Deadlifts 3x8 are killing me....what do YOU do?

[waynaferd]

I usually start my back routine with deads 3x8, then some pull ups, then BB rows 3x8...

Lately I've been adding 5-10 pounds on deads and still getting 3x8, but afterwards I can barely hit 3x8 for rows and haven't added any weight for a few weeks. And my pull ups have been embarrassing as well :08:

Tonight for deads I did 415 x 8 x 2, then 420 x 8, and had to lay on the bench for a good 3-4 min to get my heart rate down and catch my breath, then pace around probably another 5 min before trying rows, which I immediately said "F this" on the first rep.

So now I only did 3x8 on deads and that was my back day.....that doesn't seem like much....

Any suggestions?

Thanks!!

 

[n87]

I do my deads at the very end. Weighted pullups, then BB rows, curls, hmr curls and then deadlofts.
If I did them at the beginning I'd be spent.

 

[strester]

I do deads first on my pull day ... have you looked at your warm up sets leading up to your working 3x8?

 

[killamac27]

I do 3x5-6 But I have been having the same problem as you when I get done with heavy deads. Maybe its time to take a week off and regain compusure, let your body fully recover. That should help somewhat. Also make sure you get proper pre workout nutrition.

 

[weeniman]

I have a day when I do deads, abs, cardio, and stretching. followed by at least 2 days of no lower back usage, giving my back max. recovery time. Change-up your routine where there's a couple days between your heavy pulling day and your deadlifts.

 

[WhatsaRoid?]

I do 3x5-6 But I have been having the same problem as you when I get done with heavy deads. Maybe its time to take a week off and regain compusure, let your body fully recover. That should help somewhat. Also make sure you get proper pre workout nutrition.

I was thinking the same, sounds like a recovery issue.

I do deads last tho

 

[Chubbinmuffin]

Do deads last or close to last, less chance of injury after you're nice and warmed up from the other back exercises!

 

[WarMachine000]

I stretch, do a couple of LIGHT warmups with deads, a medium weight set of 8-10, then 3x8 heavy. Kills me! Then I do barbell or tbar rows, then pulldowns or seated cable rows, then shrugs (bar or dumbbells ). Because of such a heavy day, I do forearms on back day too. All done- about 50-60 min.
For me, deads and rows MAKE my back day.
Look forward to others training.

 

[deadlift18]

put them at the end

 

[waynaferd]

Aighty....next time I'll do them last and see how it goes....if not good then I'll make a back day then a "deadlift back day"...

Thanks for all the advice!!

 

[Rodja]

Do them in the beginning. Start with about 10 minutes of light cardio to get the CV and CNS systems warm. Then, do dynamic stretches followed by several (3-5) sets of warm-ups. I generally don't go above 5 reps on any sets of deadlifts as it is a strength exercise and form tends to get really crappy as the erectors begin to fatigue.

 

[drivehard]

I do them in the middle. That allows some time to get myself warmed up, yet still have tons of energy to pour into it. After deads, I take some time and work on something simple on my lower body, or something specific on my back that uses light weight. That allows my CNS and body to recover before going into the next heavy left.

DEADLIFT
-then one of the following-
Calf raises
rear flys
side delt raises
etc.

 

[brownstown89]

i would personally never go over 5 reps... hell i wouldnt go over 3 but for Bodybuilders i dont think they would like that advice lol

 

[bezoe]

if youre looking for general muscle hypertrophy, you need not go under 8 or so reps.. those who said not to make it the first exercise i agree with because: 1. you want your muscle bellies nice and warm first; and 2. you will be too fried to efficiently do other exercises if you do deads out the gate

 

[permanabol]

Deads>all other back excercises IMO..
Just rest alot And warm up good 3 set of working dead sets took me about 25 min +or-
Maybe I can do them first because of my young testosterone levels lol

 

[brownstown89]

if youre looking for general muscle hypertrophy, you need not go under 8 or so reps.. those who said not to make it the first exercise i agree with because: 1. you want your muscle bellies nice and warm first; and 2. you will be too fried to efficiently do other exercises if you do deads out the gate

why would u wanna do deads at the end when it adds the most mass? I dont see the logic in going heavy on pulldowns then go to deads?

 

[TheLastRonin]

Eat more,sleep more, Deadlift first, switch workouts. 1st back day heavy deadlifts+1 arm rows or t-bar rows. Next work out, speed work+rows+pull ups. Try adding a bit of cardio through the week if you persist in doing high rep deads as well.

 

[lennoxchi]

i would personally never go over 5 reps... hell i wouldnt go over 3 but for Bodybuilders i dont think they would like that advice lol

Do them in the beginning. Start with about 10 minutes of light cardio to get the CV and CNS systems warm. Then, do dynamic stretches followed by several (3-5) sets of warm-ups. I generally don't go above 5 reps on any sets of deadlifts as it is a strength exercise and form tends to get really crappy as the erectors begin to fatigue.

i was thinking the same thing, if you're doing deads the correct way, getting 8 reps would be hell unless the weight was very light, then you wouldn't be getting a good w/o anyway. maybe 6 to warm up but if i'm lifting/pulling and setting the bar down, setting my grip again and repeating by 8 reps i'd be toast. something tells me you're what we can a floor-bouncer. i have a buddy like that too, it's ok if that's how you want to do them but it's not correct. lift/pull, set the bar down, slightly let go of the bar and reset your grip and lift/pull again

 

[Rodja]

i was thinking the same thing, if you're doing deads the correct way, getting 8 reps would be hell unless the weight was very light, then you wouldn't be getting a good w/o anyway. maybe 6 to warm up but if i'm lifting/pulling and setting the bar down, setting my grip again and repeating by 8 reps i'd be toast. something tells me you're what we can a floor-bouncer. i have a buddy like that too, it's ok if that's how you want to do them but it's not correct. lift/pull, set the bar down, slightly let go of the bar and reset your grip and lift/pull again

So true. Most people do not approach deadlifts in the appropriate manner. It's not really a set of 5; it's a set of 5 singles.

 

[TheLastRonin]

So true. Most people do not approach deadlifts in the appropriate manner. It's not really a set of 5; it's a set of 5 singles.

i was thinking the same thing, if you're doing deads the correct way, getting 8 reps would be hell unless the weight was very light, then you wouldn't be getting a good w/o anyway. maybe 6 to warm up but if i'm lifting/pulling and setting the bar down, setting my grip again and repeating by 8 reps i'd be toast. something tells me you're what we can a floor-bouncer. i have a buddy like that too, it's ok if that's how you want to do them but it's not correct. lift/pull, set the bar down, slightly let go of the bar and reset your grip and lift/pull again

When I do higher reps on DL I do this pace(although I use a traditional stance).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tw5bg7RgWKY&feature=player_embedded#!
[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71wjGK1xjm8"]YouTube- 330kg x 8 deadlift[/nomedia]
I would not reset my grip every time. Only if the circulation is affected or my hands are too sweaty. You obviously use a lighter weight than what you would crank out 4-6 with...like with any other exercise you would be using higher reps with. If you are putting maximal force into ANY rep scheme, it will tire you out.

 

[Ironhyde]

I usually start my back routine with deads 3x8, then some pull ups, then BB rows 3x8...

Lately I've been adding 5-10 pounds on deads and still getting 3x8, but afterwards I can barely hit 3x8 for rows and haven't added any weight for a few weeks. And my pull ups have been embarrassing as well :08:

Tonight for deads I did 415 x 8 x 2, then 420 x 8, and had to lay on the bench for a good 3-4 min to get my heart rate down and catch my breath, then pace around probably another 5 min before trying rows, which I immediately said "F this" on the first rep.

So now I only did 3x8 on deads and that was my back day.....that doesn't seem like much....

Any suggestions?

Thanks!!

In my personal experience, my back grew more when I did nothing but deadlift for over a year. No rows, no pull ups, nothing else but heavy deads. And I rarely pulled anything for over 3 reps during this time. 5 reps is still the most I'll pull.

 

[Ironhyde]

Do deads last or close to last, less chance of injury after you're nice and warmed up from the other back exercises!

So I'm going to wait and do my heaviest exercise at the end of my workout when my muscles are already fatigued and this will decrese my chance for injury? What issue of M&F did you get this nonsense out of? Go ask Chuck Vogelpohl or Brian Siders or Andy Bolton where the deadlift falls in their order of exercises. I'd bet my home it isn't last.

 

[Chubbinmuffin]

So I'm going to wait and do my heaviest exercise at the end of my workout when my muscles are already fatigued and this will decrese my chance for injury? What issue of M&F did you get this nonsense out of? Go ask Chuck Vogelpohl or Brian Siders or Andy Bolton where the deadlift falls in their order of exercises. I'd bet my home it isn't last.

Hmmm, good point. I definitely don't want to warm up or anything. I'll just go straight in and kill it with some heavy ass weight. What's M&F?

And uhhh, what's it matter what the "Pros" do? I'm not AGG.

 

[Ironhyde]

Hmmm, good point. I definitely don't want to warm up or anything. I'll just go straight in and kill it with some heavy ass weight. What's M&F?

And uhhh, what's it matter what the "Pros" do? I'm not AGG.

Pretty sure I didn't say not to "warm up." But you can warm up adequately enough with a few light sets of deadlifts before you go "kill it with some heavy ass weight." And I would be inclined to follow the advice and example set by guys who have pulled a truckload of weight from the floor. Call me crazy. M&F is Muscle & Fitness.

 

[TheLastRonin]

Warming up with lighter dead lifts is warming up FOR heavy dead lifts. Doing sets of other exercises first is "pre-exhausting" yourself and setting you up for light weights in the DL. Pretty ass backwards if your goal is being able to lift more on the dead lift and greater strength overall.

 

[vadox6466]

do them in the beginning, but do them for only half the year

 

[TheLastRonin]

do them in the beginning, but do them for only half the year

:trout::banghead:

No.

 

[Ironhyde]

do them in the beginning, but do them for only half the year

Why stop there? Just train half the year and take the other half to lay around on the couch watching reruns of Law and Order with a bag of Lay's. You will get huge and ripped and be strong as an ox. No need to train year round, much less do those extremely hard exercises like deadlifts and squats. They're for losers.

 

[Chubbinmuffin]

Pretty sure I didn't say not to "warm up." But you can warm up adequately enough with a few light sets of deadlifts before you go "kill it with some heavy ass weight." And I would be inclined to follow the advice and example set by guys who have pulled a truckload of weight from the floor. Call me crazy. M&F is Muscle & Fitness.

Well, I'm not arguing with your view. Actually, I was wrong with my previous post. I've done deads in the beginning, middle, and end. It really depends on how I feel. Regardless, I'm always sore as hell the following day.

I'm more of an MD guy myself, not so much MF =)

 

[vadox6466]

Why stop there? Just train half the year and take the other half to lay around on the couch watching reruns of Law and Order with a bag of Lay's. You will get huge and ripped and be strong as an ox. No need to train year round, much less do those extremely hard exercises like deadlifts and squats. They're for losers.

I meant alternate one month with deads and the next without, if you're worried about other exercises.

EDIT: or two months on, one off. something that works to your liking.

 

[TheLastRonin]

I meant alternate one month with deads and the next without, if you're worried about other exercises.

EDIT: or two months on, one off. something that works to your liking.

Still not effective if the goal is to increase the dead lift and maximal overall strength this is silly. At the most I would do every other workout.

 

[WarMachine000]

Still not effective if the goal is to increase the dead lift and maximal overall strength this is silly. At the most I would do every other workout.

Ditto. Might swap it for something once in a while, but it's a staple of my back training.

 

[vadox6466]

Still not effective if the goal is to increase the dead lift and maximal overall strength this is silly. At the most I would do every other workout.

well no shiit if the goal is to increase deadlift strength this is probably less than optimal. I'm saying if the guy is worried about strength in other exercises.

 

[brownstown89]

Do deads last or close to last, less chance of injury after you're nice and warmed up from the other back exercises!

what the hell no dont listen to this at all... so that means before i bench i should do skull crushers pulldowns some curls rotator cuff work and shoulder work that way im "warmed up" to bench? wtf??!?!

what you do is sretch up do the tredmill what ever your warm up is do it.. then start pulling 135 x 5 to warm up and add weight in anywhere from 30-70 pound incraments and pull to a hard 1-5 reps.. After that you can do whatever pulldowns rows and **** you want.... Dont do deadlifts last why the hell do whats best for you last?

matter of fact if you want a huge back
Deadlifts
Kroc Rows
bent bar pulldowns (hits upper lats)
mini band pull aparts (rear delts/upper back)

thats all ive done for a year and my back looks sweet and i powerlift not bodybuild and my back looks better and thicker/wider then most ppl at my golds gym. not trying to brag i know my bench and squat suck but i know how to train back

 

[TheLastRonin]

well no shiit if the goal is to increase deadlift strength this is probably less than optimal. I'm saying if the guy is worried about strength in other exercises.

Well no **** huh? DO you happen to fathom, that IF you increase the amount you can dead lift, and increase the volume of the dead lift (which is what he was doing, it seems his goal) that your other back related exercises would go up as well? Since you seem so uneducated on the subject, I would deem not. I mentioned the goal being overall strength.
Imagine the exercise was squats. DO you think if his goal was to increase overall leg strength he should opt out of squats and do leg extensions and leg curls for half a year and expect his overall leg strength to go up? Ridiculous. You give away your lack of knowledge every time you post on this.

 

[vadox6466]

Well no **** huh? DO you happen to fathom, that IF you increase the amount you can dead lift, and increase the volume of the dead lift (which is what he was doing, it seems his goal) that your other back related exercises would go up as well? Since you seem so uneducated on the subject, I would deem not. I mentioned the goal being overall strength.
Imagine the exercise was squats. DO you think if his goal was to increase overall leg strength he should opt out of squats and do leg extensions and leg curls for half a year and expect his overall leg strength to go up? Ridiculous. You give away your lack of knowledge every time you post on this.

The man was worried about his strength on follow up exercises immediately after deadlifting. The simple solution to do the other exercises optimally is to not deadlift.

If you tire yourself out deadlifting, you can't follow up with full intensity on the next exercises.

 

[waynaferd]

I'm still waiting for back day to roll around, and when it does, I'm going to do the "minor" lifts, like pulldowns and rows and some other stuff, then a day or two after do the deadlifts, probably heavier but less reps.

I usually do 10 light reps, 5 heavier, then 3 more a bit heavier for warm up, and then do the working sets.

And I let them sit on the floor for a sec after a rep so its not bouncing.

There's definately a lot of opinions on this, so one way or another I will get a decent back workout done each week, with a little trial and error.

Thanks everybody!!

 

[Ironhyde]

The man was worried about his strength on follow up exercises immediately after deadlifting. The simple solution to do the other exercises optimally is to not deadlift.

If you tire yourself out deadlifting, you can't follow up with full intensity on the next exercises.

Who cares how much weight they use on lat pulldowns or other back assistance exercises? I'm having a hard time following this logic of skipping deadlifts because they make you too tired or because you aren't able to use as much weight in other back movements. Deadlifts are king and will build more overall back size and thickness than ANY other movement. Why are some people so worried about making sure they get in their seated cable rows and chest-supported T-bar rows with heavier weight when no other exercise comes close to doing what deads do? It's like saying I'm not going to squat because I can't do leg extensions and lunges as heavy as I could do them if I didn't squat. Anyone else having a hard time making sense out of this? Or is it just still early on a Saturday morning and ol' Iron isn't awake yet?

 

[waynaferd]

Who cares how much weight they use on lat pulldowns or other back assistance exercises? I'm having a hard time following this logic of skipping deadlifts because they make you too tired or because you aren't able to use as much weight in other back movements. Deadlifts are king and will build more overall back size and thickness than ANY other movement. Why are some people so worried about making sure they get in their seated cable rows and chest-supported T-bar rows with heavier weight when no other exercise comes close to doing what deads do? It's like saying I'm not going to squat because I can't do leg extensions and lunges as heavy as I could do them if I didn't squat. Anyone else having a hard time making sense out of this? Or is it just still early on a Saturday morning and ol' Iron isn't awake yet?

Mostly my problem is....although I'm still adding weight to deads, but I've stalled on all other back exercises. After a set of deadlifts I'm beat and it seems to me that just doing deads on a back day isn't enough, ya know?

Now if you could only do a set of bench presses and that was it would that make a very good chest day? I'm thinking no....

But deads use a lot more muscles than bench, so I know a lot more is getting worked in one fell swoop.

But anyway I wanna do more than just deadlifts on back day but don't wanna lose much intensity on the deads.

So 2 back days doing different things is the plan.....

Thanks for your replies, though!

 

[TheLastRonin]

The man was worried about his strength on follow up exercises immediately after deadlifting. The simple solution to do the other exercises optimally is to not deadlift.

If you tire yourself out deadlifting, you can't follow up with full intensity on the next exercises.

Except for the fact that he wants to keep the intensity on Dead lifts AND increase strength on other lifts. He seems to want to keep adding weight to them as well. Which if their was a happy medium between both of our perspectives it would be 1 week on 1 week off. Or what I mentioned in my original post in this thread. He will get stronger both mentally and physically and learn to push himself past simply saying f this after deads. Every one does eventually.

 

[Chubbinmuffin]

what the hell no dont listen to this at all... so that means before i bench i should do skull crushers pulldowns some curls rotator cuff work and shoulder work that way im "warmed up" to bench? wtf??!?!

what you do is sretch up do the tredmill what ever your warm up is do it.. then start pulling 135 x 5 to warm up and add weight in anywhere from 30-70 pound incraments and pull to a hard 1-5 reps.. After that you can do whatever pulldowns rows and **** you want.... Dont do deadlifts last why the hell do whats best for you last?

matter of fact if you want a huge back
Deadlifts
Kroc Rows
bent bar pulldowns (hits upper lats)
mini band pull aparts (rear delts/upper back)

thats all ive done for a year and my back looks sweet and i powerlift not bodybuild and my back looks better and thicker/wider then most ppl at my golds gym. not trying to brag i know my bench and squat suck but i know how to train back

Sorry Mr. Powerlifter.

Last time I dipped 160, it was near the end of my arm workout. Otherwise, 135 is where I'm at. But uh, my bad, everyone's the same! So everyone's workout should be the same too. Sorry!

 

[vadox6466]

Except for the fact that he wants to keep the intensity on Dead lifts AND increase strength on other lifts. He seems to want to keep adding weight to them as well. Which if their was a happy medium between both of our perspectives it would be 1 week on 1 week off. Or what I mentioned in my original post in this thread. He will get stronger both mentally and physically and learn to push himself past simply saying f this after deads. Every one does eventually.

1 week off 1 week on = 26 weeks of deadlifting a year

1 month on 1 month off = 26 weeks of deadlifting a year

..and you were giving me shiit for suggesting he alternate

 

[TheLastRonin]

1 week off 1 week on = 26 weeks of deadlifting a year

1 month on 1 month off = 26 weeks of deadlifting a year

..and you were giving me shiit for suggesting he alternate

Prime example of why you don't understand. Taking extra time off within reason to rest if you are lifting maximally, is MUCH different from stopping the exercise completely. Think of Mike Mentzer. He would take many extra days off because he was training all out. What he would not do however is stop for half a year or even a month or two, then start doing the exercise again and expect improvements. You need to practice the technique and have the body adjust to heavy loads to be truly effective in a program including dead lifts. Honestly this is almost like telling a blind man how to see. I am not sure you even dead lift.

 

[brownstown89]

Sorry Mr. Powerlifter.

Last time I dipped 160, it was near the end of my arm workout. Otherwise, 135 is where I'm at. But uh, my bad, everyone's the same! So everyone's workout should be the same too. Sorry!

Why are you talking about how much you dip? I didnt bring anything up about it. Not saying your workout should be the same at all but if you cant manage to do enough back work after deadlift you need to get conditioned. Ive done tons of back routines. Coans deadlift routine has pulldowns, lat rows, rear delt work and heavy deads all in one so dont tell me you cant go heavy on deadlifts and not use sufficent weight on the rest of the lifts. If you cant ur not conditioned well enough.

If your lifting for bodybuilding which im assuming you are because your worried about doing tons of lifts for your back then you shouldnt really care about how much weight you use.. be focused on reps sets diet and a weight that challenges you.

look at pictures of matt krocs back and then read his log about how much back work he does... ill save u time its basically deadlift and rows and rear delt work lol. please dont be that guy that tries to max out on lat pulldowns and seated cable pulls etc.. no one cares how much weight u use on those..

 

[Chubbinmuffin]

Why are you talking about how much you dip? I didnt bring anything up about it. Not saying your workout should be the same at all but if you cant manage to do enough back work after deadlift you need to get conditioned. Ive done tons of back routines. Coans deadlift routine has pulldowns, lat rows, rear delt work and heavy deads all in one so dont tell me you cant go heavy on deadlifts and not use sufficent weight on the rest of the lifts. If you cant ur not conditioned well enough.

If your lifting for bodybuilding which im assuming you are because your worried about doing tons of lifts for your back then you shouldnt really care about how much weight you use.. be focused on reps sets diet and a weight that challenges you.

look at pictures of matt krocs back and then read his log about how much back work he does... ill save u time its basically deadlift and rows and rear delt work lol. please dont be that guy that tries to max out on lat pulldowns and seated cable pulls etc.. no one cares how much weight u use on those..

Yeah I didn't mean to be a smartass. I do lift more for figure/size than strength. I said earlier I've done deads anywhere in my back workout from beginning, middle, to end. Weight wise, I don't care, you're correct. As for dips, I'm just saying that after I warm up with other exercises I can dip more than I can fresh. As for deads though, I really don't like going heavy... but It still burns like a bitch regardless of weight or order of exercise.

Hell, dieting is harder than training

 

[rampage jackson]

I only deadlift every other week at this point. Heavy deads shouldn't be done every week IMO.

 

[brownstown89]

Yeah I didn't mean to be a smartass. I do lift more for figure/size than strength. I said earlier I've done deads anywhere in my back workout from beginning, middle, to end. Weight wise, I don't care, you're correct. As for dips, I'm just saying that after I warm up with other exercises I can dip more than I can fresh. As for deads though, I really don't like going heavy... but It still burns like a bitch regardless of weight or order of exercise.

Hell, dieting is harder than training

amen on dieting being harder then training. and as far as deads go if your goign to light your form will suffer it wont feel quite "right". I dont know how to explain it but when im doing reps on 225,275 it doesnt feel right. Once i get to 315 and above it feels right. Regardless of where you do them i would not do 3 x 8.. find a 3 rep 5 rep and 1 rep max and do 1 working set and try to beat or manipulate your weights and reps so that your 1 rep max is eventually increased and ur back will grow.

 

[bezoe]

why would u wanna do deads at the end when it adds the most mass? I dont see the logic in going heavy on pulldowns then go to deads?

did i say do them at the end? no, absolutely not that wouldnt be practical, and if my post seemed to insenuate that im sorry. I said dont do them first.. i treat deads as another compound back exercise.. im not powerlifting, its not about strength.

 

[Type O Hero]

I do my deads at the very end. Weighted pullups, then BB rows, curls, hmr curls and then deadlofts.
If I did them at the beginning I'd be spent.

^ This

If I were going to do biceps though I would still do deadlifts before that. But deadlifts would come at the end of my back training.

I think it's a good idea to do some back work before deadlifts just to get the CNS warmed up more if nothing else.

 

[bezoe]

I usually start my back routine with deads 3x8, then some pull ups, then BB rows 3x8...

Lately I've been adding 5-10 pounds on deads and still getting 3x8, but afterwards I can barely hit 3x8 for rows and haven't added any weight for a few weeks. And my pull ups have been embarrassing as well :08:

Tonight for deads I did 415 x 8 x 2, then 420 x 8, and had to lay on the bench for a good 3-4 min to get my heart rate down and catch my breath, then pace around probably another 5 min before trying rows, which I immediately said "F this" on the first rep.

So now I only did 3x8 on deads and that was my back day.....that doesn't seem like much....

Any suggestions?

Thanks!!

if your goal is size sir, wait til 2nd or 3rd exercise.. youre not gonna be doing as much weight with the deads of course, but the primary muscles used in the deadlift will be "pre-exhausted' (not enough to cause sloppy body mechanics and injury) and those muscle fibers will be torn down even more after deads. Youll be glad you were able to complete a full back workout and i guarantee you will grow.. also FYI, i do deads every other week which i feel keeps me from overtraining- you may want to consider this.. (dont take too much time off to recover as others have mentioned)