stance? Keep my grip wide, like keep my hands far apart? how far though? Like to each end of the bar? Why does the wide grip on the deadlift work your upper back more? So many questions lol, i love this stuff.